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OT: OK, so maybe the Greeks are starting to worry...

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gRUntWork

Freshman
Sep 11, 2014
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So I'm halfway through a 2 week trip in Greece, and the first few days seemed like nobody was concerned by the crisis. I think that might be changing now. I just got a call from the manager of the villa I'm staying in, and he asked if we could close the account early. We had put 50% down and were to pay the remaining amount at checkout on July 1st, but they wanted to close out early in case a default screwed up VISA transactions.

Also, one bank ran out of money over the weekend and another limited withdrawals to 300€. (However, the bank that ran out, Alpha Bank, had money today and allowed a 400€ withdrawal.) I might take out some more money tomorrow just in case (I can always pay down the next hotel bill with cash if I end up with too many Euros, but I suppose I don't want to be left in a situation with too little cash...

But I'm having a blast here and not letting the crisis talk detract from a great vaycay!
 
Wait till the end to pay, it will be cheaper! If everything goes to poop, you will get a better coversion i bet. Thats why they want you to pay now.
 
I'll be going to Greece in August and am following this crisis closely. Hoping I get a real good exchange rate!
 
RU2007RSLN2010 said:
I'll be going to Greece in August and am following this crisis closely. Hoping I get a real good exchange rate!
Click to expand...
I hope you have trip insurance. This isnt going well at all.
And how comfortable are you traveling with tons of cash. The ATMs only allow the equivalent of $60 cash a day withdrawal.

Hope you have a plan B
 
the 60Euro cap is only for citizens. If your bank card is issued from another country, there is no cap on withdrawals.
 
I withdrew 400€ yesterday with no trouble. All of my ATM withdrawals have been for at least 300€. On a weekend, one of the ATMs ran out of money on the weekend, bi probably because no one was restocking it over the weekend.
 
I withdrew 400€ yesterday with no trouble. All of my ATM withdrawals have been for at least 300€. On a weekend, one of the ATMs ran out of money on the weekend, bi probably because no one was restocking it over the weekend.
 
WhiteBus said:
I hope you have trip insurance. This isnt going well at all.
And how comfortable are you traveling with tons of cash. The ATMs only allow the equivalent of $60 cash a day withdrawal.

Hope you have a plan B
Click to expand...

And where did you get this from....mayb stop launching mindless garbage out and actually know what you a posting about. Do you even have a clue what is going on over there?
 
I wouldn't be vacationing in Greece right now or planning one either, but that's just me. Financial collapse does not a good vacation make - but again that's just me.
 
It will be very interesting how this plays out. I am not a risk taker so I'd be out of there. I wonder how long a transition would take for an economy to not use euros and print and use new currency.
 
RUtix4me said:
And where did you get this from....mayb stop launching mindless garbage out and actually know what you a posting about. Do you even have a clue what is going on over there?
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ABC 6:30 pm national news. Interviewed a tourist that confirm she was limited. Said she was cutting her trip short because you can't do much everyday on that amount.
 

See thats where we miss Brian Williams! He would have personally tried to with draw many in greece, even if he didnt go there. I can only imagine the drama he would have injected into the story!
 
RUtix4me said:
See thats where we miss Brian Williams! He would have personally tried to with draw many in greece, even if he didnt go there. I can only imagine the drama he would have injected into the story!
Click to expand...


Maybe White Bus is Brian Williams!
 
gRUntWork said:
So I'm halfway through a 2 week trip in Greece, and the first few days seemed like nobody was concerned by the crisis. I think that might be changing now. I just got a call from the manager of the villa I'm staying in, and he asked if we could close the account early. We had put 50% down and were to pay the remaining amount at checkout on July 1st, but they wanted to close out early in case a default screwed up VISA transactions.

Also, one bank ran out of money over the weekend and another limited withdrawals to 300€. (However, the bank that ran out, Alpha Bank, had money today and allowed a 400€ withdrawal.) I might take out some more money tomorrow just in case (I can always pay down the next hotel bill with cash if I end up with too many Euros, but I suppose I don't want to be left in a situation with too little cash...

But I'm having a blast here and not letting the crisis talk detract from a great vaycay!
Click to expand...
And after the riots he was never heard from again...
 
It's not politics, it's math.

The ECB doesn't want the banking system to be insolvent, and the Greeks don't want to keave the Euro and don't want austerity. