5 - 7 team to a bowl game?
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If we are 5-7 we don't deserve a bowl game. Furthermore, it would be and embarrassing opponent and location.
NCAA added 3 more bowl games this year. (Total of 42 games so top 84 teams get a bowl). Based on past seasons and projections for this year, in order to fill all the bowl slots they may have to take up to six 5-7 teams this year. I would assume a 5-7 from the B1G would get a slot.
http://espn.go.com/college-football...-total-42-sites-include-tucson-austin-orlando
http://espn.go.com/college-football...-total-42-sites-include-tucson-austin-orlando
I still think that is the case but there are more bowl games so 5-7 are going to be needed to fill slots
On the other nad, it would mean 3-4 more weeks of practice, which would be very good for the long-term development of the team.
One of the great inequities of NCAA football is that non-bowl teams are not allowed to practice after the regular season, while bowl teams can, thus creating ever more inequity.
Due to this year's season it doesn't appear that they will be enough schools with 6-6 records or better to fill all of the slots.
So the bowls will be forced to dip into the 5-7 pool for extra teams.
If Rutgers finishes 5-7 I would be for it dor two reasons: extra practice and for the seniors.
So the bowls will be forced to dip into the 5-7 pool for extra teams.
If Rutgers finishes 5-7 I would be for it dor two reasons: extra practice and for the seniors.
Go 5-7 during the season, make a bowl and lose it. Finish the year at 5-8 but call it successful because the team made a bowl game? Truly pitiful.
5-7 schools going to bowls is terrible. Yet some will call it a successful year. You can go 1-7 in league and wins 4 OOC against nobodies and make it. Just let everyone go to bowls then.
This has been covered in a prior post. But. . . were is the harm in having two 5-7 teams play each other in an extra game?
Extra game/bowl trip is a reward for the players.
Staffs get an extra game and prep time, which have lasting benefits that extend into next season, and perhaps recruiting.
Fans get an extra game to watch amid the Holiday season.
Participating schools and associated conferences get some added revenue.
Think back to the RU vs. IU game. That was fun to watch, no? In short, there is entertaining football to be had in a 5-7 vs. 5-7 match up.
Lastly, no one will make you watch these games.
Extra game/bowl trip is a reward for the players.
Staffs get an extra game and prep time, which have lasting benefits that extend into next season, and perhaps recruiting.
Fans get an extra game to watch amid the Holiday season.
Participating schools and associated conferences get some added revenue.
Think back to the RU vs. IU game. That was fun to watch, no? In short, there is entertaining football to be had in a 5-7 vs. 5-7 match up.
Lastly, no one will make you watch these games.
In general I do not think a 5-7 team should go bowling. But... if there are extra slots they will take 5-7 teams. The question would be which 5-7 teams. Typically they go to name programs.
Here are some teams with 3 wins currently that may be a 5 win team at the end of the season:
- Syracuse, BC, Wake, Va Tech, Ga Tech, Nebraska, Ks St, WVU, Army (2 wins), Vandy, Tenn, Arkansas, and Washington. I added Army since they would be a national tv draw for a bowl game if they get to 5 wins.
Here are some teams with 3 wins currently that may be a 5 win team at the end of the season:
- Syracuse, BC, Wake, Va Tech, Ga Tech, Nebraska, Ks St, WVU, Army (2 wins), Vandy, Tenn, Arkansas, and Washington. I added Army since they would be a national tv draw for a bowl game if they get to 5 wins.
This would be like mathematical proof that there are too many bowl games. It's something most people always thought, but now this would be over the top. Why a reward for a losing season? Of course, if a team is selected, they'd be foolish not to go, because of the reasons others here listed - more time to practice, etc. - but really, is it justified? I don't even love 6-6 teams being selected.
Because the tax payer is paying for it. It is a massive ponzi scheme supporting localities.
It's obviously absurd to be excited about a 5-7 team in the bowl.
But this would be huge for practice purposes. Regardless of if KF is coach or not
But this would be huge for practice purposes. Regardless of if KF is coach or not
Oh, I agree with that. Also, for the sort of bowl that would take a 5-7 team, the "payout" will also most certainly cost the school a million dollars to go.
The suggestion that 3 weeks of extra practice is great for future development is hogwash. What has going to piddling bowls gotten us over time ? More piddling bowls.
Bowls are good for fans, for local economies and something to hype for future recruits but the extra practice has no value.
Bowls are good for fans, for local economies and something to hype for future recruits but the extra practice has no value.
I agree with this. From Pop Warner to the Pros, by that time of the season a player just wants the season to be over. They are physically and mentally shot. Take a survey. This is true.
