OT: Voting by mail (oh well, political)

[Abro1975]

'Colorado secretary of state sues USPS over election mailers she says misleads state's voters' :

Colorado secretary of state sues USPS over election mailers she says misleads state's voters

Colorado's secretary of state filed a lawsuit on Saturday against the US Postal Service, embattled Postmaster General Louis DeJoy and other USPS officials over a pre-election mailer that includes information she says will mislead voters in the state.

www.cnn.com

 

[RULoyal]

My daughter’s NJ primary mail in ballot came to our address. She has lived in Boston for the last ten years. This is probably just a one off.

 

[ElmiraExpress]

This whole thing seems like a mess and its gonna be a $hit show. By reading some of this thread basically you can only vote by mail in you live in NJ and want your vote to count on election day. If you dont vote by mail you may be able to do a provisional ballot and that vote will not be counted until after the election if needed. I just wanna vote in person. I can go to the store, restaurant and even protest but I cant vote in person. Does not make any sense to me. There has to be a reason behind this.

just vote my mail. Save yourself some stress and aggravation. It’s not hard to do

 

[robcac26]

My daughter’s NJ primary mail in ballot came to our address. She has lived in Boston for the last ten years. This is probably just a one off.

I'm guessing she probably hasn't updated her voter registration since moving.

 

[RULoyal]

I'm guessing she probably hasn't updated her voter registration since moving.

You’d be guessing wrong. All her NJ sample ballots were coming here for years. She tried to rectify it a couple of times but in typical NJ bureaucratic snafu fashion nothing got accomplished. Didn’t seem like a big deal until they sent the primary ballot. I told her I would fill out her presidential ballot if one was sent here - she was not amused.

 

[Doctor Worm]

I am ambivalent about vote by mail. There are a couple of valid arguments against it:

1) Lack of intra-household secrecy. A dominant member of a household can say, "OK, let's fill out our ballots now. Don't worry, I'll help you!" I do like the idea of going behind the curtain where no one can influence you.

2) If you are the felonious type and inclined to commit voter fraud, vote by mail MAY in certain circumstances make it easier for you. For instance, NJ counties are notoriously lax about removing deceased people from the voter rolls. You may receive a ballot for dear departed Grandma. Of course, if you are not a criminal you will not use it. And if you are a criminal, you always could have illicitly requested an absentee ballot for her anyway. You just would have had to work a little harder to do it. (Note: This is a theoretical argument. Absolutely no evidence is significant mail vote fraud in real life.)

I think those negatives are outweighed by these positives.

1) Vote by mail is Putin-proof. This is NOT a theoretical argument. Several agencies have opined on the Russian threat to our democracy, including the Republican controlled Senate Intelligence Committee.

2) Most importantly, voting by mail is easier. Easier is better. Voting is a basic American right (perhaps THE basic American right) and it is not supposed to be hard.

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

I posted a thread about voting online in NJ awhile ago

 

[OntheBanks]

Mail-in voting means that someone else will see who you are voting for, and then you will depend on that person to count your vote. For that reason I will go to the polls.

Doesn't that still mean that someone else will see who you are voting for? You can go to the polls but there are no voting machines. They are just going to take the same ballot that you could have mailed in and throw it in a pile of other ballots that a human will process.
Absolutely insane and it will take many weeks to go through all the paper ballots before declaring a winner.

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

I think those negatives are outweighed by these positives.

1) Vote by mail is Putin-proof. This is NOT a theoretical argument. Several agencies have opined on the Russian threat to our democracy, including the Republican controlled Senate Intelligence Committee.

2) Most importantly, voting by mail is easier. Easier is better. Voting is a basic American right (perhaps THE basic American right) and it is not supposed to be hard.

Your 1 is way off base. The complaints about Putin now have nothing to do with HOW we vote. But certainly, Putin could pay people to ballot harvest in interesting ways if he wanted it.

2.. easier is not always better... not if it is highly suspect. If your vote is made easier to cancel by easier cheating.. is that "better"?

 

[OntheBanks]

I am ambivalent about vote by mail. There are a couple of valid arguments against it:

1) Lack of intra-household secrecy. A dominant member of a household can say, "OK, let's fill out our ballots now. Don't worry, I'll help you!" I do like the idea of going behind the curtain where no one can influence you.

2) If you are the felonious type and inclined to commit voter fraud, vote by mail MAY in certain circumstances make it easier for you. For instance, NJ counties are notoriously lax about removing deceased people from the voter rolls. You may receive a ballot for dear departed Grandma. Of course, if you are not a criminal you will not use it. And if you are a criminal, you always could have illicitly requested an absentee ballot for her anyway. You just would have had to work a little harder to do it. (Note: This is a theoretical argument. Absolutely no evidence is significant mail vote fraud in real life.)

I think those negatives are outweighed by these positives.

1) Vote by mail is Putin-proof. This is NOT a theoretical argument. Several agencies have opined on the Russian threat to our democracy, including the Republican controlled Senate Intelligence Committee.

2) Most importantly, voting by mail is easier. Easier is better. Voting is a basic American right (perhaps THE basic American right) and it is not supposed to be hard.

Add this to your list. You had a female tenant who just got married and moved out. You receive in your mailbox ballots for Mary Smith and Mary Jones and neither live in your house any more. Now add in the fact that Charlie Jones moved in with Mary 6 months before they got married. Now you have 3 ballots that you can fill in and mail voting for the person you prefer.

 

[chrisru99]

Just make sure you vote. No sense in complaining about everything as is done here if you don’t vote either in person or by mail. I will vote by mail it’s just too convenient to not do.

 

[Doctor Worm]

Add this to your list. You had a female tenant who just got married and moved out. You receive in your mailbox ballots for Mary Smith and Mary Jones and neither live in your house any more. Now add in the fact that Charlie Jones moved in with Mary 6 months before they got married. Now you have 3 ballots that you can fill in and mail voting for the person you prefer.

In all likelihood Mary and Charlie would have provided a forwarding address.

We can discuss the hypotheticals, but the fact is that vote by mail has a track record with no evidence of actual fraud.

 

[RUfromSoCal?]

1) Vote by mail is Putin-proof. This is NOT a theoretical argument. Several agencies have opined on the Russian threat to our democracy, including the Republican controlled Senate Intelligence Committee.

Vote harvesting and fraud is way more likely than Vlad breaking into the Middlesex Country voting system brah....

but, you tell yourself that Russians are your biggest problem............. watch out for that monster under your bed too...

 

[BigRnj]

I’m just wondering who my dead grandparents are voting for this year 🤔

 

[e5fdny]

I’m just wondering who my dead grandparents are voting for this year 🤔

Buried in Hudson County?

 

[BigRnj]

All 4 in Jersey City 😉

 

[Kbee3]

I’m just wondering who my dead grandparents are voting for this year 🤔

Who did they vote for last time around ?

 

[OTBOTOR]

Add this to your list. You had a female tenant who just got married and moved out. You receive in your mailbox ballots for Mary Smith and Mary Jones and neither live in your house any more. Now add in the fact that Charlie Jones moved in with Mary 6 months before they got married. Now you have 3 ballots that you can fill in and mail voting for the person you prefer.

Do the signatures on these three hypothetical mailed-in ballots match the signature on the roll?

 

[RULoyal]

Do the signatures on these three hypothetical mailed-in ballots match the signature on the roll?

Do they use the same 70 year blue haired handwriting experts to verify signatures that are used at the polling locations?

 

[MulletCork]

You can wait on a line for 3 hours to get zero service at New Jersey Motor Vehicles
But it’s not safe to wait for a half hour to vote for the leader of the free world.
Sure makes sense

 

[RUScrew85]

I was under the assumption that in NJ all registered voters would automatically get a mail in ballot, mailed to them

yesterday I received a postcard from USPS saying that we should request your mail-in ballot at least 15 days before election day, or those who just did not get it for some reason

Maybe this is for those who are newly here, or not sure if they are registered

still a bit upset that I cannot just go to my polling place and pull the lever..... a big sh@tshow may arise.

anyway, we don't have to request a ballot, correct?

Well even though voting will be a guaranteed shitshow in NJ - it won't matter - NJ has the election theft process down to a T. And it's not even needed with NJ voters.

 

[RUScrew85]

Told this story in June...friends are registered to one party and their daughter the other.

They got one ballot each, she got THREE.

Do we have to guess which is the Dem?

 

[RUScrew85]

I’m just guessing, but they probably think that there would be a huge demand for absentee ballots and they would not be able to administer it. It’s easier to just send everyone a ballot. (FWIW, I’m not defending Murphy’s decision and I did email him my concerns when it was announced. Like you, I want to vote in-person, in a booth).

How is one mailed in ballot harder to count than the other?

 

[RUScrew85]

In NJ, mail in ballots ARE absentee ballots -- they're absolutely tied to an identity and are not anonymous

LOL. Sure they're so secure the rest of the world doesn't do mail in ballots.

 

[Greg2020]

LOL. Sure they're so secure the rest of the world doesn't do mail in ballots.

Australia had around 9 percent of their votes by mail in 2016, Austria 15 percent of votes in 2017, Canada 4 percent, Germany allows anyone to mail vote, Switzerland is ALL mail in voting, UK anyone can mail vote. So plenty of countries do it.

 

[Terry_2426]

LOL. Sure they're so secure the rest of the world doesn't do mail in ballots.

That's not what I said. OP said that absentee ballots are more legit and mail ins are practically anonymous. All I said is that they're the same ballot counted and processed the same way.

 

[LBusDoor90]

1) Vote by mail is Putin-proof. This is NOT a theoretical argument. Several agencies have opined on the Russian threat to our democracy, including the Republican controlled Senate Intelligence Committee.

This is why I became a full voter by mail in the spring. Forget the virus. In an age of voting machines with an internet connection or USB port that produce no paper record, handing mine to a person at my Division of Elections office in Gloucester Co. in October and knowing it will be put on file for reference in the case of a recount or investigation is why I did it. It’s unhackable.

 

[newell138]

not possible votes have to be certified by early December for electoral college voting purposes. AKA count has to be done by early December at latest.

Just because they have to doesn’t mean it’s physically possible

 

[newell138]

I don’t believe that one bit. Voting by mail is the safest way to go and will allow a big turnout to decide who will be President. This method is literally saving lives all over this Country and that’s very important or it should be. I’m very happy my mother and my uncles and aunts can now mail there ballot in and not risk infection.

LOL

 

[Salvi's Headband]

There are many voters who are just as pissed that they have had their choice manipulated by Murphy. I have spoken to people who are involved with the election and there is a backlash about having polling stations limited and in in some instances non existent. Why the hell would people have to travel to a regional center such as the Prudential Center ? That is totally absurd ... How do think that would play out in this day and age... Any chance of intimidation or conflict in Newark? How about attempting to find nearby parking.. and like I said ...simply one’s safety... most agree that there is a great chance of miscounts and fraudulent ballots which can and have occurred. There is the current pending lawsuit to stop this nonsense and also the questionable theory of the danger to the public and poll personnel. If you call your local main county board office that is how to voice or ask questions.We are being scammed by this governor and his southpaw party in power.

Sorry you're too much of an idiot to drop your ballot in a Dropbox.

 

[MrsScrew]

In Mercer County, where I live, the website says
1. Mail in your ballot
2. Drop your ballot off at one of 5 ballot boxes around the coumty
3. Give it to someone at your local polling site
4. Vote in person ONLY if you are disabled and request in advance
5. Request a provisional ballot on electionday which may or may not be counted because there is a lot of scrutiny on them to be sure you are who the ballot says you are and to be sure you didn't vote by mail

There is NO voting with a machine in NJ this year

Polling Locations & Secured Drop Box Locations | Mercer County, NJ

www.mercercounty.org

 

[Salvi's Headband]

This whole thing seems like a mess and its gonna be a $hit show. By reading some of this thread basically you can only vote by mail in you live in NJ and want your vote to count on election day. If you dont vote by mail you may be able to do a provisional ballot and that vote will not be counted until after the election if needed. I just wanna vote in person. I can go to the store, restaurant and even protest but I cant vote in person. Does not make any sense to me. There has to be a reason behind this.

look up box location
drive to box.
insert filled out ballot in box.

 

[ru109]

Imagine being offended that our voting methods are finally catching up to the technology of the postal service.

How about we take it once step furthe

Add this to your list. You had a female tenant who just got married and moved out. You receive in your mailbox ballots for Mary Smith and Mary Jones and neither live in your house any more. Now add in the fact that Charlie Jones moved in with Mary 6 months before they got married. Now you have 3 ballots that you can fill in and mail voting for the person you prefer.

I would guess that when you fill them all out and the signatures don't match what is on record they would be discounted and the FBI would show up as voter fraud is a felony, hypothetically speaking.

 

[RUBOB72]

Sorry you're too much of an idiot to drop your ballot in a Dropbox.

Sorry voting in person is my choice and thousands of others. It’s idiots like me who financially support trash like you.

 

[leftoright]

Predictably, this thread started going sideways pretty fast. Good attempt OP, but you know this board.

All registered voters in NJ will receive a mail in ballot. They will start being mailed in early October. There will even be a way to track your individual ballot via a website to ensure your vote has been received and counted. Polling places will be open, but no machines — anyone wishing to vote in person will do so via provisional ballot.

Which website will keep track of your ballot and show you have voted? Seems like an important address to know or else you have the POTUS warning people to go to the polling place to write a provisional ballot if the officials there can't prove you voted. Not voting twice, just making sure you in fact voted once.

 

[RUBOB72]

In Mercer County, where I live, the website says
1. Mail in your ballot
2. Drop your ballot off at one of 5 ballot boxes around the coumty
3. Give it to someone at your local polling site
4. Vote in person ONLY if you are disabled and request in advance
5. Request a provisional ballot on electionday which may or may not be counted because there is a lot of scrutiny on them to be sure you are who the ballot says you are and to be sure you didn't vote by mail

There is NO voting with a machine in NJ this year

Polling Locations & Secured Drop Box Locations | Mercer County, NJ

www.mercercounty.org

And that is illegal and an infringement upon those in favor of voting at an actual polling place...the governor has overstepped his powers... Lawsuit to allow both in person and by mail is still active . Either way there will be many questions with missing , undercounted, over-counted, dead, legal voters... wait.

 

[Salvi's Headband]

Sorry voting in person is my choice and thousands of others. It’s idiots like me who financially support trash like you.

lol neverending whiny grievance theater with you trumpy snowflakes... stfu, drop your ballot and enjoy the rout.

 

[OntheBanks]

Do the signatures on these three hypothetical mailed-in ballots match the signature on the roll?

Maybe they do or maybe they don't. But with 31 million unrequested ballots being mailed in how careful are the checkers going to be.

 

[Harambe_be_my_qb]

And that is illegal and an infringement upon those in favor of voting at an actual polling place...the governor has overstepped his powers... Lawsuit to allow both in person and by mail is still active . Either way there will be many questions with missing , undercounted, over-counted, dead, legal voters... wait.

The law is illegal when this guy doesn't like the law. I get it. He took for granted how voting works. Now it has interruptedhis routine of wearing a stupid I Voted sticker to pick up his senior coffee at McDonald's on some Tuesday in November and now he is pissed that the world doesn't bend to his whim.

 

[Harambe_be_my_qb]

Sorry voting in person is my choice and thousands of others. It’s idiots like me who financially support trash like you.

Do you think you should get more of a vote because you claim to make more money