NIL - Where to divert the $$

kapyoche

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Hobbs should get his butt to Bedminster next week like Charles Barkley and get some of that Saudi money they are throwing around to those who can lay a big wet one.
We can then use that money to buy some 5 stars and 4 stars. This is how to win. It's not that complicated.
A Messiah has a better chance of showing up before a 5 star does On the Banks of the Old Raritan. We have been praying since 1869.
It's time to stop praying and get Hobbs an Uber ride to Bedminster next week.
 

NickRU714

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What makes you think that would happen?

If Rutgers basketball won like Gonzaga then Rutgers football would benefit. Same the other way around. Think Michigan State. You are forcing this into a binary choice that just doesn't make sense.

Besides, NIL is name, image and likeness and no two athletes, regardless of sport, shares the same name, image and likeness. Each can get whatever it is their name, image and likeness can generate for themselves. And it is up to those providing the funds to decide whom they wish to invest in.. to leverage off their name, image and likeness. At least that is supposed to be how that works.. but that is not what is happening in all.. or even most.. cases. They are being paid according to their percieved value in helping a program achieve its goals.

Exactly.

$1m NIL for a football OL or $1m NIL for an elite SF?

That elite SF is going to have a bigger impact and sooner impact than even the best OL.
It's just a fact of less players on the field/court.

The AD can still be "football focused" while also spending money on basketball.
 
Sep 11, 2006
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Exactly.

$1m NIL for a football OL or $1m NIL for an elite SF?

That elite SF is going to have a bigger impact and sooner impact than even the best OL.
It's just a fact of less players on the field/court.

The AD can still be "football focused" while also spending money on basketball.
Well.. except for the idea that NIL money is not spent nor directed by any AD or coach.. supposedly. Yeah, I know, in practice the boosters are told whose name image and likeness is worth X to a coach/program.

Schiano came very close to saying something about it in the afternoon interview at Big Ten media day today.. he said we all need to live by the same rules (and, really, right now is the wild west.. no rules.. in practice).
 

AdventureHasAName

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I’d sign up for a fraction of UNC/UVA Bball success in a hot minute if it meant 500 football and minor bowls
Yeah, I wouldn't. And it wouldn't mean 500 football and minor bowls. There is exactly zero evidence that success in basketball would result in 500 football (ask Kansas, UConn, Syracuse, Arkansas, UCLA). You could certainly have a great basketball program and a 500 football program, but correlation does not equal causation.
 
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iReC89

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I hate to say it but I think Penn State players are on the right track. Players deserve a meaningful share of media rights revenue and also ticket sales. Universities and media companies are earning off of the hyping of individual players as well as the team as a whole. If RU is going to put 3 players on a billboard, show them the NIL money. If someone makes a highlight reel, give them a cut. I think the pool of business that can make a investment case for spending money on NIL is a lot more shallow then the amount that should come out of media rights.
 

JayDogSmooth

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Aug 18, 2006
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Yeah, I wouldn't. And it wouldn't mean 500 football and minor bowls. There is exactly zero evidence that success in football would result in 500 football (ask Kansas, UConn, Syracuse, Arkansas, UCLA). You could certainly have a great basketball program and a 500 football program, but correlation does not equal causation.
So what are your ideas man? Every idea we’ve come up with to try to get some donors you’ve shot right down.

You certainly don’t wanna be basketball centric as I don’t, but you’re not providing any ideas or positive input. It’s all negative and we can’t do this and we can’t do that, this has never worked and the state only supports a winner

If not basketball centric, and not a grass roots effort to reach out to current students, young alumni, all living alumni and all major corporations within 150 to 200 mile radius, then what the hell are your ideas?
 

rutgersal

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It can’t be either / or
Money needs to be allocated for both

assuming a check was written today, the earliest the IPF / FOF would open is 2024

Conversely, big schools are already forming war chests for the best players

I’m very intersted to see what schiano has to say about it Thursday at the TD club meeting
Schiano is going to say we need you to support this to compete.

But in regards to NIL, it’s not schools, it’s boosters. Schools don’t have any part in this.

I already support Knights of the Raritan.
Our level of support isn’t enough to beat out the Texas A&Ms, and Ohio States and Texas’ out for NIL kids. Maybe once in a while we get lucky, but our NIL efforts should be focused on retention, as Knights of the Raritan is doing. Focusing on retention will will give us a better chance to keep the 3* kids we do develop.

Any check written for the IPF will have an impact for the next 100 years. People should support Knights of the Raritan, but the bulk of support should go to the R Fund.
 

JayDogSmooth

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Schiano is going to say we need you to support this to compete.