That would be good, in theory, but most of the coaches you'd want will still be working at that time of year with their current teams.
I wouldn't call it successful even if we win the bowl but it is still worth it for the extra practice and for the seniors to have some extra fun before they leave Rutgers.
No. 5-7 losing teams are not deserving of bowl games, period. Granted, I think that it's silly to give only bowling teams those extra weeks of practice. But I'm not interested in watching glorified scrimmages between any 5-7 teams (including our very own), and think it doesn't mean much of anything for even a new coach to practice for and win such a game. Spring and summer practices are arguably way more important for development of young players and formation of the following season's depth chart.
That is a tremendous amount of money to spend to give the seniors a good time after 4 years of giving them a good time.
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5-7 teams going to a bowl game should not be allowed. They should actually go the other way and only let 7-5 and better teams go bowling. It just makes it more meaningful. If they want to resolve the balance of extra practice time as an issue then lobby the NCAA to let all teams continue to practice at the end of the season as if they were invited to a bowl game. This way that argument is no longer valid, the bowls are meaningful. What's next...everyone gets to participate and everyone gets a trophy will be the next thing...just like they do with kids these days. Keep diluting this and it makes the regular season less meaningful (with the exception of the top tier bowl / playoff system).
as long as bowls are profitable for TV channels you will see more and more of them and I love it. You guys can watch Greys Anatomy and I'll watch LaTech vs Western Michigan.
Agreed. I never understood the idea of "there's too much college football on tv"?!?!
its a insanely stupid idea, much like a participation trophy.
I'll be happy to take the money though
I'll be happy to take the money though
Your employees must love you. Do the bare minimum or even less and get patted on the back for a job well done. Participation trophies for everyone!
This. The games are scheduled for TV $$$$. It surprises me that RU fans would complain about this. This is same reason RU was invited to the B1G.
What are you talking about? How in the world is the bowl system a Ponzi scheme? See the definition below. Who are the "new investors" that are paying the returns to the prior investors? I don't see that at all.
"A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation where the operator, an individual or organization, pays returns to its investors from new capital paid to the operators by new investors, rather than from profit earned by the operator."
From the actual NCAA bowl guidelines:
Insufficient Number of Deserving Teams For a period of four years beginning August 2, 2012, if an insufficient number of institutions meet the definition of a "deserving team" to participate in postseason bowl games in a particular year, an institution that meets a condition set forth below shall be eligible to be selected to participate in such a bowl game. A particular bowl game may benefit from this provision only one time within the four-year period. All institutions that meet the first condition must be selected before an institution that meets the second condition may be selected and so forth in descending order:
1. An institution that would have met the FCS Opponent exception but for the fact that one victory was against a FCS opponent that had not averaged 90 percent of the permissible maximum number of grantsin-aid per year in football during a rolling two-year period and the institution's waiver request was denied. (This won't be us this year.)
2. An institution that has won a number of games against FBS opponents and two FCS opponents that together is equal to or greater than the number of its overall losses. (This won't be us this year.)
3. An institution that participated in 13 regular-season contests and finished the season with a record of six wins and seven losses. (This won't be us this year.)
4. An institution that is in its final year of reclassification from the Football Championship Subdivision to the Football Bowl Subdivision and meets the definition of a "deserving team". (This won't be us this year.)
5. An institution that finished its season with a minimum of five wins and a maximum of seven losses but achieved a top-five Academic Progress Rate in the Football Bowl Subdivision for the most recent reporting year. (Were we a top-five APR team in the most recent reporting year?)
Its isnt a ponzi scheme - but because of the ticket purchse minimums, it is a bit of a scam by ESPN (who owns most of the crappier bowls) to make profits on the backs of universities, who almost all lose money from these kind of bowls.
Frankly, if we are 5-7 and get invited (and I assume, as a big Ten program we would be among the first on the list) that we say no. What good does playing some Sun Belt team pre-Christmas, in some second rate city do for anyone?
Frankly, if we are 5-7 and get invited (and I assume, as a big Ten program we would be among the first on the list) that we say no. What good does playing some Sun Belt team pre-Christmas, in some second rate city do for anyone?
We have had the real estate "bubble and the stock market "bubble" ...I'm waiting for the college tuition bubble and the excess bowl games "bubble" to burst...
Bowl tie-ins by conference and an early look at filling them:
Sun Belt: four tie-ins (Cure Bowl in Orlando, Dec 19; Camellia Bowl in Montgomery AL, Dec 19; New Orleans Bowl, Dec 19; and GoDaddy.com Bowl, Mobile, AL, Dec 23)
Teams with most wins: Appalachian State, 6-1; Georgia Southern, 6-2; Arkansas State, 4-3; Idaho and South Alabama, 3-4. CBS projects UL Lafayette (currently 2-4) to be bowling as the 4th Sun Belt team.
