Response: 4 of the 7 guys you listed have 2 combined high major offers. More than half.
BB Recruiting Rutgers in Josh Baker’s Final 3
- Thread starter jordkap
- Start date
You.... do understand what a trend is, right?
Last 6 guys, in chronological order, by # of high major offers (which, again, is a bad metric that doesn't prove to be all that meaningful in reality, but I'm humoring you).... 9, 1, 0, 1, 6, 19, 0
If anything, the trend has largely been upward, not downward.
Over the last 17 months, we've picked up 3 recruits, 2 of which had multiple high major offers.
Looking further back to show trend, again looking at presence of other major offers as though it is anything more than theoretically meaningful:
02/02/16: 0 - Thiam
03/25/16: 0 - Bullock
07/27/16: 1 - Baker
08/03/16 0 - E. Omoruyi
12/20/16: 7 - Doucoure
05/14/17: 0 - Johnson
08/04/17: 11 Mathis
08/11/17: 1 Harper
04/15/18: 1 McConnell
05/16/18: 9 - Mulcahy
08/31/19: 1 - Reiber
11/08/19: 0 - Palmquist
11/20/19: 1 - Mag
03/04/20: 6 - Jones
03/29/20: 19 - C. Omoruyi
08/14/20: 0 - Miller
Number of HS commitments with multiple high major offers, by year:
2016: 0
2017: 1
2018: 1
2019: 0
2020: 2
Please tell me how this is a downward trend?
02/02/16: 0 - Thiam
03/25/16: 0 - Bullock
07/27/16: 1 - Baker
08/03/16 0 - E. Omoruyi
12/20/16: 7 - Doucoure
05/14/17: 0 - Johnson
08/04/17: 11 Mathis
08/11/17: 1 Harper
04/15/18: 1 McConnell
05/16/18: 9 - Mulcahy
08/31/19: 1 - Reiber
11/08/19: 0 - Palmquist
11/20/19: 1 - Mag
03/04/20: 6 - Jones
03/29/20: 19 - C. Omoruyi
08/14/20: 0 - Miller
Number of HS commitments with multiple high major offers, by year:
2016: 0
2017: 1
2018: 1
2019: 0
2020: 2
Please tell me how this is a downward trend?
Number of HS commitments with multiple high major offers, by year:
2016: 0
2017: 1
2018: 1
2019: 0
2020: 2
2021: 0
2022:0
All the while we in theory should be in a much more attractive situation as it comes to recruiting based on recent performance vs 5 years ago. Definitely troubling. Again, not a primary point of contention.
Also, remind me how may 20+ win seasons we had with the 2011-2013 Mike Rice classes that were chock full of high-major offers.
9 - Seagears
9 - Mack
9 - Carter
6 - Randall
5 - Etou
4 - Lewis
3 - Jack
0 - Kone
Could it possibly be that having the right coach and right "fit" works out better than just collecting a bunch of guys with high major offers?
9 - Seagears
9 - Mack
9 - Carter
6 - Randall
5 - Etou
4 - Lewis
3 - Jack
0 - Kone
Could it possibly be that having the right coach and right "fit" works out better than just collecting a bunch of guys with high major offers?
Coaching matters a ton. That’s not what we’re talking about though. This particular topic is not a referendum on Pikiells entire body of work though the link keeps getting mentioned. No one is disputing on court results.
Really, you're adding 2022 to that list? It's 7 months out from the EARLY signing period for 2022, and 12 months out from the regular signing period.
Yes as we have missed on our top targets who have committed elsewhere so far. We can revisit later in the year no problem with that. But we’ve been recruiting the class so worth mentioning imo. Unfinished no doubt
Success isn't going to come from the HS recruiting ranks in any given year as much as it will from the transfer portal, which is definitely a trend that I think will continue.
We wouldn't have been a 20+ win team the last two years without Young, Yeboah, and Carter. And we wouldn't have pulled out of the hole Jordan left us in without Gettys and Sa.
Which gets back to the point of this thread..... Josh Baker would be a great get for us.
We wouldn't have been a 20+ win team the last two years without Young, Yeboah, and Carter. And we wouldn't have pulled out of the hole Jordan left us in without Gettys and Sa.