But in regards to NIL, it’s not schools, it’s boosters. Schools don’t have any part in this.

I already support Knights of the Raritan.
Our level of support isn’t enough to beat out the Texas A&Ms, and Ohio States and Texas’ out for NIL kids. Maybe once in a while we get lucky, but our NIL efforts should be focused on retention, as Knights of the Raritan is doing. Focusing on retention will will give us a better chance to keep the 3* kids we do develop.

Any check written for the IPF will have an impact for the next 100 years. People should support Knights of the Raritan, but the bulk of support should go to the R Fund.
That’s why we need more donors
And corporations
Hobbs and co need to start reaching out asap if they haven’t already stsrted
 

RUBlackout7

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Schiano is going to say we need you to support this to compete.

But in regards to NIL, it’s not schools, it’s boosters. Schools don’t have any part in this.

I already support Knights of the Raritan.
Our level of support isn’t enough to beat out the Texas A&Ms, and Ohio States and Texas’ out for NIL kids. Maybe once in a while we get lucky, but our NIL efforts should be focused on retention, as Knights of the Raritan is doing. Focusing on retention will will give us a better chance to keep the 3* kids we do develop.

Any check written for the IPF will have an impact for the next 100 years. People should support Knights of the Raritan, but the bulk of support should go to the R Fund.
Is retention all they are focused on? We probably have like 5 players max worth putting effort into retaining. Odd to only focus on that.

Top priority is getting better players into the program via new recruits or transfers. That’s where Knights of the Raritan should focus.
 

rutgersal

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That’s why we need more donors
And corporations
Hobbs and co need to start reaching out asap if they haven’t already stsrted
Hobbs isn’t going to have any part of this. It’s all donor driven, and this NIL money is FK U money. People have to take the initiative and step up.

Miami, USC, OSU alums etc have lots of F U money supporting NIL. We’re not even in the same galaxy. Schools love this, because they don’t need additional overhead to manage NIL.

we’ve got a few hundred members doing NIL. what we need is 3K willing to donate $1K. That will give us $3M to provide to a player that develops, so that he won’t have to transfer to USC or similar.
 
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rutgersal

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Is retention all they are focused on? We probably have like 5 players max worth putting effort into retaining. Odd to only focus on that.

Top priority is getting better players into the program via new recruits or transfers. That’s where Knights of the Raritan should focus.
Retention is what we can realistically support for now. Even with that too, we will provide something nominal, but won’t break the bank.

Going after high school kids is complex. There’s just not enough support to make it a focus. Once they are enrolled, it’s easier to support them.
 

JayDogSmooth

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Hobbs isn’t going to have any part of this. It’s all donor driven, and this NIL money is FK U money. People have to take the initiative and step up.

Miami, USC, OSU alums etc have lots of F U money supporting NIL. We’re not even in the same galaxy. Schools love this, because they don’t need additional overhead to manage NIL.

we’ve got fewer than 300 members doing NIL, or may be we just passed that number.
what we need is 3K willing to donate $1K. That will give us $3M to provide to a player that develops, so that he won’t have to transfer to USC or similar.
Hobbs needs to hire or have input hiring the team to go out and solicit $$

Hobbs also be speaking w big $ donors, as they hopefully will also assist w facilities (again, NIL & facilities aren’t mutually exclusive of one another)
 

AdventureHasAName

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So what are your ideas man? Every idea we’ve come up with to try to get some donors you’ve shot right down.

You certainly don’t wanna be basketball centric as I don’t, but you’re not providing any ideas or positive input. It’s all negative and we can’t do this and we can’t do that, this has never worked and the state only supports a winner

If not basketball centric, and not a grass roots effort to reach out to current students, young alumni, all living alumni and all major corporations within 150 to 200 mile radius, then what the hell are your ideas?
Sometimes there are no good solutions. In this instance, there are none. But doing something worse with a "got to do sumthin'" attitude is neither wise or realistic. As best I can tell, your two ideas are (a) spend all the NIL money you have on buying one superstar basketball player, and (b) ask people for more donations. The first is a bad idea because other schools that have essentially already taken that course of action over the last 30 years are in far worse shape than we are. The second is something we already do; you didn't invent begging people for money.

Here's the truth: You are not a fan of a school that values intercollegiate athletic success. Rutgers only started to pretend to care if it was successful in athletics about 20 years go. Some of our competitors started caring 100 years ago. And at those competitors, they have 75-80% buy-in from those affiliated with the school. At Rutgers you probably have 10-15% buy-in (administration, faculty, staff, students, alumni, local news media, politicians). Under the old system, we were making small progress for the last 20 years. Small progress. We're less than ten years away from hiring an athletics director specifically because she was a lesbian; that's not a school that makes athletic success a priority. Under this new NIL system, we basically have no chance of competing. It was not designed for us to compete; it just wasn't.

