OT: Need some interview/salary advice for a friend - Denouement!

[DJ Spanky]

A good friend of mine from my last job had an interview yesterday and got a job offer today. The interview went so well yesterday that they asked her how much she was looking for. And she made a classic mistake, she gave them a salary range. Of course, the job offer was at the low end of the salary range, which she's not happy about. So she doesn't know what to do at that point. I kind of think she's already screwed the pooch, but is there a way she can approach this about wanting a higher offer?

Edit: see my last post in this thread for the result: A successful outcome!

 

[RUTGERS95]

She can go back and give her price and they shouldn't think negatively on it. It's always smart to give the price you want vs what you'll take when asked but it's a 'feel it out' type thing too.

tell her to go back and thank them, excited, etc etc but her salary needs are x, not y

 

[T2Kplus20]

A good friend of mine from my last job had an interview yesterday and got a job offer today. The interview went so well yesterday that they asked her how much she was looking for. And she made a classic mistake, she gave them a salary range. Of course, the job offer was at the low end of the salary range, which she's not happy about. So she doesn't know what to do at that point. I kind of think she's already screwed the pooch, but is there a way she can approach this about wanting a higher offer?

Just ask for more. This is still the job offering stage, so ask and see what they say. Also, don't screw up again in the future. Lesson learned.

No matter what you are offered, it is common to ask for more.

 

[Scarlet1984]

A face saving way for all would be to say that the all-in comp is lower than what she would like at target bonus.

 

[DJ Spanky]

Also, don't screw up again in the future. Lesson learned.

Yeah, I've made that plain to her.

 

[SleepingGiantIsAwake]

They should expect her to come back with a higher number. Without knowing the details of how wide a range from low/mid/high only advice is to ask close to or at mid range.

Also, depending on state where job is, some states require hiring company to disclose THEIR range for the open role. She should ask.

When communicating she should say something to the effect of how much she is excited about working for X, but was hoping for salary closer to the midpoint.

Nothing to lose.

 

[dconifer]

Just ask for more. This is still the job offering stage, so ask and see what they say. Also, don't screw up again in the future. Lesson learned.

No matter what you are offered, it is common to ask for more.

I agree with this. There'd be nothing worse than taking the job and feeling cheated about the salary.

It's all a negotiation, and it wouldn't be in bad faith to say something to the effect that things had changed (implying that a better offer was in hand, or something similarly plausible), and volunteering a higher number.

I've learned the hard way never to be overly loyal to employers from my past, present, and future. That was once a thing, but that ship has sailed...

 

[T2Kplus20]

I agree with this. There'd be nothing worse than taking the job and feeling cheated about the salary.

It's all a negotiation, and it wouldn't be in bad faith to say something to the effect that things had changed (implying that a better offer was in hand, or something similarly plausible), and volunteering a higher number.

I've learned the hard way never to be overly loyal to employers from my past, present, and future. That was once a thing, but that ship has sailed...

+1
Besides, they probably offered the low end of the range in anticipation of her asking for more. Perfectly normal.

There was a study conducted 5-10 years ago and it was determined you need to change jobs 3-4 times in your career to maximize comp, responsibilities, and satisfaction. That's definitely true today.

 

[ClassOf02]

It’s the offer stage, not the acceptance stage….negotiations are fair game at this point, but different companies react different ways to negotiating.

Agree with the person above who factored in total comp in including bonus.

Can also try to negotiate a signing bonus.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Agree with everyone above. Though, she also made another classic mistake, she never should have gotten to that point of the interview process without already discussing what they had expected to pay for that position.

 

[jtung230]

The good news is that they already made her an offer. At worst, they don’t move on the pay. She should ask for the top end of the range and tell them why she deserves it.

 

[mildone]

I would tell her to consider looking elsewhere for a job. That the offer was at the bottom of her given range indicates that the company may be stingy which, if true, is likely to be an ongoing problem.

 

[rutgersdave]

I would tell her to consider looking elsewhere for a job. That the offer was at the bottom of her given range indicates that the company may be stingy which, if true, is likely to be an ongoing problem.

Good point, if I was hiring wouldn’t go to the lowest part of the range.

 

[mildone]

Good point, if I was hiring wouldn’t go to the lowest part of the range.

It’s a pretty bad look for the company, IMO.

My philosophy is, if you want to run a great company, hire great people, treat them with great respect, provide a great work environment with great benefits, and pay great salaries.

There are companies like that out there. I recommend doing some research on Glassdoor and other similar sites, when possible. Interview prospective employers as much, or more, than they interview you.

