I didn't know it has been this long.
We all want better than 16 wins this year, but no doubt going 16-16 means a lot.
We all want better than 16 wins this year, but no doubt going 16-16 means a lot.
2005-06 was our last season .500 or better
- Thread starter Greene Rice FIG
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Let's get 17 regular season then even an opening round loss in the B1G tournament means a winning record! (and I'm counting CCNY)
It's also been since 2001-02 that we've gone .500 in conference, and before that it was 1998-99. Have to back to 1990-91 in the A10 to see a better than .500 conference record.
Pikiell has the opportunity to put a lot of those negative streaks to bed.
Pikiell has the opportunity to put a lot of those negative streaks to bed.
I have to admit I'm surprised you didn't know Waters' final year on the banks was our last season with a winning record. We had to beat St. John's in Queens in the last regular season game to qualify for the BE tourney. We beat The Hall in the first round at MSG before getting trounced by Nova. In the NIT, we won at Penn State before losing at St. Joe's to end the season. Mulcahy wanted Waters out the door as quickly as possible to make way for FHJ so he refused to host any NIT games at the RAC. As I'm sure you recall, it was Douby's last year, too.
Its beyond embarrassing to have been a season ticket holder though all these losing seasons past and present and changes in coaching staffs.I agree Pikiell has the opportunity to change the mindset of fans and recruits starting this seasoni
I hope the optimism we have now has a different ending. We know how then ending went, but at this point in the last 3 coaching staffs there was similar optimism....and always the feeling was this time it is different.
decmber 23rd, 2008 YEAR 2 of FHJ. 9-3 OOC. Corey Chandler was a sophomore. rosario and greg E were freshman. The future looked VERY bright.
december 29th, 2011 Year 2 of Rice, We just beat Florida at home and the fans rushed the court. Carter mack Seagears were FR and Biruta was a soph
january 11, 2015 YEAR 2 of Jordan. We just beat Wisconsin to go 2-2 in B1G. Won at Clemson and beat Vanderbilt. had Williams and Etou and i believe Corey Sanders was signed.
If 90% of people said they are much more confident now compared to at least 2 of the 3 past regime they are lying.
decmber 23rd, 2008 YEAR 2 of FHJ. 9-3 OOC. Corey Chandler was a sophomore. rosario and greg E were freshman. The future looked VERY bright.
december 29th, 2011 Year 2 of Rice, We just beat Florida at home and the fans rushed the court. Carter mack Seagears were FR and Biruta was a soph
january 11, 2015 YEAR 2 of Jordan. We just beat Wisconsin to go 2-2 in B1G. Won at Clemson and beat Vanderbilt. had Williams and Etou and i believe Corey Sanders was signed.
If 90% of people said they are much more confident now compared to at least 2 of the 3 past regime they are lying.
I'll admit that I was hugely confident at that point in 2008. I really thought the program was going the right direction, and was talking to people about "now is the time" and "I'm really excited for the next few years"... then the conference season hit. At first I figured "we're starting with the toughest teams in the conference... we'll win more after this stretch"... but then the losses started piling, and doubt about FHJ's coaching ability crept in. When Chandler started talking transfer, I think the bubble burst... even though he decided to stay, he was then dismissed. Then Ech and Rosario were gone the next season. I don't get the same vibe out of this team right now, it seems to be more substance than flash - so, maybe a bit more confident now after being burned then?
2015 I didn't have those same feelings. I couldn't process the Wisconsin win, because I felt we weren't good enough to knock off a team like that... it felt like the stars aligned for us for just that one night, and we won on a fluke. We had already lost by 18 to St. Peters and 27 to SHU earlier that year, so I wasn't very optimistic. I also was tempering any expectations after getting my hopes up in 2008.
GRF, very, very few had any confidence in FHJ's coaching ability, since he had been considered and passed over by several mid-major schools. All he had was this mythical recruiting ability, since he was able to recruit a few guys for Nova. Never doubted FHJ would screw it up. Lousy tactician. lousy strategist, lousy "people person".
.As for EJ, always thought he was hired primarily to rescue the program and stop the negativity that accompanied the Rice videos. Never thought EJ, who was best suited for an NBA assistant's job, would succeed jumping into a Power 5 job. Knew it when he hired O'Koren. But the negativity more or less stopped, and the job became attractive enough to land Pike.
I really believed in Mike Rice and thought he was the perfect hire. Have the same belief in Pike, who has all the assets and none of the debits of Rice, plus great assistants. I remember you in the days before EJ was fired. And you have not bought into the new era. Yet.
