New Jersey History

[R1776U]

"New Jersey was the last of the Northern states to abolish slavery completely. The last 16 slaves in New Jersey were freed in 1865 by the Thirteenth Amendment.[2]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_slavery_in_New_Jersey


little known fact that NJ wanted to be part of the confederacy but was screwed outta it by being surrounded by the union

 

[oldman87]

Screwed outta it? You mean saved.

 

[RUJohnny99]

little known fact that NJ wanted to be part of the confederacy but was screwed outta it by being surrounded by the union

Incorrect. It was one family that moved from Virginia to Salem County in the 1820s that brought their servants with them. I forget the name, but the slaves are listed in the 1830-1860 censuses.

 

[RUSONIC]

Screwed outta it? You mean saved.

Thank god we waited to be part of the big ten.

 

[RU Husky]

Lincoln lost the popular vote in NJ in both 1860 and 1864. The descendants of those who voted against Honest Abe post regularly on the current events board.

 

[zappaa]

What is Winfield Park?

 

[Chuch Wilder]

Misleading thread. New Jersey passed laws of graduated freedom for those under slavery, so it was a near dead institution by the outbreak of the Civil War. Additionally, slavery was never huge in the state and certainly would not be a reason for NJ sympathy for the South. What did have some interest was the economic ties buying raw material and selling products to the South. NJ exported over 50% of its products below the Mason Dixon Line, and this trade would be disrupted by any Civil War. Also large numbers of Virginia vacationers came to the NJ shore and mixed with New Jerseyans for summer fun. Citing not voting for Lincoln in 1864 (Lincoln won NJ in 1860) as pro South is apples and oranges. Voting for McClellan a local guy an future governor of NJ at a time where there was serious war fatigue is not rooting against the Union.

 

[Proud NJ Sports Fan]

What is Winfield Park?

Military barracks?

 

[Proud NJ Sports Fan]

Some of South Jersey is basically the Deep South, today

 

[BigLou]

Isn't Winfield Park part of Linden?

 

[retired711]

Misleading thread. New Jersey passed laws of graduated freedom for those under slavery, so it was a near dead institution by the outbreak of the Civil War. Additionally, slavery was never huge in the state and certainly would not be a reason for NJ sympathy for the South. What did have some interest was the economic ties buying raw material and selling products to the South. NJ exported over 50% of its products below the Mason Dixon Line, and this trade would be disrupted by any Civil War. Also large numbers of Virginia vacationers came to the NJ shore and mixed with New Jerseyans for summer fun. Citing not voting for Lincoln in 1864 (Lincoln won NJ in 1860) as pro South is apples and oranges. Voting for McClellan a local guy an future governor of NJ at a time where there was serious war fatigue is not rooting against the Union.

Just a correction: in 1860, Lincoln and Stephen Douglas split New Jersey's electoral votes; Lincoln got 4, and Douglas 3. For the story, see the link below:
http://www.bluejersey.com/2010/03/how-new-jersey-split-its-electoral-votes-in-1860/

 

[Scarlet16E]

"New Jersey was the last of the Northern states to abolish slavery completely. The last 16 slaves in New Jersey were freed in 1865 by the Thirteenth Amendment.[2]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_slavery_in_New_Jersey


little known fact that NJ wanted to be part of the confederacy but was screwed outta it by being surrounded by the union

West Jersey (Mostly what we call South Jersey) was settled by Quakers who were opposed to slavery since the 1600's.
Many of their descendants, including my family, still live there. South Jersey was anything but a hotbed of slavery.

 

[RU Husky]

Misleading thread. New Jersey passed laws of graduated freedom for those under slavery, so it was a near dead institution by the outbreak of the Civil War. Additionally, slavery was never huge in the state and certainly would not be a reason for NJ sympathy for the South. What did have some interest was the economic ties buying raw material and selling products to the South. NJ exported over 50% of its products below the Mason Dixon Line, and this trade would be disrupted by any Civil War. Also large numbers of Virginia vacationers came to the NJ shore and mixed with New Jerseyans for summer fun. Citing not voting for Lincoln in 1864 (Lincoln won NJ in 1860) as pro South is apples and oranges. Voting for McClellan a local guy an future governor of NJ at a time where there was serious war fatigue is not rooting against the Union.

