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Do all the QBs other than Laviano really suck?

lighty

lighty

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Aug 13, 2003
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In other thread, a mod said that the reason Laviano was always playing was because Rettig didn't have it going on upstairs AND the team supported Laviano and didn't want the backup on the field.

I just don't buy it.

The team HAS to recognize that we're not scoring touchdowns. They have to see all of the three and outs taking place. And how nobody but Carroo is ever being thrown the ball.

Maybe Rettig isn't the answer. I don't know. He has looked better than Laviano to me when he's been in the games, but Flood has limited his time so much that the average fan has no idea what his ability is. But if what the mod is saying is true, doesn't that mean that EVERY OTHER QB is equally as bad as Rettig?

That's hard to believe. We've all seen Laviano struggle MIGHTILY this season. If Rutgers does not have a single QB that could be put in to possibly give the team a spark or give Laviano a breather to watch a few plays from the sideline than we are in worse straits than I ever imagined.

Has Flood instilled such a "family" atmosphere and "nice guy" atmosphere that the team would rather have their friend at QB even while he struggles OR are the backups really that bad? Is this why some here are putting their faith in Russo coming in? Are we planning on seeing another true freshman start at QB?
 
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Proud NJ Sports Fan said:
Rettig is way better.

Dare and Gio will be better next Fall now that they have grasped the playbook.

Laviano stinks,period.
Click to expand...

And that sums up why our offense stinks. If you can't play people because they can't grasp the playbook, your playbook is at fault. This is college, you're going to have a lot of turnover and you can't be in a situation where players need years to get up to speed.
 
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lighty said:
In other thread, a mod said that the reason Laviano was always playing was because Rettig didn't have it going on upstairs AND the team supported Laviano and didn't want the backup on the field.

I just don't buy it.

The team HAS to recognize that we're not scoring touchdowns. They have to see all of the three and outs taking place. And how nobody but Carroo is ever being thrown the ball.

Maybe Rettig isn't the answer. I don't know. He has looked better than Laviano to me when he's been in the games, but Flood has limited his time so much that the average fan has no idea what his ability is. But if what the mod is saying is true, doesn't that mean that EVERY OTHER QB is equally as bad as Rettig?

That's hard to believe. We've all seen Laviano struggle MIGHTILY this season. If Rutgers does not have a single QB that could be put in to possibly give the team a spark or give Laviano a breather to watch a few plays from the sideline than we are in worse straits than I ever imagined.

Has Flood instilled such a "family" atmosphere and "nice guy" atmosphere that the team would rather have their friend at QB even while he struggles OR are the backups really that bad? Is this why some here are putting their faith in Russo coming in? Are we planning on seeing another true freshman start at QB?
Click to expand...
I am not defending Laviano, but have you noticed the OL has sucked the last several games, except for Army?
Now, Army. Laviano missed a wide open pass to a TE, but other than that, were the WRs getting open down field.

Your indictment is a gross oversimplification of the problem, unless the problem is the receivers are not running deep routes in the first place because Laviano can't throw a deep ball. But he has, on occasion. Some (maybe many) have not been pretty.

Do you really think Flood, who knows/knew his job has been on the line this year, would put the most popular QB on the team in as the starter? I don't think that is to be the case, and if it is, Flood is more stubborn and stupid than many of us believe.
 
This the same guy that didn't start players like Marcus Cooper and Tim Wright who are playing on Sunday. Didn't make any effort to get Tyler Kroft any catches last year(3rd round draft pick). Was OC during the wild knight fiasco. Recruited some of the worst OL prospects we've ever had( ahem Vicioso ) .Yet we're supposed to trust in his evaluation skills of who's the better QB?
 
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Knight Shift said:
I am not defending Laviano, but have you noticed the OL has sucked the last several games, except for Army?
Now, Army. Laviano missed a wide open pass to a TE, but other than that, were the WRs getting open down field.

Your indictment is a gross oversimplification of the problem, unless the problem is the receivers are not running deep routes in the first place because Laviano can't throw a deep ball. But he has, on occasion. Some (maybe many) have not been pretty.

