OT - Game of Thrones Season 7 Thread
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Well.. in the HBO series.. which is becoming canon.. though GRRM cannot be trusted there I think... we saw Ned being asked to take the baby by his sister who was dying. At least I assume that was hat she was saying.. no on can know.. they'll kill my baby.. etc.
I don't think Ned needed a replacement for raising Dany.. but I do like the ideal that Ned knows she's his. Maybe we'll see in flashbacks that Ned was responsible for Dany and Viserys escape to Essos.
Dany is clearly Dragonborn or whatever they call her. If yo are correct, then House Dayne was invested with Valyrian blood in ancient times.. the marks of silver hair and purple eyes are likely a sign of that... and they had trading ports that traded with Valyria so its possible ... even though her father Ned is of First Men stock. But then you have to wonder about Viserys.. clearly no protection from heat and fire for him. Why not? And Dany, thinking she was of Targaryen stock, assumed.. correctly.. that she had dragonblood.
I like that your idea about Ned being Dany's father makes her both aunt and cousin to Jon Snow. Sister to Arya and Sansa and Bran.
Something key about mother's dying in childbirth with dragonriders. Not ever Targaryen could ride Dragons in book.
Yea Ned had to protect Jon Snow from Robert, but again biggest arrow at this to me is in books and show when Robert wanted to kill Danerys, that's when Ned quit. Everything else, Ned let him do, but that was the breaking point. Ned can't take a bastard girl home withe silver hair and purple eyes. In show even Cersei accused Ned of having a child with Ashara Dayne. It got around he was in love with her. At Harrenhal, Ned danced with her and Barristan said "A stark dishonored" Ashara. At the time Brandon Stark was supposed to wed Catlyn, and Ned was free to pursue who he wanted.
Which is why honorable Ned who lovee Ashara, had a child with her, Ashara told Ned where to find his sister, but did his duty and married Catelyn. However, when Ned has all the nightmare of broken promises and such. Jon Snow is safe at the wall, taking the black, and he cannot claim any crowns, so at that point he is of no threat to Robert, but Daneys is ordered to be killed by Robert and Ned has nightmares and quits as hand. Only makes sense if it is his child, or he promised Ashara Dayne to protect the child.
I like the idea that Jon Snow raised from a bastard to King, and Queen Daneys will be lowered to a bastard.
Ned would never cheat on his wife, that in the central point to the R+L=J theory, which turn out to be true. Dany can't be his daughter, that is one crazy crackpot theory, LOL. She is 100% Targaryen, she hatch the dragon eggs and she never had any wolf dreams. The facts do not that match any of that. It just doesn't make any sense. Jamie Lannister is not Azhor Ahai, The red woman saw a child and a wolf in her visions and a dragon... no lions. It is either Jon or Dany as they both match it 100%. Of course it could actually be their off-spring if they ever have a baby together or Azhor Ahai could be just a myth. No one said that was a real thing, they just think it is, or some people do.
I love crackpot theories as they are funny to read, so thank you for that at least.
Tyrion being half Targaryen has sightly more weight behind it but but the heads of the Dragon DO NOT have to be Targaryens per say. No one ever said that, GRRM made that clear.
I love crackpot theories as they are funny to read, so thank you for that at least.
Tyrion being half Targaryen has sightly more weight behind it but but the heads of the Dragon DO NOT have to be Targaryens per say. No one ever said that, GRRM made that clear.
have to agree
on the Tyrion thing however, that's an interesting theory that Good had
for anyone who is interested---some sites that my colleagues put together and work on: http://gameofthrones.com/game-of-thrones/season-7/episode-1 (this does all episodes of the show)
http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/
http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/
disclaimer, I haven't read the books....but gentlemen, please help me.......who the f*ck are Ashara Dayne & Ashor Ahai?????......and is it realistic they'll be tied in to the existing HBO stories with only 12 episodes left?
great read/theories, but i have no clue of these 2 characters.
Here's a shortcut for you.. GRRM modeled this world after England and the the War of the Roses. So, if you know anything about that, that should give you the right "feel" for what's going on. The Lannisters are the Lancasters and the Starks the Yorks. The Lancasters took an early lead, the Yorks took the crown.. Lancasters got it back and then the Yorks again.. pretty evenly matched.. then the Tudors came in.
