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Game 3 St John's: Not ready yet

bac2therac

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The all too common dreaded reality check for the fanbase tonight....so cliche but so predictable. Look great in two games against weak competition and everyone is brimming with optimism. We are all guilty of it, some more than others. A game most of us had as an L coming into the year now all of sudden was looking like a W to many of us, but the harsh reality is RU failed its first test and is not ready for the prime time and big lights....and its okay....really it is okay.

Let's start off by saying, St John's was simply sick tonight. They were never going to lose this game. RU could have made more foul shots, cleaned up the turnovers, hit more 3s or had Corey Sanders and they were still going lose. 16 made threes on 32 attempts...are you kidding me..this is St John's??? Whether we played good defense on their shots or bad defense, these shots kept going in. They played as well as they did against Duke last season. Men against boys. SJU is a legit Big East title contender. For some reason this board likes to rip on Mullen..me included but he has the players now and it was crystal clear the talent advantage went to St John's tonight. RU's talent is too young and inexperienced to match up tonight

There was a lot of hype around this game from the fans and the media but I also saw alot on social media. I think the players came into this game overhyped from the get go. This was a home game and they didnt come into the game settled and were too juiced they were pressing and got out of their game quickly. One thing was obvious to me tonight, once SJU got rolling, RU seemed scared and played scared. They did not handle adversity well and were not able to regroup and even mount any semblence of a run in the 2nd half. Again that is okay. This game a clear learning experience., I am confident that Coach Pikiell will get alot out of this loss and be able to keep this team focused on the next two dangerous games ahead. Could he have played more zone..perhaps, I just do not think really there is anything he could have done today that would have changed the outcome. I think perhaps the only thing he could have done was toned down the hype about the game but even that that wouldnt have mattered. When Eugene got his 2nd foul and had to sit the rest of the first half, he had to have known RU would be in big trouble and they were because the lead ballooned to 11.

The game was a struggle for Geo today no doubt about it. That is going to happen sometimes. He still is only a soph and this is only his third game as the leader of the team. Ditto for Eugene. He was frustrated and double teamed and could never make his presence felt. Just a terrible matchup for Kiss tonight who struggled and seemed to rush things. The good news is this matchup tonight isnt going to be like the matchup from almost all other Big 10 school. They will learn from this. The younger guys Myles, Montez, and Ron all had varying degrees of struggle and success but this was 10x more of a challenge for them than their first game. To me the big positive I saw tonight was Harper Jr is legit. I really thought he belonged out there and played probably the most fearless of all RU players tonight. Johnson 6 points and 7 boards in 17 minutes, I like how he is being brought along. I wouldnt get on any of these players for getting schooled tonight, they were beat, they were pummelled by a better team period.

There are two negatives that are clear on the team right now. One is foul shooting. It is insanely bad and seems contagious as even Geo missed two in a stretch where RU was 1-8..that does not cut it at this level. RU finished 14-25 for the night...terrible 56%. Harper and Matthis simply have to get better and better with their form. Wasnt the reason they lost tonight but in closer games its vital to keep pace by hitting them. The other glaring negative obviously is defense. Its not there yet. Its something that we were used to for most of Pike's first two years. Now SJU was hitting everything even when we played decent D but the rotations were slow, too many wide open shots, lazy closeouts. Need to get that shored up. I would like to see that in the next two games..less reliance on up and down and more focus on everybodys roles on defense. Shots will fall with this team but defense has to be drilled into their head. Losing Sanders and Freeman hurt no question on the defensive end but it will come, just do not expect it right away.,

So in a season where coming I thought we would fall in the 12-14 win range, people should not be pessimistic over tonights beatdown. Its one game..one game against a program that will be in the NCAA this season. It does not mean RU will not beat anyone other than Penn State or get blown out every night in the Big 10. It does mean that the program has a lot of work to do to get to the level where this team can win under the big stage. We should all be okay with year 3 under Pikiell. We can see what he is trying to build and with who. No one wants to hear about more time blah blah blah but yeah it does. Moving up in the league is not that easy. I have been warning people that. Keep expectations in check this year. With such a young team, improvement is not always linear and they will not always be ready to meet expectations. Patience is what no RU fan wants to hear but is the tough medicine they will have to swallow.

short note on the crowd...excellent crowd and student turnout...7102 I think...hopefully students didnt get too turned off but they can be fickle once they see a beatdown. Crowd was juiced and loud early but the air came out once SJU pulled away before half and the crowd was totally neutered. I will have to credit 4 or 5 totally annoying SJU fans..all girls who cheered for the Johnnies all night, chanting for them and anti RU stuff. As annoying as they were they were consistently loud and I cannot blame them for it and I think often times they were louder than our band. It sucks to hear it but it was their night.
 