And yours is no less misleading. It is interesting to note that this bastion of liberty was one of the last states to ratify the 13th and 15 th amendments , having defeated each at the first attempt at ratification. You are quite correct that NJ had strong economic ties to the South , but you under state its border state political character. NJ was no land of Lincoln or bastion of freedom for the slaves or former slaves in their quest for political freedom and equality.

 

[retired711]

West Jersey (Mostly what we call South Jersey) was settled by Quakers who were opposed to slavery since the 1600's.
Many of their descendants, including my family, still live there. South Jersey was anything but a hotbed of slavery.

You are right that West Jersey was largely settled by Quakers. But apparently there were enough slaves in Burlington so that there almost was a slave rebellion there. That and other details about slavery in New Jersey and its abolition can be found in the link below:

http://slavenorth.com/newjersey.htm

 

[CERU00]

Lincoln lost the popular vote in NJ in both 1860 and 1864. The descendants of those who voted against Honest Abe post regularly on the current events board.

The radical Republicans that supported Lincoln are the forbearers of today's pro life movement. They were considered radical in those days to the slavers as pro lifers are to liberals today.

 

[retired711]

Lincoln lost the popular vote in NJ in both 1860 and 1864. The descendants of those who voted against Honest Abe post regularly on the current events board.

true about 1864, not 1860. The state voted for individual electors, and Lincoln's electors won four.

 

[retired711]

The radical Republicans that supported Lincoln are the forbearers of today's pro life movement. They were considered radical in those days to the slavers as pro lifers are to liberals today.

Most historians, present and past, use the term "radical Republican" to mean those who resisted President Andrew Johnson's extreme pro-southern policies after the assassination of Lincoln. Lincoln carried not only "radicals" , but also Republicans of other views. That's why he won in 1860 and 1864 -- he put together a strong coalition.

 

[BigLou]

Misleading thread. New Jersey passed laws of graduated freedom for those under slavery, so it was a near dead institution by the outbreak of the Civil War. Additionally, slavery was never huge in the state and certainly would not be a reason for NJ sympathy for the South. What did have some interest was the economic ties buying raw material and selling products to the South. NJ exported over 50% of its products below the Mason Dixon Line, and this trade would be disrupted by any Civil War. Also large numbers of Virginia vacationers came to the NJ shore and mixed with New Jerseyans for summer fun. Citing not voting for Lincoln in 1864 (Lincoln won NJ in 1860) as pro South is apples and oranges. Voting for McClellan a local guy an future governor of NJ at a time where there was serious war fatigue is not rooting against the Union.

Kudos to Chuck for sounding like Matt Damon in the Harvard bar scene in "Good Will Hunting". How do you like them apples.

Me, I took history as a survey class.

 

[RU Husky]

true about 1864, not 1860. The state voted for individual electors, and Lincoln's electors won four.

true about 1864, not 1860. The state voted for individual electors, and Lincoln's electors won four.

The split electoral vote in NJ in 1860 is somewhat of a historical anomaly and is noteworthy, but there was a popular vote in 1860 and the Douglas team of electors got 62,869 votes and Lincoln 58,346 as explained in the link you provided. No presidential election in our history has been decided directly by popular vote; it is always the Electoral College that determines the outcome and today, as in 1860, the electors in NJ are chosen by popular vote. Of course we've had a few where even the Electoral College needed help- 1800, 1824 and 1876. And who could forget 2000.

 

[17Q66]

true about 1864, not 1860. The state voted for individual electors, and Lincoln's electors won four.

Jack Nicholson mentions this in his New Jersey Hall of Fame acceptance speech as part of his effort to understand and explain the Garden State's quirkiness. "New Jersey is the only state in the Union that voted against Abraham Lincoln ... TWICE!"

