OT: 2021 NY Giants Off Season Thread
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How interesting that posting facts and stats about the Giants passing offense going backwards and regressing in 2020 (ending the season ahead of only the Jets in most categories) is "trashing Jones".
Also interesting how everyone is saying Giants don't have the draft capital to get Watson.
I was assuming Jones has more trade value than Tua, Lawrence (Jax #1) and Fields (Jets #2).
Maybe I'm wrong.
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All elite QBs are expensive after their rookie contract.
Jones will cost approx 25-30mil in 2023 (5th year option) and then probably 30-40mil after that.
That's why teams need to start winning while their QB is cheap. It's a huge cap advantage.
See KC, Baltimore, Buffalo, Cleveland, Philly, Rams, Chicago, Seattle.
All those teams competed in the playoffs and most made the Super Bowl with QBs in their 2nd to 3rd year.
He regressed because the offensive line sucked.
By the way, did you see Watson's cap numbers for the next 3 years?
No one is saying Giants don't have draft capital. For instance I was saying that Jets have more Draft capital right now with #2 and #23 picks. As well as probably what may be a good pick next year. Also, shiny new toys are always worth more.....plus they are less expensive cap wise.......thats why teams covet picks vs most players in trades.
Thus we shouldn't trade for a QB who is already making big money? That would seem to be the obvious logical argument based upon this post.
Not to mention the trade cost it would take to get him.
We are going to be paying big money for a QB within 2 years anyway if Jones is still here.
Watson is significantly more expensive for 1 year and will be cheaper once Jones' extension kicks in.
The trade cost is how much better is Watson than Jones now and in the future.
We'll leave that argument alone for now.
Jones contract
2021: 7m
2022: 8m
2023: approx 30mil (5th year option)
2024-2027 - approx 30-35m/year
Watson contract
2021: 15m
2022: 40m
2023: 42m (10m dead cap)
2024: 34m (5m dead cap)
2025: 32m (0 dead cap)
The logical argument would be to never pay a young QB a big extension unless 100% positive you can compete for multiple Super Bowls with them (such as Mahomes).
Look at Wentz (team won SB), Goff (went to SB), Garoppolo (went to SB).
All had great success and now teams regretting the contratcts.
Trubisky went 11-3 his 2nd year, took the Bears to the playoffs and made the Pro Bowl.
They still didn't pick up his 5th year option and offer an extension.
This year he went 6-3 as a starter with 16td 8int and the team is still not sure about bringing him back.
Dak took the Cowboys to the playoffs twice and they wouldn't give him a big extension.
Baker, Lamar and Allen are likely going to get their huge contracts this offseason too.
Not sure Cleveland and Ravens won't regret that in a couple years.
Look at Wentz (team won SB), Goff (went to SB), Garoppolo (went to SB).
All had great success and now teams regretting the contratcts.
Trubisky went 11-3 his 2nd year, took the Bears to the playoffs and made the Pro Bowl.
They still didn't pick up his 5th year option and offer an extension.
This year he went 6-3 as a starter with 16td 8int and the team is still not sure about bringing him back.
Dak took the Cowboys to the playoffs twice and they wouldn't give him a big extension.
Baker, Lamar and Allen are likely going to get their huge contracts this offseason too.
Not sure Cleveland and Ravens won't regret that in a couple years.
I fully agree, and this still looks like an anti Watson argument.
Just going by your #'s. Watson would be twice as expensive next year, 5x more expensive in 2022, and a $12mil larger cap hit in 2023, and then pretty even after that.
So that's 3 years of significantly more expensive.
Giants cut WR Golden Tate, LB Mayo in salary cap moves
EAST RUTHERFORD, N.J. — The New York Giants have cut Golden Tate in a move that clears $6.1 million in salary cap space and says goodbye to a wide receiver who never panned out after signing …
pix11.com
WR Free Agent hopes (however fleeting they were in the first place) seem to be drying up.
WR Allen Robinson (Chi) - franchise tagged
WR Chris Godwin (TB) - franchise tagged
WR Kenny Golloday (Det) - not tagged. He'll be the top WR on the market and probably out of our price range. A bunch of other WR-needy teams have much more cap space.
Looks like it'll be hope on a WR1 in the draft and then producing in his rookie year.
WR Allen Robinson (Chi) - franchise tagged
WR Chris Godwin (TB) - franchise tagged
WR Kenny Golloday (Det) - not tagged. He'll be the top WR on the market and probably out of our price range. A bunch of other WR-needy teams have much more cap space.
Looks like it'll be hope on a WR1 in the draft and then producing in his rookie year.
Also, Leonard Williams franchise tagged again.
Currently taking up about $20m in capspace.
Giants need to figure out a long term contract for him and get under the cap by start of league year on 3-17.
Having Williams on the tag would be devastating for the cap.
Currently taking up about $20m in capspace.
Giants need to figure out a long term contract for him and get under the cap by start of league year on 3-17.
Having Williams on the tag would be devastating for the cap.
Zeitler released. Not sure I agree with this. Yeah it saves them 10M but he was their best O lineman on a team that ranked last in pass protection I believe. I’d rather them go O line in round one now. Another year rebuilding the O line.
