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Your top 5 replacements for head coach

I shake my head when people make comments but don't do the research or don't pay attention even when others have done it for them. I looked at the P5 openings back to 2001 and I even posted the link. The last 2 years there were an unusually small number of openings around 7. But if you look past that there were more times where there were double digit numbers of P5 openings with 17 being the high and 4 being the low a couple times. Most years there were anywhere from 11-13 P5 openings.

This year just seems like a lot because there's been so much movement in season. As of now nothing unusual in total. We don't know if it's actually going to be more or are moves just being pulled forward to in season and like I said most years have double digit number of openings. So far we're at 8 P5 openings.

In this thread itself I posted openings where coordinators at top programs went. I'll post it again. None the destinations are anything special.

Is Miss St some top job in the SEC? Mullen went there. Louisville? Strong went there. Pitt where Narduzzi is now. Herman took a job at Houston? Are we not better than Houston really? Fuente went to Memphis my god. Jim McElwain the Alabama OC at the time went to CSU. Kevin Wilson the OU OC at the time to Indiana.

Herman/Fuente are likely out of reach now but they wouldn't have been a couple years ago. I mentioned Herman 2 years ago during that whole USF last game thing but no one even discussed him after I put all the stats and background info up. That's when you get these guys and we could have gotten him then, unlikely now. Have to try and possibly sniff out the next big one before he blows up and gets out of reach and names like Meacham/Aranda aren't too big for us.
 
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rutgersguy1 said:
I shake my head when people make comments but don't do the research or don't pay attention even when others have done it for them. I looked at the P5 openings back to 2001 and I even posted the link. The last 2 years there were an unusually small number of openings around 7. But if you look past that there were more times where there were double digit numbers of P5 openings with 17 being the high and 4 being the low a couple times. Most years there were anywhere from 11-13 P5 openings.

This year just seems like a lot because there's been so much movement in season. As of now nothing unusual in total. We don't know if it's actually going to be more or are moves just being pulled forward to in season and like I said most years have double digit number of openings. So far we're at 8 P5 openings.

In this thread itself I posted openings where coordinators at top programs went. I'll post it again. None the destinations are anything special.

Is Miss St some top job in the SEC? Mullen went there. Louisville? Strong went there. Pitt where Narduzzi is now. Herman took a job at Houston? Are we not better than Houston really? Fuente went to Memphis my god. Jim McElwain the Alabama OC at the time went to CSU. Kevin Wilson the OU OC at the time to Indiana.

Herman/Fuente are likely out of reach now but they wouldn't have been a couple years ago. I mentioned Herman 2 years ago during that whole USF last game thing but no one even discussed him after I put all the stats and background info up. That's when you get these guys and we could have gotten him then, unlikely now. Have to try and possibly sniff out the next big one before he blows up and gets out of reach and names like Meacham/Aranda aren't too big for us.
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It should be noted that both Herman and Fuente make more than Flood. Right now. In tax friendly states. Rutgers has a real problem in this area.
 
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NewJerseyGuy said:
7. Will restore the program to the antediluvian glory we once enjoyed.
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I wonder how many people will get that reference. I admit that I didn't and had to look it up to understand it. Very funny though.
 
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Caliknight said:
It should be noted that both Herman and Fuente make more than Flood. Right now. In tax friendly states. Rutgers has a real problem in this area.
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It's a hundred grand. Not peanuts for a program like ours, but it's not like we'd have to float a bond to make either of them whole.
 
NewJerseyGuy -- mildone is spot on. That's one of the best references I've ever seen on a message board. I guarantee that you'd never find such a clever and arcane reference on any P5 message board. Matter of fact, "Eat your hearts out, Ivies!" And a 50 cent word on top of it! Biggest word I've ever seen so far has been "delicatessen."
 
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Pritz99 said:
NewJerseyGuy -- mildone is spot on. That's one of the best references I've ever seen on a message board. I guarantee that you'd never find such a clever and arcane reference on any P5 message board. Matter of fact, "Eat your hearts out, Ivies!" And a 50 cent word on top of it! Biggest word I've ever seen so far has been "delicatessen."
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It was great. I didn't love the whole post, but that particular reference might be a top 5 all time great reference on any message board ever. I literally LOLed.

I fear it will fly under most people's radar though, which is really too bad.
 
ruhudsonfan said:
It's a hundred grand. Not peanuts for a program like ours, but it's not like we'd have to float a bond to make either of them whole.
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Herman/Fuente are likely out of reach now but they wouldn't have been before and would have come in our price range. Coordinators make in that 500K range. Meacham makes 350K, Aranda makes 550K. Taxes be damned, they're not worried about that when you're tripling/quadrupling their salaries and giving them a P5 job in a decent recruiting ground/market.
 
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I took a look at the NCAA Football coaching salaries posted by USA Today.

Rutgers was second to last in HC salary (school pay) giving Flood $1,250,000 - ahead of only Illinois's Cubit, who is officially an interim. Average for the conference was $3.1M. Rutgers ranked 10th in staff pay with $2,445,200 (assuming TTFP and Northwestern were at the league average, given that they didn't report numbers in this area) - but this number includes $500K for Fridge. Average for the conference was $2.7M.

So, just to get up to "average" - we'd need to be shelling out another approx. $2M for a head coach and $300-800K for staff.

If you just take the top half of the conference, the average coaching salary is $4.3M. Top half reported staff salary was $3.0M (not including TTFP or Northwestern who didn't report, but who could be higher. So, to spend in the top half of the conference onc oaching, we'd need to be dropping another $3.5-4M per year.

I just don't see that happening out of the gate next year.

Best case scenario is that we get a young, up-and-coming coordinator at another P5 school (or an FCS HC) who's looking to make a name for himself - even if it's a guy who's looking at Rutgers as a stepping stone. If he doesn't do well, we drop him after 3 years and have the money to conduct a legitimate coaching search. If he does do well, we'll have the money in 3 years to pay to keep him.
 
RUChoppin said:
I took a look at the NCAA Football coaching salaries posted by USA Today.

Rutgers was second to last in HC salary (school pay) giving Flood $1,250,000 - ahead of only Illinois's Cubit, who is officially an interim. Average for the conference was $3.1M. Rutgers ranked 10th in staff pay with $2,445,200 (assuming TTFP and Northwestern were at the league average, given that they didn't report numbers in this area) - but this number includes $500K for Fridge. Average for the conference was $2.7M.

So, just to get up to "average" - we'd need to be shelling out another approx. $2M for a head coach and $300-800K for staff.

If you just take the top half of the conference, the average coaching salary is $4.3M. Top half reported staff salary was $3.0M (not including TTFP or Northwestern who didn't report, but who could be higher. So, to spend in the top half of the conference onc oaching, we'd need to be dropping another $3.5-4M per year.

I just don't see that happening out of the gate next year.

Best case scenario is that we get a young, up-and-coming coordinator at another P5 school (or an FCS HC) who's looking to make a name for himself - even if it's a guy who's looking at Rutgers as a stepping stone. If he doesn't do well, we drop him after 3 years and have the money to conduct a legitimate coaching search. If he does do well, we'll have the money in 3 years to pay to keep him.
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Thing is many schools hire guys who were coordinators or previously mid major HCs and if you look at their first HC contracts they've usually fallen in that 1.5-2.5M range. Occasionally sometimes more but by and large that's the range on a first time contract.
 
rutgersguy1 said:
Thing is many schools hire guys who were coordinators or previously mid major HCs and if you look at their first HC contracts they've usually fallen in that 1.5-2.5M range. Occasionally sometimes more but by and large that's the range on a first time contract.
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Exactly. That's the type of coach we need to be targeting for next year - mid major (or FCS) HC or P5 coordinator. High ceiling, low cost guys.

Mark Dantonio was OSU's DC before he came to Cincy, and then MSU grabbed him from Cincy. Brian Kelly was at Central MIchigan before Cincy, then FUND grabbed him from Cincy. Urban Meyer was at Bowling Green before Utah. Jim Harbaugh was at U of San Diego before Stanford picked him up.

Now, there are a lot of failures to go along with those success stories. But I think we really need to be looking to go after a high potential guy that will come in at a lower cost for next year - expecting to grab a big name, established HC is unrealistic.
 
[QUOTE="NewJerseyGuy, post: 865193, member: 1962"QUOTE


7. Will restore the program to the antediluvian glory we once enjoyed.

Quite clever had to look it up myself after mildone pointed it out. You have got to be a Rhodes scholar or quite religious. I applaud you "NewJerseyGuy" well done sir.
 
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RUChoppin said:
Exactly. That's the type of coach we need to be targeting for next year - mid major (or FCS) HC or P5 coordinator. High ceiling, low cost guys.

Mark Dantonio was OSU's DC before he came to Cincy, and then MSU grabbed him from Cincy. Brian Kelly was at Central MIchigan before Cincy, then FUND grabbed him from Cincy. Urban Meyer was at Bowling Green before Utah. Jim Harbaugh was at U of San Diego before Stanford picked him up.

Now, there are a lot of failures to go along with those success stories. But I think we really need to be looking to go after a high potential guy that will come in at a lower cost for next year - expecting to grab a big name, established HC is unrealistic.
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I agree 100% but you are only noting the success stories. For every success there are 5 big mistakes. On top of that RU is going to get the 5th or 6th choice of those type of guys. Way too many good jobs available.
 
I understand some of the pros of bringing schiano back but I think the program needs a reboot. The blueprint is already out there we should be shifting towards a Baylor, TCU, Oregon, WVU with rich rod model. This shift should have happened already. Maryland understands this change is needed and has been proactive in firing Edsall. We need to put an exciting product on the field to grow interest in this program. We need an efficient offensive attack.

Herman we missed the boat on.

In no order.

Dino Babers Art Briles disciple and would bring the Bayor playbook. Two good years HC at Eastern Illinois developed Jimmy Garrapolo. Now head coach at Bowling Green and has already beaten two bottom tier B10 teams this year. This hire could possibly keep Rettig here and get the most out of his skill set.

Doug Meacham TCU OC. Was the OC of the 2013 Houston team that torched us.

Jeff Brohm head coach WKU.

Scott Frost Oregon OC. For some reason I'm not sold on Chip Kelly coaching tree yet.

Other thoughts.

If we wanted to go contrarian and concede to being an underdog Ken Niumatutolo (navy) or Willie Fritz (Georgia southern). This would mirror what Georgia Tech decided to do in the ACC.

Pipe dream, no brainier, current coaches that will probably be brought up on these boards but will never happen. Mark Richt, Rich Rodriguez

Outside the box option Joe Moglia. Successful CEO, savvy with the media and proving to be a competent football coach at Coastal Carolina. I would trust him to build the necessary coaching staff to compete in the b10. Maybe he sees the same upside at Rutgers that we see and wants to buy low on the program.
 
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needmorecowbell said:
I agree 100% but you are only noting the success stories. For every success there are 5 big mistakes. On top of that RU is going to get the 5th or 6th choice of those type of guys. Way too many good jobs available.
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I said there were a lot of failures to go along with those successes in my last para From our position, though, in 3 years or so, we'll be in the position financially to make a real move (going into 2019). If that type of coach doesn't pan out, after 3 years we drop him and move to a legitimate top shelf coaching search. If he does pan out, we are in the position to offer a real extension to prevent him from jumping to a bigger job.
 
