Here is the answer you are looking for, which many in this thread have already said. We trust Schiano and his eye for underrated talent and we did not with the last guy. Plain and simple. That is why you see the difference in the reactions.
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It's definitely not because I didn't ask about the class as a whole or anything to do with what you discussed. I asked why these last few recruits are good gets when other pp5 schools didn't see it.
Some here are reframing my argument in a way that wasn't intended I am specifically talking about recruits who have few or no Power 5 offers, yet people give them a pass because it's GS. I know the class, as a whole, is better. That wasn't my point. Why is there no outcry when we beat Akrom ,William and Mary, or Army for kids this year? That's all I'm asking.
I'd be interested in a year 1 comparison for this time of year for Schiano and Ash. I'm pretty sure that Ash didn't have a top 20 class his first year in late May.
I think your numbers are way off. The last commit alone lists several Ivy offers.I tried comparing the two-star commits between our current class and the 2017 class. As was noted above, the rankings tend to be wonky (and this year will probably will probably be worse than most years). Plus, it’s way too early to draw conclusions and things will change, but here are a few observations…
The OP is correct, the 2017 class had a high percentage of Ivy/Service offers, but our current class has a much higher percentage of P5 offers and a much lower percentage of FCS offers. In addition, the two-stars are a smaller percentage of the class to date. There is still a lot of time left for this year's class to change, but this is how our under recruited kids compare to Ash's first year.
- Overall, 27% (4/15) of our current class is made up of two-stars compared to 35% (9/26) in 2017.
- Of our current two-stars, there are 8 P5 offers for 4 players (2/recruit), compared to 4 P5 offers for 9 players in 2017 (.44/recruit).
- There are only 2 FCS offers among our current 4 two-stars (.5/recruit), compared to 15 FCS offers for 9 kids in 2017 (1.67/recruit).
- Our 4 current two-stars, hold 1 Ivy/Service Academy offer (.25/recruit) compared to 4 offers (.44/recruit) for our 9 two-star recruits in 2017.
I think your numbers are way off. The last commit alone lists several Ivy offers.
I know that I'll get chewed up and spit out for this, but someone has to say it, and I would never dishonor a kid in his commitment thread, so I made a separate thread.
When Ash was here, he got absolutely killed on this board for winning recruits over schools like Akron, Miami (OH), the sevice academies, and the Ivies. Now that Schiano is doing the same thing, I see almost exclusively "Great get" type comments in the threads. Now, maybe everyone in these threads has a better eye for talent than I do and they can see a difference. But looking strictly at offer lists (Only because that's what you all did with Ash), I see no difference at all between his recruits and several of Schiano's. Can someone set me straight?
Thank you. This is more of what I was wondering. I don't have the ability to see these kinds of details in recruiting videos, so I was hoping someone with a better eye could explain why these kids are good gets.After you watch his film you will see why Schiano likes a player like this . Good size... Good push... Good speed ...uses his hands and has lateral quickness. .. reminds me of PeteTverdov out of Union NJ before he became a star at RU...a ** star recruit with a 7.00 rating...I think this is typical Greg Schiano .by the time he is a sophomore Austin Dean under Jay Butler will be 6’2”” 6’3” 230 -235... I also agree a typical MLB as we see at Wisconsin or Iowa year after year.
I think your numbers are way off. The last commit alone lists several Ivy offers.
The first few years for Ash were very similar to Greg’s first few years 2001-2003. Greg sold his vision to the fanbase and turned us around. I don’t know if Ash ever would have but he certainly did not get the time Greg did.I know that I'll get chewed up and spit out for this, but someone has to say it, and I would never dishonor a kid in his commitment thread, so I made a separate thread.
When Ash was here, he got absolutely killed on this board for winning recruits over schools like Akron, Miami (OH), the sevice academies, and the Ivies. Now that Schiano is doing the same thing, I see almost exclusively "Great get" type comments in the threads. Now, maybe everyone in these threads has a better eye for talent than I do and they can see a difference. But looking strictly at offer lists (Only because that's what you all did with Ash), I see no difference at all between his recruits and several of Schiano's. Can someone set me straight?
I trust Schiano's eye for talent. I cannot say the same for Chris Ash.
I trust Schiano's eye for talent. I cannot say the same for Chris Ash.
Maybe I wasn't clear. I'm glad he has relationships. I jsut think these are personal relationships, and taking a 2 star with whom you have a personal relationship might be seen as more of a favor or being blinded by your personal love for the kid or his family. Again, I hope I'm wrong.
Some people forget this simple fact he has had many 2** players who played in the NFL...Devin and Jason McCourty, Pete Tverdov , Burton NFLI don't believe he had any other FBS offers - that would mean from G5 conference schools. I don't think any were listed at all.
I agree but with that NFL talent we didnt win many conference titles. I mentioned it because we are competing in the tougher division vs coaches that are just as competent.It doesn't matter that it was a "watered down Big East" IMO. MANY of the under recruited kids Greg brought and developed became successful NFL players. Shows that talent is talent.
I agree but with that NFL talent we didnt win many conference titles. I mentioned it because we are competing in the tougher division vs coaches that are just as competent.
. The vision is to win conference and National titles... the goal for the first 3 years is win , be competitive and get to mid pack... after that by year 4 is when the kids who are 12–14 will see Rutgers as it was in the good years under Schiano. Had Greg stayed in 2012 we wouldn’t be in the place we settled at under Flood and Ash . There will always be bad seasons but there will be more good ones then most of us imagine now.I agree but with that NFL talent we didnt win many conference titles. I mentioned it because we are competing in the tougher division vs coaches that are just as competent.
