When does everyone usually start this? I was thinking right around Tax Day 4/15, but with the warmer weather I'm not so sure. Is it like plants, where if you plant them early and there's a freeze they can die? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
When to start fertalizing the lawn ??? (2016 thread)
- Thread starter JosephLanza
- Start date
Most university turf programs will say to avoid an early spring fertilizer, especially if you dropped nitrogen with a Winterizer in late fall. Early spring fert forces top growth at the expensive of root growth and can lead to problems/disease in the summer when grass is stressed. I tend to do my first fertilizer around Memorial Day. Of course Scotts and lawn service companies will say otherwise for their own "reasons."
So are you suggesting just a pre-emergent without fertilizer in early spring? Because my biggest issue is timing the crabgrass control.
Best time to put down the crabgrass preventer is when the forsythia start to bloom. Something about the soil temps of both being at just the right time.
Yes, put down PM alone (no fert) around the time forsythia blooms. Dimension or Barricade will give you a few months, depending on rate applied. You can do split applications, for example I'll do dithiopyr (Dimmension) early April then again in summer. if you are battling poa annua you want a fall PM too but you can't seed with these. You can seed with mesotrione (another PM) but it only gives you about 30 days of coverage. So to fight crab grass I'd use Dimmension or Baricade when the forsythia bloom. There are a couple other PMs too but I like these I mentioned.
since we are on the lawn topic, best thing I have found to fight grubs is Milky Spore. It blows away everything else and 1 application lasts a few years.
Phs73 - So it is ok to do 2 apps of crabgrass preventer? I put it down in spring and then at end of July it grows like crazy.
God I love this board sometimes. I was actually going to ask this question, and now I don't have to. Thanks!
Yes, you can do split apps, I do. Depending on the rate and product you put down, you can get from 3 to up to around 6 months coverage. Dimmension gives you about 3, again depending on rate. There are limits for a single application and also for the full year. So I would do a PM in early April then again late June (check the label, again, it depends on the rate). I also do a fall PM for poa annua. One point to note, the best time to seed is around here is mid to late August into September ( depending on the seed due to different germination periods), whether you have irrigation, etc. if you are going to seed in the fall, you don't want to have a long term PM such as barricade down or it will inhibit grass germination.
I think you are okay with the chemicals but you want to water them in thoroughly with irrigation if you have it or apply before an expected heavy rain. Or you can just skip the PM for a couple/few years. When my kids were little I applied it but always used the sprinkler system to water it in. That's my two cents, anyway.
THe biggest mistake that people do is put down seed after putting down fertilizer with pre-emergent such as Halts. This will not let your new seeds germinate.
So you have to make a choice put seed down without pre-emergent and then deal with weeks later in the year.
Correct, you can't seed with Halts. You can, however, seed with mesotrione (Tenacity), which is a PM. Mesotrione only gives you 30 days protection, though, so you can seed let's say 15-30 days before applying mesotrione (or at seeding), then repeat an app of mesotrione until grass is established and then use Dimmension, Barricade, Halts, etc. or you can skip the second mesotrione app depending on germination progress.
Okay, just to clarify, I am NOT talking about putting down fertilizer. I want to reseed these areas that took a beating over the winter. Should I do it as early as possible? Or wait until it's a little warmer (consistently I mean, given today's almost 80 degree temperature)?
Don't seed in the spring if you can avoid it. Fall is the best time. It takes 4 weeks or so for seed germination and usually by that time we are at the end of May and the poor seedlings get wiped out by the heat. Seeding at the end of Aug or beginning of Sept works better with the cool nights and warm days.
You also cannot seed and put down any pre emergent or post emergent weed killers as they will prevent seed germination.
As far as timing the soil temps have to be in the 60's. For my customers I will wait until the first week of April or the forsythia start to bloom. I don;t have as many as the big lawn companies as they have already started their pre emergent last week. It's not as bad in the past as new regulations state no professional fertilizing before March 1st but I've seen them out a few days before then.
You also cannot seed and put down any pre emergent or post emergent weed killers as they will prevent seed germination.