I dont understand how we are in such cap hell. We are not paying our QB or Barkley yet. We don’t have a stud receiver, o lineman or defensive end. Who are we paying?!?! Most good teams are paying their stud QB huge money and they can still afford to sign players.
I have no clue tbh. Just a lot of bad contracts. They have no real stars on the team either. Maybe Barkley but he only performed that way his rookie year. Was reading earlier today that they have a bunch of money next year. Hopefully they can find a replacement guard for Zeitler as a bunch are gonna be free agents.
The cap dropping didn't help.
Also, I saw a quote/tweet that GM DG isn't a fan of backloading contracts to create cap space. Because it "kicks the can down the road".
He prefers flat contracts with same cap hit each year.
Problem with that thinking though is that the cap is constantly rising (note - freak COVID year aside).
And you can always create cap space. Just means it's more work for the GM.
See the Saints every year.
Also, I saw a quote/tweet that GM DG isn't a fan of backloading contracts to create cap space. Because it "kicks the can down the road".
He prefers flat contracts with same cap hit each year.
Problem with that thinking though is that the cap is constantly rising (note - freak COVID year aside).
And you can always create cap space. Just means it's more work for the GM.
See the Saints every year.
Everyone complains about the Eagles being in "cap hell" now.
Ya, but they won a Super Bowl 3 years ago.
Saints have been annual contenders despite cap hell every year.
Rams have traded away approx 45 1st round picks - but they went to a SB and have been in the playoffs.
Is a couple years of "cap hell" worth a SB run?
We have "cap hell" currently with no years of contention.
Ya, but they won a Super Bowl 3 years ago.
Saints have been annual contenders despite cap hell every year.
Rams have traded away approx 45 1st round picks - but they went to a SB and have been in the playoffs.
Is a couple years of "cap hell" worth a SB run?
We have "cap hell" currently with no years of contention.
They signed bradberry and Martinez last year . I assume it’s still a cap hit in 21. Both good signings
Just checked spotrac site.
Martinez cap hit 10 mil. Very expensive for ILB.
Btw- Saquon also 10 mil. Very expensive for RB.
Soldier 16.5 mil. Very expensive for bench.
Starting to understand our cap issues...
they are terrible w the cap. They had some holes that needed to be filled last year and they need to take some lumps this season. They NEED to have weapons around Jones to get an honest evaluation going forward.
I think when you look at what free agent ILBs get in the market Martinez is not expensive, and definitely not "very" expensive. Soldier yes. Saquon depends on his health.
Explains the cap hell they are in a bit.
Very good explanation of their cap situation. In the current NFL landscape, I imagine GMs will have to devalue certain positions in order to be successful and not sure Gettlemen has fully figured that out. That being said, the NFL cap has become un-interpretable. For instance, the Cowboys able to sign Prescott for over $40M per year on average - but it only counts as $22.2M against the cap in 2021.
Big signing in Kenny Golladay today. Feels like they interviewed him for 24 hours
Could be a pair of good signings if, and only IF they can get on the field and stay there for a season.
Good offseason.
Despite what he has publically stated - DG worked the salary cap with backloaded deals and "void years" like every other team does to "massage" the salary cap.
Great job.
It is a little weird that every other team seemed to be offering Gollaway only a 1 year "prove it" deal while the Giants gave him a 3 yr deal.
Despite what he has publically stated - DG worked the salary cap with backloaded deals and "void years" like every other team does to "massage" the salary cap.
Great job.
It is a little weird that every other team seemed to be offering Gollaway only a 1 year "prove it" deal while the Giants gave him a 3 yr deal.
I hear the Texans are still not taking any calls on Watson. Probably because no one is calling.
Man I would hate to be a Texans Fan. Watson was threatening to sit out and not get paid. Looks like the NFL may put him on paid leave over conduct policy. Can't make this stuff up.
Man I would hate to be a Texans Fan. Watson was threatening to sit out and not get paid. Looks like the NFL may put him on paid leave over conduct policy. Can't make this stuff up.
Ex-Giants WR arrested for 1st-degree murder
Ex-Giants WR arrested for 1st-degree murder
The Palm Beach County Sheriff's Office arrested Travis Rudolph, who faces first-degree murder and attempted first-degree murder charges.
Fight outside ex-Giants WR Travis Rudolph’s home preceded deadly shooting, report says
Fight outside ex-Giants WR Travis Rudolph’s home preceded deadly shooting, report says
The Palm Beach County Sheriff's Office arrested former New York Giants wide receiver Travis Rudolph, who faces first-degree murder and attempted first-degree murder charges.
He played less than 1/2 a year with the Giants.
Do they really need to keep throwing that in the headlines?
NJ.com must be pissed didn't play at or against Rutgers.
"Former Rutgers oppenent commits crime....."
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/R/RudoTr00.htm
Do they really need to keep throwing that in the headlines?
NJ.com must be pissed didn't play at or against Rutgers.
"Former Rutgers oppenent commits crime....."
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/R/RudoTr00.htm
Is it any worse then one of our "mods" bringing it here with huge font over multiple posts? I couln't even remember the guy and I pretty much watch every down of every game. Is Tango on the nj.com payroll?
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