OT: Travel Coach Arrested for Assaulting 72 Year Old Umpire

[RU_DIO]

I've been umping baseball in SJ for a few years now. Some of the stories I've heard from fellow umpires are mind-boggling. At this point I'm just waiting for something crazy to happen to me. I still haven't had to eject anyone, but i'm sure it's coming, and hopefully it doesn't lead to anything further like this poor guy.

The shortage of officials is very real. I know for a fact there were high school level games cancelled this year because schools couldn't even get ONE umpire to show up. And there were many more games that went forward with just the 1 umpire. Anyone who knows anything about baseball knows that 1 umpire is not enough on a 60/90 field.

Lock this guy up and throw away the key. What 40 year old punches a 72 year old in the face? I bet this coward never would have gone through with it if the umpire was of similar age/stature. Fking coward

My kids play in The Shore Conference, A South Division. Umpiring was really BAD this year, I mean really BAD but what can you do? Many older guys who just can't keep up with the pace of the game and their calls reflected it. Wish there were more qualified guys out there but between the effects of Covid causing turmoil in 2020 and 2021 and dealing with crazy coaches and parents, I understand why umpiring is the way it is.

 

[CodyRU]

My kids play in The Shore Conference, A South Division. Umpiring was really BAD this year, I mean really BAD but what can you do? Many older guys who just can't keep up with the pace of the game and their calls reflected it. Wish there were more qualified guys out there but between the effects of Covid causing turmoil in 2020 and 2021 and dealing with crazy coaches and parents, I understand why umpiring is the way it is.

That's a shame. Part of the problem is most umpires fall into 2 categories.
A. Older retired guys
B. Younger guys who have careers and umpire on the side like myself

Problem is high schools probably get a lot of category A because high school games start in the 3-4PM time frame. The category B guys can't make it.

Now I'm sure there are plenty of older guys who do a great job. I work with many of them. Just pointing out a problem that is unique to high school baseball

 

[RU_DIO]

That's a shame. Part of the problem is most umpires fall into 2 categories.
A. Older retired guys
B. Younger guys who have careers and umpire on the side like myself

Problem is high schools probably get a lot of category A because high school games start in the 3-4PM time frame. The category B guys can't make it.

Now I'm sure there are plenty of older guys who do a great job. I work with many of them. Just pointing out a problem that is unique to high school baseball

I am hoping my oldest has better umpiring next season as he will be playing in college. We will see.

 

[CodyRU]

I am hoping my oldest has better umpiring next season as he will be playing in college. We will see.

I'm sure he will. Where is he going to school?

 

[mdk01]

I grew up in an era where you played the sports of your choosing all day long.
No parents watching, no folding chairs, no snacks, no water bottles, no umpires.
There was no one there to say it’s okay honey, or ease your pain…. You figured it out for yourself.
The two hour little league or Pop Warner game was merely a distraction from the real playing.
For me the real playing was out the door at 9 am back for dinner playing 3 different sports with no one but your friends, no one watching and no one making excuses for you or comforting you

We went home for lunch, then right back at it.

 

[zappaa]

My kids play in The Shore Conference, A South Division. Umpiring was really BAD this year, I mean really BAD but what can you do? Many older guys who just can't keep up with the pace of the game and their calls reflected it. Wish there were more qualified guys out there but between the effects of Covid causing turmoil in 2020 and 2021 and dealing with crazy coaches and parents, I understand why umpiring is the way it is.

You have to live with Strike zones that move the game along and are exactly the same for both teams
I told an umpire this year “I’ve taught my daughter a ball above her eye level isn’t a hitable pitch”
Didn’t do any good….lol
Is there anything more nerve wracking than your kid hitting with men on base and a horse shit umpire?