We laid an egg. I know the team is young, but I don’t believe anyone thought a 19 pt. home loss for St. John’s was forthcoming tonight.

Pikiell has his work cutout because a single-digit win total and something like 2-16 in the B1G is not acceptable in year 3, regardless of how young this team is. Need to turn things around and quick.
 
Agree totally...have to be patient with this team. I think next year is the year this team goes above 500 in the regular season (17 or 18 wins).
 
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We laid an egg. I know the team is young, but I don’t believe anyone thought a 19 pt. home loss for St. John’s was forthcoming tonight.

Pikiell has his work cutout because a single-digit win total and something like 2-16 in the B1G is not acceptable in year 3, regardless of how young this team is. Need to turn things around and quick.


no one thought that but no one thought SJU was going 16-32 from 3...seemed like everyone was sleeping on SJU because they struggled with Bowling Green. Not sure where you are getting a single digit win total from watching a loss tonight while we played so many young players and lost to a lights out NCAA likely team...gee maybe you want a larger sample size before you bury year 3 in the single digits...even at best RU is maybe looking at 14-16 this year..that is just how it goes in a rebuild so deep
 
We laid an egg. I know the team is young, but I don’t believe anyone thought a 19 pt. home loss for St. John’s was forthcoming tonight.

Pikiell has his work cutout because a single-digit win total and something like 2-16 in the B1G is not acceptable in year 3, regardless of how young this team is. Need to turn things around and quick.

This kind of game is always on the table. Last year's Villanova team allowed 101 points to Butler, UNC the year before allowed 103 to Kentucky, Villanova the year before lost by 23 to Oklahoma... Those are the last three champs, elite teams going against other schools in their weight class. We were punching up which put us at a disadvantage to begin with.

One hot shooting night either way doesn't define you. Villanova repaid that Oklahoma loss with a 44-point final four beat down where they were super hot and OU couldn't buy a bucket.

Need to respond against EMU who per KenPom is right in our weight class.
 
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This kind of game is always on the table. Last year's Villanova team allowed 101 points to Butler, UNC the year before allowed 103 to Kentucky, Villanova the year before lost by 23 to Oklahoma... Those are the last three champs, elite teams going against other schools in their weight class. We were punching up which put us at a disadvantage to begin with.

One hot shooting night either way doesn't define you. Villanova repaid that Oklahoma loss with a 44-point final four beat down where they were super hot and OU couldn't buy a bucket.

Need to respond against EMU who per KenPom is right in our weight class.


Michigan beat Villanova 73-47 right....doesnt mean their season is over. New guys for them trying to get adjusted and ran into a bad matchup where the other team was a buzzsaw
 
We laid an egg. I know the team is young, but I don’t believe anyone thought a 19 pt. home loss for St. John’s was forthcoming tonight.

Pikiell has his work cutout because a single-digit win total and something like 2-16 in the B1G is not acceptable in year 3, regardless of how young this team is. Need to turn things around and quick.

Oh lord, it's college hoops. Everyone gets blown out by 20 here and there. Even excellent teams.

Rutgers is ridiculously young. If you can't see the game plan and how successful it can be with experience--even tonight--then you are itching to put yet another coach on the hot seat.
 
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I expected a competitive game and this was not. Game started 9-2 on three St. John’s 3’s and it was all but over. I know we got the game within 1 pt in the first half but the St. J lead quickly ballooned to 11 by half.

0-9 from 3 and 1-8 from the line to start... that ain’t gonna cut it.

I’m not ready to bury the team or coach, but I don’t think this was the result anyone was looking for from our first test. But to be fair, a bad season this year and coming into next year it’s put up or shut up time unless we want b-ball to be on a Chris Ash rebuild timeline.
 
I expected a competitive game and this was not. Game started 9-2 on three St. John’s 3’s and it was all but over. I know we got the game within 1 pt in the first half but the St. J lead quickly ballooned to 11 by half.

0-9 from 3 and 1-8 from the line to start... that ain’t gonna cut it.

I’m not ready to bury the team or coach, but I don’t think this was the result anyone was looking for from our first test. But to be fair, a bad season this year and coming into next year it’s put up or shut up time unless we want b-ball to be on a Chris Ash rebuild timeline.