Which gets back to the point of this thread..... Josh Baker would be a great get for us.
You have a photo of Pike's "top targets" board? Or are you just going based on who has passed their decision date? There's no one out there higher up on our board who's still uncommitted?
At the end of the day, I'd much rather we grab a no-offer Johnson than a multiple-offer Doucoure. Offers (and stars) are only corollated to success in aggregate, not on a player-by-player basis.
Agreed regarding the difficulty we’ll have replacing MJ’s interior D. Young’s ability to be a pest on the perimeter can’t be understated either. I see almost no way our defense is as good as it’s been these last 2 seasons — which is concerning because it means the offense will have to be even better if we’d like to be a bubble/tourney team
By not going after or getting reciprocal interest from some high impact guard transfers the season imo hinges on Jones ability to step in and start from day 1 and be a top 3 scorer on the team. Plausible yes but I will not pretend to know how likely it is. All reports seem to indicate he can do it just a matter of when. To a lesser degree we will also need a solid contribution from Mag on both ends.
We had a big man that we rarely went down to on offense and used him basically to set high (sometimes “moving”) screens that were never used. Our offense might actually be better without Johnson considering the way he was used. Our defense certainly will not be, however.
Apparently Sampson had bigger fish than Josh Baker to fry. Hopefully, he falls to us now.
You can never know based on offers or when something is accepted, maybe Baker already has a decision made and Houston went with plan B.....and took the commitment of the transfer. There's no way to know what is first or second or maybe Houston is fine with either player.
You forgot to include 2023 and 2024 years. Can't factor them into a trend until they are complete.
I know your exaggerating the situation in the 2022 class to make a point but I just couldn’t help but immediately think about if a company took your advice and decided not to react to missing growth goals in Q1 until the end of the year...
Edwards was not plan B.
In 29 games Edwards averaged 10.1 points, 4.8 rebounds, and 2.8 per game in the Big12 not Juco. 6’4 guard 25+ big 12 starts 2 year left over 40% from 3..
His list included Florida and LSU (won’t pretend to know if they were committable). Houston has a solid transfer class with him, Moore, and the uconn big (don’t know as much about him to be fair)
Good get for them.
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lol Houston was not prioritizing a JUCO, even a good one, over a proven honorable mention All Big XII guard.
Houston and a bunch of major schools all offered Baker before his JUCO season started LAST YEAR
The Texas Tech transfer hits the portal or Chris Beard leaves for Texas......or did that not just happen a little over a week ago.....??
Says here the kid hit the portal after the season and officially stayed in the portal on April 10th......it is simply supply and demand......there are more available players than spots.....Houston went in a different direction last week and has nothing to do with Baker or whether Houston would have taken him or not.
Edwards to Remain in Transfer Portal - Texas Tech Red Raiders
Texas Tech head coach Mark Adams has announced that junior guard Kyler Edwards has decided to transfer from the program.
texastech.com
In any event, I have tried many times, in many threads to state that with 1300 kids in the transfer portal, RU is going to land quality kids, because there are more quality kids in the portal AND in normal HS recruiting AND in JUCO recruiting.
So, it may be disappointing for some "fans", but RU is going to be fine....and RU is going to be good again next year and beyond, despite others thinking they won't.
I thought Houston would be good on guards but I just saw Cameron Tyson is in the portal. Very similar player to Baker.
Houston and a bunch of major schools all offered Baker before his JUCO season started LAST YEAR
The Texas Tech transfer hits the portal or Chris Beard leaves for Texas......or did that not just happen a little over a week ago.....??
Says here the kid hit the portal after the season and officially stayed in the portal on April 10th......it is simply supply and demand......there are more available players than spots.....Houston went in a different direction last week and has nothing to do with Baker or whether Houston would have taken him or not.
Edwards to Remain in Transfer Portal - Texas Tech Red Raiders
Texas Tech head coach Mark Adams has announced that junior guard Kyler Edwards has decided to transfer from the program.
In any event, I have tried many times, in many threads to state that with 1300 kids in the transfer portal, RU is going to land quality kids, because there are more quality kids in the portal AND in normal HS recruiting AND in JUCO recruiting.
