It's Flood's fault, unless ...

[BoroKnight]

Look, we all know what a mess Mr. Flood left behind. But think about this:

Many, many people here are saying that is should have been obvious that Laviano wasn't the guy, and the way Gio played has people thinking he should have been. Taking that to the next step, we have a chance to beat Iowa and Illinois with Gio at QB, and the experience he would have gained might have prevented a couple of mistakes today and changed that outcome. All of a sudden, this same team is 5-3 and we're talking only needing one more win to go to a bowl.

How much less "This is all Flood's fault" would we have read under those conditions? And that decision is entirely, 100 percent, on Ash. Not Flood. Same roster. And thinking bowl.

Am I down on Ash? No, he's a first-year coach and he will learn (hopefully). He has to grow into the job and gain confidence and learn to think outside the box. But it is interesting how much someone else's decision served to increase the disdain for the Flood debacle.

If we're 5-3, are we saying, "Too bad Flood couldn't discipline this team. He had some talent?" Are we saying, "Those distractions last year cost a decent coach his job?" The mind reels ...

 

[RUSK97]

You make my head hurt. Maybe that's the vodka.

Poor depth of talent? Sure, that's on Flood. But Ash is responsible for his own personnel decisions. No way you can pin that on Flood. That said, doubtful Gio would be playing now if he started the whole season. He'd be banged up with the minimal protection the oline provides.

 

[Scarlet_Scourge]

Sigh... When most people talk about lack of talent they mean DEPTH. We have some good starters but they leave the game everything goes downhill.

We lack depth due to poor recruiting, by that I mean too many players were never good enough for FBS and drop out and went to FCS or quit football. Also too many players of questionable backgrounds ended up getting kick off the team. All in all an ENTIRE years worth of recruits left the team! That is worse than the death penalty!

Most of the guys left are just not enough to play in the Big Ten. But Not all of them. We have some good players and some may even go pro but we just do not have enough of them to beat most teams.

Many of best players are also senior and this is their final season.

As a result it will take years to build this program up to the point where we can beat most teams in the Big Ten. The Elite teams will always be hard to beat no matter what. But what I mean it will take 3-5 years before we are going bowling on a regular basis again.

That is reality and yes that is on Flood.

Now it is up to Ash to fix it. It will take years and nothing that anyone posts here will ever make it happen faster.

 

[knightinaz]

Or maybe it's the staff developing Gio to the point where he is now ready to start.

Given that this is a brand new offense maybe it took Gio a little while to grasp it. Instead of throwing him out there and having his confidence crushed they kept/keep working with him.

Now we are staring to see those results

 

[Dpgru]

There is one thing that has been happening all year that has nothing to do with Flood, the lack of talent and lack of depth. That is that this was the sixth time (Wash, Howard, NM, OSU, Mich, and Minn) we have been badly out played and outscored in the first quarter. In some we recovered and played very well the rest of the way and in others we did not. Still, why isn't this team ready for the speed and power of the game when it starts. Even Howard, fcs Howard, was more prepared to start the game then RU was that day and has been all season. Why? And you can't blame Flood for it.

 

[ashokan]

Some Floodies go down hard

 

[RUSK97]

There is one thing that has been happening all year that has nothing to do with Flood, the lack of talent and lack of depth. That is that this was the sixth time (Wash, Howard, NM, OSU, Mich, and Minn) we have been badly out played and outscored in the first quarter. In some we recovered and played very well the rest of the way and in others we did not. Still, why isn't this team ready for the speed and power of the game when it starts. Even Howard, fcs Howard, was more prepared to start the game then RU was that day and has been all season. Why? And you can't blame Flood for it.

Of course it's Flood's fault. Flood recruited poorly. The team is slower. They practice at a slower speed. So when they play, they expect the opponent to be slow and play crappy because the scout team they face is worse than Howard.

That of course doesn't excuse playcalling buffoonery, but yeah you can place some of the blame on Flood.