Actually , Tyshon Fogg has performed well in a defense which lacked enough players to compete week in and week out... let’s see how he does under Greg if we are able to get on the field this year.The majority of our early commits have strong ratings and were very good gets with most from NJ. We remain in the running for some of the top 10 guys in NJ. Ash built his classes around guys who didn't have P5 offers and his distribution of scholarships (how many WRs do you need and where are the linemen?) was questionable. By the way, I was thrilled Ash landed those 3 4 stars in 2017. But Melton was a legacy excited about the high scoring offense Ash expected, Clark required a scholie for his brother and both didn't pan out, and Fogg had solid offers but has not been a star at RU. Blackshear was a 2* who flipped from Temple. At the end of the day, no solid OLs.
Looks at BC so far in 2020. No 4* commits despite supposedly hiring a recruiting guru. Took Cheek who GS passed on. Bottom line, looking at our whole commitment list, we are doing excellent.
TKR 2016: “I trust Ash’s eye for talent. I cannot say the same about Kyle Flood”
Feel the same as OP but have been keeping my mouth shut. Like GS once said, 80 percent of it is talent
I can guarantee that if this pandemic didn’t hit and Florida had their annual spring football this player would have generated additional offers. Schiano had that advantage to offer this G5 kid... time will tell so don’t whine if in 6 months other D1 schools offer this player . The young man is still a junior with a year to play.I don't believe he had any other FBS offers - that would mean from G5 conference schools. I don't think any were listed at all.
Link?It's been interesting to note that there have been 10 top target on the home page, all showing as 100% RU except for the last one, who shows as 100% Wisconsin. Our last three recruits were not among them but each appeared in the first position on that page, literally hours before committing. It just seems to be a pattern.
When earlier today, there was an article about Tahjamell Bullock, who has been further back among the 10 for weeks, he moved up to the first spot, then was bumped into the second spot with the new commit, who literally seems to have come out of no where.
I think some of our frustration has to do with what seems to be an extraordinarily long wait for the decisions by our top targets.
Perhaps there's another explanation for the composition of the 10 who have appeared on the home page for a long while?
In any event, like everyone here, I wish our new recruits the best of luck for a fulfilling academic and athletic career at Rutgers.
Man, you jumping the gun. I didnt say anything about results. I like our staff. I'm looking forward to seeing what Schiano can do with the new resources but lets not act like its not going to be more challenging.But we are in the B1G now with much better resources. Much better asst coaching staff (tied to comp). If you are going to be one of the guys crying because we haven't won conference titles but consistently go to bowls and play entertaining football against elite competition, and want him fired like last time around, beware of what that got us.
You saying this like I dont think Greg can do it lol. Just because its going to be more challenging doesnt mean I dont think it can happen.That's a great blue print. Im hoping it goes as plan.. The vision is to win conference and National titles... the goal for the first 3 years is win , be competitive and get to mid pack... after that by year 4 is when the kids who are 12–14 will see Rutgers as it was in the good years under Schiano. Had Greg stayed in 2012 we wouldn’t be in the place we settled at under Flood and Ash . There will always be bad seasons but there will be more good ones then most of us imagine now.
I know that I'll get chewed up and spit out for this, but someone has to say it, and I would never dishonor a kid in his commitment thread, so I made a separate thread.
When Ash was here, he got absolutely killed on this board for winning recruits over schools like Akron, Miami (OH), the sevice academies, and the Ivies. Now that Schiano is doing the same thing, I see almost exclusively "Great get" type comments in the threads. Now, maybe everyone in these threads has a better eye for talent than I do and they can see a difference. But looking strictly at offer lists (Only because that's what you all did with Ash), I see no difference at all between his recruits and several of Schiano's. Can someone set me straight?
Some here are reframing my argument in a way that wasn't intended I am specifically talking about recruits who have few or no Power 5 offers, yet people give them a pass because it's GS. I know the class, as a whole, is better. That wasn't my point. Why is there no outcry when we beat Akrom ,William and Mary, or Army for kids this year? That's all I'm asking.
I agree with everything you're saying, and not one of the things you said answers my question, or is really even relevant to the discussion.
And again, this is not my question.
I think the obvious answer is: "Aliens!"It's definitely not because I didn't ask about the class as a whole or anything to do with what you discussed. I asked why these last few recruits are good gets when other pp5 schools didn't see it.
Ash would have gotten roasted over the coals for the Dean commit.
I don't think our best years were with a watered down BE...During most of the 05-09 years, WVU and L'Ville made up for the loss of Mia and VaTech and then Cincy had some very good teams as did Shit, hate to say it, UConn and you had Pitt. During those years, we had great showings in bowl games and many were saying that the BE actually compared close to the BIG Ten and better than ACC.I agree with everything you said but also keep in mind that he did that in a water down big east. Not going to get everyone in NJ so we do have to take chances on kids like this. Low risk, high reward type players.
Man, you jumping the gun. I didnt say anything about results. I like our staff. I'm looking forward to seeing what Schiano can do with the new resources but lets not act like its not going to be more challenging.
And if 247 didnt offer these fans, then they are worth our time to be posting here as it is obvious they are no good.We should rated Rutgers fans on a scale similar to rivals. I don't think some of the complainers would like the results. They will be quick to point out their contributions to the board goes further than the negativity other love to focus on.:Laughing