Stop. Sometimes, in basketball where you play 30 games and not 11, you just get punched in the mouth. This isn't a trend yet.
 
I was not shocked at all. This team has a lot of growing up to do. They were very jumpy. Need to settle down and be confident. They get there.
 
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Nice summary. My biggest fear right now is the D, where we just don't have the quickness some teams do, especially at guard against a team like SJU's - we focused on not giving up the penetration and they seriously made us pay from three. At one point they were 16-28 - who the hell shoots like that? They were better than us, but not that much better - sometimes a team just gets insanely hot. If we cut down the TOs, hit more FTs and a few more treys, it's a much more competitive game.
 
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Great review! Foul shooting has to get better. Liked that Montez drove to the hoop. St. John’s was unconscious.
118 is still a mistake, should be packed with 250+, not 35 if that many. Dumb.
 
I agree that RU is really young and unfortunately played like it. But, if history is a guide, tonight was a huge loss in terms of getting students to come back to games. They didn’t have to win, but they needed to compete to keep the crowd in the game and coming back. Against the backdrop of a long history of misery, after laying an egg tonight I fear they will have difficulty getting the students to continue to pack the RAC. Not fair to this young team, but that’s probably reality.
 
The all too common dreaded reality check for the fanbase tonight....so cliche but so predictable. Look great in two games against weak competition and everyone is brimming with optimism. We are all guilty of it, some more than others. A game most of us had as an L coming into the year now all of sudden was looking like a W to many of us, but the harsh reality is RU failed its first test and is not ready for the prime time and big lights....and its okay....really it is okay.

Let's start off by saying, St John's was simply sick tonight. They were never going to lose this game. RU could have made more foul shots, cleaned up the turnovers, hit more 3s or had Corey Sanders and they were still going lose. 16 made threes on 32 attempts...are you kidding me..this is St John's??? Whether we played good defense on their shots or bad defense, these shots kept going in. They played as well as they did against Duke last season. Men against boys. SJU is a legit Big East title contender. For some reason this board likes to rip on Mullen..me included but he has the players now and it was crystal clear the talent advantage went to St John's tonight. RU's talent is too young and inexperienced to match up tonight

There was a lot of hype around this game from the fans and the media but I also saw alot on social media. I think the players came into this game overhyped from the get go. This was a home game and they didnt come into the game settled and were too juiced they were pressing and got out of their game quickly. One thing was obvious to me tonight, once SJU got rolling, RU seemed scared and played scared. They did not handle adversity well and were not able to regroup and even mount any semblence of a run in the 2nd half. Again that is okay. This game a clear learning experience., I am confident that Coach Pikiell will get alot out of this loss and be able to keep this team focused on the next two dangerous games ahead. Could he have played more zone..perhaps, I just do not think really there is anything he could have done today that would have changed the outcome. I think perhaps the only thing he could have done was toned down the hype about the game but even that that wouldnt have mattered. When Eugene got his 2nd foul and had to sit the rest of the first half, he had to have known RU would be in big trouble and they were because the lead ballooned to 11.

The game was a struggle for Geo today no doubt about it. That is going to happen sometimes. He still is only a soph and this is only his third game as the leader of the team. Ditto for Eugene. He was frustrated and double teamed and could never make his presence felt. Just a terrible matchup for Kiss tonight who struggled and seemed to rush things. The good news is this matchup tonight isnt going to be like the matchup from almost all other Big 10 school. They will learn from this. The younger guys Myles, Montez, and Ron all had varying degrees of struggle and success but this was 10x more of a challenge for them than their first game. To me the big positive I saw tonight was Harper Jr is legit. I really thought he belonged out there and played probably the most fearless of all RU players tonight. Johnson 6 points and 7 boards in 17 minutes, I like how he is being brought along. I wouldnt get on any of these players for getting schooled tonight, they were beat, they were pummelled by a better team period.