Do you really think Flood, who knows/knew his job has been on the line this year, would put the most popular QB on the team in as the starter? I don't think that is to be the case, and if it is, Flood is more stubborn and stupid than many of us believe.
Click to expand...
The OL has underperformed but I think that is more on technique than talent. When the OL is allowed to fire off the ball and play nose on nose football they perform well. When the game plan is finesse zone blocking (Kyle Flood's expertise) they do not fair as well. This staff has 3, count them, 3 coaches on staff that have OL coaching experience. This is something that should be a strong point.

As far as QB talent. There are 4QB's on the roster. 2 throw very well 2 have fundamental problems and 1 has a very weak arm. I advise people to get to the game early enough to watch the warm ups. They are eye opening to say the least. To say that one QB does not have support of the locker room is true but it is not the one you think. Watch the body language of the skill players.
 
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I think that there are a few problems going on. The primary one being that player development this season and last has suffered significantly. The only outlier being Nova, last year. Other than that, our OL has regressed. Yes, we are up against better competition these days but this is clearly not the OL from the mid-2000s. The WRs, who have showed some flashes, have also not improved at all. (Also, our defense hasn't exactly done the offense any favors.) I believe that all of these things, along with no development at the QB position, have shown our offense to be exactly what it is. But, putting this all on Laviano reminds me of that old saying, "the quarterback gets too much of the credit when the team wins and too much of the blame when the team loses."
 
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Kids know talent. I'd be shocked if they aren't thinking why Rettig doesn't play.

There sure seems to be a spark when he goes in.
 
Laviano has not "stunk" all season. He was good the first part of the season, but has not had the same production, obviously, in the later part, and I assume that there are many reasons, some on Laviano, some on the receivers, some on the OL. Coaches have more information than fans so I haven't been critical of Flood's decision to start CL; however, it does make me wonder why Flood wouldn't make the competition more competitive. If the competition was close, as Flood claimed, coaches would tell their players that he will go with the "hot hand" if one of them is struggling. Again, Flood and his assistants know more than me, but it does seem curious.
 
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Brandon Jones, Marcus Cooper and Logan Ryan all made NFL rosters, at least practice squads. Pissing and moaning about which one didn't start at Rutgers is absurd.
 
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Cantbelieveit99 said:
This the same guy that didn't start players like Marcus Cooper and Tim Wright who are playing on Sunday. Didn't make any effort to get Tyler Kroft any catches last year(3rd round draft pick). Was OC during the wild knight fiasco. Recruited some of the worst OL prospects we've ever had( ahem Vicioso ) .Yet we're supposed to trust in his evaluation skills of who's the better QB?
Click to expand...
And many people want the same guy back who did not stick with Tom Savage. . . . .
 
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Caliknight said:
Kids know talent. I'd be shocked if they aren't thinking why Rettig doesn't play.

There sure seems to be a spark when he goes in.
Click to expand...
I certainly noticed the difference in the Michigan game. The already defeated and down trodden Knights sparked to life when Rettig came in. His first series they gained 5 yards on 3 plays, the second series 8 yards on 4 plays. Quite a turn around if you ask me.

This teams' problems may start at the QB position but they run a lot deeper than that.
 
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Knight Shift said:
Do you really think Flood, who knows/knew his job has been on the line this year
Click to expand...

Unless he either truly believes or was told that his job is not on the line.

All I know is that it my job was on the line, I would have tried someone else -- just to see if the problems were entirely the OL, the receivers, or the QB. I don't think it's far-fetched to want to see what the problem is. Instead, Flood just assumes Laviano is the answer even when he struggles all game long.
 
Think of it this way, if our other QBs don't have it going on upstairs, why are we recruiting them???? Doesn't "coachablility" enter the equation? I would think it should.

I don't know why Laviano was chosen as starter, but he was. Frankly, I don't have a problem with Flood making that choice out of camp. What bothers me, is, you cannot watch the last few games and think that he should be out there for the 2nd half. TRY SOMETHING ELSE. If it doesn't work, so be it, but how continuing with what hasn't worked seems like a good strategy is more that I can possibly comprehend.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, when the QB starts to think instead of PLAY there are problems; playing to avoid mistakes is not a winning solution. Think of the player coming back after injury, if you won't play at full speed, you are not as effective (obviously), but I believe the odds of getting hurt again are greatly increased. Football is a full speed, full contact game, taking time to consider what you should do is detrimental.