TL
.As for EJ, always thought he was hired primarily to rescue the program and stop the negativity that accompanied the Rice videos. Never thought EJ, who was best suited for an NBA assistant's job, would succeed jumping into a Power 5 job. Knew it when he hired O'Koren. But the negativity more or less stopped, and the job became attractive enough to land Pike.
I really believed in Mike Rice and thought he was the perfect hire. Have the same belief in Pike, who has all the assets and none of the debits of Rice, plus great assistants. I remember you in the days before EJ was fired. And you have not bought into the new era. Yet.
TL
As great as things are looking right now, keep in mind that Pike is still working with parts that may not all be the best fit. What he has done is fantastic and I am sincerely hoping the players continue to fight to the buzzer every game. Certainly, there are games ahead that most probably will not be very good opportunities for a win, it's the games that have us playing teams also looking to complete their own puzzles that we should be expecting a lot more conference wins than we have seen so far.
Also, I did feel really optimistic in 2011, as I thought that we had a coach that "got it"... passionate about defense, passionate about the game, good with X's and O's, showed good recruiting chops... and if he hadn't been such a behind-the-scenes nutjob, he very well may have gotten us to turn the corner. I don't think Pike is the type to lose the locker room like that - everything in his tenure shows that his former players love him, and there's no animosity there. So, again, more confident this go around, with an additional checkbox checked that I didn't know I had to check in 2011.
Also, the All American 7 footer didn't play. I never considered that a signature win because of that.
I was very confident after Rice at that time in year 2. Not so with Hill or EJ.
You are saying all this with hindsight. Anyone saying at this point in the FHJ era what you are saying would have been killed and in a very small minority.
I'll let people slide with the no confidence in Jordan at this point, BUT almost everyone was PRO Jordan at this point.
Disagree
This time is different for several reasons.
We have a real coaching staff with high quality assistants, probably the best assistants we have ever had. (Can anyone dispute that?)
That alone makes this feel different.
Next we have our most competent AD ever.
Next we have a practice facility finally going up.
Next, our head coach has had success at multiple stops, some as head coach, some as an assistant. Can't say that about recent hires.
With previous recent coaching regimes, we HOPED we were going in the right direction.
Now we KNOW we are.
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Liked Hill more than EJ but not as much as Pike or Rice. I never really believed in Hill. Didn't like the hire. Thought we were in trouble first game when Rosario and Chandler didn't seem to talk to each other. I mean I thought there was a chance but I wasn't really confident. Never thought EJ had a chance. I really like EJ though so I hoped and stuck with him in my head longer than I should have. With Rice I was extremely confident but his antics always gave me some reservations. I did believe he would get it done though.
You pretty much knew EJ was on borrowed time when he lost by 60 to Louisville in the AAC tournament his first year in the game Seagears pretty much quit.
Besides Fred's back to back wins over Nova and Pitt he basically sucked.
Rice had me excited and I loved the intensity those teams played with.
Besides Fred's back to back wins over Nova and Pitt he basically sucked.
Rice had me excited and I loved the intensity those teams played with.
If we finish .500 we probably have some tangible evidence.
After beating Villanova in Year 2 of Rice kenpom had us at 70. We started Rice last year at 52, but when downhill after that.
70 was legit and 52 was a preseason # kenpom gave us based on all the returning players
judge JR dane SR mack class SO
After beating Villanova in Year 2 of Rice kenpom had us at 70. We started Rice last year at 52, but when downhill after that.
70 was legit and 52 was a preseason # kenpom gave us based on all the returning players
judge JR dane SR mack class SO
Even if people were confident in those previous years, the poster who mentioned the AD and the practice facility are on the money. As much as I like Pike, it's still early. But Hobbs (still somewhat early, but has had more to say and do) and infrastructure are definitely for real. So this IS different, and you don't have to pretend you weren't confident before to realize that.
You must be kidding Greene, right? This feels nothing like the prior regimes. From Day 1, Pike had us competing against teams we had no business competing against. We have never had a coach whose signature stalwarts, are defense and rebounding. Waters was a defensive coach but did not stress Rebounding. We had less overall talent year 1 under Coach Pike than all the other regimes. He clearly is the best in game coach, for taking away the other team's best weapon, adjustments in game, X and O's coming out of timeouts, great substitutions and timely ones without disrupting the flow of the action. I have seen them all for the last 40 years, Young, Littlepage, Wenzel, Bannon, Waters, Hill, Rice and Eddie; and he is better than them all. Young was terrific, Wenzel was good offensively, Bannon had a real shot, and Waters was close, but when you combine recruiting with coaching and flat out competition night in night out , Pike is the clear leader. You can doubt all day if you like but you will be very happy when he proves you wrong. This will be Rutgers rebirth as a basketball school after a 30 year nap, so just enjoy the ride.