There are two negatives that are clear on the team right now. One is foul shooting. It is insanely bad and seems contagious as even Geo missed two in a stretch where RU was 1-8..that does not cut it at this level. RU finished 14-25 for the night...terrible 56%. Harper and Matthis simply have to get better and better with their form. Wasnt the reason they lost tonight but in closer games its vital to keep pace by hitting them. The other glaring negative obviously is defense. Its not there yet. Its something that we were used to for most of Pike's first two years. Now SJU was hitting everything even when we played decent D but the rotations were slow, too many wide open shots, lazy closeouts. Need to get that shored up. I would like to see that in the next two games..less reliance on up and down and more focus on everybodys roles on defense. Shots will fall with this team but defense has to be drilled into their head. Losing Sanders and Freeman hurt no question on the defensive end but it will come, just do not expect it right away.,

So in a season where coming I thought we would fall in the 12-14 win range, people should not be pessimistic over tonights beatdown. Its one game..one game against a program that will be in the NCAA this season. It does not mean RU will not beat anyone other than Penn State or get blown out every night in the Big 10. It does mean that the program has a lot of work to do to get to the level where this team can win under the big stage. We should all be okay with year 3 under Pikiell. We can see what he is trying to build and with who. No one wants to hear about more time blah blah blah but yeah it does. Moving up in the league is not that easy. I have been warning people that. Keep expectations in check this year. With such a young team, improvement is not always linear and they will not always be ready to meet expectations. Patience is what no RU fan wants to hear but is the tough medicine they will have to swallow.

short note on the crowd...excellent crowd and student turnout...7102 I think...hopefully students didnt get too turned off but they can be fickle once they see a beatdown. Crowd was juiced and loud early but the air came out once SJU pulled away before half and the crowd was totally neutered. I will have to credit 4 or 5 totally annoying SJU fans..all girls who cheered for the Johnnies all night, chanting for them and anti RU stuff. As annoying as they were they were consistently loud and I cannot blame them for it and I think often times they were louder than our band. It sucks to hear it but it was their night.

Very good analysis. IMO, the only player who played well was Harper. He’s going to be very good. I thought some of the substitutions were very questionable in the first half. Baker did not play well and Kiss played even worse but I think you need one of them on the court at all times. I believe he had McConnell and Mathis out there together in the first half when we were still in the game with Doorson and it was a really bad stretch.
 
There are new fans to basketball on the boards that are looking for something to root for because of the meltdown in football and that's fine. The overall difference in the game was upperclassmen and talent on SJU was impressive.

I think SJU came in ready and heard a lot about the scrimmage result from last year. But the game is about matchups from team and stylea and there isn't a matchup where 4 to 5 wings spread the floor and you're asking Shaq Doorson and Myles Johnson to close out on shooters and keep up with people off the dribble.

But there's 3 things that structurely cannot change until next season IMO

A) Half court "token" pressure didn't result in any turnovers in the backcourt, but it shaved 8 to 9 seconds off the shot clock.....now starting the offense at 20-21 seconds just crossing halfcourt, shortens the possessions and passing and puts pressure on RU to score. If Eugene is part of your best passer in that backcourt scenario, he cannot go from playing guard on press break to high post offense, to low post offense asked to make passes and splitting double teams etc....He's being asked to do too much IMO, but he's an upperclassman and eventually i think the freshman will catch up and help Geo out as a true backcourt tandem.

Those extra ball handling guards are Young and Mulcahy who are here next year....Both are capable of either handling the ball and attacking the press to score....or RU needed to aggressively attack the press but are not equipped athletically to then attack the rim....,we are better off getting shooters out in areas in preparation to shoot and score, not run and jump at the basket for dunks.

B) The staff didn't help the players in Man to man defense and never chased the players off the 3 point line with quicker smaller players or lineup...and that only happens by removing Shaq and Myles and going smaller.

C) Harper looked eerily comfortable on both ends...almost to the point where he probably should have been the person on press break with Geo....by nature, he's a guard and Eugene is not as fluid with the ball off the dribble....i would have flip flopped Harper and Eugene on press break or consider starting Harper vs Issa.......or get Kiss and Mathis up to a point....but you do that and you take away a shooting and slashing threat with Kiss and Mathis, if you do break the press.

Once the staff has a large enough sample size is when they can carve out what players can do things well and what other players need to improve upon....this is a literal 2 to 3 game process and building/tweaking/improving etc...

I will say it again...a normal sorting out can take about a season and a half (50 college games) before it's stabilized and more consistent when you have this many underclassmen learning on the job.

Tonight wasn't a good effort but we learned a lot and will continue to do so as we move forward. There's a lot more to work with than I thought, even 1 week ago.
 
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The all too common dreaded reality check for the fanbase tonight....so cliche but so predictable. Look great in two games against weak competition and everyone is brimming with optimism. We are all guilty of it, some more than others. A game most of us had as an L coming into the year now all of sudden was looking like a W to many of us, but the harsh reality is RU failed its first test and is not ready for the prime time and big lights....and its okay....really it is okay.

