Schiano wanted (and rightly so) improvements for football that cost a lot of money. Unfortunately that led to basketball being horribly neglected to the point of becoming a laughingstock.
Another Schiano Thread (yes, there's mutual interest according to my sources)...
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If you recall i was a big Schiano critic here. I think he is the best candidate for this particularly time
True but we also will be getting 20-40 million more. I was one of the few lamenting hoops being allowed to die on the vine by Uncle Bob...but if he didnt RU wouldnt be in the Big 10 despite the market
Why did we have a receiver drop a surefire td? Why did Ito miss a 50 some yard fg?
Those things tend to even out over time. You can't look at them by themselves without considering other teams' "what-ifs," for example, in certain close games that Rutgers may have won.
we beat Louisville..that wasnt a what if. Look Schiano had his share of disappointing no show games...I know very well as I was one of his harshest critics on the board and took a lot of heat for that.
That said this program is on life support...we have 16K season tickets and are getting maybe 15K to our games. Our talent level is as bad as it was under Shea relative to the competition. Thats why Schiano is the right guy at this time...all the bluster of Rose Bowl and championship is laughable on Hobbs part. Its not abou that.
I agree with your earlier post about not needing a program builder this time around and said as much in my first post. I also agree that Greg's resume is mediocre since he left Rutgers (I think he did better at TB than most do, but bottom line is he was fired after 2 years, which isn't good and his 3rd year at OSU was filled with injuries to his best players).
However, with regard to what Rutgers needs now, I don't much care that he may have struggled since RU. I'm confident he can light it up with recruiting, especially having the B1G behind him. I'm confident he hasn't lost his knack for identifying under-appreciated talent and developing talent (he was pretty famous for converting 2 and 3 star players into players who were very successful in the NFL). And I'm guardedly optimistic he's learned how to delegate more and be more of a CEO.
I also don't think it's fair to sum up his Rutgers career by saying he was 1 game over 0.500. Not sure you intended it that way, but it came across that way. Bottom line for me, is that I have less confidence in the names I've been hearing turning RU around as well and as fast as I think Schiano can. I'm certain someone other than Schiano can do it, but I just think the risk of failure is higher than it is with Greg.
Ignoring the first four rebuilding seasons, and starting with the season he got us to a bowl game.... from 2005-11, Schiano was 56-33 (63%). 8 of those wins came against FCS teams, making him 48-33 (59%) against FBS programs. He was 25-24 (51%) in Big East games, 6-6 (50%) in OOC games against BCS conferences, and 17-3 (85%) against non-BCS opponents out of conference. He was 4-8 (33%) against ranked opponents.
Certainly far and away better than what we've had the last several years, and the longest string of success we've had since the 70s, but the results don't really jump off the page.
Very well put.
Its not just the Greg-Cult vs the Anti-Schiano Patrol on here and it shouldnt be. Many of us here like yourself know he isnt flawless and are in fact open to other options, but also believe Schiano is the safest choice for a number of fair and legitimate reasons. That doesnt make you a cultist who refuses to acknowledge that he bleeds or has lost to WVU..
No matter who we hire, we arent winning anything of significance for the next 5 years, we are THAT devoid of talent. What we need more than anything is a person who could flat out recruit, lace the Banks with talent. We already know for a fact he could do this no matter how bleak our situation may be, and bleak it is. As long as we are searching he should remain in heavy consideration.
I see it the other way.
The most important thing Greg brings, is people know him. Certainly the fans, but also the donors, the media, and probably most importantly the high school football community, coaches and players included.
His name recognition immediately stabilizes the situation.
I'd also say that, despite some mixed results post 2006, he did have a big recruiting year on his way out. It's very possible he would have had some very good seasons if he had stayed. At which point the recruiting may have further improved. Remember Flood had a stacked recruiting class going before, what seemed like out of nowhere, the wheels started to fall off. Imagine if Schiano had stayed and he had convinced Barkley to stay.
Speculation for sure, but pretty reasonable speculation.
I've said several times in the past that the introduction of Hafley opened a lot of doors for that 2012 class and took Schiano's already above average recruiting to the next higher level. Had they both stayed 2-3 more years together here, I agree that we could have really hit a new plateau of what we defined as "normal". That 2012 class was ranked 24th nationally and best in the Big East.... last year, a 24th national ranking would have been 4th in the B1G East. We need that level of recruiting consistently to be competitive in our division.
Unfortunately we don't have anything on which to base your optimism. All we have is his body of work, taken as a whole.
And on the whole, I don't see him as a breakaway candidate for this job.
I don't disagree with your overall viewpoint, but was more just saying I am not one who looks at close losses and says they should have been wins. Rutgers was also fortunate to win close games. Even games like UNC in 2006 (which I traveled to). If they lose that, is the whole season different? I was just saying close wins and losses tend to even out over time -- I'm sure they generally did for Schiano in his 11 seasons at Rutgers.
I'm fine with hiring him now, but the way some are gushing over him makes those people seem a bit foolish in my opinion. I for one won't skewer Hobbs if Schiano doesn't work out so long as he gets a staff in place that is as close to a sure thing as you can get at this point in time.
Syracuse won 10 games last year with similar rated talent. I don't know if that is "winning anything of significance," but I'd say getting to and winning any bowl game would be significant for Rutgers. There is absolutely no reason that should take beyond 3 years in the present state of college football and the Rutgers program as a whole.
Amen brother, this program needs a young charismatic coach, who can recruiting and relate to the players. Schiano's old school ways won't cut it here.