 

[retired711]

The split electoral vote in NJ in 1860 is somewhat of a historical anomaly and is noteworthy, but there was a popular vote in 1860 and the Douglas team of electors got 62,869 votes and Lincoln 58,346 as explained in the link you provided. No presidential election in our history has been decided directly by popular vote; it is always the Electoral College that determines the outcome and today, as in 1860, the electors in NJ are chosen by popular vote. Of course we've had a few where even the Electoral College needed help- 1800, 1824 and 1876. And who could forget 2000.

My impression from the link was that Douglas's 62,000 was comprised of two groups: (a) Douglas supporters; and (b) "fusion" voters who supported either Douglas, Bell or Breckinridge. It's hard to say that all of the Douglas votes came from people who actually wanted Douglas to win. And it's hard to say exactly how many votes each candidate got because the electors were running individually, not as part of slates as is normally the case.

 

[RU Husky]

My impression from the link was that Douglas's 62,000 was comprised of two groups: (a) Douglas supporters; and (b) "fusion" voters who supported either Douglas, Bell or Breckinridge. It's hard to say that all of the Douglas votes came from people who actually wanted Douglas to win. And it's hard to say exactly how many votes each candidate got because the electors were running individually, not as part of slates as is normally the case.

No question that there were a lot of shenanigans on the Democratic side which is why Lincoln got 4 of the 7 electoral votes, even tho his guys got fewer votes. The Lincoln electors were basically a slate. Look at the vote each of the 7 got; the vote was almost identical, give or take a few. Not so on the Democratic side.

What you fail to mention is how popular Breckenridge was in NJ amongst the Democrats , especially in the Southern counties, and that guy ends up being the Vice President of the Confederacy.

 

[retired711]

No question that there were a lot of shenanigans on the Democratic side which is why Lincoln got 4 of the 7 electoral votes, even tho his guys got fewer votes. The Lincoln electors were basically a slate. Look at the vote each of the 7 got; the vote was almost identical, give or take a few. Not so on the Democratic side.

What you fail to mention is how popular Breckenridge was in NJ amongst the Democrats , especially in the Southern counties, and that guy ends up being the Vice President of the Confederacy.

No, Breckenridge became a Confederate General. The Vice President of the Confederacy was Alexander Stephens of Georgia -- even though he had made an eloquent speech *against* secession at the beginning of the Georgia convention. (He pointed out the South had a lot to lose by seceding, and he was indeed right!)

Breckinridge's popularity in Southern New Jersey reflects just how far south New Jersey goes. Cape May is south of the Mason-Dixon line.

 

[RU Husky]

No, Breckenridge became a Confederate General. The Vice President of the Confederacy was Alexander Stephens of Georgia -- even though he had made an eloquent speech *against* secession at the beginning of the Georgia convention. (He pointed out the South had a lot to lose by seceding, and he was indeed right!)

Breckinridge's popularity in Southern New Jersey reflects just how far south New Jersey goes. Cape May is south of the Mason-Dixon line.

My bad on John C, I was too quick on the trigger, but you made my point. He was VP of the U.S.under Buchanan.

 

[oldman87]

I'm just glad we ended up on the same side as Drogon.

 

[retired711]

My bad on John C, I was too quick on the trigger, but you made my point. He was VP of the U.S.under Buchanan.

Didn't know that; thanks! Breckenridge was from Kentucky. Remember what Abraham Lincoln said to visiting clergy; "I hope to have God on my side, but I must have Kentucky!" This is why Lincoln edged his way to emancipation; he didn't want to get too far in front of his coalition.

 

[superfan01]

Not sure what is more embarrassing for NJ. Voting against Lincoln twice or for Christie twice.

 

[AshSaturday]

From one who tends to vote mostly Democratic I add "vote for Corzine twice" At least Christie was very visable re "Hurricane Sandy" and crossed many Repubicans by working with President Obama. That said still many affected by Sandy related losses.

 

[Proud NJ Sports Fan]

NJ was at war vs NY & I think vs PA at some point.

 

[mwcllc]

Lincoln lost the popular vote in NJ in both 1860 and 1864. The descendants of those who voted against Honest Abe post regularly on the current events board.

