Please, Rutgers, don’t forget what makes Jersey Mike’s Arena great | Politi
Renovations are needed, but the Rutgers basketball arena is not supposed to be a luxury experience.
Politi on the RAC Renovations
- Thread starter colbert17
- Start date
The North Carolina guy is right. If the focus is mostly on luxury we’re going to be disappointed with the end result. As far as catering to the celebs and big donors… look at what we have today with court side seats. I sit in row A in the 100 section and unless it’s a huge game, the big wig seats one row in front of me are:
A - often empty
B - when occupied the folks wear anything but Rutgers gear
C - rarely participate in any cheers or crowd activities
D - arrive late and leave early
E - talk and don’t pay attention to the game
F - linger well into the second half eating chicken fingers and cheap beer in the hospitality area
E - are often Not RU fans and often not even true hoops fans
OF COURSE there are exceptions (give me Todd Frazier every game), but the bottom line is IF YOU WANT TO STERILIZE AND NEUTRALIZE the great JMA/RAC atmosphere we all crave, then go heavy on the transient “luxury“ seeking fans.
A - often empty
B - when occupied the folks wear anything but Rutgers gear
C - rarely participate in any cheers or crowd activities
D - arrive late and leave early
E - talk and don’t pay attention to the game
F - linger well into the second half eating chicken fingers and cheap beer in the hospitality area
E - are often Not RU fans and often not even true hoops fans
OF COURSE there are exceptions (give me Todd Frazier every game), but the bottom line is IF YOU WANT TO STERILIZE AND NEUTRALIZE the great JMA/RAC atmosphere we all crave, then go heavy on the transient “luxury“ seeking fans.
Some of these folks best qualifications to sit there may be their donation history and/or local political connections and ties.
People just love to complain. I’m sure the much needed renovations will be great.
So where are your season tickets located and how long have you been in that location? Don't bother answering. I already know the answer.
A lot of those are people taking clients, vendors, etc out to games. Half of them would rather do anything than be at the game, it’s essentially just another work commitment to them.
Rutgers alums and fans only care about their individual bottom line screw the needs of the athletic programs. It’s why we are amongst the lowest if not the lowest in terms of donations in the BIG. It’s an old cheap fanbase who counts every dime.
Hobbs quote is spot-on:
“We’re not going to change the atmosphere. We’re going to maintain the atmosphere, but folks know we need better concourses. We need more concessions. We need premium seating. We need a few more bathrooms — maybe four times what we have now.”
That is EXACTLY what we need . The renderings don’t really answer whether this design does that. Looks like a large luxury area.
Politi also added a few other things like - the ability for people to eat or drink the concessions.
Bottom line: sure add some luxury stuff for the high rollers but it is imperative that the improvements:
(1) fix the significant PROBLEMS with the RAC: not enough bathrooms; larger concourses; more bathrooms; places for the regular people to sit down and eat the concessions
while…
(2) NOT taking away from what makes the RAC special (and I think that would happen with an over emphasis on luxury accommodations)
“We’re not going to change the atmosphere. We’re going to maintain the atmosphere, but folks know we need better concourses. We need more concessions. We need premium seating. We need a few more bathrooms — maybe four times what we have now.”
That is EXACTLY what we need . The renderings don’t really answer whether this design does that. Looks like a large luxury area.
Politi also added a few other things like - the ability for people to eat or drink the concessions.
Bottom line: sure add some luxury stuff for the high rollers but it is imperative that the improvements:
(1) fix the significant PROBLEMS with the RAC: not enough bathrooms; larger concourses; more bathrooms; places for the regular people to sit down and eat the concessions
while…
(2) NOT taking away from what makes the RAC special (and I think that would happen with an over emphasis on luxury accommodations)
I feel like people are just not listening to every bit of communication that has come out about this project overtime as your 1) and 2) is EXACTLY what has been communicated and is exactly what is going to be accomplished in this project.
If there is a desire for corporate seating and we can maintain the decibels in there it is a complete no brainer. We have a cash flow problem that makes the state paper of record excoriate us every 6 months. This is exactly the time to make the changes. The iron is hot. Let’s go!
I’m listening - I quoted Hobbs for goodness sake
But it’s one thing for them to SAY that and another thing to accomplish just that.
The rendering didn’t answer that conclusively for me. There weren’t floor plans (which I’d be able to read) just a bunch of conceptual renderings (to give the flavor of things). But no plans showing the amount of new bathrooms, the extent of luxury stuff, the widths of the new concourses, etc.
this is not a criticism (i understand they aren’t at that state yet) but the renderings don’t prove (to any degree) that this will ACCOMPLISH what they are SAYING
thus as the process moves forward and plans come together - the fans need to hammer these points home. Repeatedly
That’s all
Didn’t intend to imply you weren’t. Many are not and you laid out the communication to date nicely and demonstrated it takes care of exactly what people say they want in text.
Most people aren’t responding with “sounds good just need more details later about the areas the we are targeting to rightfully improve”. Most people are saying Hobbs is out of touch and that he is going to screw over season ticket holders.
Thanks for understanding my point
With that said - I don’t blame the pessimism. There ARE myriad examples of “improvements” to such venues ruining what made them special. So a constant refrain of “concentrate on the problems” is warranted.
The fact that Hobbs is saying the right things right now is at least encouraging.
Great article by Politi!!! Nailed it!
So fearful that the race to create luxury boxes will ruin what has become one of college basketball’s great atmospheres.
We have already seen what they did with 118.
On many occasions there were 12 people or less in that entire section. Sure RU may have made some revenue but come on. You’re destroying the very atmosphere that people want to be a part of in the first place not to mention displacing possibly the most loyal fans who sat though all the disasters and 30 years of no tourney. BK 118 ring a bell? Degaz… And many other posters on this board. ;-)
All we need is a nice concourse and bathrooms and for Jersey Mikes, to sell some cheesesteaks and subs every game. (Is this like the Carrier Dome not having air conditioning ?).
Dont mess with the footprint.
Have to laugh or cry at the irony of making a new entrance to the parking lot (Why?) and why they haven’t used the entrances and exits there oh since 1977? SMH
Ever see the lines to get in and they have all entrances not using? A pattern just like the football stadium when answer is so obvious.
No confidence and fear RU will inevitably destroy the RACmosphere.
So fearful that the race to create luxury boxes will ruin what has become one of college basketball’s great atmospheres.
We have already seen what they did with 118.
On many occasions there were 12 people or less in that entire section. Sure RU may have made some revenue but come on. You’re destroying the very atmosphere that people want to be a part of in the first place not to mention displacing possibly the most loyal fans who sat though all the disasters and 30 years of no tourney. BK 118 ring a bell? Degaz… And many other posters on this board. ;-)
All we need is a nice concourse and bathrooms and for Jersey Mikes, to sell some cheesesteaks and subs every game. (Is this like the Carrier Dome not having air conditioning ?).
Dont mess with the footprint.
Have to laugh or cry at the irony of making a new entrance to the parking lot (Why?) and why they haven’t used the entrances and exits there oh since 1977? SMH
Ever see the lines to get in and they have all entrances not using? A pattern just like the football stadium when answer is so obvious.
No confidence and fear RU will inevitably destroy the RACmosphere.
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I love the RAC and am not made of money, but I really don’t think adding some people that may not be there exactly for the game on top of the people already there won’t ruin the acoustics, as long as the stadium is a trapezoid it will be loud.
Winning equals cash flow.
Huge home court advantage = Winning
We all saw the morgue that is the Cure Arena in Trenton.
Be very careful what you wish for.
Politi who has been bashed here on a reg basis and his newspaper called a rag for wanting to charge to read their articles so that they can survive and not close down is now being praised by Rutgers fans. The keep things cheap screw what the programs crowd has changed their tune on Politi and NJ.COM.
The best 3 things about these renderings:
1) real seats in the 300s (current 300 season ticket holder thanks for this, currently the world’s mist uncomfortable seats)
2) students in the first 3/5 rows behind the benches on the TV side - time we start acting like a Big Ten program. They all do this - this is college sports, it’s about the students, for the students, by the students, sorry if you will be shifted back a couple rows, thats like 50-100 people total because the away section will also get shifted
3) gone are the quiet floor loges in 118 which provide 0 intimidation, replaced with seats all the way around .. more people than even before when 118 was there = louder and more intimidating than ever
1) real seats in the 300s (current 300 season ticket holder thanks for this, currently the world’s mist uncomfortable seats)
2) students in the first 3/5 rows behind the benches on the TV side - time we start acting like a Big Ten program. They all do this - this is college sports, it’s about the students, for the students, by the students, sorry if you will be shifted back a couple rows, thats like 50-100 people total because the away section will also get shifted
3) gone are the quiet floor loges in 118 which provide 0 intimidation, replaced with seats all the way around .. more people than even before when 118 was there = louder and more intimidating than ever
An RAC renovation factor being ignored is the scope of the renovation will be determined by funding availability.