The only possible ways we could become competitive in the current landscape are:

1. A rabid Rutgers fan becomes a billionaire overnight,
2. The Big Ten bans NIL for all member schools,
3. Pro-Rutgers forces overtake the NJ governor's mansion and legislature and specifically earmark state money for athletic upgrades (on that note, we just got a mass influx of money from the state - which is great - but it's barely a blip compared to the money available to our competitor schools),
4. The US Congress grants an anti-trust exemption to the NCAA.

None of these are likely to happen, but that's basically it. These are the potential solutions.
 

rutgersal

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Hobbs needs to hire or have input hiring the team to go out and solicit $$

Hobbs also be speaking w big $ donors, as they hopefully will also assist w facilities (again, NIL & facilities aren’t mutually exclusive of one another)
Hobbs scope is facilities. NIL is something that he won’t get involved with. It’s completely out of the schools scope.

yes, we will simultaneously do both, but the R fund should receive the bulk of donations.
 

JayDogSmooth

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Hobbs scope is facilities. NIL is something that he won’t get involved with. It’s completely out of the schools scope.

yes, we will simultaneously do both, but the R fund should receive the bulk of donations.

Hobbs scope is facilities. NIL is something that he won’t get involved with. It’s completely out of the schools scope.

yes, we will simultaneously do both, but the R fund should receive the bulk of donations.
We agree on NIL receiving bulk of donations, and on Hobbs duties
Disagree on facilities, you constantly have to be tweaking them once built
Either way, more $ is desperately needed
 
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JayDogSmooth

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Sometimes there are no good solutions. In this instance, there are none. But doing something worse with a "got to do sumthin'" attitude is neither wise or realistic. As best I can tell, your two ideas are (a) spend all the NIL money you have on buying one superstar basketball player, and (b) ask people for more donations. The first is a bad idea because other schools that have essentially already taken that course of action over the last 30 years are in far worse shape than we are. The second is something we already do; you didn't invent begging people for money.

Here's the truth: You are not a fan of a school that values intercollegiate athletic success. Rutgers only started to pretend to care if it was successful in athletics about 20 years go. Some of our competitors started caring 100 years ago. And at those competitors, they have 75-80% buy-in from those affiliated with the school. At Rutgers you probably have 10-15% buy-in (administration, faculty, staff, students, alumni, local news media, politicians). Under the old system, we were making small progress for the last 20 years. Small progress. We're less than ten years away from hiring an athletics director specifically because she was a lesbian; that's not a school that makes athletic success a priority. Under this new NIL system, we basically have no chance of competing. It was not designed for us to compete; it just wasn't.

The only possible ways we could become competitive in the current landscape are:

1. A rabid Rutgers fan becomes a billionaire overnight,
2. The Big Ten bans NIL for all member schools,
3. Pro-Rutgers forces overtake the NJ governor's mansion and legislature and specifically earmark state money for athletic upgrades (on that note, we just got a mass influx of money from the state - which is great - but it's barely a blip compared to the money available to our competitor schools),
4. The US Congress grants an anti-trust exemption to the NCAA.

None of these are likely to happen, but that's basically it. These are the potential solutions.
Again I ask, when have we had a true grassroots effort into soliciting $$? Hired a professional team of people to call, meet, etc. ?

If we don't try this, and sit back and say "oh well, let's cash checks and keep getting our ass kicked" that will do no good.

You can't have cake and eat it too. You either have to go all in w/football in an attempt to get the $$, or you go Duke style and hope bball works out

Whether or not it's worked before is irreverent, as the NIL has changed the game and the longer we sit on our ass and bemoan the past, the farther we'll fall behind
 

Caliknight

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When they say it’s not about the money, it’s always about the money

You pay market value for marquee players.

If arch Manning wanted to come here and the cost is $3 million, we pay it, no questions asked
Reggie Bush never got paid by boosters. He was given illegal at the time benefits by a sports agency looking to sign him when he went pro. They had no affiliation with SC.

Cam Newton got paid by Auburn boosters.
 

JayDogSmooth

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Reggie Bush never got paid by boosters. He was given illegal at the time benefits by a sports agency looking to sign him when he went pro. They had no affiliation with SC.

Cam Newton got paid by Auburn boosters.
Crazy thing w/Cam (after he was thrown out of UF for stealing laptops) was Cecil initially verbally agreed w/Miss St for 100k

Then Auburn came in at the last minute and nearly doubled it. Additionally, there was a lot of smoke around Miss State dropping a dime on Barn b/c of the double cross, but nothing came of it
 

rutgersal

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Again I ask, when have we had a true grassroots effort into soliciting $$? Hired a professional team of people to call, meet, etc. ?