You also have to remember that RU was outspending every team in the BE on football by the time RU left, and we still weren't winning. He was/is a solid coach, but he doesn't jump out as outstanding. Still, I get the impulse to want a guy who is proven to be solid.
http://businessofcollegesports.com/2011/03/23/money-not-as-big-in-big-east-football/
He was hired by Tennessee and that’s a pretty big endorsement and they certainly have far more success as a program than RU. Yes, the fans started a mutiny and didn’t think he was prestigious enough and so they pulled the offer. And by the time they were done with him they created the narrative that he was somehow associated with the PSU/Sandusky matter. Now listen, I’m not a big Schiano fan, but we at least need to get our facts right - Tennessee did try to hire him.
I find this narrative that Schiano is a bad or even “average” coach ridiculous. In the past 5 years, he was hired by the second best coach in college football, the University of Tennessee and the best coach in the NFL.
You can question whether he’s the right fit here but by questioning his coaching you stand at odds, at the very least, with Urban and Belichick.
You can question whether he’s the right fit here but by questioning his coaching you stand at odds, at the very least, with Urban and Belichick.
You can be wonderful football mind/DC and not a great HC the skillsets are not the same, as I think we recently learned. Also, even top coaches get hires wrong, you can be a great football mind and an OK coach. The simple fact of the matter is he coached one of OSU's worst defenses of all time last year. That is not something we would overlook in another candidate.
So lets say we map this on to our current situation.
We have 4 (currently) ranked teams on our schedule. Based on the above we should, on average, go 1.33-2.66 against them
We have 6 non-Ranked "BCS" teams on our schedule. Removing the ranked teams from the BE and OOC BCS teams above, we should win 55% of these games, so 3.3-2.7
Against Non-BCS FBS teams we should be 85%, or 1.7-0.3.
So, on average, with our current schedule we should expect to go 6.33 - 5.66. So over three years we should go 7-5, 6-6, and 6-6.
Or, if we assume something like a 2 Win/Loss standard deviation, in a three year span we could expected to go something like 4-8, 6-6, 9-3 (depending on where we are at in the "rebuild" cycle from a talent POV).
Is that the type of three year performance folks would be happy with?
He was about to take over in Tennessee before their lynch mob ran him out of town. For reasons having nothing to do with his coaching ability, I might add.
yeah and history is littered with people who were supposed geniuses in their field hiring and making decisions that made zero sense. Saying he worked for this guy or that guy holds no sway. Ash worked for him too and how did that turn out?
Urban’s tree produced like 15 HCs. Sure, not all turned out to be great HCs but working under Urban actually does matter. His opinion is valued. Same with Belichick. Yeah, I get it, the fact that 2 HOF coaches think very highly of Schiano doesn’t guarantee success, but it’s ridiculous to dismiss such coaches simply because you don’t think the guy is a good coach.
Any successful college program will tell you how important the three headed team of : coach, AD and President is.
If Schiano and Hobbs even have a chance at not being able to work well together , that along with the likelihood that he hasn’t been able to change his managerial ways - then his hire could actually put us in a terrible position
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We’ve had Paterno, Walsh and Meyer recommendations that all sucked.
Here's the goal...
Annual basis... worst case scenario
Beat UMD, Indiana, 3 OOC games, 1 B1G West team
Compete with Mich St, PSU, other 2 B1G West
Upset OSU or Mich once in a while
7-5. Bowling.
Many feel like schiano can get us to that baseline. And that baseline is light years ahead of where we are right now. If we want to do better, maybe he's not the guy, but the floor with the other candidates mentioned seem much lower.
Annual basis... worst case scenario
Beat UMD, Indiana, 3 OOC games, 1 B1G West team
Compete with Mich St, PSU, other 2 B1G West
Upset OSU or Mich once in a while
7-5. Bowling.
Many feel like schiano can get us to that baseline. And that baseline is light years ahead of where we are right now. If we want to do better, maybe he's not the guy, but the floor with the other candidates mentioned seem much lower.
Six sentences means you read the first three paragraphs which had very long sentences prolonged by commas galore.
What you did not miss then was the OP basically ratting out this highly credible source by linking him to Greg and stating he was very good friends with him..that certainly narrows the pool of sources. Greg is not going to be happy when he reads TKR and this thread.
Schiano is presumably one of a very limited pool of viable candidates who would be able to light a match under this program immediately. I say hire him, get some very good assistants, and let them recruit their tails off. Get better players on the field and hopefully be competitive. If nothing else, the hope is better facilities and better players will be more attractive to a future coach if Greg doesn't pan out. PLUS we will have more money should we need to hire a successor to Greg. If the next coach after Greg doesn't work out, we all might need to gather for a summer tailgate. Bring gas containers and some matches and we all march to the stadium to burn that place to the ground. I'm well beyond frustrated and disinterested at this point. To quote a famous movie line "I'm mad as hell...and I can't take it anymore!!!!"
Well the one Paterno recommended not to take the job worked out pretty well after he did.
Maybe Hobbs should look for the ones told not to come and forget about the ones recommended [roll]
This is pretty much as I see it, from an expectation point of view. Back to .500 seasons and bowls... with the occasional 7-5 (or even 8-4) season, and the occasional 5-7 (or 4-8) season, depending on who we draw in the cross-divisional matchups and how strong the OOC is that year.
Back to respectability, but still consistently 4th/5th in the B1G East.
But they didn't because the fans there, who might know more about winning, didn't want him.
You could add that, but you'd be wrong. The PSU stuff was drummed up by Tennessee fans who simply didn't want him because they thought he wasn't a good enough coach. Simple as that.
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