Let's start off by saying, St John's was simply sick tonight. They were never going to lose this game. RU could have made more foul shots, cleaned up the turnovers, hit more 3s or had Corey Sanders and they were still going lose. 16 made threes on 32 attempts...are you kidding me..this is St John's??? Whether we played good defense on their shots or bad defense, these shots kept going in. They played as well as they did against Duke last season. Men against boys. SJU is a legit Big East title contender. For some reason this board likes to rip on Mullen..me included but he has the players now and it was crystal clear the talent advantage went to St John's tonight. RU's talent is too young and inexperienced to match up tonight

There was a lot of hype around this game from the fans and the media but I also saw alot on social media. I think the players came into this game overhyped from the get go. This was a home game and they didnt come into the game settled and were too juiced they were pressing and got out of their game quickly. One thing was obvious to me tonight, once SJU got rolling, RU seemed scared and played scared. They did not handle adversity well and were not able to regroup and even mount any semblence of a run in the 2nd half. Again that is okay. This game a clear learning experience., I am confident that Coach Pikiell will get alot out of this loss and be able to keep this team focused on the next two dangerous games ahead. Could he have played more zone..perhaps, I just do not think really there is anything he could have done today that would have changed the outcome. I think perhaps the only thing he could have done was toned down the hype about the game but even that that wouldnt have mattered. When Eugene got his 2nd foul and had to sit the rest of the first half, he had to have known RU would be in big trouble and they were because the lead ballooned to 11.

The game was a struggle for Geo today no doubt about it. That is going to happen sometimes. He still is only a soph and this is only his third game as the leader of the team. Ditto for Eugene. He was frustrated and double teamed and could never make his presence felt. Just a terrible matchup for Kiss tonight who struggled and seemed to rush things. The good news is this matchup tonight isnt going to be like the matchup from almost all other Big 10 school. They will learn from this. The younger guys Myles, Montez, and Ron all had varying degrees of struggle and success but this was 10x more of a challenge for them than their first game. To me the big positive I saw tonight was Harper Jr is legit. I really thought he belonged out there and played probably the most fearless of all RU players tonight. Johnson 6 points and 7 boards in 17 minutes, I like how he is being brought along. I wouldnt get on any of these players for getting schooled tonight, they were beat, they were pummelled by a better team period.

There are two negatives that are clear on the team right now. One is foul shooting. It is insanely bad and seems contagious as even Geo missed two in a stretch where RU was 1-8..that does not cut it at this level. RU finished 14-25 for the night...terrible 56%. Harper and Matthis simply have to get better and better with their form. Wasnt the reason they lost tonight but in closer games its vital to keep pace by hitting them. The other glaring negative obviously is defense. Its not there yet. Its something that we were used to for most of Pike's first two years. Now SJU was hitting everything even when we played decent D but the rotations were slow, too many wide open shots, lazy closeouts. Need to get that shored up. I would like to see that in the next two games..less reliance on up and down and more focus on everybodys roles on defense. Shots will fall with this team but defense has to be drilled into their head. Losing Sanders and Freeman hurt no question on the defensive end but it will come, just do not expect it right away.,

So in a season where coming I thought we would fall in the 12-14 win range, people should not be pessimistic over tonights beatdown. Its one game..one game against a program that will be in the NCAA this season. It does not mean RU will not beat anyone other than Penn State or get blown out every night in the Big 10. It does mean that the program has a lot of work to do to get to the level where this team can win under the big stage. We should all be okay with year 3 under Pikiell. We can see what he is trying to build and with who. No one wants to hear about more time blah blah blah but yeah it does. Moving up in the league is not that easy. I have been warning people that. Keep expectations in check this year. With such a young team, improvement is not always linear and they will not always be ready to meet expectations. Patience is what no RU fan wants to hear but is the tough medicine they will have to swallow.

short note on the crowd...excellent crowd and student turnout...7102 I think...hopefully students didnt get too turned off but they can be fickle once they see a beatdown. Crowd was juiced and loud early but the air came out once SJU pulled away before half and the crowd was totally neutered. I will have to credit 4 or 5 totally annoying SJU fans..all girls who cheered for the Johnnies all night, chanting for them and anti RU stuff. As annoying as they were they were consistently loud and I cannot blame them for it and I think often times they were louder than our band. It sucks to hear it but it was their night.
Nice and complete summary.

As much Ive listened to people diss him in the past......I agree that FREEMAN is missed.

This years team will be just fine..theyre
:basketball::okay::boxing:"just a bunch of kids":boxing::okay::basketball:
 
Good summary, bac. Spot on.