If we don't try this, and sit back and say "oh well, let's cash checks and keep getting our ass kicked" that will do no good.

You can't have cake and eat it too. You either have to go all in w/football in an attempt to get the $$, or you go Duke style and hope bball works out

Whether or not it's worked before is irreverent, as the NIL has changed the game and the longer we sit on our ass and bemoan the past, the farther we'll fall behind
If we want a good team, people have to pony up. The team will be as good as our support.

Ever since Doug Dolan left, the R Fund, doesn’t seem to be as effective. They would probably benefit from a professional effort.
 
Sep 11, 2006
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How about if I think Kansas? Or Duke. Or Arizona. Or North Carolina. Or Virginia.
So you refuse any example where football and basketball have equal and good success. Got it. A Big Ten program has to be Gonzaga.. or Kansas.. or Arizona.. etc. You have zero information as to what NIL money can do for footbnall or basketball at a place like Rutgers. We get it.. you want football success and will not permit investment in basketball because that might send us down a path to becoming Kansa or Arizona or Gonzaga.. etc etc. It is a stupid point made stupidly and does not refute the idea that it might be cheaper to greatly affect the sucecss of basketball with NIL before you'd see any appreciable impact on football for the same money. You want to refute that idea by saying you don't want to see it. Just silly.
 

WhichReligionIsRight

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You are correct in this thread. Inflation will have a big negative impact on all of this. I know the football players look at the giant TV contracts and say, where's my share? But that money is all accounted for and every day they walk into the stadiums, practice fields, training facilities, special dorms... they are walking through a giant share of that money.

And salaries for coaches and administrators.
 

AdventureHasAName

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Again I ask, when have we had a true grassroots effort into soliciting $$? Hired a professional team of people to call, meet, etc. ?
Cary Elwes Disney Plus GIF by Disney+


What do you mean by "grassroots"? Typically, grassroots would be the exact opposite of hiring a professional team.
 

AdventureHasAName

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So you refuse any example where football and basketball have equal and good success. Got it.
I don't refuse any example ... what I refuse is the statement of fact that championship-level success in mens basketball will automatically translate into middle-of-the-pack-at-worst football absent any evidence. Do you have evidence of schools where they had bottom of the barrel football, then went to a Final Four and their football team took off?

EDIT: Because I have a lot of examples of schools where their mens basketball team went to a Final Four and their football team continued to suck and now the school is begging to get into a conference that is still going to exist in 20 years (and that invitation/escape route is not going to happen).
 
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I don't refuse any example ... what I refuse is the statement of fact that championship-level success in mens basketball will automatically translate into middle-of-the-pack-at-worst football absent any evidence. Do you have evidence of schools where they had bottom of the barrel football, then went to a Final Four and their football team took off?
Baylor, UVA, Cinicnatti, UCLA, Louisville, Michigan State, ..

Your challenge is skewed since there are 3X more bastball teams playing at the top level than there are football teams.

Show me Big Ten teams that have had success in basketball but not in football. Indiana? Illinois won the football conference in 2001 and 14 times before that. Do they count in your world?

You demand that a Big Ten team that invests in baskebtall relegates football to mediocrity.. and that just is not the case. Why you insist upon this I have no idea. I have even less of an idea as to why I bother to answer.. the challenge maybe? Not much of that. Finger exercise?
 

JayDogSmooth

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Cary Elwes Disney Plus GIF by Disney+


What do you mean by "grassroots"? Typically, grassroots would be the exact opposite of hiring a professional team.
I mean they should be targeting everybody.

Current students, young alumni, all living alumni, businesses, corporations etc.

That is how you build future generations of fans and donors, instead of alienating people and selectively choosing who and whom not to engage with based on some nonsense criteria.

We need all the money we can get, and it’s time we start acting like a big league organization - Obviously remains the seen if it’ll work but absent of somebody hitting Powerball or a mega donor are stepping up, these are the steps that we need to take starting yesterday
 

AreYouNUTS

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Initially it’s a bad idea because you have to get the football only facility and the IPF built. Once that’s done, in addition to other maintenance around the stadium etc. as well as other athletic updates like the rack across stadium etc., NIL will be the driving force moving forward and you’ll see a significant amount of money go towards that
Okay so you're talking football-ONLY funds?
 

AdventureHasAName

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Baylor, UVA, Cinicnatti, UCLA, Louisville, Michigan State, ..