PAC-12: seven tie-ins; currently two teams with 6 wins (Stanford and Utah) and five teams with 5 wins (Washington State 5-2, Oregon, California, UCLA, and Arizona), and three with four wins (USC, Arizona State, Colorado). Should have no trouble filling bids and probably can steal other open bids.
SEC: ten tie-ins, plus probably will land a team in the playoffs unless LSU, Ole Miss, and Alabama beat each other up too much. Five teams have 6+ wins now (Florida, LSU, Alabama, Ole Miss, Mississippi State); two with 5 wins (Georgia and Texas A&M); three with 4 wins (Kentucky, Missouri, and Auburn); and four with 3 wins (Tennessee, Vanderbilt, South Carolina and Arkansas). Probably get 11 teams to 6+ wins.
MAC: five tie-ins. Two teams with 6+ today (Bowling Green and Toledo), and three with 5 wins (Ohio, Western Michigan, and Northern Illinois. Also, Buffalo and Central Michigan are both 4-4. They will fill their slots and should have additional teams at .500 or better.
MOUNTAIN WEST: Wow - seven bowl tie-ins for 12 teams (two bowls are listed as BYU or Mtn West - I only include one slot here for that). Boise State has 6 wins. SDSU has 5. There are five teams at 4 wins and Colorado State is 3-4. A good chance they will get all seven filled but it is possible they will fall one short if they beat each other up the wrong way.
C-USA: Six bowl tie-ins. Already have two teams with 6+ wins (Marshall and Western Kentucky) and two with 5 (La Tech and Southern Miss). Also two 4 win teams (Rice and FIU) and three with 3 wins (UTEP, Mid Tenn State, and Old Dominion.) Good shot at filling all six slots.
INDEPENDENTS: BYU has a tie-in with the Mtn West bowls and is qualified already. Notre Dame will get an at-large to the BCS level games if they win enough going forward, or an ACC bid. Army is 2-6 and should not win out at Air Force and Navy and at home vs Tulane and Rutgers. I expect they won't even get to 5 wins.
BIG 12: Seven slots, counting the Sugar Bowl tie-in and two combo bowls with the B1G. Four teams already qualified (TCU, Baylor, OSU, Oklahoma); Texas Tech has five wins. Three teams at 3-4 (Texas, Kansas State, and WVU). Might not get enough to fill all bowls, especially if their champion makes the playoffs. Iowa State (2 wins) and Kansas (winless) won't be bowling.
B1G: Nine slots if I understand the combined ACC/B1G spots correctly - plus a playoff team is OSU/MSU/Iowa finish strong - plus at least one more BCS at-large with the above. Six teams have 6+ wins (MSU, OSU, PSU, Iowa, Wisconsin, Northwestern); Michigan has 5; four wins for Indiana, Illinois, and Minnesota; and of course RU and Nebraska have 3 wins each. Minnesota and Illinois have some challenging games ahead and the loser of their game on Nov 21 might not get to six wins. Indiana will need to beat Purdue and Maryland, probably, because it will be tough for them to beat Iowa or Michigan.
ACC: Eight slots, plus a playoff spot if Clemson keeps it up. Five teams have 6+ wins (Clemson, FSU, UNC, Duke, Pitt); NC State has 5 wins; Miami has 4 wins; and six teams with 3 wins (Louisville, Syracuse, Wake Forest, BC, VT, and GT). Interesting stat: GT has 18 straight bowl appearances, so that is in jeopardy for sure. They still play Virginia, VT, Miami, and UGA. It will be close to fill those slots.
AMERICAN: Seven slots, plus the champion figures to get a BCS spot as the best Group of Five team. Three teams are at 7 wins (Memphis, Houston, Tulane); Navy is 5-1; and three have 4 wins (South Florida, East Carolina, and Cincinnati). UConn and Tulsa have 3 wins. No bowls for Tulane, SMU, or UCF. Feels more likely to fall short than to fill all bids.
This does not account for all of the at-large BCS spots, so there could be a few more that fall short.
And of course, nobody read all of that. :)
Sun Belt: four tie-ins (Cure Bowl in Orlando, Dec 19; Camellia Bowl in Montgomery AL, Dec 19; New Orleans Bowl, Dec 19; and GoDaddy.com Bowl, Mobile, AL, Dec 23)
Teams with most wins: Appalachian State, 6-1; Georgia Southern, 6-2; Arkansas State, 4-3; Idaho and South Alabama, 3-4. CBS projects UL Lafayette (currently 2-4) to be bowling as the 4th Sun Belt team.