The team will learn from this. They just weren’t ready for the bright lights, and yes, they were too amped in the first half, shooting up wild bricks.

We knew SJU was athletic, but geezus, they were just SCORCHING us from deep. It was like they were shooting layups.
 
After I saw SJU play on TV and saw their offense I was concerned with this game. As I stated in another thread SJU plays 4 or 5 outside the arc, and does a lot of one on one and two man games. Our team, especially this early on is going to struggle trying to chase players on the perimeter, especially with the type of players SJU has. All can shoot and handle.

SJU was on fire and would beat most teams playing like this, even contested 3s were going in. We got the game to 1 point the crowd got into it, then SJU pulled away.

I was hoping coach would try a smaller lineup earlier, even though when he did for the last few minutes it didn't seem to work either. I know we are not a zone team, but maybe a 1-3-1, with Issa at the top could have been tried. Hindsight is 20-20. I trust coach.

I have said it many times, to me this is the last season of building blocks, next season is season one of the turnaround...and I am not saying NCAAs next year but it will be a more complete team with depth/experience at all positions

At the game I said we played about as bad as we could play. Hopefully we got the jitters of a bigger game out of our systems and learn from it.
 
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Nice summary. My biggest fear right now is the D, where we just don't have the quickness some teams do, especially at guard against a team like SJU's - we focused on not giving up the penetration and they seriously made us pay from three. At one point they were 16-28 - who the hell shoots like that? They were better than us, but not that much better - sometimes a team just gets insanely hot. If we cut down the TOs, hit more FTs and a few more treys, it's a much more competitive game.
That's how I saw the game. Their outside shooting were lights out and their defense was much better than ours, especially along the perimeter. As I've said before we'll miss Corey Sanders defense more than his offense. More important is how the team responds in the next several games against tough competition. One point made by Bac that I really agreed with was Harper, Jr. 's play...He plays with a level of confidence and poise not usual for a freshman. He will be very good . Mathis has athleticism but needs to let the game come to him..
 
Young team----will learn from this.

St Johns shooting well out of the gate unnerved them a bit IMO. Game needed to be in the 60's IMO but when you're hitting 3's that's tough.

Don't like the Johnnies but they're good.
 
This nails is

The one thing people need to see is it’s a process

First it requires talent ...we have made MAJOR strides

Second ...you have to learn how to compete on this level. What it takes. Thought we looked a bit soft. That goes away with experience...especially on D

Third ...after you now how to compete ...you have to learn how to WiN

As a reminder ...we have a 11 man roster that has a total of 11 years of division 1 basketball experience ...and the amount of minutes is far less

Next year ...that’s 22 for 12 players

Two years from now ...21 for 8 players

It’s just takes time to grow up....and we will have moments this year...but right now...bac says is best with “not ready yet”
 
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Lots of good points here.

Pike can downplay the FT issue in the post game presser but it needs to get fixed. I liked the way Mathis took the ball to the basket but if he cannot make FT's then getting to the line is not a positive.

Mullin was able to get Doorson matched up on Heron with a switch too often. Shaq tried but that is not a good match up.

Agree we probably should have went with the line up with Issa as our tallest player earlier. I don't know why we did not try harder to establish Myles in the low post after hearing about his moves. Against SJU did not make sense to have him out there if that was not the plan.

Going forward the team needs to figure out what is a good three point attempt and what is a rushed or poor attempt. That should be correctable. So should be leaving your feet on ball fakes.

Adjustments off this tape is where Pike and the staff earn their money.
 
The all too common dreaded reality check for the fanbase tonight....so cliche but so predictable. Look great in two games against weak competition and everyone is brimming with optimism. We are all guilty of it, some more than others. A game most of us had as an L coming into the year now all of sudden was looking like a W to many of us, but the harsh reality is RU failed its first test and is not ready for the prime time and big lights....and its okay....really it is okay.