Your challenge is skewed since there are 3X more bastball teams playing at the top level than there are football teams.

Show me Big Ten teams that have had success in basketball but not in football. Indiana? Illinois won the football conference in 2001 and 14 times before that. Do they count in your world?
Baylor first went to a New Years Day bowl in 2013 and first went to the Final Four in 2020. They have no chance of an SEC or Big Ten invitation.

Virginia first went to a Final Four in 2019, and nine months later, they first went to a New Years Day bowl. They have like a five percent chance of an SEC or Big Ten invitation.

Cincinnati went to Final Fours in 1963 and 1992. They first went to a New Years Day bowl in 2008. They have no chance of an SEC or Big Ten invitation.

UCLA is the best college basketball program of all time. They first went to a Final Four in 1962 and have been to a ton ever since (as recently as last year). They first went to the Rose Bowl in 1942 and went to their first non-Rose Bowl New Years Day bowl in 1978. Their most recent New Years Day bowl was in 1998 and their football team has fallen off the national map in the last 25 years. They were just accepted into the Big Ten (and would have been invited to the SEC if they asked).

Louisville has been to a ton of Final Fours (starting in 1958 and as recently as 2013). Their football team went to a lone New Years Day bowl in 1990 and then again had a string of success (Gator Bowl, Orange Bowl) starting in 2005. Neither the Big Ten would never invite them into the conference. There's one percent chance the SEC might eventually invite them (in a 24 team league).

Michigan State first went to a Final Four in 1957. It saw renewed basketball success in 1978 and again in 1999. It's been to 10 Final Fours (as most recently as 2019). It's first New Years Day bowl was in 1937, but its recent football success began in 1987. It's most recent New Years Day bowl was 2013, but it's last really good bowl (Peach Bowl) was two years ago. They've been in the Big Ten forever, but if they asked to go to the SEC, they would be denied.

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I fail to see how any of these examples prove a theory that investment in basketball results in improvement in football.

You demand that a Big Ten team that invests in baskebtall relegates football to mediocrity.. and that just is not the case. Why you insist upon this I have no idea. I have even less of an idea as to why I bother to answer.. the challenge maybe? Not much of that. Finger exercise?

Yeah, I never said that. I said that there is no evidence of schools that bought Final Four caliber basketball team and then immediately saw their football program take off as a result. If that concept worked, schools like Arizona and UConn wouldn't be begging to get out of their conferences and we'd be hearing about all the 5-star offensive linemen headed to Kansas and Duke.
 
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WhiteBus

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Reading this thread it is very clear that a lot of people don't know how the NIL really works.
 

JayDogSmooth

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Baylor first went to a New Years Day bowl in 2013 and first went to the Final Four in 2020. They have no chance of an SEC or Big Ten invitation.

Virginia first went to a Final Four in 2019, and nine months later, they first went to a New Years Day bowl. They have like a five percent chance of an SEC or Big Ten invitation.

Cincinnati went to Final Fours in 1963 and 1992. They first went to a New Years Day bowl in 2008. They have no chance of an SEC or Big Ten invitation.

UCLA is the best college basketball program of all time. They first went to a Final Four in 1962 and have been to a ton ever since (as recently as last year). They first went to the Rose Bowl in 1942 and went to their first non-Rose Bowl New Years Day bowl in 1978. Their most recent New Years Day bowl was in 1998 and their football team has fallen off the national map in the last 25 years. They were just accepted into the Big Ten (and would have been invited to the SEC if they asked).

Louisville has been to a ton of Final Fours (starting in 1958 and as recently as 2013). Their football team went to a lone New Years Day bowl in 1990 and then again had a string of success (Gator Bowl, Orange Bowl) starting in 2005. Neither the Big Ten would never invite them into the conference. There's one percent chance the SEC might eventually invite them (in a 24 team league).

Michigan State first went to a Final Four in 1957. It saw renewed basketball success in 1978 and again in 1999. It's been to 10 Final Fours (as most recently as 2019). It's first New Years Day bowl was in 1937, but its recent football success began in 1987. It's most recent New Years Day bowl was 2013, but it's last really good bowl (Peach Bowl) was two years ago. They've been in the Big Ten forever, but if they asked to go to the SEC, they would be denied.

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I fail to see how any of these examples prove a theory that investment in basketball results in improvement in football.



Yeah, I never said that. I said that there is no evidence of schools that bought Final Four caliber basketball team and then immediately saw their football program take off as a result. If that concept worked, schools like Arizona and UConn wouldn't be begging to get out of their conferences and we'd be hearing about all the 5-star offensive linemen headed to Kansas and Duke.
UVA near lock for B1G or SEC (hearing B1G)