 

[knightfan7]

I grew up in an era where you played the sports of your choosing all day long.
No parents watching, no folding chairs, no snacks, no water bottles, no umpires.
There was no one there to say it’s okay honey, or ease your pain…. You figured it out for yourself.
The two hour little league or Pop Warner game was merely a distraction from the real playing.
For me the real playing was out the door at 9 am back for dinner playing 3 different sports with no one but your friends, no one watching and no one making excuses for you or comforting you

Get up and go to the playground for a pick up game. Sometimes 9 vs 9, sometimes 6 vs 6 where if a righty hit to right it was a foul ball. Go home for lunch and come back and play again.. Go back after dinner and play till dark. When there weren't enough kids we'd play 5 inning stickball games.

All that ball and I still couldn't hit the curve lol.

 

[knightfan7]

You have to live with Strike zones that move the game along and are exactly the same for both teams
I told an umpire this year “I’ve taught my daughter a ball above her eye level isn’t a hitable pitch”
Didn’t do any good….lol
Is there anything more nerve wracking than your kid hitting with men on base and a horse shit umpire?

Your kid having a 1 and 1 down by a point with less than 30 secs to go.

Yes he made both thankfully.

 

[RU_DIO]

You have to live with Strike zones that move the game along and are exactly the same for both teams
I told an umpire this year “I’ve taught my daughter a ball above her eye level isn’t a hitable pitch”
Didn’t do any good….lol
Is there anything more nerve wracking than your kid hitting with men on base and a horse shit umpire?

Terrible Zap. When the umpire is consistently inconsistent, it makes it tough on them. No issue with a strike being 4 inches off the plate if it's called like that every time. Not good when it's sometimes a strike at their feet. We faced Leiter (UCF) and Crotchfelt (Auburn) this year and the strike zone for both games was crazy bad for both teams. Neither of those guys need any extra help.

 

[RU_DIO]

I'm sure he will. Where is he going to school?

Delaware Valley. Chose them over a good amount of offers to play with a couple of old teammates.

 

[RUBubba]

Having played baseball at the D1 level, and coaching both basketball and baseball since, my biggest issues with umpires are when they don't know the rules or "how" to umpire/ref a game.

Son's baseball game, kid hits one straight down off his leg and down the first base line. Umpire doesn't raise his arms and call out "FOUL", so the catcher runs out to field the ball, throws into right field, runners on 2nd and 3rd cross the plate... Went out to "argue", and he admitted that yes, it was a foul ball. Thankfully the other coach was a friend of mine and a stand up guy and stood by the call. The parents went ballistic, but again, the other coach had to go over and settle them down.

As for not knowing the rules, my one and only technical foul was the result of a basketball ref not knowing the rules. Winning a game, the other team is pressing us in the last minute. I had an inbound play set up for after a made basket where the in bounder throws a pass while out of bounds to another player also standing out of bounds on the baseline. After a made basket, this is perfectly legal, not legal though if the ball just went out of bounds. We ran the play, but the ref blew the play dead and gave the ball to the other team. So yeah... I got a technical. We still won the game though.

 

[toby83]

I always go into my daughter's HS basketball games expecting subpar refs but was stunning this year how bad the older guys were. It's a tough situation.

 

[Erial_Lion]

I always go into my daughter's HS basketball games expecting subpar refs but was stunning this year how bad the older guys were. It's a tough situation.

Heck, Big Ten basketball and football refs are in the top 1% of refs in the world (probably closer to top .1%), yet many think they are terrible.

 

[rubaseball78]

A good friend of mine who has been going to RU football games with us for about 18 years now, does a ton of umping for girls softball at the highest levels and he said he's close to calling it quits. He enjoys umping, but he can't stand some of the idiot parents, who make it about themselves rather than the kids and don't even realize how much they embarrass themselves (and their kids).

What happened? No “I’s” in this post. 🙂

 

[MoreCowbellRU]

For one we have lost all objectivity and devolved into blind loyalty. We can't even tell our own kids "Yes it was strike three, you should have swung". We always feel aggrieved. Our side is pure as Mother's milk

And I'd love an explanation why disagreements like this end up in assault and battery

When coaching baseball we would tell the kids" if it was close enough to be called a strike, it was close enough to be hit. With 2 strikes hit anything borderline. Don't give away that power to the ump." I wouldn't fault an ump for called 3rd strike. Unless it hit the mascot in the second row.

 

[zappaa]

When coaching baseball we would tell the kids" if it was close enough to be called a strike, it was close enough to be hit. With 2 strikes hit anything borderline. Don't give away that power to the ump." I wouldn't fault an ump for called 3rd strike. Unless it hit the mascot in the second row.

You must instill a protect the plate mentality in young hitters…urgent!
And I agree, do not take anything close.
By the same token, young pitchers master their craft by having to bear down when they’re behind in the count…at a young age, they also need to learn you need to throw a strike.
Umpires calling strikes at the shoe tops and above the eyes does no one any good, and doesn’t help young pitchers learn.

 

[MoreCowbellRU]

You must instill a protect the plate mentality in young hitters…urgent!
And I agree, do not take anything close.
By the same token, young pitchers master their craft by having to bear down when they’re behind in the count…at a young age, they also need to learn you need to throw a strike.
Umpires calling strikes at the shoe tops and above the eyes does no one any good, and doesn’t help young pitchers learn.

I'm from the same school brother. Throw strikes. The guys behind you can't field ball 4. I always would tell my guys that the best hitter ever, made an out 6 out of ten times. Trust the other 8 guys to help you out.
Can't do anything about bad umpires. Just have to deal with it. Consistant is all I ever hope for.

 

[JayDogSmooth]

Umpired baseball / softball for 20 years
Basketball for 20 years
Football for 5 years
It’s changed exponentially over the years

 

[zappaa]

Umpired baseball / softball for 20 years
Basketball for 20 years
Football for 5 years
It’s changed exponentially over the years

More insight please?
What’s changed?
The officiating aspect of any sport is black and white…no?
Either you’re a hustling, perfectionist who prides himself on getting every call correct, but is humble enough to realize you make errors and mistakes, or you’re not!

 

[mdk01]

It’s changed exponentially over the years

Parental excesses, while always extant, now on steroids?

 

[RU_DIO]

You must instill a protect the plate mentality in young hitters…urgent!
And I agree, do not take anything close.
By the same token, young pitchers master their craft by having to bear down when they’re behind in the count…at a young age, they also need to learn you need to throw a strike.
Umpires calling strikes at the shoe tops and above the eyes does no one any good, and doesn’t help young pitchers learn.

Yep,

And unfortunately we saw this happen too much this year in a very competitive Division in the Shore Conference.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Maybe. what is it to ya? At least my posts do not revolve around ME. A little self-centered aren't we.

It was a story he related that had to do with his experience. Your troll is strange to say the least.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Had a son that played D1 football- not going to say where. Fans and parents of players weren’t that bad with refs but you should have heard the things they yelled at their own team.,,

 

[JayDogSmooth]

More insight please?
What’s changed?
The officiating aspect of any sport is black and white…no?
Either you’re a hustling, perfectionist who prides himself on getting every call correct, but is humble enough to realize you make errors and mistakes, or you’re not!

The bullshit officials deal with
The excuses players / coaches make when things don’t go their way
Lack of motivated officials who want to get better
Society on a whole

 

[Erial_Lion]

More insight please?
What’s changed?
The officiating aspect of any sport is black and white…no?
Either you’re a hustling, perfectionist who prides himself on getting every call correct, but is humble enough to realize you make errors and mistakes, or you’re not!

I've been umpiring for just about 20 years, and my observations would be...

