WNBA 2023 season

[RUcrazee]

A name that came to my mind a few weeks ago and I noticed being mentioned after last night's result, is Skylar Diggins-Smith. The lack of toughness on the Liberty has been evident for a while after matchups with the Aces and Mystics this past season. Skylar checks all the boxes for what this team needs. She is looking for a new team, I believe.

I would love to be able to keep Sloot for IQ and leadership. IMO, she was more crucial to the Liberty's success this season than Ionescu. Sabrina has not shown that she is up to running the point guard duties full time. As good a passer and shooter as she is, Sabrina's problems on defense along with her weakness handling the ball against strong defenders brings about a need for a Sloot. And I have to say, the shot Sloot missed was a tough, contested shot. She shot it the best of all of them last night, and also was very clutch on both sides of the ball in the final minutes. If anybody had to take the last shot, last night I may have preferred it be her. She and Jonquel seemed to be the only ones with a clear head and confidence to take the shot on that last play.

Gotta feel for Stewie. It's so hard to figure out what happened to her.

 

[RUcrazee]

Just my opinion, but I think that if the Liberty want to experience multiple championships with this core group, they are going to have to be more selfless(no egos, coincidentally, ..like the Aces) and Brondello and staff (IDK if it goes all the way to the front office) are going to have to get away from pushing pre-determined favorites. Yes, I'm just going to say it.

It's okay to bring in a player or players who you plan to build around and consider the face(s) of the franchise. It becomes problematic when the coaching or handling of the rest of the team is such that it sacrifices the full potential of the team in favor of pushing the featured one(s). We had examples of this with the Liberty this season from day 1 all the way up to the end.

This is no different than what we witnessed right here with our RUWBB program when Arella came back for that extra year. CVS and staff made the mistake of letting that balance of featuring the star player versus the betterment of the team become skewed. I can't fault Arella because she was in the young stages of her basketball career and I don't think she realized that leaning on her young, talented teammates, mainly Diamond J., would have been the best way for her to put her best foot forward in auditioning for the WNBA Draft and helping the team be its' best.

Stewie trying to play hero ball so often on a team that starts 4 other AllStars, really hurt the team. But it seems that the coach chose that style over letting the points come from whoever on the team gets them. It doesn't have to be Sabrina or Stewie. Not making excuses for Betnijah, but I do believe the limiting of her role, upon the entrance of the "big four", played a role in her tentativeness at times, including last night in crunch time. Maybe she was just overwhelmed by the moment,...Idk. But the lack of respect for her offense early on is not something that lends itself to greater cohesion as the season progresses. At times this season, they showed flashes of what it could look like, but then reverted back to Stewie ball. Similar to how our CVS teams, toward the end, would show flashes but then revert back to lesser cohesion and efficiency.

Brondello and some "big four" teammates, when asked about Nijah in interviews as her inclusion in the offense saw the team hit its stride, made it seem like she finally figured it out and found her place in the offense. It sounded more like covering for coaching error in regard to Brondello's initial misuse of talent. I think it is the coaches responsibility to include all of the team's talent as opposed to making an all-star into a role player so that the marketed, centerpieces can stand in the foreffront.

Thank goodness Betnijah was a strong enough person that she was able to continue to function and be the All-Star that she is despite a coaching plan that treated her as if she was just a role player.

We witnessed, time after time, moments during the season where the Liberty needed a lifeline, and who is it that answered the call???.........the organic face of the franchise, in my mind(I may be RU biased,...a lilbit) .......the one who looks like a comic book superhero when swooping to the basket after getting the steal on the other end, or when she is knocking down the triple!, .................the one I call, "Laney Liberty"(in the likeness of Lady Liberty).

 

[sammybb]

I don't agree with your analysis of the Liberty's season. This was a completely new team to start the season, and everyone needed to figure out their roles--no one more so than Betnijah. But every month of the season, her PPG increased as the team got used to playing together and she figured out where her shots would come from. JJ took the longest to get going, but she really started to get there post all star break, and minus last night, was the Liberty's best player all playoffs.