People who come into interviews with lots of challenging and informed/smart questions are far more likely to get invited back by me than people who don’t.

 

[NewJerseyGuy]

Counter with the high end of the range.

Both sides likely expecting to wind up halfway between the initial offer and the counter.

Also tell her to ask for a sign-on bonus. They likely have more flexibility there.

 

[ruinac]

Advice given to me many years ago - Don‘t take a job with a company that tries to nickel and dime you with a salary offer. Even if you do get them to go higher now they might find a reason to use that for smaller raises later.

 

[RU Cheese]

Does she want the job? What does she need to be paid to take it? Tell them that.

 

[BillyC80]

I always tell my sons, the best deal you’re gonna get from an employer is the first deal you agree on. That goes for new hire and promotion situations.

So she absolutely should aim higher at the beginning. She can say something like:

“I’ve given it some thought and I’m flattered to receive your offer for a position that’s a great fit for the company and for me.

When I was asked to give a salary range, I answered in a polite way, thinking that with my qualifications I would be offered the high end of that range.

By accepting my counter-offer at the high end, you’ll be getting a loyal and dedicated employee who will know and appreciate that the company understands and embraces the value I bring to the organization.”

 

[iReC89]

What is the better way to answer the question?

 

[jtung230]

What is the better way to answer the question?

1 billion dollars

 

[SkilletHead2]

To me the question revolves around how much she wants the job and what other irons she has in the fire. Also, would the top end be exciting to her?

If this is a big company, then somebody other than the interviewers might be in charge of salary offers. But in all honesty, I would maybe tell her to think about whether she really wants to work for a place that thought low balling an initial offer was a good way to treat prospective employees.

 

[yesrutgers01]

The reality of it- if she did give a range, was she able to live with the low end of it and be happy?
If not, she should have given a higher low.

My experience- if your low number really is higher than they can spend, but really love you- let them be the ones to ask you if you could do it for a little less.
That also gives you some leverage for other things- starting healthcare earlier, extra week of PTO, more WFH etc

 

[mildone]

What is the better way to answer the question?

Gimme the cash!

 

[mildone]

Counter with the high end of the range.

Both sides likely expecting to wind up halfway between the initial offer and the counter.

Also tell her to ask for a sign-on bonus. They likely have more flexibility there.

Can't hurt to ask. Especially if she really wants this particular job for some reason. And if they acquiesce, that too might be a hopeful sign for the future with the company.

But, while they ponder her counter-offer, she should perhaps seek employment opportunities with a company that is more generous from the outset.

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

A good friend of mine from my last job had an interview yesterday and got a job offer today. The interview went so well yesterday that they asked her how much she was looking for. And she made a classic mistake, she gave them a salary range. Of course, the job offer was at the low end of the salary range, which she's not happy about. So she doesn't know what to do at that point. I kind of think she's already screwed the pooch, but is there a way she can approach this about wanting a higher offer?

It's a negotiation, not a take it or leave it when they offered that salary. There are so many ways to approach this.

First and foremost as others have noted, counter with a higher number. She should have all the reasons why she deserves more than their offer listed in the counter.

If they don't budge as much as she wants, she can counter with a sign on bonus or certain other types of compensation depending on the position as well as other perks like extra weeks of vacation, etc. to bridge the gap.

Ultimately, it needs to be a win win for both parties so they will negotiate if she counters. If they don't, then she's better off not joining them.

 

[drewbagel423]

It’s a pretty bad look for the company, IMO.

My philosophy is, if you want to run a great company, hire great people, treat them with great respect, provide a great work environment with great benefits, and pay great salaries.

There are companies like that out there. I recommend doing some research on Glassdoor and other similar sites, when possible. Interview prospective employers as much, or more, than they interview you.

People who come into interviews with lots of challenging and informed/smart questions are far more likely to get invited back by me than people who don’t.

This is always great advice. Any suggestions as to what lines of questions to ask?

 

[yesrutgers01]

I will say this in defense of the company- a candidate should never give a range with a floor they can’t live with and be happy.
As for offering the low number- as long as the company has a valid reason- then they should be able to explain it clearly.
She shouldn’t be afraid to ask why they offered the floor of her range. Maybe that was even higher than they wanted to spend and are doing the opposite of what we think. That they offered her then they wanted to spend because they really liked her but couldn’t go higher.

 

[tom1944]

A lot depends on her current job and her willingness to continue there until she finds a job with the salary she wants.

If she likes her current job but is willing to leave for a certain compensation level tell them that number.