• The shortage of umpires really impacts the coverage on games...when I started, we'd have 2 guys covering every Varsity, JV, Freshman, and Middle School game. Maybe once or twice a year, I'd work a one-man Middle School or Freshman game if rain really backed up the schedule. Same with Little League, we'd even have two guys covering games at all levels down through Majors (the 11-12 year old division).
• Now, it's probably rare to get 2 guys covering a Freshman, Middle School, or any level little league game. We're even covering some travel games up to the 16u level solo. Trying to call a bang-bang play on a steal at 2nd from behind the plate is just making an educated guess.
• Due to everything in the last two points...each year, more officials are quitting or dying, and not enough are coming in to replace them. The average age of officials continues to rise, and the number of quality guys drops which leads to guys being placed on games which are a little over their heads.
• Maybe it's just perception, but kids today don't swing at nearly as many pitches as kids in the past (and certainly not like 30 years ago when I was playing). Kid takes a called third strike on the corner, and you'll hear parents sitting down the baseline yelling "good eye, that wasn't a strike", coaches with a "come on blue, you have to give us that pitch too". About once a week, you'll hear a "come on, we need to protect with two strikes". And I'm not talking about at the varsity level...this goes all the way down to the 8u level...in fact, it's probably worse the younger the kids are...it's like they can do no wrong and any called strike 3 is the umpire's fault. It wasn't nearly this bad 20 years ago.
• I'm positive that knowledge of baseball rules by coaches and fans gets worse every single year, at all levels of play. Not even talking about more complex things like balks...simply understand things like the "dropped" third strike, infield fly, hit batters, batting out of order, etc. Frustrating when you're applying a proper ruling and have coaches/fans arguing when they don't understand the proper call.

 

[rubaseball78]

When coaching baseball we would tell the kids" if it was close enough to be called a strike, it was close enough to be hit. With 2 strikes hit anything borderline. Don't give away that power to the ump." I wouldn't fault an ump for called 3rd strike. Unless it hit the mascot in the second row.

As long as they were consistent.

 

[zappaa]

The bullshit officials deal with
The excuses players / coaches make when things don’t go their way
Lack of motivated officials who want to get better
Society on a whole

Thank you

 

[rubaseball78]

I’ve officiated many swim meets. Would always here you can’t make that call in a final. It’s unfair to swimmer. My answers was always it was unfair to the other swimmers swimming stroke correctly not to make the call. Once disqualified a sweep met who finished first in a junior olympics breadtroke final. You can imagine the uproar over that one.

 

[robcac26]

• I'm positive that knowledge of baseball rules by coaches and fans gets worse every single year, at all levels of play. Not even talking about more complex things like balks...simply understand things like the "dropped" third strike, infield fly, hit batters, batting out of order, etc. Frustrating when you're applying a proper ruling and have coaches/fans arguing when they don't understand the proper call.

I noticed this in my hockey league admin and reffing years. The people who are the most argumentative tend to be the least knowledgeable about the rules. Mind-boggling in an era when everyone can reach into their pocket and access the rulebook in a matter of seconds.

 

[B0ski]

Most of these kids parents were receiving participation trophy‘s. The fact that parents are off the rails more than ever is directly tied to the participation trophy era. Those that were supportive of the participation trophy’s are responsible for the sh*t show now. Not many younger people are willing to be subjected to the nonsense that comes with being an official.

 

[Plum Street]

My kids play in The Shore Conference, A South Division. Umpiring was really BAD this year, I mean really BAD but what can you do? Many older guys who just can't keep up with the pace of the game and their calls reflected it. Wish there were more qualified guys out there but between the effects of Covid causing turmoil in 2020 and 2021 and dealing with crazy coaches and parents, I understand why umpiring is the way it is.

Sad to hear. Most hs baseball games I assume are after school during the day. I think right there that narrows the applicants . Lots of retirees can do it.

Maybe I should have been. PE teacher and umpired after school and be laughing all the way to the bank

 

[robcac26]

Most of these kids parents were receiving participation trophy‘s. The fact that parents are off the rails more than ever is directly tied to the participation trophy era. Those that were supportive of the participation trophy’s are responsible for the sh*t show now. Not many younger people are willing to be subjected to the nonsense that comes with being an official.