Pernetti launched a RAC renovation plan in 2010. The fundraising went nowhere so the premium seats weren't built. The locker rooms were renovated - that was the highlight. Little for the fans in that one. Perhaps the latest plan is scaled down and features added bathrooms as the highlight.
I completed the Hobbs survey. A glaring omission in the questions was the experience for the best college basketball fans - the students. ScarletDave captured this a few moments ago.
Politi's article dropped the hammer. "Rutgers was right to ask fans for their feedback on how to improve Jersey Mike’s Arena. Now comes the important part — actually listening to them."
Will Hobbs listen to the students?
Pernetti launched a RAC renovation plan in 2010. The fundraising went nowhere so the premium seats weren't built. The locker rooms were renovated - that was the highlight. Little for the fans in that one. Perhaps the latest plan is scaled down and features added bathrooms as the highlight.
I completed the Hobbs survey. A glaring omission in the questions was the experience for the best college basketball fans - the students. ScarletDave captured this a few moments ago.
Politi's article dropped the hammer. "Rutgers was right to ask fans for their feedback on how to improve Jersey Mike’s Arena. Now comes the important part — actually listening to them."
Will Hobbs listen to the students?
A while back, for football, they made the first row of parking in the green lot a reserved spot for 10,000
The first year they had more cars there that I would have guessed
Now, a vast wasteland
The first year they had more cars there that I would have guessed
Now, a vast wasteland
They still sell those spots -- the "owners" simply don't show up. I know a handful of generous donors. Not six-figure people, but solid mid-five figure supporters. A few have those spots now because they were already donating so they figured they might as well get a dedicated spot for some of their money.
As for the RAC, there is money to be made by having premium seating. I get that it "needs to be done", but I can promise you they won't be at every game. Moreover, they are not the types to sell their tickets -- they'll offer them to clients, and who knows if they show up, or eat the tickets. We see it in every venue that has premium seating. And, RU won't care if the seats are empty on game day because hey we got the money.
I appreciate Hobbs' statements. They are well intentioned. And, of course, he's dead wrong. It absolutely will change the atmosphere. More importantly, it will price out 75% of fans from their current sections.
The first year or two the owners did show up
I would have guessed sales dropped off when the team did poorly
The season ticket holders complaining that they will no longer get cheap season tickets are hypocrites. You want this team to be big time? Then pay like they are, or someone else will.
I mean he nailed it . But this board beat him to it yesterday
For Everything There Is A Season
Poet: Catherine Pulsifer, © 2019
Life is full of change
If it wasn't it would be so strange
Everything would remain the same
It would be like playing a boring game.
For everything, there is a season
And always a good reason
We may not see it now
But all progress it does allow
Imagine if no progress was made
If change just made us all afraid.
Alter your attitude and look for the good
Let things evolve as they should.
Poet: Catherine Pulsifer, © 2019
Life is full of change
If it wasn't it would be so strange
Everything would remain the same
It would be like playing a boring game.
For everything, there is a season
And always a good reason
We may not see it now
But all progress it does allow
Imagine if no progress was made
If change just made us all afraid.
Alter your attitude and look for the good
Let things evolve as they should.
Politi is also right metlife and Yankee stadium suck
I would also say the new msg is not better after renovations for the average fan.
Prudential and Barclays better than Brendan Byrne.
Citi field better than Shea.
I would also say the new msg is not better after renovations for the average fan.
Prudential and Barclays better than Brendan Byrne.
Citi field better than Shea.
RAC is multiuse.. with practice areas and so on.. that ends. It becomes a basketball-sized venue only. No more folding bleachers.
This idea relies on teh concept of the large columns inside that hole up teh roof from the inside, get moved outside and hold up the new larger-area roof from above it.