Bo Pellini - very good coach, Nebraska fans probably wish they still had him
Turner Gill - did wonders in Buffalo, not sure what went wrong at Kansas, but good character guy and pedigree
 
Ken Niamotolo of Navy. I know that running the triple option isn't sexy but I tell you what it does do...with the level of athlete we can recruit to run it, it will level the playing field greatly. Sure we may not win the the B1G championship running it, but do it for 5-6 years until we gain full revenue share. I guarantee the following will happen:

1. We will become a pain in the ass to prepare for and play.
2. We won't need upper echelon OL, the kind of kids we aren't getting now anyway, to run it.
3. We have a better chance at landing an effective dual threat QB, especially from inside our state/region, than a world beater pro style QB.
4. We can take advantage of the athletes in our area to play running back, flanker and WR.
5. Niamotolo will restore discipline and academic pride in the university.

Lou Holtz resurrected Notre Dame running this offense. Paul Johnson has had GT in several ACC championship games since he took over running this offense. The question is will the Navy coach come here but if he does, I think we'd win more often than we lose.
 
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ruhudsonfan said:
It's a hundred grand. Not peanuts for a program like ours, but it's not like we'd have to float a bond to make either of them whole.
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It's $200k in one case. And that is what they make now. You really think they'd come to Rutgers for lateral money?
 
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Caliknight said:
It's $200k in one case. And that is what they make now. You really think they'd come to Rutgers for lateral money?
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NJ's top rate is 8.97%

Assuming EVERY single dollar of income was taxable, which it isn't, their base salary would have to be $2.25M for your math to work.

As I said, we're not going to lose out on a head coach due to income tax considerations.
 
ruhudsonfan said:
NJ's top rate is 8.97%

Assuming EVERY single dollar of income was taxable, which it isn't, their base salary would have to be $2.25M for your math to work.

As I said, we're not going to lose out on a head coach due to income tax considerations.
Click to expand...

I'm not their agent, but I'm guessing they are looking to make more money, not the same.
 
Caliknight said:
I'm not their agent, but I'm guessing they are looking to make more money, not the same.
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I'm not suggesting they would take the same money. I'm saying we could make up whatever differences you are attributing to taxes.

It's not Arod signing a $250 million dollar contract where state income tax can be as much as $20MM over the life of the deal.

It's less than a million bucks over a 5 year deal.

You can't tell me a guy coaching in a non P5 in Texas would say to the B10 at slightly more money and attribute his decision to income taxes.
 
needmorecowbell said:
I agree 100% but you are only noting the success stories. For every success there are 5 big mistakes. On top of that RU is going to get the 5th or 6th choice of those type of guys. Way too many good jobs available.
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Well there are failures/successes for coordinators and failures/successes for mid major HCs but I don't think the hit rate for one avenue or the other is any better. I think they're the same.

As for current P5 coaches, well they're no guarantee either. People automatically think they're "proven" and to me that's a myth and illusion. A select few are proven most are risks no matter what category you pull them from.

Tommy Tuberville was supposedly "proven" at Auburn but he didn't have a single winning conference record in his 3 years at Texas Tech and that's after Mike Leach hadn't had a losing conference record since his first year there. Bret Bielema who I still think is a good coach and had quite a bit of success at Wisconsin isn't doing so hot at Arkansas. Charlie Strong at Texas who I think is a solid coach too but right now struggling at Texas. Mike Riley in his first year having trouble. Gary Andersen at Oregon State. Some of these guys are still early in their tenures but you get the point. Urban Meyer/Nick Saban are proven most of the resst, not so much even if they did well at one stop.

Some guys can thrive anywhere others need the right fit, it depends. So like I say it's more about identifying the right guy then narrowing down your search to pick a coach from a particular category. Identifying the right guy is easier said then done though.