Participation trophies have nothing to do with anything. I grew up receiving them and they almost always ended up in the trash. Some boomer handed us our 7th place trophy while we wondered why we were even receiving anything. Now the same generation that handed us these things cites them as a reason to blame us for all of today's problems. They didn't even have any meaning to us as kids, let alone now. We all wanted to win and we knew when we didn't, and we never asked for these pointless trophies in the first place.

EDIT: By the way, you don't use an apostrophe to make a noun plural. I knew that even before I got my U8 baseball participation trophy.

 

[ScarletCrimson]

I coach youth soccer, and some of the coaches and parents are out of control. It's wild, but also serves as a teaching moment for young athletes.

 

[Knight Shift]

What happened? No “I’s” in this post. 🙂

 

[Knight Shift]

This was an interesting overturned call last night in the Mets game. Buck Showalter really knows the rules. Two outs overturned in one review. Even the pros get things wrong, sometimes twice in one play.

 

[RUboston]

I remember way back in HS umpiring little league games. I remember to this day one kid getting up, a pitch right down the middle, he looks at it. Strike one. Kid dropped his bat and gave me some lip, same thing on the next two pitches. Kid starts yelling at me, father comes out of the stands starts yelling at me right in my face. I tried to handle it as best I could, but I was 17. Guy continued to harass me at the end of the game as I was leaving. No parents intervened to help me out. Last umpiring I ever did. It wasn’t worth the $20 or whatever it was back then.

 

[rubaseball78]

This was an interesting overturned call last night in the Mets game. Buck Showalter really knows the rules. Two outs overturned in one review. Even the pros get things wrong, sometimes twice in one play.

View embedded media

Can't believe 2nd baseman made the tag without the ball in his glove.

 

[Knight Shift]

Can't believe 2nd baseman made the tag without the ball in his glove.

That second baseman isn't really a second baseman. He is a utility player that plays most positions, including pitcher. He has been around the majors since 2008, accumulating just over 500 ABs. He is listed at 5'9" and 225 lbs, but that weight has to be off by at least 50 lbs.

Here's a longer look at the play. To his credit (or maybe discredit), the 2B knew he did not tag Nimmo with the ball in his glove and he frantically motioned to throw the ball back to second base, but that tipped off the umpire that the tag was not made, which was clear on the replay. Mets have had 15 of 20 reviewed plays overturned this year, which leads the majors, but it just goes to show that even in MLB umpires make mistakes. Sure, fans (and parents!) want every call to be correct, but many of these are split second decisions. Robot umps, anyone?

 

[rubaseball78]

That second baseman isn't really a second baseman. He is a utility player that plays most positions, including pitcher. He has been around the majors since 2008, accumulating just over 500 ABs. He is listed at 5'9" and 225 lbs, but that weight has to be off by at least 50 lbs.

Here's a longer look at the play. To his credit (or maybe discredit), the 2B knew he did not tag Nimmo with the ball in his glove and he frantically motioned to throw the ball back to second base, but that tipped off the umpire that the tag was not made, which was clear on the replay. Mets have had 15 of 20 reviewed plays overturned this year, which leads the majors, but it just goes to show that even in MLB umpires make mistakes. Sure, fans (and parents!) want every call to be correct, but many of these are split second decisions. Robot umps, anyone?

View embedded media

I’m surprised they called Nimmo safe as he was tagged after play at first. I’m guessing they ruled he stopped because ump incorrectly called him out.

 

[Knight Shift]

I’m surprised they called Nimmo safe as he was tagged after play at first. I’m guessing they ruled he stopped because ump incorrectly called him out.

But was that umpire interference by erroneously calling Nimmo out, because had the umpire made the correct call and demonstrably called him safe, Nimmo is the kind of player who would have bolted for second base. But the umpire took him out of the play by calling him out. 🤷‍♂️ Really strange play, and credit Showalter for arguing and getting both players called safe.