As far as timing the soil temps have to be in the 60's. For my customers I will wait until the first week of April or the forsythia start to bloom. I don;t have as many as the big lawn companies as they have already started their pre emergent last week. It's not as bad in the past as new regulations state no professional fertilizing before March 1st but I've seen them out a few days before then.
- Rock, you can use mesotrione as a PM with seeding, it will not damage germination. As I stated above, it only gives 30 days of coverage but you can do a second app, or you may not need it. Look at any university turf program, including RU (check with Dr.Bruce Clarke or Dr. James Murphy, the leading turf specialists at RU), or read the label.
Last edited:
Slight tangent, but any advice for laying down sod? I have a small area in my backyard (maybe 150 sq. ft.) that is pretty much destroyed to the point where I think sod might be the best option. I would think it's pretty simple to do.
In the front, I'm in a constant battle with trying to stop Bermuda grass from taking over my lawn in the summer.
In the front, I'm in a constant battle with trying to stop Bermuda grass from taking over my lawn in the summer.
On the Milky Spore, does brand matter? I understand that you shouldn't put down any grub killer before using it? Any suggestions? Thanks.
I never put down the pre-emergent. I just never saw any benefit. I usually hit it with 10-10-10 in early April then I do the liquid weed kill with the hose once the dandelions emerge a week or two later. When it warms up I put down straight insect control. Finally, around August I put down weed and feed and I'm more or less done. I have a Creeping Charlie problem so a lot of times I'll do the liquid weed bgon max late Oct so as to weaken it right before winter hits
My boys are 4 1/2, 2 1/2, and 3 months, I've resigned to the fact I won't have the best lawn on the block for the next bunch of years. I just overseed, water, mow high and leave the clippings and it stays decent, not great, but certainly not bad. Put a nice edge on it and never let it get too overgrown and you're fine.
Probably just being paranoid, especially with the "I used to run behind the mosquito truck when I was a kid" crowd, but better safe than sorry, imo.
Like many topics, peoples' views on lawns vary vastly. There is no right or wrong, different strokes for different folks and so on and so on and scoot dooby dooby (I'm dating myself). Some people want an elite lawn and are willing to spend a lot of time, money, and energy to get it. Others just want something green and still others are fine however it looks. Again, no right or wrong and all are valid. My comments come more from someone who is okay with putting some time in--keeps me out of other trouble on occasion.
First, to back up, if you find yourself being someone who has decided to put some time and energy in your lawn it's always a good idea to get a soil test. You can go to the Rutgers New Jersey Agriculture Experiment Station on their website and then drop off a soil sample (near Ryder's lane and Rt1) or mail it to them. They evaluate it and come back with some recommendations. There are other places that do this too. It's $20 for a basic test and can go higher depending on what you want.
Couple comments for those that care:
Spanky, I agree with Rock, fall is the best time to seed. If you want to spring seed you can, usually wait until soil temps are 55 or so (46 now). Having said that, people dormant seed in winter. Germination rate may be less as you move from ideal conditions but it could work for you, especially if your main goal is some ground cover. Once you seed, you have to keep it watered, though, to improve the germination rate. Also note that different cultivars have different rates, so, for example, Kentucky Blue grass takes longer than perennial rye or fescues.
Newell, re milky spore, that's interesting. I haven't used it but comments seem to vary from one app works great to you need a few years of apps to build up the bacteria level. I think milky spore deals with Japanese beetles more effectively than it does European Chefer so those of you contemplating an organic grub solution (e.g., milky spore) might try to determine your nemesis. I have heard reports of varying degrees of effectiveness that could be based on granular vs powder, degree of infestation, other factors. The best article I know on grub control is on the Michigan State University extension site, although it only deals with non organic products. I don't have the link but google it for those researching grub control. One other point, Scotts changed the active ingredient in grub ex (from imidacloprid to chlorantraniliprole for those that care) a couple years ago and the labeling wasn't at first revised. The latter needs to go down earlier than the latter). Always look for the active ingredient rather than the "brand" because things change.
As far as sod, I don't have personal experience with it but be aware of the sod type (cultivar you are buying) and what you have in your lawn. Different grass types and even cultivars within a type will have different characteristics in terms of color, blade width, growing patters, etc that can make it stand out if it isn't a match. For those that don't really care and what some shade of green it won't be a problem; for those that go over to the lawn "dark side obsession" you may not like it. Purdue turf mgt has a great article on sod.