Shakespeare wrote during the Tudor years.. and since they took over from the Yorks, York kings got largely blasted by him and Lancasters fared well.
The continent of Westeros looks like Britain with Kings Landing being London and the Wildmen are the Scotts! The huge land mass to its east could be thought of as Eurasia. With the Dothraki stepping in for Atilla the Hun's crowd.. or Kossacks.
But if you don't know about England and the War of the Roses then this info will not help you picture things.
But back to GoT...
I'll see if I can help you out in a simple format...
Westeros is the 7 Kingdoms.. so lets set up what is going on in each kingdom.. starting in the north showing the traditional house that rules that kingdom.
Stark of Winterfell, rulers of The North.
The Battle of the Bastards pitted Jon Snow/Sansa Stark with an army that was made up largely of a few loyal northern houses plus wildmen and a giant against Ramsay Snow/Bolton (also a northern house). The good guys were going to lose but Sansa brought the cavalry provided by her cousin from
Arryn of the Eyrie, rulers of The Vale.
Littlefinger controls the boy ruler, Sansa's cousin Robert (who likes to make people fly out the moon door). Littlefinger is the social-climbing whore-monger from kings Landing who had the hots for Sansa's mom and now has them for Sansa... and the Iron Throne itself. He brought the Knights of the Vale into the wars to help Sansa take Winterfell back. Which reward does he want more.. Sansa or her help as an ally to get something else. Dunno.
Tully of Riverrun, rulers of The Riverlands.
Sansa's mom was a Tully and was killed along with her son, Rob Stark at The Twins (also in the Riverlands and think of it as a toll bridge over a great river.. without that bridge moving on land between the North and anyplace south is nigh impossible). And at the start of the first episode this season the perpetrator of the Red Wedding, old Walder Frey, controlled Riverun (because Jamie and the Lannsters took it back for him using Freys new Son-in-Law Edmure Tully (Sansa's uncle) who was the groom at The red Wedding.
Since Arya killed all the Freys at the Twins (mass murder is fun!) I would assume that this makes the Lannisters rulers of Riverun and the Riverlands. And we see Arya sitting down to eat with a bunch of Lannister soldiers in the 1st episode.. on her way to kill Queen Cersei.. LOL.
Lannister of Casterly Rock, rulers of The Westerlands.
Pretty straightforward here. The Lannisters still hold their kingdom and keep, Casterly Rock. Who is actually in control there? Don't know. Jamie is running around helping the army secure the Riverlands (where rebels still cause trouble.. the people The HOUND are with). In S6EP10 (finale) we see Daario Naharis (Dany's lover) ask her if he should go directly to Casterly Rock... but Dany's ditches him and leaves him in Mereen.
Baratheon of Storm's End, rulers of The Stormlands.
Far Robert, the guy who sat on the Iron throne to start the series.. was killed by Cersie with poison.. just like she killed his Hand of the King, John Arryn (which was the reason Robert rode north to get Eddard Stark to be his Hand. His lands are south of Kings Landing and the 3 Baratheon brothers, now all dead, all claimed to be King... once Robert died. Robert was on the Iron throne in Kings Landing. Stannis was in the old Targaryen King's keep on Dragonstone and Renley was in Storm's End.
It looked like Dragonstone was abandoned when Stannis brought his forces north.. to the Wall and then to attack the Boltons at Winterfell. That's where Dany is now.
Tyrell of Highgarden, rulers of The Reach.
The Reach is Southwest of King's Landing.. fertile ground for farming, they are the food source for Kings Landing and the Lannisters. All of them, we assume, died in Cersei's wildfire attack on the great Sept of Baelor. Lady Olenna is the grandmother of Margary (married Renly Baratheon then bethrothed to Joffrey and Tommen) and Loras (gay lover of Renley Baratheon) who died alongside their father, Mace Tyrell.
At the end of last season (or was it in this first episode this season) we see Lady Olenna (who was hot as hell as an Avenger and a Bond Girl) we see her down south at..
an independent Kingdom of Dorne... capital/keep is Sunspear.. House Martell
What's that like.. Spain maybe? That's where "The Red Viper" was from.. the guy whose head got crushed by The Mountain defending Tyrion. The Mountain, Gregor Clegaine, raped and murdered some Martels down in Dorne. Anyway.. itlooks like Te Reach and Drone are going to team up against the Lannisters and the Iron Throne.. and I think we know that Dorne was going to try to woo Dany too...