You definitely got that right. That board is like Mississippi sometimes

 

[Scarlet16E]

just how far south New Jersey goes. Cape May is south of the Mason-Dixon line.

Often said, but simply not true.
The Mason-Dixon line delineates Maryland's borders with Pennsylvania and Delaware.

The truth is that if you extended the portion of the Mason-Dixon line that separates MD and PA eastward (forgetting about the 90 degree turn the line makes when it meets Delaware) then large parts of Salem, Cumberland, and Cape May Counties would be south of this imaginary line.

 

[HeyHuey]

Kind of a wedgie...trollie....scummy post.

 

[Myrtleknight]

Yeah I'm not a historian and have never read about slaves in NJ. But when I was growing up in New Milford my parents were friends with someone who lived in a historic home. I think it was built in the 1700s. I distinctly remember the entrance in the floor of the kitchen that led to the all dirt basement that still had chains they said were original and were used for slaves.

 

[RU Husky]

The Underground Railroad had tunnels that ran right down Mine St leading into what is now Ford Hall and then slaves crossed the Raritan on the way to New York.

Focus on Ford - Ford Hall

Winants Hall was constructed in 1890 and was the first and only Rutgers dormitory until Ford Hall was built in 1915. The building is still used for graduate housing. The interesting stories surrounding Ford Hall involve a mysterious underground tunnel which ends at or near the residence hall. Based on maps and information in the Rutgers Picture Book, the tunnel is an old mine shaft that was in operation during the mid 1700's. It runs down Mine Street to College Avenue and ends at or near Ford Hall. Uses for the mine after its closing are believed to include a means of escape for slaves as an Underground Railroad, a passage for arms smuggling during the Revolutionary War, and a tunnel for smuggling alcohol during Prohibition.

An investigation of the basement in Ford Hall led to the discovery of many locked up and boarded up rooms and apparent crawl spaces that could not be accessed. One item of interest was a two-step metal stairwell that appeared to be covering up some sort of terrain. It is possible that one of the inaccessible rooms or areas, or maybe even the space under the stairwell could have some tie to the end of the mysterious tunnel, since its location is right below College Avenue. This could be another interesting location to come back to.

 

[DirtyRU]

This thread makes me wanna watch Glory.

 

[srru86]

Isn't Winfield Park part of Linden?

Though raised and lived most of my life in NJ I never heard of Winfield Park until I moved to Union County. When house shopping I noted the buildings looked like WWII vintage housing. The realtor said they were built for war time workers at the Kearny Shipyard. When the feds wanted to build temporary housing Clark, and Linden, wanted nothing to do with transplanted war workers to be housed in a New Deal mutual housing complex and another one of NJ's odd little municipalities was created in 1941 by the legislature carving out a piece for the workers housing.

 

[BROTHERSKINNY]

Lincoln lost the popular vote in NJ in both 1860 and 1864. The descendants of those who voted against Honest Abe post regularly on the current events board.

You do realize that Lincoln was a republican, so its not surprising he lost NJ. unfotuantely, We were majority democrat back then.

 

[mdk01]

Misleading thread. New Jersey passed laws of graduated freedom for those under slavery, so it was a near dead institution by the outbreak of the Civil War. Additionally, slavery was never huge in the state and certainly would not be a reason for NJ sympathy for the South. What did have some interest was the economic ties buying raw material and selling products to the South. NJ exported over 50% of its products below the Mason Dixon Line, and this trade would be disrupted by any Civil War. Also large numbers of Virginia vacationers came to the NJ shore and mixed with New Jerseyans for summer fun. Citing not voting for Lincoln in 1864 (Lincoln won NJ in 1860) as pro South is apples and oranges. Voting for McClellan a local guy an future governor of NJ at a time where there was serious war fatigue is not rooting against the Union.

Too nuanced for the SJWs

 

[miket007]

I swear you can go to more than a few communities in north jerz & the shore and still think you're back in those segregated days

 

[RU Husky]

You do realize that Lincoln was a republican, so its not surprising he lost NJ. unfotuantely, We were majority democrat back then.

So we're neighboring NY and PA and Lincoln carried both of them, twice.