Laviano should have been forced to sit the 2nd half of any of these losses, and coached up as soon as Sunday night. If he comes back Saturday as the starter, so be it. But, to let him learn through mistakes while literally getting the TAR KICKED OUT OF HIM, doesn't help him, doesn't help the team and leads me to believe the coach is an idiot!!
 
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Knight Shift said:
Do you really think Flood, who knows/knew his job has been on the line this year, would put the most popular QB on the team in as the starter? I don't think that is to be the case, and if it is, Flood is more stubborn and stupid than many of us believe.
Click to expand...

I tend to think Flood just isn't that good of a football coach, with all that implies. He's a fine guy, he's trying, he's just in over his head. He was convinced at some point in his life that you're better off picking a QB and sticking with him and that's that. That point is settled for him.

Similarly he was convinced at some point that stopping and establishing the run is what wins football games. Done and done.

His coaching shows all the hallmarks of a guy who learned things, took them to heart and tries to apply them, but has no real ability to think on his feet and adapt.
 
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It's likely that Flood thinks that Rettig can't properly read/react to the defensive schemes and prefers to have Laviano's dinks and dunks - which presents less risks of turnovers. There are times when the offense does move - but in the second half of the season - still cannot execute a score.

The issue with this approach is that the team is losing (often in big fashion) anyway and sometimes you have to change that up and try something different when what you are doing is not making an impact. Since you cannot change out the entire offense - you make the change where it would be most impactful - at QB. Perhaps Flood does not understand this...which is why most fans that were once/still on his side (even in light of the emailgate) - now want him out.
 
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Laviano does not totally comprehensively suck - it is just that he, either through pure lack of ability, consistently inadequate execution or whatever, has NOT proven to provide any genuine deep threat - defenses have no fear that he is going to crisply & suddenly drop back and rifle a spot-on 30 yard laser beam pass to a sprinting receiver. Sooo if they have no fear of getting toasted with sizzling downfield bullets - they crowd into where the action is - the strong teams then stuff the run & blast off toward the QB. Basically, once a strong opponent confirms their suspicions that Laviano won't be able to burn them deep, they just focus on the close to the line play & rain Armageddon down on him. Also - the RU offensive line would find it challenging to hold off some of the strongest opponents in the B1G - but when the strong opponents are confident that they can just rush with maximum intensity - go ballistic - without fear that Laviano could use their aggressiveness against them and make them look foolish - then it turns into a very very long game.
 
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lighty said:
In other thread, a mod said that the reason Laviano was always playing was because Rettig didn't have it going on upstairs AND the team supported Laviano and didn't want the backup on the field.

I just don't buy it.

The team HAS to recognize that we're not scoring touchdowns. They have to see all of the three and outs taking place. And how nobody but Carroo is ever being thrown the ball.

Maybe Rettig isn't the answer. I don't know. He has looked better than Laviano to me when he's been in the games, but Flood has limited his time so much that the average fan has no idea what his ability is. But if what the mod is saying is true, doesn't that mean that EVERY OTHER QB is equally as bad as Rettig?

That's hard to believe. We've all seen Laviano struggle MIGHTILY this season. If Rutgers does not have a single QB that could be put in to possibly give the team a spark or give Laviano a breather to watch a few plays from the sideline than we are in worse straits than I ever imagined.

Has Flood instilled such a "family" atmosphere and "nice guy" atmosphere that the team would rather have their friend at QB even while he struggles OR are the backups really that bad? Is this why some here are putting their faith in Russo coming in? Are we planning on seeing another true freshman start at QB?
Click to expand...

Shut the **** up already! For the love of god
 
RUInsanity said:
It's likely that Flood thinks that Rettig can't properly read/react to the defensive schemes and prefers to have Laviano's dinks and dunks - which presents less risks of turnovers. There are times when the offense does move - but in the second half of the season - still cannot execute a score.

The issue with this approach is that the team is losing (often in big fashion) anyway and sometimes you have to change that up and try something different when what you are doing is not making an impact. Since you cannot change out the entire offense - you make the change where it would be most impactful - at QB. Perhaps Flood does not understand this...which is why most fans that were once/still on his side (even in light of the emailgate) - now want him out.
Click to expand...
Or Rettig can read and react and that goes against the ball control eat clock mentality of the coaching staff. Stranger things have happened....
 