Breanna Stewart is one of the 2 best players in the world and this year's regular season MVP. She needs to shoot, no matter what. She was just ice cold last night. But her 17 shots were not that outrageous compared to the rest of the team: Vandersloot had 16 shots, Laney 13, Sabrina 12.

I never thought "selflessness" was an issue for the Liberty. I thought they had issues with sometimes stagnant half court offense, lapses in intensity, and outside Laney, real issues with keeping perimeter players in front of them. Even then, they went 32-8 and made it to the team's first WNBA finals in 21 years.

a hugely disappointing ending, but not, I'd argue, a disappointing season overall.

 

[RUcrazee]

I don't agree with your analysis of the Liberty's season. This was a completely new team to start the season, and everyone needed to figure out their roles--no one more so than Betnijah. But every month of the season, her PPG increased as the team got used to playing together and she figured out where her shots would come from. JJ took the longest to get going, but she really started to get there post all star break, and minus last night, was the Liberty's best player all playoffs.

Breanna Stewart is one of the 2 best players in the world and this year's regular season MVP. She needs to shoot, no matter what. She was just ice cold last night. But her 17 shots were not that outrageous compared to the rest of the team: Vandersloot had 16 shots, Laney 13, Sabrina 12.

I never thought "selflessness" was an issue for the Liberty. I thought they had issues with sometimes stagnant half court offense, lapses in intensity, and outside Laney, real issues with keeping perimeter players in front of them. Even then, they went 32-8 and made it to the team's first WNBA finals in 21 years.

a hugely disappointing ending, but not, I'd argue, a disappointing season overall.

Much respect sammybb. As I've said before, I always appreciate hearing your viewpoints. I'm usually in total agreement with them. Thank you for sharing your thoughts to my post.

Firstly, I just have to say....I totally agree with everything you said in your reply.
My comments may sound condemning but I also think the season was a huge success. All of my comments are really targeted toward the team's path to reaching their full potential. You are absolutely correct when mentioning that it takes time for new pieces to gel fully. Kelsey Plum talked about the ups and downs that their core players experienced to get to where they are. Maybe I just need to exhibit more patience here also..

Although they were a new core together, .....from my vantage point, ....and I could be totally off here, ....but it appeared to me that at the start of the season, Betnijah more than anyone else, had to figure out where she fit in, because it was a lot of 3-man(player) involvement in the offensive motions(Sloot, Ionescu, and Stewie). Jonquel was still working into better conditioning and wasn't able to be herself. Laney(and then K Thornton) where given the role of standing in the corner to stretch the floor. That's fine, but my problem with it is that it appeared she was not invited to the party(included into the screening and cutting motions until it was evident the initial 3-man and occasional Jonquel pick and role was not getting it done.

Once Betnijah was brought into the mix and not just put in the corner, the teams play improved dramatically. They all are capable three point shooters, so I didn't understand why she would have to be singled out to take such a dininished role. ....especially when she is one of the strongest finishers, and midrange shooters on the team. Keeping her in the mix makes it easier for everyone to get their own open looks. And of course, a full-strength Jonquel Jones in the mix put the team on equal footing with the dominant Aces.

Stewie does need to get plenty of touches and shots, but if they are forced shots over top-notch defenders who match up well with her, she needs to make that extra pass and possibly get it back in a better position to score. Last night, and during other games that the team struggled, they didn't make that extra pass. The stagnation we saw at points during the season often came from forcing it in to Stewie to go 1-on-1 (usually in attempt to get her going from a slump). I just think that was the wrong way to go about getting her going. The Aces spread the wealth and the burden to carry the load. Stewie has four all stars alongside her, ....no need to put excessive pressure on herself to put the team on her back while her teammates stand and watch . They will never win that way. Aja demands that Jackie carry some of that load when the team just "has to have it". She realizes Chelsea and Kelsey are already on that same wavelength.

I don't think that the Liberty players, by nature, or personality-wise, are selfish. I just think that organizational brass, marketing depts., and media often play a role in shaping individual player expectations. Unfortunately, some players don't handle that pressure of meeting those expectations well.....causing them to play in a way that is more individualistic or out of character. Throwing off the flow of selfless play.

To me, it seemed like this is what hampered Stewie's game down the stretch of this season.

 

[RUcrazee]

OMG! I was just watching a Jets show on SNY and after its' conclusion , they switched over to discussing the Liberty /Aces game from last night.

I swear, when I entered the post above, I had not heard these Kelsey Plum takes on the Liberty. I heard what she said after the game last night about going thru the ups and downs to get to where they are. She also said that you can't become a super team in a couple months, it took them a few years. Just now hearing the rest of her comments and my jaw is hanging.

Kelsey Plum on Aces' title: Building a superteam 'takes years'

The Las Vegas guard also questioned the New York Liberty's team mentality. "They don't care about each other," she said.

justwomenssports.com

Don't know if she is just taking jabs at the Liberty or if she really sees it that way. Maybe she sees some of what I have been referring to.

 

[RUcrazee]

Lots of interesting info and perspectives from the season-ending exit interviews for the Liberty. The majority of the team was asked to address the K Plum comments. I'm sure, at this point, she probably wishes she hadn't said that. Really makes her look bad as the Liberty maturely, took the high road.

Some things I gathered from the responses- !) Jonquel may very likely not be with this team next year. She sounded like she's not sure what she wants to do. Other comments she shared were really surprising. Just goes to show, you never know what's going on behind the scenes with people. I thought she just needed more time to get rounded into great game shape during her struggles early in the season. Seems there was so much more to it than just that.

All of JJ's teammates appropriately expressed a strong desire to see her stay with the team and run it back. Weirdly, to me, Brondello was the one person who's response in reference to JJ coming back, seemed much too cold to show a true desire for her to return. Came across as a 'we'll be okay whether she comes back or not, we just go to option B'. Yeah, you take that mental approach if you aren't able to keep her in Brooklyn, but not while the person 's return is still on the table. Could you imagine our coaching staff saying something like that about any of the recruits they hope to land??!

The other thing that stood out to me and kinda goes along the lines of the opinions I've expressed in the above posts, is Stewie having undue pressure placed on her that may have affected her play somewhat.

She and Brondello responded to questions about Stewie taking up the leadership role this season. It was clear from their comments that Stewie felt like she had to be the team leader, not only by example, but also vocally. Stewie also admitted that it was new territory for her. Brondello mentioned, this was Year1 for Stewie "post-Sue Bird". She says Stewie didn't have to be the vocal leader because Sue handled all the leadership roles. ...... ??????..... Why?! do you ask Stewie to take on a role she isn't used to or natural at, when you have Sloot, Betnijah, and Sabrina who already seem to fill that role more naturally. Just let Stewie do what she does! without additional burden!

Effective team leaders, from my sports experience, always emerged organically. Couldn't just be pre-assigned because of skill level. True PGs and football QBs have leadership traits that seem like they're ingrained from young ages. Like Sue, for example. Seems to me that she was raised to be the leader that she has shown to be going back to her days as a kid in Bkyn/Queens

Also, in the end, we could see that JJ too, has some natural leadership qualities.

We just need Stewie to be Stewie and ball out!! She don't have to be the one to organize the troops.

 

[RUcrazee]

Another observation was in regard to our reserve players, Jocelyn W, Steph Dolson, and N. Sabally. They all seem to realize that there is a good chance they may not be back next year. The GM mentioned that the bench was a little post heavy and he'll be looking to get more effective defensive presence from the guard spot(preferably with length). Immediately, Didi Richards came to mind . GM said they are keeping an eye on her play over in Australia, where they connected her with a team. Skylar Diggins also fits the bill if she gets along with the current Liberty core players.

I just hope they keep Sabally because she is gonna be good in a short while with more playing time. IMO, she has a higher ceiling than Dolson and is a better fit in how the team likes to play.

Jocelyn is going to have to expand that offense and find her shot again. She said she feels fully healthy so now all she needs is to play and find her groove again.

Unfortunately, the new, league prioritization rule is not gonna allow Marine Johannes to join the team late again. She stated she will be playing for her national team in the Olympics, so she will not be back with the Liberty at all next season.