 

[Dpgru]

Some Floodies go down hard

First of all, I am not a Floodie. I have stated more times than I can count how much better off we are without him. He was in way over his head and clearly was not getting better with experience. All I am saying is that this team has problems and they are not all Flood related. It is far too easy to blame everything on him. There is no way the slow starts are his fault. How many times are we going to hear that the other team came out and punched us in the mouth. Or. We had to adjust to there speed or they were in a scheme or formation we didn't predict. Why can't we punch them in the mouth. If anything Flood was just the opposite. How many times did his team take the first possession down the field and score and then the offense disappeared. this staff is new and they are learning on the job. Many of them are in a position that is above any they had before. I only hope they learn and improve from their experience which is something Flood didn't do.

 

[koleszar]

Look, we all know what a mess Mr. Flood left behind. But think about this:

Many, many people here are saying that is should have been obvious that Laviano wasn't the guy, and the way Gio played has people thinking he should have been. Taking that to the next step, we have a chance to beat Iowa and Illinois with Gio at QB, and the experience he would have gained might have prevented a couple of mistakes today and changed that outcome. All of a sudden, this same team is 5-3 and we're talking only needing one more win to go to a bowl.

How much less "This is all Flood's fault" would we have read under those conditions? And that decision is entirely, 100 percent, on Ash. Not Flood. Same roster. And thinking bowl.

Am I down on Ash? No, he's a first-year coach and he will learn (hopefully). He has to grow into the job and gain confidence and learn to think outside the box. But it is interesting how much someone else's decision served to increase the disdain for the Flood debacle.

If we're 5-3, are we saying, "Too bad Flood couldn't discipline this team. He had some talent?" Are we saying, "Those distractions last year cost a decent coach his job?" The mind reels ...

Whose fault was it that Gio wasn't properly developed to this point? The new staff obviously saw something in Gio that they began to enhance his development.(thus the reports we've heard) The last staff put all their eggs into Laviano. Tough to develop when your coach has his sights set on one QB come hell or high water.

Then Gio goes out and proves to be the best passer we've seen, to hell with his feet. That's just icing on the cake. He wasn't completing 5 yd. passes here, he completed passes at over 10yds a clip at almost 60%. With a bum leg for a half.. Why didn't the last staff see this potential. What Ash inherited was one QB whose development was far superior. But he reached his ceiling at sucks. The last staff developed the wrong QB it appears. Ash and company developed Gio and he was far behind do to the last staff's poor choice.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

Of course it's Flood's fault. Flood recruited poorly. The team is slower. They practice at a slower speed. So when they play, they expect the opponent to be slow and play crappy because the scout team they face is worse than Howard.

That of course doesn't excuse playcalling buffoonery, but yeah you can place some of the blame on Flood.

"playcalling buffoonery" lol...you and a few others act AS IF there aren't questionanable calls, every week, by almost every staff in the NF-freakin'-L, let alone in college. I mean aside from one or two calls yesterday the OC did a very, very good job of playcalling. Shit, even Politi apparently liked it lol!

 

[lighty]

I think Ash and staff may have over valued Laviano because he was the starter last year, which was Flood's decision. I was hoping the new staff was going to start completely fresh -- and maybe they did -- but yesterday certainly validated the opinion of everyone here who thought we absolutely had to have someone better than Laviano already on the staff.

Maybe Gio was too raw to start the season, maybe not. But we all saw a year of Laviano last year and had a pretty good idea of his limitations. After 1-2 actual games, I would have hoped Ash and company would have had enough as well. We were going to lose more than win in the first half of the season anyway, so why not try developing someone who could be the #1 QB ? Did Ash and Drew M. really think Laviano was that guy? I just can't believe it, unless he really looks like superman in practice...

 

[megadrone]

I think Ash and staff may have over valued Laviano because he was the starter last year, which was Flood's decision. I was hoping the new staff was going to start completely fresh -- and maybe they did -- but yesterday certainly validated the opinion of everyone here who thought we absolutely had to have someone better than Laviano already on the staff.

Maybe Gio was too raw to start the season, maybe not. But we all saw a year of Laviano last year and had a pretty good idea of his limitations. After 1-2 actual games, I would have hoped Ash and company would have had enough as well. We were going to lose more than win in the first half of the season anyway, so why not try developing someone who could be the #1 QB ? Did Ash and Drew M. really think Laviano was that guy? I just can't believe it, unless he really looks like superman in practice...

