Coach Mike Rice

[Bobol]

There is speculation among St. John's fans that former Rutgers men's basketball head coach Mike Rice may be added as an assistant coach.

Apparently Rice has addressed anger issues and is leading a successful AAU program.

My questions are:
* what were your impressions of Rice when he coached Rutgers?
* was he a good bench coach?
* was he a good recruiter?
* were his indiscretions overblown by the media?
* in your opinion would a school be wise to hire Mike Rice as an assistant coach?

Thanks for your replies.

 

[Caliknight]

Total meathead. Spaz. Sometimes people don't have issues. It's just who they are. I am guessing Rice falls under that category.

I remember Bilas saying he was at a practice before the BE tourney and he was shocked how the kids were being treated. He told someone that you simply can't coach that way. I am guessing that video was the least of what was going on.

I am all for second chances though. Hopefully he's changed his behavior. But I wouldn't want him near Rutgers even to get water.

 

[Local Shill]

There is speculation among St. John's fans that former Rutgers men's basketball head coach Mike Rice may be added as an assistant coach.

Apparently Rice has addressed anger issues and is leading a successful AAU program.

My questions are:
* what were your impressions of Rice when he coached Rutgers?
* was he a good bench coach?
* was he a good recruiter?
* were his indiscretions overblown by the media?
* in your opinion would a school be wise to hire Mike Rice as an assistant coach?

Thanks for your replies.

-Really good defensive coach. Offense was too stagnant for my liking. Loved the fight his teams showed.
-yes, kept his team in games. Made the most of talent that wasn’t elite.
-for Rutgers’ level, pretty good.
-yes
-not sure how he’d be not being the boss but that’s obviously his only way back into college coaching

 

[KnightTerrors]

I always liked Rice. As a fan, I loved seeing a coach that seemed to want to win and see effort as badly as I did. It was fun to count the minutes until his suit jacket would come off and the sweaty shirt would appear. He had some good classes and some big wins.

IMO he deserved to lose his job but he also deserves a second chance. He was humiliated, had his reputation tarnished, and hasn’t gotten a chance at redemption for years.

 

[Upstream]

Rice was an enigma. He was actually a really nice guy and a decent coach. But he couldn't control his emotions and when he got out of control he was really out of control. But he is now painfully aware of his failings, and if he is under a head coach who keeps an eye on him to keep in control, he could be an asset.

 

[Local Shill]

On related note, the already interesting SJU-RU game at the RAC in November will get even more interesting if Mike is there on the sidelines.

 

[Mr Magoo]

The players initially reacted to his high-strung antics and over-performed, and then, in my opinion, he lost them and became kind of a buffoon. The program was stagnating when he went off the deep-end.

Funny thing is, years later he was still a nut-job in the stands of his son’s high school basketball games.

 

[Rac'nRoll]

1.) He was a pretty good bench coach as evidenced by a difficult come-from-behind win vs a #9 'Nova team and an upset of a Top 10 Billy Donovan coached Florida team.
https://www.nj.com/rutgersbasketball/index.ssf/2011/02/miracle_shot_by_jonathan_mitch.html
https://www.nj.com/rutgersbasketball/index.ssf/2011/12/rutgers_shocks_no_10_florida_8.html

2.) He couldn't recruit his way out of a paper bag and it'll be tougher now because of his rep

3.) Yes, his indiscretions were overblown by the media because ESPN effectively ran a continuous loop of the tape provided by assistant Eric Murdock. But just 'cause they were overblown doesn't mean they weren't really really bad. They were. Remember, Tim Pernetti initially just suspended Rice in December because he didn't wanna fire him and have to pay him. It was only when the tape came out that he had to go

4.) A school would be unwise to hire Mike Rice in any capacity

 

[RUinFla]

The players initially reacted to his high-strung antics and over-performed, and then, in my opinion, he lost them and became kind of a buffoon. The program was stagnating when he went off the deep-end.

Funny thing is, years later he was still a nut-job in the stands of his son’s high school basketball games.