 

[Knight Time Fan]

Another observation was in regard to our reserve players, Jocelyn W, Steph Dolson, and N. Sabally. They all seem to realize that there is a good chance they may not be back next year. The GM mentioned that the bench was a little post heavy and he'll be looking to get more effective defensive presence from the guard spot(preferably with length). Immediately, Didi Richards came to mind . GM said they are keeping an eye on her play over in Australia, where they connected her with a team. Skylar Diggins also fits the bill if she gets along with the current Liberty core players.

I just hope they keep Sabally because she is gonna be good in a short while with more playing time. IMO, she has a higher ceiling than Dolson and is a better fit in how the team likes to play.

Jocelyn is going to have to expand that offense and find her shot again. She said she feels fully healthy so now all she needs is to play and find her groove again.

Unfortunately, the new, league prioritization rule is not gonna allow Marine Johannes to join the team late again. She stated she will be playing for her national team in the Olympics, so she will not be back with the Liberty at all next season.

Without researching it, I don't think playing in the Olympics is directly the issue, as the US team is also WNBA players. More likely, it is if someone's national program requires your attendance in other events / training that conflicts with the prioritization rule. No league would penalize players (directly) for playing in the Olympics.

As to the rest, it will be interesting to see how it plays out. I only watched a few games and was fairly impressed after recent seasons. I actually like Brondello, since her days as a player and with the Mercury. I don't think Sloot, Laney or Ionescu were likely choices as team leaders before the season, I don't have an issue with putting Stewart in that role.

Plum is knows for saying what she thinks, IIRC. It is difficult to assess interactions sometimes because so much of WNBA play is based on individual talents. It is one of several differences to NCAA play that tends to make me prefer college ball; however, unlike some, I also do like the WNBA.

 

[RUcrazee]

Without researching it, I don't think playing in the Olympics is directly the issue, as the US team is also WNBA players. More likely, it is if someone's national program requires your attendance in other events / training that conflicts with the prioritization rule. No league would penalize players (directly) for playing in the Olympics.

I was just going by Marine's response. She said she has to talk with her National team coaches and Liberty mgmt. to see if her return is possible, but she didn't see how she could be here for the W since she promised to be in training camp for her national team.

Whether she plans to play with the club team that she has been playing for, I don't know. I have no clue of those overseas schedules in relation to the start of the W season. So, you could be right, it might not be a problem with prioritization for her. We'll just have to wait and see how it all plays out.

 

[RUcrazee]

I don't think Sloot, Laney or Ionescu were likely choices as team leaders before the season, I don't have an issue with putting Stewart in that role.

This is where I feel as though, I must be missing something.

Why would they NOT be likely choices?

I've seen alot of all three over their time in the W and have seen them assume leadership roles, in the naturally emergent-leader sense. That is where I think problems can arise with a team, when player's positive attributes are totally overlooked or casually dismissed in favor of someone else who may be the new star attraction, but isn't known for those same leadership skills.

 

[Knight Time Fan]

I was just going by Marine's response. She said she has to talk with her National team coaches and Liberty mgmt. to see if her return is possible, but she didn't see how she could be here for the W since she promised to be in training camp for her national team.

Whether she plans to play with the club team that she has been playing for, I don't know. I have no clue of those overseas schedules in relation to the start of the W season. So, you could be right, it might not be a problem with prioritization for her. We'll just have to wait and see how it all plays out.

Actually, you are saying exactly what I said - that she may have commitments with her national team (i.e. training camps and exhibitions) that are in conflict with the prioritization rule. I only said (based on your original comment) that actually playing in the Olympics would not be the issue, it was possibly the commitments that went with it.

 

[RUcrazee]

Actually, you are saying exactly what I said - that she may have commitments with her national team (i.e. training camps and exhibitions) that are in conflict with the prioritization rule.

Yes, this was all I was saying in the original post. I just said it with the expectation that it was understood that those commitments are a part of playing for her national team and were the reason for her uncertainty regarding a return next season.

I'm also keeping in mind that she was a bit late coming over this season due to playing overseas. If she plays in that league again, the Olympics would seem to rule out her trying to leave an overseas team to make the W report date and then go right back to the National Team report date. That were the new rule could come into play.

Bottom line, Marine sounds like she is planning for a season back home, pending talks on a couple of fronts.

And of course. I'm well aware that participation in the Olympics, by itself, does not preclude athletes from playing in the W.