Last thing I'll point out, again for those that care, is that there are some very effective herbicides, fungicides, pesticides but they are not to be used lightly. I don't mean to lecture anyone but some of these are used at 4 oz per acre so if you go down that road please read the label (some are 20 pages long or more) calibrate your equipment, measure your yard, and follow all instructions. Alternatively, you could have a licensed pro do it or you can choose to not get compulsive about lawns--all are fine options.
First, to back up, if you find yourself being someone who has decided to put some time and energy in your lawn it's always a good idea to get a soil test. You can go to the Rutgers New Jersey Agriculture Experiment Station on their website and then drop off a soil sample (near Ryder's lane and Rt1) or mail it to them. They evaluate it and come back with some recommendations. There are other places that do this too. It's $20 for a basic test and can go higher depending on what you want.
Couple comments for those that care:
Spanky, I agree with Rock, fall is the best time to seed. If you want to spring seed you can, usually wait until soil temps are 55 or so (46 now). Having said that, people dormant seed in winter. Germination rate may be less as you move from ideal conditions but it could work for you, especially if your main goal is some ground cover. Once you seed, you have to keep it watered, though, to improve the germination rate. Also note that different cultivars have different rates, so, for example, Kentucky Blue grass takes longer than perennial rye or fescues.
Newell, re milky spore, that's interesting. I haven't used it but comments seem to vary from one app works great to you need a few years of apps to build up the bacteria level. I think milky spore deals with Japanese beetles more effectively than it does European Chefer so those of you contemplating an organic grub solution (e.g., milky spore) might try to determine your nemesis. I have heard reports of varying degrees of effectiveness that could be based on granular vs powder, degree of infestation, other factors. The best article I know on grub control is on the Michigan State University extension site, although it only deals with non organic products. I don't have the link but google it for those researching grub control. One other point, Scotts changed the active ingredient in grub ex (from imidacloprid to chlorantraniliprole for those that care) a couple years ago and the labeling wasn't at first revised. The latter needs to go down earlier than the latter). Always look for the active ingredient rather than the "brand" because things change.
As far as sod, I don't have personal experience with it but be aware of the sod type (cultivar you are buying) and what you have in your lawn. Different grass types and even cultivars within a type will have different characteristics in terms of color, blade width, growing patters, etc that can make it stand out if it isn't a match. For those that don't really care and what some shade of green it won't be a problem; for those that go over to the lawn "dark side obsession" you may not like it. Purdue turf mgt has a great article on sod.
Last thing I'll point out, again for those that care, is that there are some very effective herbicides, fungicides, pesticides but they are not to be used lightly. I don't mean to lecture anyone but some of these are used at 4 oz per acre so if you go down that road please read the label (some are 20 pages long or more) calibrate your equipment, measure your yard, and follow all instructions. Alternatively, you could have a licensed pro do it or you can choose to not get compulsive about lawns--all are fine options.
You might want to post this on the Current Event board too.
I'm sure the Current Event readers would be interested.
Wow this is such a great topic! I know nothing about lawns at all except mine is terrible
I really need to get a pro in here to help me out as I couldn't follow any of the above bit seems like everyone really cares a lot about what their lawn looks like. Seems that most are willing to personally out in the time especially with a bit of experience.
Do people recommend Scotts?
I really need to get a pro in here to help me out as I couldn't follow any of the above bit seems like everyone really cares a lot about what their lawn looks like. Seems that most are willing to personally out in the time especially with a bit of experience.
Do people recommend Scotts?