Saw the same thing happen with Matt Doherty, when he lost his job with NC and a couple of years later, took the Florida Atlantic job. He brought a couple of very good recruits with questionable academic credentials along, and the team played well. But saw him scream at them on the sidelines once too often and saw them close down. The team was never quite the same, and the following year, Doherty migrated to SMU. Coached a few years there and was gone. Today's players just won't put up with that kind of coach. If a coach screams at his team on the sidelines during a game, you have to wonder how he is in the locker room and at practice.
That said, people can change. Or at least change their behavior. Hope Mike Rice is one of those.
TL

 

[Russ Wood]

There is speculation among St. John's fans that former Rutgers men's basketball head coach Mike Rice may be added as an assistant coach.

Fwiw, I've seen this elsewhere so I asked someone close to Coach Rice about it and he told me "That's old news. Nothing new on that."

 

[Big East Beast]

Rice was an enigma. He was actually a really nice guy and a decent coach. But he couldn't control his emotions and when he got out of control he was really out of control. But he is now painfully aware of his failings, and if he is under a head coach who keeps an eye on him to keep in control, he could be an asset.

I tend to agree with this sentiment; plenty of guys can’t handle the kind of spotlight he was under. That said, I’d be more inclined to say it was a good idea under a veteran guy where there was no question about authority and that he could learn from like - how Calhoun used to have old HCs on staff; Mullin actually has had less head coaching experience / succes so probably not the best situation.

 

[RU-ROCS]

I always liked Rice. As a fan, I loved seeing a coach that seemed to want to win and see effort as badly as I did. It was fun to count the minutes until his suit jacket would come off and the sweaty shirt would appear. He had some good classes and some big wins.

IMO he deserved to lose his job but he also deserves a second chance. He was humiliated, had his reputation tarnished, and hasn’t gotten a chance at redemption for years.

I feel the same way. The guy is a very good coach if he’s fixed his anger issues.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

Excellent defensive coach.

 

[MADHAT1]

Can only speculate that MR won't mess up under the pressure of having HC responsibility if given another shot.
But feel he'd make a great assistant and would be a good hire for any program that could use a defensive minded assistant.
His experience as HC (Robert Morris & Rutgers) would be an asset for just about any program that hires him.
But in this day and age, his reputation might keep programs from hiring him and a few more years at the HS level to prove he has changed might be what we see before a program hires him as an assistant.

 

[bowlgoal]

There is speculation among St. John's fans that former Rutgers men's basketball head coach Mike Rice may be added as an assistant coach.

Apparently Rice has addressed anger issues and is leading a successful AAU program.

My questions are:
* what were your impressions of Rice when he coached Rutgers?
* was he a good bench coach?
* was he a good recruiter?
* were his indiscretions overblown by the media?
* in your opinion would a school be wise to hire Mike Rice as an assistant coach?

Thanks for your replies.

Really pathetic that there are people badmouthing someone they don't know, period. Mike came to Rutgers with zero support of the program and recruited a very good initial class. He was on the right track and unfortunately coaching in the Big East was as high pressure as it got in college basketball. Did he fly off the handle sometimes? Name me coaches who have never done that? The second post in this thread is just an example of what can happen on the internet when people read nonsense.

Mike would be a huge help to St. Johns.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Don’t need to know the guy. Plenty of evidence out there to badmouth.

Did you not read the quotes?

Things he said were disgusting. His physical actions caught on tape were disturbing. Someone that said the things he said is a bad person. Sorry.

 

[bowlgoal]

Maybe I didn’t read all that you’ve read but I know that coaches sometimes say crazy things in the heat of practice. It’s simply not released to espn by some disgruntled coach black mailing the school for money. That’s what this was about.

There weren’t former players lining up to say how bad this guy was to them. There were a few who wanted to jump on the gravy train and take advantage so they can get paid.

Maybe I just know Mike and I’m telling you he’s far from the monster he was made out to be. He’s paid a very dear price and I hope things work out for him because he’s one of the good guys and deserves another shot

 

[BillyC80]

Strictly in a basketball sense, I thought Rice’s teams were too aggressive on defense, expending far too much energy and fouling way too much. I believe those extremes on defense hurt us on the offensive end.

 

[whofrewdatmataRU13]

I liked Rice, thought he was a good coach.