Let's start off by saying, St John's was simply sick tonight. They were never going to lose this game. RU could have made more foul shots, cleaned up the turnovers, hit more 3s or had Corey Sanders and they were still going lose. 16 made threes on 32 attempts...are you kidding me..this is St John's??? Whether we played good defense on their shots or bad defense, these shots kept going in. They played as well as they did against Duke last season. Men against boys. SJU is a legit Big East title contender. For some reason this board likes to rip on Mullen..me included but he has the players now and it was crystal clear the talent advantage went to St John's tonight. RU's talent is too young and inexperienced to match up tonight

There was a lot of hype around this game from the fans and the media but I also saw alot on social media. I think the players came into this game overhyped from the get go. This was a home game and they didnt come into the game settled and were too juiced they were pressing and got out of their game quickly. One thing was obvious to me tonight, once SJU got rolling, RU seemed scared and played scared. They did not handle adversity well and were not able to regroup and even mount any semblence of a run in the 2nd half. Again that is okay. This game a clear learning experience., I am confident that Coach Pikiell will get alot out of this loss and be able to keep this team focused on the next two dangerous games ahead. Could he have played more zone..perhaps, I just do not think really there is anything he could have done today that would have changed the outcome. I think perhaps the only thing he could have done was toned down the hype about the game but even that that wouldnt have mattered. When Eugene got his 2nd foul and had to sit the rest of the first half, he had to have known RU would be in big trouble and they were because the lead ballooned to 11.

The game was a struggle for Geo today no doubt about it. That is going to happen sometimes. He still is only a soph and this is only his third game as the leader of the team. Ditto for Eugene. He was frustrated and double teamed and could never make his presence felt. Just a terrible matchup for Kiss tonight who struggled and seemed to rush things. The good news is this matchup tonight isnt going to be like the matchup from almost all other Big 10 school. They will learn from this. The younger guys Myles, Montez, and Ron all had varying degrees of struggle and success but this was 10x more of a challenge for them than their first game. To me the big positive I saw tonight was Harper Jr is legit. I really thought he belonged out there and played probably the most fearless of all RU players tonight. Johnson 6 points and 7 boards in 17 minutes, I like how he is being brought along. I wouldnt get on any of these players for getting schooled tonight, they were beat, they were pummelled by a better team period.

There are two negatives that are clear on the team right now. One is foul shooting. It is insanely bad and seems contagious as even Geo missed two in a stretch where RU was 1-8..that does not cut it at this level. RU finished 14-25 for the night...terrible 56%. Harper and Matthis simply have to get better and better with their form. Wasnt the reason they lost tonight but in closer games its vital to keep pace by hitting them. The other glaring negative obviously is defense. Its not there yet. Its something that we were used to for most of Pike's first two years. Now SJU was hitting everything even when we played decent D but the rotations were slow, too many wide open shots, lazy closeouts. Need to get that shored up. I would like to see that in the next two games..less reliance on up and down and more focus on everybodys roles on defense. Shots will fall with this team but defense has to be drilled into their head. Losing Sanders and Freeman hurt no question on the defensive end but it will come, just do not expect it right away.,

So in a season where coming I thought we would fall in the 12-14 win range, people should not be pessimistic over tonights beatdown. Its one game..one game against a program that will be in the NCAA this season. It does not mean RU will not beat anyone other than Penn State or get blown out every night in the Big 10. It does mean that the program has a lot of work to do to get to the level where this team can win under the big stage. We should all be okay with year 3 under Pikiell. We can see what he is trying to build and with who. No one wants to hear about more time blah blah blah but yeah it does. Moving up in the league is not that easy. I have been warning people that. Keep expectations in check this year. With such a young team, improvement is not always linear and they will not always be ready to meet expectations. Patience is what no RU fan wants to hear but is the tough medicine they will have to swallow.

short note on the crowd...excellent crowd and student turnout...7102 I think...hopefully students didnt get too turned off but they can be fickle once they see a beatdown. Crowd was juiced and loud early but the air came out once SJU pulled away before half and the crowd was totally neutered. I will have to credit 4 or 5 totally annoying SJU fans..all girls who cheered for the Johnnies all night, chanting for them and anti RU stuff. As annoying as they were they were consistently loud and I cannot blame them for it and I think often times they were louder than our band. It sucks to hear it but it was their night.
Nice recap. I was there after attending the Alumni event in the Livingston student center. I was happy they were only down 8 half way thru the 1st half despite missing badly from 3 and the FT line. They were getting open looks, the shots just wouldn’t fall. I felt like if they hit a few to start the game might have been different. They were rushing a bit, maybe fearful of SJU’s athletes but I don’t think defense caused them to miss shots early. They had two guys who were just unconscious from 3, it seemed like anything they chucked up was going in. Yes, in my opinion they were just heaving it up in spots and just couldn’t miss. It was one of those kind of nights..
 
