OT: Do dealers inflate the documentation and destination fees?

[yesrutgers01]

Was at a dealer, they had a fee for $109 for putting nitrogen in the tires. They said they would waive that and save me $109 dollars. Has anyone put nitrogen in their tires? I have never heard of such a thing. And how can you even prove that it is nitrogen? Once it is in the tire you can't let it out to test it

Most likely a car someone backed out on. Very rarely would someone put nitrogen in tires unless requested. Wouldn’t make any sense to do so for any other reason. It is something that can be done 15 minutes before delivery so why narrow your purchasing pool by doing so beforehand

 

[Upstream]

Was at a dealer, they had a fee for $109 for putting nitrogen in the tires. They said they would waive that and save me $109 dollars. Has anyone put nitrogen in their tires? I have never heard of such a thing. And how can you even prove that it is nitrogen? Once it is in the tire you can't let it out to test it

I prefer to put helium in my tires. It makes the car lighter. Like driving on a cloud.

 

[rurx1228]

I was at an Infiniti dealer last night and the manager mentioned that a car that costs around 50k will have "inception" fees of around $2000. Did not ask what that included but was wondering if anyone knows what may be included in those fees??

 

[RUinOhio]

First is that nitrogen is less likely to migrate through tire rubber than is oxygen, which means that your tire pressures will remain more stable over the long term. Racers figured out pretty quickly that tires filled with nitrogen rather than air also exhibit less pressure change with temperature swings.

Was at a dealer, they had a fee for $109 for putting nitrogen in the tires. They said they would waive that and save me $109 dollars. Has anyone put nitrogen in their tires? I have never heard of such a thing. And how can you even prove that it is nitrogen? Once it is in the tire you can't let it out to test it

 

[Upstream]

First is that nitrogen is less likely to migrate through tire rubber than is oxygen, which means that your tire pressures will remain more stable over the long term. Racers figured out pretty quickly that tires filled with nitrogen rather than air also exhibit less pressure change with temperature swings.

That is a very important consideration when I'm driving a racecar and a 0.1% improvement can make the difference between winning and losing a race.

Do I really care when I'm driving down Route 22 with a trunk full of supplies I picked up at Home Depot?

 

[RUinOhio]

LOL I just cut and paste that.... don't do it, I have no idea where to fill nitrogen....BUT some dealers do fill nitrogen and put a colored cap so people (mechanics) know. It's actually useful, as you're supposed to check air pressure couple times a month.

That is a very important consideration when I'm driving a racecar and a 0.1% improvement can make the difference between winning and losing a race.

Do I really care when I'm driving down Route 22 with a trunk full of supplies I picked up at Home Depot?

 

[beaced]

My son in law sold cars for a short period of time.He told me "Pop, when the salesman greets you and opens his mouth to say Hello,He's LYING"

 

[RUpop]

Costco, Truecar basically the same. As stated previously by another poster you get the average price paid locally not a 'deal', dealerships love it when you come in with that $$ amount.
Find a vehicle you want, google forums for that vehicle and you'll often find threads for price paid and where it was bought from. If you're willing to travel you can get great deals. I'm looking at a 2019 RAM 1500 Limited, loaded out. Through a RAM forum I found a dealer who is giving 7% BELOW invoice before any rebates/incentives. This is over 3k less than I can get locally, believe me I have tried. One way flight to Dulles is $78, 4 hour drive home for over 3k savings is worth it to me. YMMV

 

[ruready4somefootball]

As

As a GM of a dealer in Florida I can tell you no sales man would ever tell you that. If you only knew the pay plans they work under they are all bonus driven based on volum. The sales man can care less what you buy the car for they are on your side and only want to sell a car new car commissions are mostly flat commissions.I can assure you RANDALLJ, this happened. The person who comes over, whatever you call him, who's job it is to "close" the deal said this to me.

 

[Extra Point]

Was at a dealership and they included the doc fee when calculating the tax. The last car I bought, they did not include the doc fee in the tax calculation. The tax on the doc fee was only $26 and change but I don't think that is right.

 

[Upstream]

Was at a dealership and they included the doc fee when calculating the tax. The last car I bought, they did not include the doc fee in the tax calculation. The tax on the doc fee was only $26 and change but I don't think that is right.

Doc fees are the administrative fees charged by the dealer to process documentation for a car sale. These are considered part of the sales price of the car, and are therefore taxable. The actual costs of the Title and Registration fees imposed by the Motor Vehicle Commission should be listed separately and should not be included in the Doc Fees, as those costs are not taxable.

 

[Extra Point]

Doc fees are the administrative fees charged by the dealer to process documentation for a car sale. These are considered part of the sales price of the car, and are therefore taxable. The actual costs of the Title and Registration fees imposed by the Motor Vehicle Commission should be listed separately and should not be included in the Doc Fees, as those costs are not taxable.

That is crazy. Dealers should call it something else so buyers aren't burdened with more taxes.