It's entirely possible that Gio would have fallen on his face. At the beginning of the season, we expected to lose to Ohio St., Michigan and Iowa. If Gio wasn't truly ready what would have been the value in having him in there to face a murderer's row? We weren't expecting to win those games anyway, and perhaps the overall yield is better to have him wait, play against the easier part of the schedule and get some confidence to take him in to next year.

Laviano's limitations were probably well known at the start of the season. Maybe the Illinois game could have been a win, maybe not. We'll never know.

 

[ru75]

amazing how many fans we have that are grand-masters in the various systems, officiating, recruiting, play calling, and now player development!

 

[rubaseball78]

"playcalling buffoonery" lol...you and a few others act AS IF there aren't questionanable calls, every week, by almost every staff in the NF-freakin'-L, let alone in college. I mean aside from one or two calls yesterday the OC did a very, very good job of playcalling. Shit, even Politi apparently liked it lol!

I agree. A questionable call is only questionable when it doesn't work. Otherwise it's a great call.

 

[koleszar]

amazing how many fans we have that are grand-masters in the various systems, officiating, recruiting, play calling, and now player development!

Not an expert on development, but if you can't see that Gio was slinging the ball far superior to the Laviano lobs or his poise in the pocket, then I can't help you. The last staff chose to develop Laviano and he received almost all the starting 1st team reps for over a year. That's an indisputable fact. It's been reported Gio was making progress this year in practice reports. Somebody gave him a shot and it wasn't last years staff. The last staff it appears chose poorly.

 

[ru75]

Not an expert on development, but if you can't see that Gio was slinging the ball far superior to the Laviano lobs or his poise in the pocket, then I can't help you. The last staff chose to develop Laviano and he received almost all the starting 1st team reps for over a year. That's an indisputable fact. It's been reported Gio was making progress this year in practice reports. Somebody gave him a shot and it wasn't last years staff. The last staff it appears chose poorly.

can't argue too much but consider Gio started only his senior year in HS. The kid had a lot to learn and throwing him in to the BiG too soon might not have helped his development. Early confidence is a terrible thing to waste.

 

[Dpgru]

Well let's look at it this way - this year our QB competition was essentially between Laviano and Allen with Gio and Oden needing development and Rettig again being passed over by the third defferent staff. Next year it will be between Gio and Oden with a years worth of development and Lewis who many feel is the real deal. things are looking up.

 

[koleszar]

can't argue too much but consider Gio started only his senior year in HS. The kid had a lot to learn and throwing him in to the BiG too soon might not have helped his development. Early confidence is a terrible thing to waste.

Fair enough and I agree. Which is why I think the staff waited till game 7. They finally saw enough from him to trust him in a game. I think his live game awareness even caught them by surprise. I just think the last staff was so enamored with Laviano(or head coach) that they couldn't see any other possible options. Was he ready last year probably not. But I do know this, Laviano and Rettig were the only competitors in 00stupids QB competition. With Laviano apparently being the favorite son.

 

[brodo]

I can give some of the blame to Flood, but the real culprit has to be George Foster Sanford, who relied too heavily on Paul Robeson.

 

[ru75]

Fair enough and I agree. Which is why I think the staff waited till game 7. They finally saw enough from him to trust him in a game. I think his live game awareness even caught them by surprise. I just think the last staff was so enamored with Laviano(or head coach) that they couldn't see any other possible options. Was he ready last year probably not. But I do know this, Laviano and Rettig were the only competitors in 00stupids QB competition. With Laviano apparently being the favorite son.

You mentioned he who should not be named...

 

[chase07470]

Coaches love QB's with experience and they love QB's they can trust to not turn it over. They hoped Laviano could improve, he didn't. So now they're biting the bullet and taking on the risk of turnovers. Wish they had moved sooner but understand why they waited.

At least they made a change. More than Flood can say for himself. They also would have had another experienced QB to consider had Flood made a move. What a disaster that guy was.