PAC-12: seven tie-ins; currently two teams with 6 wins (Stanford and Utah) and five teams with 5 wins (Washington State 5-2, Oregon, California, UCLA, and Arizona), and three with four wins (USC, Arizona State, Colorado). Should have no trouble filling bids and probably can steal other open bids.
SEC: ten tie-ins, plus probably will land a team in the playoffs unless LSU, Ole Miss, and Alabama beat each other up too much. Five teams have 6+ wins now (Florida, LSU, Alabama, Ole Miss, Mississippi State); two with 5 wins (Georgia and Texas A&M); three with 4 wins (Kentucky, Missouri, and Auburn); and four with 3 wins (Tennessee, Vanderbilt, South Carolina and Arkansas). Probably get 11 teams to 6+ wins.
MAC: five tie-ins. Two teams with 6+ today (Bowling Green and Toledo), and three with 5 wins (Ohio, Western Michigan, and Northern Illinois. Also, Buffalo and Central Michigan are both 4-4. They will fill their slots and should have additional teams at .500 or better.
MOUNTAIN WEST: Wow - seven bowl tie-ins for 12 teams (two bowls are listed as BYU or Mtn West - I only include one slot here for that). Boise State has 6 wins. SDSU has 5. There are five teams at 4 wins and Colorado State is 3-4. A good chance they will get all seven filled but it is possible they will fall one short if they beat each other up the wrong way.
C-USA: Six bowl tie-ins. Already have two teams with 6+ wins (Marshall and Western Kentucky) and two with 5 (La Tech and Southern Miss). Also two 4 win teams (Rice and FIU) and three with 3 wins (UTEP, Mid Tenn State, and Old Dominion.) Good shot at filling all six slots.
INDEPENDENTS: BYU has a tie-in with the Mtn West bowls and is qualified already. Notre Dame will get an at-large to the BCS level games if they win enough going forward, or an ACC bid. Army is 2-6 and should not win out at Air Force and Navy and at home vs Tulane and Rutgers. I expect they won't even get to 5 wins.
BIG 12: Seven slots, counting the Sugar Bowl tie-in and two combo bowls with the B1G. Four teams already qualified (TCU, Baylor, OSU, Oklahoma); Texas Tech has five wins. Three teams at 3-4 (Texas, Kansas State, and WVU). Might not get enough to fill all bowls, especially if their champion makes the playoffs. Iowa State (2 wins) and Kansas (winless) won't be bowling.
B1G: Nine slots if I understand the combined ACC/B1G spots correctly - plus a playoff team is OSU/MSU/Iowa finish strong - plus at least one more BCS at-large with the above. Six teams have 6+ wins (MSU, OSU, PSU, Iowa, Wisconsin, Northwestern); Michigan has 5; four wins for Indiana, Illinois, and Minnesota; and of course RU and Nebraska have 3 wins each. Minnesota and Illinois have some challenging games ahead and the loser of their game on Nov 21 might not get to six wins. Indiana will need to beat Purdue and Maryland, probably, because it will be tough for them to beat Iowa or Michigan.
ACC: Eight slots, plus a playoff spot if Clemson keeps it up. Five teams have 6+ wins (Clemson, FSU, UNC, Duke, Pitt); NC State has 5 wins; Miami has 4 wins; and six teams with 3 wins (Louisville, Syracuse, Wake Forest, BC, VT, and GT). Interesting stat: GT has 18 straight bowl appearances, so that is in jeopardy for sure. They still play Virginia, VT, Miami, and UGA. It will be close to fill those slots.
AMERICAN: Seven slots, plus the champion figures to get a BCS spot as the best Group of Five team. Three teams are at 7 wins (Memphis, Houston, Tulane); Navy is 5-1; and three have 4 wins (South Florida, East Carolina, and Cincinnati). UConn and Tulsa have 3 wins. No bowls for Tulane, SMU, or UCF. Feels more likely to fall short than to fill all bids.
This does not account for all of the at-large BCS spots, so there could be a few more that fall short.
And of course, nobody read all of that. :)
How will undeserving brand new bowl committees get their money, free junkets and tax write offs if they don't add more bowl games???
I don't even like 6-6 teams being "rewarded" with a bowl game. 5-7 teams, getting a bowl bid, is absolutely pathetic IMHO. Also, with ALL the off-season stuff kids do, on their own, do 15 extra practice sessions REALLY make that much of a difference in "the long run" Jelly? Or does better talent do that? Food for thought.
Not sure if you heard, but Rutgers has made Rutgers Camden tuition free for students from families making $60,000 or less and half off for families making $100,000 or less.