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kupuna133 said:
Or Rettig can read and react and that goes against the ball control eat clock mentality of the coaching staff. Stranger things have happened....
Click to expand...

I could buy this if we had stretches where we controlled the clock. I didn't expect to beat OSU or Michigan this year, but I expected we could keep it close. When the other team loads the box, the THREAT to throw over the top needs to be there, without that, nothing will back them off the line and running the ball eating clock becomes almost impossible.

I loved when our defenses were able to "pin their ears back" and just go to disrupt the other team's offense. Without a deep threat (hell, possibility), we are now the prey.

It's most likely a combination of O-line play and some limitations to QB arm strength, but whatever the reason, without being able to run we have little chance of controlling the clock.
 
QB in college now is the opposite of the NFL. It has been devalued to a large degree in many places due to some smart coaches with great systems. We have seen a good number of teams now placing their backups in the games due to injury and not really having too much of a drop off.

But at RU the coaches (and their bootlickers) still want us to believe Laviano >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>anyone else on our bench. Of course, it's mostly due to them being garbage coaches, not due to any significant differences between our QB's abilities. At least not to the order of magnitude of still being being a better option even after no passing touchdowns in a third of the season.

In the end, I'd like to see Rettig simply because Laviano has earned a seat and extreme poor performance must be punished in some way. Unfotunately, I don't think too much would change (though I would be surprised if there wasn't some improvement). Again, not because of the players involved, but because the coaches are truly horrible.
 
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It has seemed that there is something that bugs Flood about Rettig - and it appears to be in a way that causes Flood to be a bit weird (about a mild as it can be put)

Flood has been almost irrationally resistant when dealing with the simple idea that - "if something is not working effectively, try something else". Flood has adamantly (belligerently) refused to allocate any quality playing time to Rettig - - and this is way, way beyond just "Chris is our starter" - this is - gee we have gotten absolutely nothing - zero- out of Chris for 3 quarters - so, let's give him half of the 4th quarter too ....

For me, a HUGE red flag went up about this situation back when Flood announced that Laviano would be the starter - Flood did something that was either just mindlessly stupid verbal diarrhea - or some of the most twisted & cynical passive aggressive crap that I have ever seen from a college coach who is generally viewed as 'even-handed'

Flood was asked what specifically separated Laviano from Rettig - - he said that he did not want to answer that ... but then said some totally unnecessary crap that revealed that he perceived significant flaws in Rettigs game :

"I wouldn't want to do that because I don't really want to share what we see as a staff as maybe the deficiencies of any of our players and give those thing up in game planning to our opponents," Flood said.

- weird - since this was a QB contest that Flood had been saying was close, close, close -
 
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The truth is Rettig lacks accuracy and touch as well as having play learning issues but it seems to fit the narrative that people want to have that the answers to our QB problems is sitting on the bench and our dumb coach just refuses to see it.
We simply don't have the answer on the roster right now. Just like when we started Dodd for those three games in place of Nova and he played god awful. People always leave that one out of the history here.
Rettig has now been riding the pine at two colleges. The idea that he is our savior at QB if he only got the chance is just people dreaming.
I'm hopeful that Russo ends up here and we actually have some talent at QB.
 
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Knight Ed said:
The truth is Rettig lacks accuracy and touch as well as having play learning issues but it seems to fit the narrative that people want to have that the answers to our QB problems is sitting on the bench and our dumb coach just refuses to see it.
We simply don't have the answer on the roster right now. Just like when we started Dodd for those three games in place of Nova and he played god awful. People always leave that one out of the history here.
Rettig has now been riding the pine at two colleges. The idea that he is our savior at QB if he only got the chance is just people dreaming.
I'm hopeful that Russo ends up here and we actually have some talent at QB.
Click to expand...
The problem with your "truth" is that the competition was too close to call and Rettig looked great in his only start. If they were that close why not develop the backup in the event the starter goes down. Why not let the starter earn the start? Truth be told, your narrative fits the Flood is not a DF* defense. The evidence is 70-30 that he is a DF*. Only 30% chance you are defending an astute coaching genius,

* dance fan
 
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