That's not easy. I'm going to preface this with these are my opinions. I tackled that last year and so far so good but this isn't a one time shot. Fenoxaprop is what I used, the brand being Acclaim Extra. Please note this is something you should closely follow the label--it will damage desirable turf if not used properly. This is a herbicide that is generally used by pros, although you can purchase it for residential use. I did two apps of fenoxaprop at 30 days apart, with a preemergence such as dithiopyr for a couple cycles. I did this last summer and will do the PM again this year. Japanese stilt grass germinates in spring and seeds inAugust so timing is important. It tends to grow at boarders of wooded area where there is a lot of moisture. Again, If you do this yourself please read the label carefully and measure precisely. This is a multi year battle as far as I understand, and that seems to be right. Last thought, make sure you are sure it's Japanese stilt grass and not nimblewill, which are sometimes confused. The latter is easier to deal with. Also, Japanese stilt grass is often confused with both Nimblewill and creeping bent grass, the latter two are not controlled by fenoxaprop. Please read the label prior to purchase and application to avoid possible harm to desire able turf.
Last edited:
You know, a lot of people don't care that much and that is totally, totally fine. We all have different hobbies and ways to use our discretionary dollars and time. Frankly I don't necessarily recommend Scotts. A lot of what is out there (e.g., 4 step) is generally thought to be flawed by most university turf management programs. Timing, ingredients, and general theory have been called into question. Having said that, it depends on how much time you want to spend--no right or wrong answer. I think many turf management folks probably think that some, not all, service companies recommend products and services that meet company needs rather than home owners. I don't want to over generalize though, and many are reputable. Depends on your goals and interests, I think. If you have the interest there is a lot of great research and info at third websites like RU, NC State, Purdue, OSU, MSU, and others.
Thanks for the feedback! I am generally interested in having a nice looking lawn. I have too many brown spots, too much crabgrass, and it just looks awful at times.
I have about 1.25 acres in colts neck and the time investment is just not in the cards for
Me. I am willing to pay someone else to do it
But I feel I don't know as much about it and that is always a disaster as someone could easily
Rip me off or sell me something I have limited knowledge in. I'm looking for ideas on who to trust to help me out.
I have about 1.25 acres in colts neck and the time investment is just not in the cards for
Me. I am willing to pay someone else to do it
But I feel I don't know as much about it and that is always a disaster as someone could easily
Rip me off or sell me something I have limited knowledge in. I'm looking for ideas on who to trust to help me out.
Lots of great stuff in this thread. Specifically - I think I have nimblewill. So how do I get rid of it? TIA
Tenacity (mesotrione) will take Nimblewill out. Please follow the label, though, since it is very powerful and is fine if used as directed but can adversely impact desirable turf if not used properly. Not cheap either but a little goes a long way. It's based on the natural effect of the bottle brush plant. Note that it can bleach desirable turf temporarily. This is a product that the base use is 4 oz an acre so you don't want to be imprecise.
Thanks for the response. Just a little background: I reclaimed this area from the forest back in April and May. I put down grass seed and cultivated it over the summer. I also put some seed down this past fall although it didn't seem to take. Anyway it got kind of torn up over the winter and I want to bolster what's down there.
Too bad, I had a whole thread on it step by step, but because it's under the old forum format, it's not recoverable.
You sound a little bit like me. Contact Agritech in Freehold. When we lived in Belmar, our neighbor worked for them. Our yard in Belmar was only 50 X100 and we had a small amount of grass. He was doing his yard and our other neighbor's yard and ours stood out like a sore thumb. We have been using Agritech for 15 years at that house and the lawn always looks fantastic.
We live on 3/4 of an acre in Rumson, and we have a lot of shaded area. We don't want to spend the money on a company, and I have always just used a bag of spring fertilizer in the spring and fall fertilizer in the fall. Our law here is decent, but not great.
The sunny areas of our lawn took a beating last year. We ordered 8 yards of top soil. I used a rotottiller and rake to work up the browned out sections then spread topsoil and then watered copiously last fall. The new grass looks great.
I'd get a quote from Agritech. They have plans that are comprehensive but you can probably get by with 2-3 application per year.
Any advice on how to deal with voles (not moles)? They tunnel around our yard making a lot of tripping hazards. Do we need to eliminate their food source, or eliminate them? And what do we use? Never encountered this until we moved to Rumson.
Good luck. Voles each plant roots. Moles eat grubs. Voles are much more difficult to "manage," as a result. Try an effective repellant and use frequently. You can also use mousetraps baited with peanut butter and oatmeal, placing traps next to their tunnel/holes, and then cover the trap and hole with a box. Happy hunting.