1) remove roof
2) remove columns that hold up roof
3) wrap-around seating in 100s. Removing everything standing in the way of doing that... include path to lockerrooms/media rooms and wrap-around walking path at tip of 100s
4) 200s and 300s demolished
5) wrap-around 200s while building-in TV-Media boxes on one side and luxury on the other. with seats over them. Re-grade 200s and 300s to fit the boxes. Steeper/closer (unless you sink court a bit and add to 100s and grade. fewer seats with seatbacks but made up for an more by new wrap-around seating. Walls and structure to support 200s and 300s pushed out farther to allow for larger concourse area, more restrooms, etc.
6) top of 300 supports a catwalk structure for lights and scoreboard.
7) new roof is an externally supported cantilever roof allowing for larger concourse area and allows for escalators to 300s so fans can walk down to seats.
8) do whatever is needed for ticket office and offices and storerooms in additional footprint under new roof area.
I do think that, ultimately, we'd be better off building new and utilizing the current RAC for other purposes.
But we should be ably to do this in one year. Make a deal with teh Big Ten where we play only road games for one year with a good vast majority share of the revenue from outer home games played at Big Ten schools venues. They should all jump on that offer, right? Extra home games with advantage if not extra money.. it would be like we rent out all their venues. But we'd have to make that 1-year build work.
This idea relies on teh concept of the large columns inside that hole up teh roof from the inside, get moved outside and hold up the new larger-area roof from above it.
1) remove roof
2) remove columns that hold up roof
3) wrap-around seating in 100s. Removing everything standing in the way of doing that... include path to lockerrooms/media rooms and wrap-around walking path at tip of 100s
4) 200s and 300s demolished
5) wrap-around 200s while building-in TV-Media boxes on one side and luxury on the other. with seats over them. Re-grade 200s and 300s to fit the boxes. Steeper/closer (unless you sink court a bit and add to 100s and grade. fewer seats with seatbacks but made up for an more by new wrap-around seating. Walls and structure to support 200s and 300s pushed out farther to allow for larger concourse area, more restrooms, etc.
6) top of 300 supports a catwalk structure for lights and scoreboard.
7) new roof is an externally supported cantilever roof allowing for larger concourse area and allows for escalators to 300s so fans can walk down to seats.
8) do whatever is needed for ticket office and offices and storerooms in additional footprint under new roof area.
I do think that, ultimately, we'd be better off building new and utilizing the current RAC for other purposes.
But we should be ably to do this in one year. Make a deal with teh Big Ten where we play only road games for one year with a good vast majority share of the revenue from outer home games played at Big Ten schools venues. They should all jump on that offer, right? Extra home games with advantage if not extra money.. it would be like we rent out all their venues. But we'd have to make that 1-year build work.
Differences in home court advantage from the particulars of our stadium are miniscule.
I hope they don't make the RAC less fun, but nothing they do here is going to make the team worse.
Ed Cooley called the Arena one of the toughest places to play in the country because of the fans.
You change the footprint of the RAC you run a real danger of ruining the home court advantage. That’s not minuscule. 118 wasn’t great for the home court advantage. Whole sections changed will have an effect.
You change the footprint of the RAC you run a real danger of ruining the home court advantage. That’s not minuscule. 118 wasn’t great for the home court advantage. Whole sections changed will have an effect.
Not apples to apples w new arenas / stadiums
Citi >> shea
Pru >> Byrne
Barclays >> Byrne
New msg >> old msg (Reno to pre Reno)
Giants >> met life
Old Yankee >> new Yankee
Some aspects of the new places are better, some of the old are better
Let’s see what the final plans entail
Lots of ambiguity here
Citi >> shea
Pru >> Byrne
Barclays >> Byrne
New msg >> old msg (Reno to pre Reno)
Giants >> met life
Old Yankee >> new Yankee
Some aspects of the new places are better, some of the old are better
Let’s see what the final plans entail
Lots of ambiguity here
Hobbs is banking on some new group of 30 and 40 something alums with cash to spend
There is a lot to this ….the courtside seats are more empty Than you think….
What they need to do is build luxury bkxes where the office are , build a sexond club for higher end season tickets holders…and focus on real ammentiris for the arena and adding seating capacity to the RAC to get it to 5 digits
The rest of this is not a good idea …see the Audi club where I believe the seats are not all sold , and why the luxury boxes are not built for the football stadium
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