 

[Morrischiano]

A good friend of mine from my last job had an interview yesterday and got a job offer today. The interview went so well yesterday that they asked her how much she was looking for. And she made a classic mistake, she gave them a salary range. Of course, the job offer was at the low end of the salary range, which she's not happy about. So she doesn't know what to do at that point. I kind of think she's already screwed the pooch, but is there a way she can approach this about wanting a higher offer?

“Thank you for the offer. Compared to some of the other opportunities and conversation that I’m having, this offer seems lower than the market for the position and my experience. I love your company and this opportunity. That been said I have to be fair to myself and I think you understand.

I really need base of $x and bonus of x%”.

Also don’t fall for the “bonus can be anywhere from 20-35%” bullshit. Don’t ever figure the bonus is going to be greater than 20% when negotiating your base.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Another way to handle the negotiations- instead of giving a range- tell them you currently have two offers you are considering and use those as your range
“One company has offered me X and the other Y…I really want to be a part of your team though but I wanted to be transparent”

 

[RutgersDom]

It’s the offer stage, not the acceptance stage….negotiations are fair game at this point, but different companies react different ways to negotiating.

Agree with the person above who factored in total comp in including bonus.

Can also try to negotiate a signing bonus.

How about stock shares?

 

[ClassOf02]

How about stock shares?

Could also be part of it, but not enough info in the OP to know this this position is at a level to be eligible for equity as part of their compensation. If so, I REALLY hope there’s more to the story here.

 

[yesrutgers01]

How about stock shares?

It doesn’t sound like a stock or equitshare convo…

 

[rutgersal]

“Thank you for the offer. Compared to some of the other opportunities and conversation that I’m having, this offer seems lower than the market for the position and my experience. I love your company and this opportunity. That been said I have to be fair to myself and I think you understand.

I really need base of $x and bonus of x%”.

Also don’t fall for the “bonus can be anywhere from 20-35%” bullshit. Don’t ever figure the bonus is going to be greater than 20% when negotiating your base.

Even so, government taxes the hell out of bonuses, so you’re better off getting as much salary as you can up front.

That said, employers pay for skills. So you have to give the hiring manager, the ammunition to justify why a higher salary is justified. If you simply say , I need x to be happy, it really doesn’t help the manager out. You got to say, “according to Robert Half’s salary guide, (or whatever preferred research source) a person who does x,y, and z, commands a salary of $B, which is a more effective way of negotiating.

 

[PeteGiam07]

There's nothing wrong with giving a salary range if your low number is high enough for you to switch jobs comfortably.

Was she that surprised they asked what she was looking for? Also, don't usually talk salary (besides the written application) until the 2nd interview or 2nd conversation etc...

 

[tom1944]

Even so, government taxes the hell out of bonuses, so you’re better off getting as much salary as you can up front.

That said, employers pay for skills. So you have to give the hiring manager, the ammunition to justify why a higher salary is justified. If you simply say , I need x to be happy, it really doesn’t help the manager out. You got to say, “according to Robert Half’s salary guide, (or whatever preferred research source) a person who does x,y, and z, commands a salary of $B, which is a more effective way of negotiating.

Aren't the taxes due on a bonus the same as taxes due on wages. A bonus might have a higher rate of withholding but when you file your return those 2 sources of income are subject to the same tax rate.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Aren't the taxes due on a bonus the same as taxes due on wages. A bonus might have a higher rate of withholding but when you file your return those 2 sources of income are subject to the same tax rate.

correct- many people mistake that it is readjusted at the time you file- Earnings are earnings.

BTW- even going back decades- I always shook my head at so many people saying that they didn't want to get pushed into the next tax bracket- and that never made sense to me- I always wanted to be in the next tax bracket.

 

[rutgersal]

Aren't the taxes due on a bonus the same as taxes due on wages. A bonus might have a higher rate of withholding but when you file your return those 2 sources of income are subject to the same tax rate.

Yes, they are, but my company deducted 40% right off the bat, and then i had to claim it back at tax time, so it lost its impact.

 

[CERU00]

correct- many people mistake that it is readjusted at the time you file- Earnings are earnings.

BTW- even going back decades- I always shook my head at so many people saying that they didn't want to get pushed into the next tax bracket- and that never made sense to me- I always wanted to be in the next tax bracket.

It's shocking how ignorant so many people are about how taxes work! I hear the same comments from people who've worked for 30 years but still don't understand.

 

[CERU00]

Yes, they are, but my company deducted 40% right off the bat, and then i had to claim it back at tax time, so it lost its impact.

So, you can just adjust your withholding on the bulk of your income throughout the year and even it out such that you still owe a little at the end of the year.