Like Dorne there are a couple other areas of interest to know what's going on where...
Old Town..
far South End of the reach.. near Dorner.. a coastal city.. probably like a city state.. it houses the training center for Maesters.. the Citadel.. where fat Samwell Tarly is now... to learn how to win the war against the undead.
Iron Islands...
Theon and Yara fled uncle Euron's death threat taking his best ships and joined up with Dany. So Euron took this new fleet he built (where he got teh wood on rocky iron islands I do not know) .. but he took his fleet to offer to Cersei for her hand.. she said no and now Euron is off to prove his worth to her.. so I would assume he is going after Yara, Theon and Dany and my guess is those dragons make short work of him.
North of the Wall..
Winter is Here.. in S7EP1 we see The Hound looking into the fire and seeing whats happening up north. So I assume the Brothers without Banners will be heading there to help Jon Snow fight the war against the undead.
Dragonstone.. (did this become part of the Stormlands once Baratheons won the war?)
As mentioned earlier.. this is where Dany is now with her Dothraki horde who came over on ships.. ships provided by the slavers from Mereen, Yunkai and elsewhere on Slavers' Bay on Essos (the huge continent to the east). Did not see Dothraki there though.. maybe the fleet did split up and they are headed elsewhere. I think I read in the last book something about Storms End (the old Baratheon seat of power)... but its been so long now... so maybe I just gave a spoiler for episodes about to air.. maybe not. But Dragonstone is where Samwell Tarly just read that you can find Dragonglass (Obsidian) in huge quantities.. to create weapons that kill White Walkers.
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So let's Talk about the burnt armed man asking about Dany. Does anyone else feel the same as me that this is actually a not dead Viserys Targaryen.
Yes the Same Molten Metal crown wearing jerk of a brother that Drogo possibly killed in season 1?
Who else that was burned could this be.
Yes the Same Molten Metal crown wearing jerk of a brother that Drogo possibly killed in season 1?
Who else that was burned could this be.
He wasn't burned, it was greyscale. The person in the cell was Jorah Mormont.
They updated the wikia with the same info you posted. I personally think my story arc would be more fun :)
Well I got that from the terp.. just explored and explained it more.
I was wondering why GRRM spent so much time recently on his background stories and fleshing out the history of the world (and published off it) rather than work on Winds of Winter.. the next volume in ASOIAF (A Song Of Ice And Fire), which is the proper name of the series Game of Thrones (first book title in series).... and I am convinced that he was just doing what was necessary so that HBO could begin working on the spin-off prequels.
So.. what you can find in various Wikis on GoT and ASOIAF is coming from reference books and maps.. so the idea that Tyrions birth was within a year of Rhaegar's visit to the tourney at Castle Rock... and that Tyrions mom had been a handmaiden at Rhaegar's court in Kings Landing.. and that there were rumors of an affair.. and that Rhaegar's queen sent Tyrion's mom home to Casterly Rock... well.. that's a lot of coincidences to work into the official lore as a red herring... but I wouldn't put it past that Bayonne Boy GRRM.
Or WINTER IS HERE and is heading south.
But.. we know Arya is in the Riverlands (south of the twins where she killed all the Freys).. and she is eating with Lannister soldiers. And we know her old buddy The Hound, Sandor Clegane, is with The Brotherhood without Banners who is a rebel guerrilla outfit largely in the Riverlands.. and he is in snow.
So.. maybe the Brotherhood attacks these Lannisters. Maybe the Lannisters attack the Bortherhood... and The Hound and Arya get back together and Arya learns of the danger in the north of Sansa and Jon and knows the Hound is headed there (having seen this vision in the fire) and, blah blah blah...you get the idea.
Maybe she goes north.. maybe winter moves south.
You can google them.. but its all about context. The world did not begin when King Robert Baratheon showed up at Winterfell in S1EP1. Simply put.. there are reasons he was there.. things happened.. and have been hapenning for awhile.