 

[RU31trap]

Look, we all know what a mess Mr. Flood left behind. But think about this:

Many, many people here are saying that is should have been obvious that Laviano wasn't the guy, and the way Gio played has people thinking he should have been. Taking that to the next step, we have a chance to beat Iowa and Illinois with Gio at QB, and the experience he would have gained might have prevented a couple of mistakes today and changed that outcome. All of a sudden, this same team is 5-3 and we're talking only needing one more win to go to a bowl.

How much less "This is all Flood's fault" would we have read under those conditions? And that decision is entirely, 100 percent, on Ash. Not Flood. Same roster. And thinking bowl.

Am I down on Ash? No, he's a first-year coach and he will learn (hopefully). He has to grow into the job and gain confidence and learn to think outside the box. But it is interesting how much someone else's decision served to increase the disdain for the Flood debacle.

If we're 5-3, are we saying, "Too bad Flood couldn't discipline this team. He had some talent?" Are we saying, "Those distractions last year cost a decent coach his job?" The mind reels ...

Knight: I would like to add one minor point to your post. When a defense and special teams watches their offense playing hard and converting they too start playing harder. All I'm trying to say is that Winning is contagious. Not sure how I pin this on Flood. I do believe that Ash will turn this program around.

 

[RU-05]

What if Flood wasn't fired? Would we have ever seen Gio?

Ash may have been slow to see the abilities of gio, but Ash is clearly more flexible when it comes to the QB position.

 

[D1ESEL44]

What if Flood wasn't fired? Would we have ever seen Gio?

Ash may have been slow to see the abilities of gio, but Ash is clearly more flexible when it comes to the QB position.

Ash is more "flexible when it comes to"....any position on this team. We never saw this from Flood who was the quintessential players coach.

 

[LadyRU09]

Gio might have had the better talent, but Laviano started because he had the most experience. It's good that Gio is getting the opportunities to earn the experience, though.

 

[RUBigJ]

The one area that Flood recruited poorly is WR. Three years ago the only WR recruit we got was Perry from South Africa. I think he only plays on ST. Two years ago it was Blunt, Owens and Harris. Owens was thrown off the team, Blunt hasn't seen the field and the only guy Playing is Harris. Last year it was Jabbie, Bah, and Bailey. Ash brought in Bailey and the other two haven't seen the field. So now we have 5 seniors WRs and only one underclassman playing.
LB wasn't good either. We have 3 guys leave and no one with experience to take their place.

 

[ru8081]

Stop the Flood bashing. After Schiano left the ADMINISTRATION did not hire a competent replacement. They were cheap. We have seen this story before.

 

[yesrutgers01]

I thought everyone knew for a fact that Rettig was the best QB on the team last year, not Gio...:stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

I love all the hindsight coaches here. Even Ash regulated Gio to the practice squad where he first showed his improvement. I give ALL the credit to the kid himself. All along, I have said that one of these other QB's are going to have to do something to stand out. Gio did so and good for him.

BTW- DW's offense looks a whole lot more interesting when we have a true running QB. Imagine if we had R Martin in the backfield...I think he would have went for 150+ and we win that game easy.

 

[BROTHERSKINNY]

My 2cents! Just the facts of where we are today. Flood is gone. Ash is here. Ash so far in my opinion is doing a good job of coaching up kids who are not as talented as many of the teams we face in B1G. As Ash adds kids who are athletic and talented we should start to see more W's. This is going to be a 3-5 year rebuild. Lets give him time. They looked good against Minnesota.

 

[yesrutgers01]

If we can also eliminate some simple mistakes, this team looks completely different. I'm not so sure we are so much untalented then the rest of the B1G. So far, I didn't see a huge talent difference between us and Iowa/Illinois/Minn...

 

[cicero grimes]

What if Flood wasn't fired? Would we have ever seen Gio?

Ash may have been slow to see the abilities of gio, but Ash is clearly more flexible when it comes to the QB position.

If he who shall remain nameless was not fired we would be hearing "Chris is our starting QB this week as he gives us the best chance to be 1-0". We never would have seen Gio.