 

[RUinFla]

Maybe I didn’t read all that you’ve read but I know that coaches sometimes say crazy things in the heat of practice. It’s simply not released to espn by some disgruntled coach black mailing the school for money. That’s what this was about.

There weren’t former players lining up to say how bad this guy was to them. There were a few who wanted to jump on the gravy train and take advantage so they can get paid.

Maybe I just know Mike and I’m telling you he’s far from the monster he was made out to be. He’s paid a very dear price and I hope things work out for him because he’s one of the good guys and deserves another shot

To be fair, the infamous video was a compilation of moments filmed by his trusty assistant to make him look bad. But he did what he did. Multiple times. Could see if he snapped once, but he did the same thing often. No matter how nice a guy he is, he needs to convince people he has changed his behavior. Shrinks will tell you, they can't change a person, but they can help that person change their behavior. Hoping he gets a second chance.
TL

 

[Caliknight]

Mike Rice is the type of coach you get when you can't get anyone else. That's how he wound up at RU at the time. He was a very poor representative of the school.

I hope he goes to St. John's.

 

[Plum Street]

At Rutgers he was a way better coach than the guy that preceded him, and he was way better than the guy that succeeded him.
And it’s not even close. Sad.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Maybe I didn’t read all that you’ve read but I know that coaches sometimes say crazy things in the heat of practice. It’s simply not released to espn by some disgruntled coach black mailing the school for money. That’s what this was about.

There weren’t former players lining up to say how bad this guy was to them. There were a few who wanted to jump on the gravy train and take advantage so they can get paid.

Maybe I just know Mike and I’m telling you he’s far from the monster he was made out to be. He’s paid a very dear price and I hope things work out for him because he’s one of the good guys and deserves another shot

The guy made fun of people's ethnicity and hurled homophobic slurs directly at individuals in front of the team and hid behind the power of being the head coach.

No one made him out to be a monster. He did it on his own. The fact that he is relevant in the basketball world right now tells me hasn't paid a dear price.

I am guessing you really don't know Mike Rice.

 

[RUBigFrank]

Seen him recently (past year) at rebounds in Neptune. Still has an edge. Someone who was unaware of who he is - asked "who is that asshole?"

In the competitive world of coaching in college ball I am sure that his antics are not unique.

 

[bowlgoal]

Maybe I didn’t read all that you’ve read but I know that coaches sometimes say crazy things in the heat of practice. It’s simply not released to espn by some disgruntled coach black mailing the school for money. That’s what this was about.

There weren’t former players lining up to say how bad this guy was to them. There were a few who wanted to jump on the gravy train and take advantage so they can get paid.

Maybe I just know Mike and I’m telling you he’s far from the monster he was made out to be. He’s paid a very dear price and I hope things work out for him because he’s one of the good guys and deserves another shot

The guy made fun of people's ethnicity and hurled homophobic slurs directly at individuals in front of the team and hid behind the power of being the head coach.

No one made him out to be a monster. He did it on his own. The fact that he is relevant in the basketball world right now tells me hasn't paid a dear price.

I am guessing you really don't know Mike Rice.

I don’t know what ethnicity you are talking about (seems odd) and made up to add to the story but the homophobic slur was a street term used by many growing up on the playground; very similar to calling someone a fairy. Nobody was thinking oh I’m against the homosexual population and that’s what I meant. Yes, In today’s world when you print that story and show a clip of video, you can paint any picture you choose to paint.

I’m going to leave this conversation alone because it’s not going anywhere. Not worth fighting about. Mike is a good guy with great kids of his own and he went off in a practice and it’s on tape that was shipped to espn if Rutgers didn’t pony open money. He was very animated on the sidelines and he’s a fierce competitor.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Biruta, who was born in Lithuania but played high school basketball in New Jersey, described his treatment.

"He would throw his cap at me and he would call me many names," he said of Rice. "The adjectives were creative. They were mean words."

Biruta said Rice's insults were often not about his game but about him personally. "If you're going to criticize me as a basketball player, I'm OK with that," he said, "but he would criticize me as a person."