As to the P5 jobs available, well I've already stated in other threads and gave a link. This year has 9 P5 openings now with Beamer. Most years dating back to 2001 have double digit number of openings from 11-13. Last couple years were less, about 7 each. We don't know if this year is really more or it's just that the movement is being pulled forward into the season from the end of the season.
 
ruhudsonfan said:
NJ's top rate is 8.97%

Assuming EVERY single dollar of income was taxable, which it isn't, their base salary would have to be $2.25M for your math to work.

As I said, we're not going to lose out on a head coach due to income tax considerations.
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As I said I think Fuente/Herman are likely out of our reach but not because of taxes. It's more likely because of the salary they will command at their next stop.

I've said most first time contracts for guys who were coordinators/mid major HCs is in that 1.5-2.5M range. There are exceptions to that rule and I think Fuente/Herman could possibly be those exceptions. I could see either of them making in the 2.5-3.5M range, especially if the SEC comes calling.

Looking at coaches who were more successful at a high mid major as opposed to a low mid major you see that. Butch Jones got 3M at Tenn. McElwain got 3.5M at Florida. Urban got about 3M at Florida after Utah. Chris Petersen got 3.6M from Washington.

But just about anyone else I can think of, outside of Fuente/Herman, that is a coordinator or mid major HC will likely fall in that 1.5-2.5M range.
 
scarletKNIGHT07 said:
... [Snip, snip] ...

Outside the box option Joe Moglia. Successful CEO, savvy with the media and proving to be a competent football coach at Coastal Carolina. I would trust him to build the necessary coaching staff to compete in the b10. Maybe he sees the same upside at Rutgers that we see and wants to buy low on the program.
Click to expand...

Going the Joe Moglia route would have parallels to the candidacy of Donald Trump. Having read this board for multiple years, Moglia's candidacy will not be well-received by this board's intelligentsia.
 
Not that I think they are great suggestions, but you could go with the high power offenses:
Jeff Brohm, WKU - still green with just two years of head coaching but there may be a JH connection
Skip Holtz, La Tech - his stint at USF was a disaster but he's got La Tech playing well. 6-3 with losses to WKU, Kansas St and Miss St.
Eddie Gran, Cincy - he's a good recruiter and can handle the offensive side of the ball, would prefer a P5 coordinator, but he's got tons of experience working for a variety of really good coaches

Defensive guys:
Everett Withers, JMU - former Butch Davis DC, also DC under Urban for his first two years at Ohio St. (he's the 2015 version of Mike London when he was at Richmond and was hired by Virginia)
Brent Venables, Clemson - has built a great defense, great recruiter, might be the favorite for KSU if Snyder retires
Tom Bradley, UCLA - he's had a couple years away from PSU, knows the B1G, I think he is a good recruiter?
 
You don't want Pelini. I'm telling you now. The guy sucks, hires his friends as position coaches who barely have experience.
Sucks with the media.
Sucks with the fans.
Will not stay at RU long.
Hates recruiting.
Is an embarrassment of the the field.

Yeah Nebraska isn't doing great with Mike Riley this year, but 85% of the fans believe Pelini had to go. He should have been gone in 2013.
 
Mr_Twister said:
Going the Joe Moglia route would have parallels to the candidacy of Donald Trump. Having read this board for multiple years, Moglia's candidacy will not be well-received by this board's intelligentsia.
Click to expand...

Maybe he could somehow convince Bo Pelini to come here as his DC/Assistant HC.
 
MikeRU09 said:
I am really intrigued by Brohm...
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I've thought about Brohm before but his combination of coordinator/mid major HC experience is a little short for me. In total about 4yrs or so. I'd like to see a little more so he's down below Meacham/Aranda/Babers for me.

He's also got the same drawback as Babers. He took over after Petrino and was left with a defense that ranked 14 in total and 44 in scoring. In his 2 years there, Brohm's defense was in the 120s scoring/total last year and so far this year 100 total and 68 scoring. So that's an issue if he can't deliver that mediocre defense I think is necessary.

But he realistically could have a better shot than those 3 because of his time at Louisville when JH was there.
 
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