We have seen houses fall.. the Starks.. the Tullys... well, that stuff has been happening in this land a long long time.
Edric Dayne is one of those guys in the Brotherhood without Banners.. raised from the dead. He spoke with Arya at some point and mentioned his aunt, Ashara Dayne. Edric's father was artur Dayne.. you saw him as the kick-ass sword of the morning in the flashback when Eddard went to "save" his sister (who was busy dying in childbirth).. Team Stark killed Arthur and Eddard returned his sword to his sister (and, apparently, got it on with her then.. having known her from a tourney at some point).
- Cersei Lannister to Eddard Stark (from wiki)
“ How dare you play the noble lord with me! What do you take me for? You've a bastard of your own, I've seen him. Who was the mother, I wonder? Some Dornish peasant you raped while her holdfast burned? A whore? Or was it the grieving sister, the Lady Ashara? She threw herself into the sea, I'm told. Why was that? For the brother you slew, or the child you stole?”
Cersei thinks Jon Snow is Eddard's bastard... but we now know he's not. But there has to be a reason she mentions Lady Ashara.. and we know Eddard was in love but had to marry the Tully girl Caetlyn.. who was engaged to his brother (who died). What was a political marriage between the Riverlands and the North.
So.. if Jon Snow's parentage was revealed recently.. why not this possible bastard child of Eddard Stark and this Lady Ashara?
In another spot someone says that Daenerys looks like Lady Ashara.
Here's a good reddit thread on Ashara and Ned...
Why have these quotes and these snippets if they don't mean anything? In real life that happens all the time (like some Trumps meeting Russians.. maybe)... but in a series of novels?
Azo Ahai is another story.. think of NEO in The Matrix.. the legend of THE ONE... Azor Ahai is the legendary warrior who will rise to defeat the White Walkers with the sword Lightbringer.
Certainly there is a need to be saved from the White Walkers. But I don't blame you for wondering why these names seem to come from nowhere but end up being important. Its a BIG WORLD. And 99.9% of people in this big world still don't think White Walkers are real... they think the wall was built to keep out the riff-raff.. like Trump's "wall". So why would Azor Ahia be on anyones mind but the likes of a maester or Samwell Tarly? Why should it be on the mind of a viewer?
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Watch it, love it.........best show on tv.
but, with the books' storyline ending... it's become almost fan-fiction. I'm far from a "George RR-purist", but I fear something about the unique story telling will be lost... and it will just be dragon-porn.
but, with the books' storyline ending... it's become almost fan-fiction. I'm far from a "George RR-purist", but I fear something about the unique story telling will be lost... and it will just be dragon-porn.
man...that's good stuff.
yeah, the season 1 quote from Cersei to Ned....no way I (or most people) would've remembered that, let alone connected the dots.....i like it.
then Azo Ahai?.....yeah, I'll just take your word for it...lol.....again, from left field. though, i've been reading the Ed Shereen character isn't suppose to be just a random new character....so we'll see.
much appreciated.
awesome effin show
The TV series has become more action packed ever since they went past the books, it sure makes for good TV but it is a bit sloppy at times. Some characters act dumber than they are to advance to plot, people seem to teleport around, the passage of time is not clear, etc. That kind of bad writing NEVER happens in the books, but the books are very dense and the TV show only covers part of it.
They are two different beasts at this point. To be honest they have been since season 4.
I love both! As much as I love the TV show (maybe the best show ever?) I still like the books better. The books will always be the true canon, the TV show is just for fun.
They are two different beasts at this point. To be honest they have been since season 4.
I love both! As much as I love the TV show (maybe the best show ever?) I still like the books better. The books will always be the true canon, the TV show is just for fun.
Training.. but how did she get TALLER?
They didn't explain that. She is still blind and in training in the books, btw.
So no one knows!
I did not read all the books, but I am up to date on the HBO series. Does anyone else believe that this was all orchestrated by Littlefinger? This all begins with the death of John Arryn. His death sets in motion everything that has happened so far. It is not Cersi who killed him, but Lady Elisa so that she and Littlefinger can be together. It also seems that he is behind almost all that goes on. His ultimate goal is to be on the Iron Throne, and I can almost see him getting there.