On a 30-minute video Murdock said he showed Pernetti and other Rutgers officials in December, Rice is seen hurling a ball from point-blank range just passed Biruta's head, shoving him and repeatedly swearing at him. At another point, Rice hurls a ball that strikes Biruta's knee. He appears momentarily hurt and has to sit out a play.

"The one thing I hated," Murdock said of Rice, "he would always talk about 'Lithuanian this, Lithuanian that,' talk about where he's from, 'soft-ass Lithuanian b----,' 'soft-ass Lithuanian p----.' His nickname was basically 'Lithuanian f----t.'"

Biruta said the main reason he left Rutgers was because of Rice's treatment. "Mostly it was because of the way he was leading the team," he said. "I didn't think that was a way to lead."

Some players were deeply affected by Rice's treatment of them, Murdock said, adding that he watched it undermine their desire to play. "There were some players who couldn't sleep at night, who wasn't eating, who didn't want to come to the gym," he said, adding that he told Pernetti about that, too, in December.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

I don’t know what ethnicity you are talking about (seems odd) and made up to add to the story but the homophobic slur was a street term used by many growing up on the playground; very similar to calling someone a fairy. Nobody was thinking oh I’m against the homosexual population and that’s what I meant. Yes, In today’s world when you print that story and show a clip of video, you can paint any picture you choose to paint.

I’m going to leave this conversation alone because it’s not going anywhere. Not worth fighting about. Mike is a good guy with great kids of his own and he went off in a practice and it’s on tape that was shipped to espn if Rutgers didn’t pony open money. He was very animated on the sidelines and he’s a fierce competitor.

Believe what you want to believe.

 

[RUskoolie]

Believe what you want to believe.

He's correct.

I guess it slipped your mind that Eric Murdoch was a massive POS and tried to bribe RU for money and then when he didn't get it he sent the tape to ESPN. You keep believing he cared about the players welfare first and foremost though.

To answer OPs question, he was a good defensive coach and everyone piled on that guy blindly IMO and Rutgers BOG and school President made it 10x as worse by acting like the typical buffoons that they are. His recruiting was dead though based on how he treated his guys.

 

[ScarletDave]

Couldn’t recruit amazing players because of the lack of facilities at the time but somehow still brought in reasonable talent. Won his fair share of upset victories. Got the crowd into it. If he was at a Coach K or Izzy type program he would still be there. But he had no chance at Rutgers once the video came out. He’s a good guy though I think, just a little out of control when coaching. But strategy wise he’s good so if you’re desperate, yea take him on.

 

[littlenis5]

He's correct.

I guess it slipped your mind that Eric Murdoch was a massive POS and tried to bribe RU for money and then when he didn't get it he sent the tape to ESPN. You keep believing he cared about the players welfare first and foremost though.

To answer OPs question, he was a good defensive coach and everyone piled on that guy blindly IMO and Rutgers BOG and school President made it 10x as worse by acting like the typical buffoons that they are. His recruiting was dead though based on how he treated his guys.

Two things can be true. Both Rice and Murdoch can be...not great people

 

[MADHAT1]

Murdoch was/is scum that used practice videos to get even for not being retained.
ESPN allowed videos that had just about all of its content edited out and the part that fit Murdoch’s agenda used to make the RUMBB program look like a rogue one.
But the fact is: even though Murdock was a villain, Mike Rice was one as well and this is about Rice’s actions that caused ( deservingly so) his being booted from the program.
I believe MR felt the pressure that comes from not being sure you can get the job done in an environment that holds you back, but that doesn’t excuse how he treated his players. No matter if it was only a few occasions or most of the time when they made a mistake, Rice acted like a villain and allowed his staff to be one too.
Hopefully he has learned a better way to handle the pressure and gets a chance to prove he’s changed, but I feel no major CBB program will take a chance on hiring him as even an assistant and being a HS HC or assistant at a a lower level for a few more years, to prove himself is his only chance to have any major CBB program feel he might be worth hiring as an assistant or a lesser conference school (MAAC/The Horizon League /Atlantic 10 ) giving him another chance as a HC.
But Mike Rice brought this on himself and now it’s up to him to prove he has changed before getting another college coaching position

 

[G- RUnit]

Mike Rice was a very good coach and RU overreacted because Eric Murdock was vindictive and made a videotape that could have been made against any head coach in the country. ESPN and Ledger loved it as good for ratings. Rice got a raw deal. So did Loyal son Pernetti.