Rice was all about defense, and he also got immediate results. His first season, we started 9-2, knocked off #9 Nova, took then #17 Cuse to OT, and took then #17 SJU to the final possession in the BET before the refs cut the game short. He took us from a 275th ranked DRtg in Hill's final year to 164th in his first year. We finished 15-17 and had the "Fab 5" class on board to come in the following year.
At this point in his second year, we had just knocked off #10 Florida, and 3 games later beat #8 UConn. If you really didn't feel any sort of "we're turning the corner" energy at that point, I don't know what to tell you. The Rice era saw great results early, but his antics in the locker room started losing players (e.g. Miller) and ultimately lead to his implosion.
Stop what. Hill and Jordan were horrible coaches and Rice was an accident waiting to happen.
I can tell you that at this point (1 1/3 years) anyone saying negative things about Hill, Rice and even Jordan were killed. Believe me I know.
I think anyone who paid attention knew Jordan was proven to be a terrible coach and Rice was a timebomb. I think people were hoping hill could overcome lack of coaching ability with recruiting. I don't doubt what you say. Just wasn't the case for me. Pike is the real deal.
I was negative on both Hill and Jordan pretty much. You knew right away. Rice after his first season and after wins over Fla, UConn, and ND that year looked on the up and up....yes he may have self destructed if the tape didnt come out BUT lets remember he had changed his demeanor somewhat after counseling in his third year. However the damage was done the summer before when word hit the streets and recruiting dried up...you wonder if it didnt, RU was in with alot of top recruits. Rice had potential but the other two...awful from the get go.
Pike is the best of them all and finally produced last week win the signature win he needed, just needs to keep recruiting on the same trajectory and there is no reason to believe he cannot
I like Pike as a coach a lot and as a man and a head coach he is much more mature than some of his self destructive predecessors. Hopefully these traits will result in a more stable program and roster where players will be able to stay and develop. But I have to admit I’m still a little worried about recruiting. He hasn’t really made a big splash like Bannon, Hill, and Rice did early and we still have too many roster spots and scholarships being given to guys who are either not productive or are going to need a lot of time to develop. Given our history, facilities, etc I’m not saying he necessarily SHOULD be doing better recruiting but it’s not a given that we are on a path in year 4 or 5 that we’re a tournament contender.
I agree with Colonel and will add I don't have feeling he can't recruit. The 2018 class is really the 1st in my eyes, anything before he was at a significant disadvantage.
Then why was I crucified? I was the antichrist with negative thoughts at this point with Hill and To a lesser extent Jordan.
I was also killed bringing up Rices behavior in Year 1.
I find it amusing people saying they knew these coaches weren't going to work out.
Bac,
FHJ wasn't awful from the get go. With the talent he recruited at this point in his tenure no one was doubting his recruiting.
There was only 1 poster who had negative thoughts about Rosario his freshman year.
FHJ wasn't awful from the get go. With the talent he recruited at this point in his tenure no one was doubting his recruiting.
There was only 1 poster who had negative thoughts about Rosario his freshman year.
I don’t make early categorical judgements that people will never work out. But I did not feel good about any of those coaches and not sure why anyone would notwithstanding Rice who was a wildcard. Of course lots of people look at the court and don’t see what is happening out there. But i am confident now because Pike is different. Very different. The team executes and plays above their talent level. That’s how you build. It starts with coaching. The talent will come.
I would add that pikes personality is another aspect. He has the passion and work ethic but also class and maturity. We haven’t had that in decades.
I didn't mention Rice in my original post since I was trying to forget what he did to our perception. Yeah he had some good wins, but he had better talent than Pike did initially but I do not remember our team competing on the road like we did last year in Pike's first year. Almost all Rutgers coaches , and maybe most coaches period, struggle on the road, but Pike limited the blowouts and actually gave you a few moments that made you feel we were going to win. From Wisconsin last year on the road, Northwestern, Ohio State, to name a few that I thought we were going to win. I did not feel that way with Rice or any of the others.
Rice had many close road games against ranked teams where RU led or was within 2 possessions..Geogetown, Cincy, Notre Dame, Villanova. We forget because of what happened but his 2nd year really was showing very promising signs...I would put it equal to Pike..also that team was young as a slew of freshmen. His third year stalled as did recruiting