In the show, Lysa says Littlefinger asked him to kill John Arryn, she also insinuates she killed her father too. Littlefinger also gave the dagger for the guy to try to murder Bran in his bed, but apparently Joffery ordere it, people do think Littlefinger egged him on though.
Nah, Ned is protecting Jon because Robert wants all Targaryen's dead. Many believe that Lyanna and Rhaegar fell in love at Harrenhal. But it also is said that Ned fell in love at Harrenhal tourney too with Ashara Dayne. Remember at the time, Brandon Stark was to wed Catelyn not Ned. So the Ned perhaps promised to marry Ashara, and because he had to marry Cat out of duty he had to cast her aside, that doesn't mean they didn't have a child. I personally think Ashara and Ned conceived Daneyes, shortly before the Tower of Joy, no one says how the hell Ned knew where to find his sister. Ashara Dayne's brother was in the kings guard guarding her there.
They mention Ashara on the show, when Cersei says to Ned "I know you fathered a bastard with that dornish woman, ashara" Catelyn also inquire about her in book.
Anways when Robert asks Ned who he fathered Jon Snow with, he says "Wylla" who happens to be the wetnurse for Ashara Dayne.
I doubt they put these in the show if not to come back later. Why bring in Ashara, Wylla and Quath who says to Daneyes, "You don't know who you are"
Kind of clear to me at this point.
She was probably just lying. If she told them she was going to Winterfell they might take her prisoner. The North is in open rebellion against the crown.
Yes, no problem with the voice, but she looked taller. Standing on something? Some kind of visual trick? Or just the limitations of TV shows? Regardless, no big deal.
The other faceless men had the same ability. Jaqen Hagar's voice changed as his face changed and so did the waif's. Remember when she posed as the old lady right before stabbing Arya?
Here's a question for ya:
Walder Frey (Arya) brings all the Freys together for a feast, but nobody's wondering where his son's are? Nobody notices they're not around? I'm willing to let it slide since I thought it might have been the second best opening scene of any episode, with season 1, ep 1 being the one that put the hook in me.
But it is not and doesn't make much sense.
You will see how things play pout soon enough.
IMO....Littlefinger is a metaphor for life.
When all is said and Done and everything burns to the ground the cockroaches climb to the top and survive.
I think the Ned/Dany connection is far fetched. Seems to be pure speculation and not fact based (which the Jon being a T theory was). Tyrion being a T is a little more plausible, but still based on speculation. I have to imagine that either would have been setup and foreshadowed in the TV series by now.
Two lines from Season 7, Episode 1. The first will really stick with me because I'm sure we all felt this way anytime someone says "you did great, but..."
"What did father used to say? 'Everything before the word 'but' is horse$hit.'" – Jon Snow
I also like how GOT mocked the mullet of the 2010s: the man bun. This is what the Hound says to Thoros:
“You think you're fooling anyone with that topknot?”
"What did father used to say? 'Everything before the word 'but' is horse$hit.'" – Jon Snow
I also like how GOT mocked the mullet of the 2010s: the man bun. This is what the Hound says to Thoros:
“You think you're fooling anyone with that topknot?”
I thought the Hound died last season,lol,so many characters to keep track of.
Yes.. your N+A=D theory rings true to me.
And your focus on Littlefinger has really got me thinking... wasn't Ned waylaid by Jamie and his men as he came out of Littlefingers? And Littlefinger set up Ned by leading him to Robert Baratheon's bastard.. and rumors of more.. while showing him that they all had dark hair.. thereby validating the rumor that Joffrey was a product of incest and is not really the King... Eddard orders the Lannisters be taken into custody.. but the Kings Guard strikes down his men... and Littlefinger hold s knife to Neds throat and tells him that he warned Ned not to trust him.
Very interesting. Littlefinger is behind everything. It would be fitting if he gets the Iron Throne just in time for some Stark to take it from him.
So if the TV writers are as crafty as GRRM (and he has guided them).. what would Littlefinger's next move be?
I guess he now has an army.. how dies he make it big enough to win? Maybe the Lannisters take on Dany's forces somewhere and there is no one in Kings Landing who can stop him and the men of the Vale?
Clearly his big move is to pull off some assassination (or attempt) and make i t look like someone else did it. He's got to take a shot at Jon now.. right?