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no one thought that but no one thought SJU was going 16-32 from 3...seemed like everyone was sleeping on SJU because they struggled with Bowling Green. Not sure where you are getting a single digit win total from watching a loss tonight while we played so many young players and lost to a lights out NCAA likely team...gee maybe you want a larger sample size before you bury year 3 in the single digits...even at best RU is maybe looking at 14-16 this year..that is just how it goes in a rebuild so deep
Set your expectations low, so less chance of being disappointed
 
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We laid an egg. I know the team is young, but I don’t believe anyone thought a 19 pt. home loss for St. John’s was forthcoming tonight.

Pikiell has his work cutout because a single-digit win total and something like 2-16 in the B1G is not acceptable in year 3, regardless of how young this team is. Need to turn things around and quick.
Talk about the team being young needs some modification.The starting lineup includes one senior, 2 juniors and 2 sophomores which shouldn't be interpreted as young .The bench players are young and they played as well as the starters.Bottom line games are decided by match ups and St.Johns had more talented players on the court.
 
I can't believe the overreaction to this loss. St. John's starts 2 Jrs., a R-Jr., a R-Sr. and So(3/2). A combined 303 games and 215 starts. 2 players Heron (#22 in 2016) and Ponds (#32 in 2016) that have started every game of their career. LJ Figueroa a top 100 from 2017, Marvin Clark #146 in 2014 and Simons #24 in 2015. 2 5 stars 2 4 stars and a 5th year high 3 star is their starting lineup. Yeah we stand a chance.

We start 1 So., 1 R-So., 2 Jr. And R-Sr.(93/7) A combined 299 games and 140 starts. Issa #237, Doorson #394, Geo #414, and 2 unranked in Kiss and Omoruyi. There is a reason why Mathis and RHJ looked good in this game both 4 star guys.
 
Great thread. A few comments.

1. Harper looks so comfortable out there, and Kiss is such a liability on defense, that I wonder if it’s time to insert Harper in the starting lineup and bring Kiss off the bench.

2. I too wondered why we didn’t try posting up Johnson. He could have just baby hooked over them all night.

3. Mathis is definitely getting more comfortable, but he needs to learn how to finish at the tin. And he needs to work on his FTs.

4. With our lack of quicks at guard, Jacob Young will be a HUGE addition next year.

5. This team will be better from this game. SJU showed them how to be tough and fearless.
 
Rutgers needs to recruit a point guard for the future that can be a floor general. Geo appeared to be struggling in this role.

Kiss was completely out of sink. He needs to want the ball and want to be the scorer--He is young and has 3 more years to improve.

The game was sloppy and unwatchable at times. Once again the team needs a floor general to get the chaos under control.

With St. John's shooting 3s and never missing it would have been almost impossible to win this game.

Rutgers needs to improve by 3 or 4 wins this season for it to be a success.
This is going to be hard to do with the Big 10 being so filled with talent.

There is a whole season ahead and hopefully this team will improve week by week.
 
RHJ and Mathis looked the most comfortable because they are our highest ranked recruits on our team compared to St John's 2 5 star and 2 4 star guys in the starting lineup.
 
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RHJ and Mathis looked the most comfortable because they are our highest ranked recruits on our team compared to St John's 2 5 star and 2 4 star guys in the starting lineup.

Their ratings are not relevant to the discussion....the up and down faster paced game requires more athletes.

In a half court typical paced game, you may see Mathis and Harper not look as comfortable. It will take time to get Harper and Mathis comfortable and aware of how to play more than up tempo.
 
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Like LJ Figueroa, top 100 recruit in 2017, and #1 JUCO recruit, 6'5" wing, averaged 24.2 pts his freshman year at Odessa College, 29-5 last year, shooting 55% from the field and 48% from 3pt range. Compared to our #12 JUCO Shaq Carter for East Florida St. College, 30-5 last year, averaged 8 and 6 in college and can't see the floor. Not highly recruited out of high school.
 
Good stuff, Bac.

Rutgers defense was poor at times, and St Johns offense was hot.

Rutgers went down by 20 when they went small. The outside shot was not falling, and it kept getting forced. Why didn't we stay big? Baker got a little hurt last night and it affected his game. Surprised not many have mentioned it.

Pikiell had a bad game. The team could not execute passes, and like we know, this is to be expected with new members that are playing more minutes. He is a coach.

The hype was there though, the crowd was ready. Pikiell has to get back to his values. As fans, we will never see an offense like we did the first two games again this season. Defense and rebounding must remain Pikiells focus from here on out.

I have full faith in the program. Young squad that will learn. Tons of potential on the team.
 
Don’t remember seeing this mentioned. SJU shot 16/32 from three, even though they missed seven days r eight in a row in the first half.
 
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