 

[ponyfoot19]

I believe if you buy tires from, and have them installed by Costco, they fill them with nitrogen. At least that's I encountered in Virginia.

 

[jmc11201]

Doc fees are the administrative fees charged by the dealer to process documentation for a car sale. These are considered part of the sales price of the car, and are therefore taxable. The actual costs of the Title and Registration fees imposed by the Motor Vehicle Commission should be listed separately and should not be included in the Doc Fees, as those costs are not taxable.

I hate paying someone to sell me something.

 

[Upstream]

That is crazy. Dealers should call it something else so buyers aren't burdened with more taxes.

The whole point is it doesn't matter what they call it. The state basically says whatever they call a fee, it is part of the sales price of the car. The exception is taxes and fees paid to the state, since the state isn't going to charge you tax on a tax. But the Doc Fee is kept by the dealer, so it is part of the sales price of the car.

If you could rename fees to avoid taxes, then dealers would say the sales price of the car was $100 and the doc fee is $10,000 and the transportation admin fee is $10,000, etc.

 

[Extra Point]

The whole point is it doesn't matter what they call it. The state basically says whatever they call a fee, it is part of the sales price of the car. The exception is taxes and fees paid to the state, since the state isn't going to charge you tax on a tax. But the Doc Fee is kept by the dealer, so it is part of the sales price of the car.

If you could rename fees to avoid taxes, then dealers would say the sales price of the car was $100 and the doc fee is $10,000 and the transportation admin fee is $10,000, etc.

I read that NJ does not require dealers to charge a doc fee. So if dealers charged a "I had to work today" charge the state wouldn't tax it. :-)

 

[FELONIOUSMONK]

Profit centers come in all shapes and sizes.

 

[fire251]

The destination fee is built into the window sticker...... "delivery charge".... and they are flat nationwide so that a dealership that is near a manufacturer doesn't pay less than someone 1,500 miles away. The DOC fee is set by each dealership. It is their fixed profit.

I see that everyone wants to achieve a net deal where there are discounted down to the dealer invoice, minus all rebates so they can achieve a payment of let's say $400 a month rather than one of $406. The profit becomes the DOC and the manufacturer pays the store a nominal fee of about $500 for moving the unit.

A store must pay real estate taxes, service fees like garbage, electric, gas building repairs etc....... don't forget salaries, wages and benefits for employees.

Now I see that the main goal of buying a car is to hurt the salesman that is probably getting $75-$100 a sale which is considered a minimum commission. Next time you're in the gas station, or buying groceries and milk I guess it's okay to negotiate the price. How dare a business try to make a profit.

It's simple.... you love the car... you are given a price break (not much, maybe 5-7% is all the room they have), plus the rebates.... and you are comfortable with the payment - just buy it. Or you can spend 3 Saturdays, and about 12 hours making sure you save $200 over 5 years, just so you can say you bought cheaper at store A versus store B.

Too many people feel the window sticker mark-up is huge (like 20-50%) which is absolutely not true.

 

[Wolv RU]

The destination fee is built into the window sticker...... "delivery charge".... and they are flat nationwide so that a dealership that is near a manufacturer doesn't pay less than someone 1,500 miles away. The DOC fee is set by each dealership. It is their fixed profit.

I see that everyone wants to achieve a net deal where there are discounted down to the dealer invoice, minus all rebates so they can achieve a payment of let's say $400 a month rather than one of $406. The profit becomes the DOC and the manufacturer pays the store a nominal fee of about $500 for moving the unit.

A store must pay real estate taxes, service fees like garbage, electric, gas building repairs etc....... don't forget salaries, wages and benefits for employees.

Now I see that the main goal of buying a car is to hurt the salesman that is probably getting $75-$100 a sale which is considered a minimum commission. Next time you're in the gas station, or buying groceries and milk I guess it's okay to negotiate the price. How dare a business try to make a profit.

It's simple.... you love the car... you are given a price break (not much, maybe 5-7% is all the room they have), plus the rebates.... and you are comfortable with the payment - just buy it. Or you can spend 3 Saturdays, and about 12 hours making sure you save $200 over 5 years, just so you can say you bought cheaper at store A versus store B.

Too many people feel the window sticker mark-up is huge (like 20-50%) which is absolutely not true.

If this was narrated by Troy McClure, it could probably pass for the script of a spoof video that would appear on the Simpsons.

 

[RU848789]

That is a very important consideration when I'm driving a racecar and a 0.1% improvement can make the difference between winning and losing a race.

Do I really care when I'm driving down Route 22 with a trunk full of supplies I picked up at Home Depot?

Nitrogen for tires is one of the biggest scams out there, especially given that air is 78% nitrogen/21% oxygen. Most of the purported advantages are complete bullshit. There is a very slight advantage in maintaining tire pressure, over a month or more, but certainly not worth the cost, especially since it's pretty simple to top off tire pressure every month or two with free air.

https://www.edmunds.com/car-maintenance/should-you-fill-your-cars-tires-with-nitrogen.html