Rice got more out of Biruta at RU than Hurley did at URI.

Murdock was the snake because he couldn’t get his way. Sad and Mind boggling.

Another one of Ru’s silly self imposed penalties. RU so often own worst enemy!

 

[G- RUnit]

Urban got suspended for three games. In the grand scheme of things... smh

 

[Mr Magoo]

Urban got suspended for three games. In the grand scheme of things... smh

Over-reaction to both incidents. We should be focusing on the real ones, like the past ones at UNC and Penn State, and the current one at Maryland.

 

[RUinFla]

Mike Rice was a very good coach and RU overreacted because Eric Murdock was vindictive and made a videotape that could have been made against any head coach in the country. ESPN and Ledger loved it as good for ratings. Rice got a raw deal. So did Loyal son Pernetti.

Rice got more out of Biruta at RU than Hurley did at URI.

Murdock was the snake because he couldn’t get his way. Sad and Mind boggling.

Another one of Ru’s silly self imposed penalties. RU so often own worst enemy!

Mike Rice is, in fact, a good coach. And the video was edited into snippets. But you really cannot have coaches berating players continually for their background or heaving balls at their heads. That may be the MO of a DI at Marine Corps basic, but it should not be the MO of a college basketball coach. Edited video or not, the video doesn't lie. Coach Rice was out of control multiple times. Had there not been a video, he would have been suspended--as he was-- and just maybe, he would not have repeated his behavior. My money would be on him regressing to that behavior under stress.

I was greatly pleased when they hired him, and liked where he was going with the program. Still believe in him as a coach. It turns out he had Issues. Hopefully, he has gotten help and at some point can resume his career. But saying he should not have been fired is revisionist history.
TL

 

[G- RUnit]

After seeing what’s going on at Maryland, PSU and OSU, it ain’t revisionist history. We way over reacted and feel victim to Ledger and ESPN. Geeze Pernetti got fired and he was right all along.
Shame. Rice is a good coach and deserves another shot.

 

[RUBigFrank]

Was an overreaction much the same with Bob Mucahey firing. Program had momentum - but one wonders how it would have impacted recruiting on going? May not like the antics but he is a good coach. As a person - well that is another story.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Maybe Eric Murdock is a bad guy. Are people making a poor judgement on him?

I obviously don't have all the facts here, but I have observations.

Shouldn't he be commended for speaking out?
From observations on the bench Rice treated Murdock like crap. There was one interaction during a game in front of the team and crowd where Rice went off on him.

 

[RUinOhio]

is there anyone who can corroborate this statement? seems a bit far fetched even in Biruta's case.

Some players were deeply affected by Rice's treatment of them, Murdock said, adding that he watched it undermine their desire to play. "There were some players who couldn't sleep at night, who wasn't eating, who didn't want to come to the gym," he said, adding that he told Pernetti about that, too, in December.

 

[bowlgoal]

Maybe Eric Murdock is a bad guy. Are people making a poor judgement on him?

I obviously don't have all the facts here, but I have observations.

Shouldn't he be commended for speaking out?
From observations on the bench Rice treated Murdock like crap. There was one interaction during a game in front of the team and crowd where Rice went off on him.

Greene, do you know that Eric Murdock's contract as an assistant was not renewed by Rice and that's the reason he wrote a demand letter asking for $900,000 or else here';s what I'm doing and then he just did it. He took property from Rutgers into his own possession and essentially tried to extort money. If he wanted to call it win for himself, I believe RU wrote a $500k check to him after it all ended. I'm not sure this a world we should be living in, but it is? Unfortunately for his future, who in their right mind would ever hire a guy like Murdock again in basketball? Assistants do not have to be renewed. He just refused to accept that. Maybe that karma followed him to his restaurant failing that he opened.

So, you can think what you want about Mike Rice and keeping dumping on him. I'm rooting for him to come back strong and coach again in college. I think St. Johns is a step in that direction and maybe he gets another shot. He did a good job in High School and again, his mistake was intensified 10 fold by ESPN.