So, it may be disappointing for some "fans", but RU is going to be fine....and RU is going to be good again next year and beyond, despite others thinking they won't.
This is nonsense. Rutgers offered him before last season too but you really think he'd have a spot here if Tyson Walker (to pick a name... fill in any guard you want) came to Rutgers? Houston's offer was pretty clearly not committable. It's likely that Rutgers wasn't either until recently. Houston found a guy in the portal, we didn't, so here we are. Houston tried harder than us, to be sure, but that mostly makes me think Rutgers should have tried harder.
I like Baker and I want him to come here... But a player of Kyler Edwards caliber would be better.
I see where your coming from on paper, but I don’t think it necessarily works this way. A lot of it is about chemistry and who plays well with who. Sometimes less can be surprisingly more. We’ll see. I see next year’s team being more like a veteran improved version of the competitive but inexperienced 2018-19 team if Geo and RHJ return. Looking at it that way the potential seems much brighter. That team rotated 2 frosh, a sophomore and Peter Kiss in the backcourt. We’re looking at a back court with 2 of those same kids with 3 more years of experience plus PM going into junior year along with frosh Miller and anyone else we add who could contribute. I also think senior RHJ is better than Eugene was back then. And Cliff should be at least on par with MJ from that year. We’re missing the Doorson / Carter depth. It’s important. Again, Pauly would be huge.
If would make sense that he’s ours to lose...unless Pike finds someone he likes better or another team swoops in after Houston landed Edwards. If we want him and we lose to Loyola, who just lost their coach, or Houston, who who just got a very good guard, I’d be worried.
This is what he does. Twist/ omit to support whatever “point” he thinks he has.
the bottom line is: he doesn’t understand what a “trend” means
I don’t necessarily disagree with his concern that pike is not consistently recruiting those next level recruits to get us consistently to the top half of the big10.
Thing is, this has been the case from the beginning with pike. There really isn’t a “trend” one way or the other. I’d argue the relative lack of a “trend” is the issue... the relative flat line
HOWEVER one could argue (as someone does above) that IF there is ANY “trend” it’s generally UP (not down as he suggests). Then the question is whether that upward “trend” is as steep as should be.
but there’s no downward trend. Just sojo trying to shoehorn his agenda
Not nearly as bad as we need a competent big. Cliff is not enough. We don’t even have a real 4. I’m starting to worry about this. If we can’t land someone proven we need to pick up 2 for the 10 fouls to give.
Loyola’s new coach was their lead recruiter. I’m sure they’re still in it
One other point here - Pike likes this kid so I hope we get him. But if we don’t, the portal is filled with shooting guards to chose from. We’re going to land someone for this spot.
It’s much much harder to find bigs that can contribute at the P5 level - even as back ups. If we can’t land Pauly or Harrar - Pike might need to take some chances and fill all 4 open schollies even if that wasn’t his plan. We can’t take only one unproven big out of HS or JUCO. Just too risky. Unfortunately, Shaq Carter is the exception - not the rule. There are far more Doorsons out there who need 3 years to be able to contribute, and Duke’s who just aren’t P5 level even after years of development. We would need to take at least 2 chances with unproven bigs with a hope for one come in and have some impact if we can’t land someone with proven D1 experience.
It’s much much harder to find bigs that can contribute at the P5 level - even as back ups. If we can’t land Pauly or Harrar - Pike might need to take some chances and fill all 4 open schollies even if that wasn’t his plan. We can’t take only one unproven big out of HS or JUCO. Just too risky. Unfortunately, Shaq Carter is the exception - not the rule. There are far more Doorsons out there who need 3 years to be able to contribute, and Duke’s who just aren’t P5 level even after years of development. We would need to take at least 2 chances with unproven bigs with a hope for one come in and have some impact if we can’t land someone with proven D1 experience.
Question is if there are any CJ Gettys-type players in the portal. Gettys wasn't a rockstar choice - but he came up a level in competition and improved in a lot of areas.
Gettys was a contributor on an auto-bid team. That qualifies (at least in my book) as someone with proven experience. There aren’t that many bigs out there though in even this category.
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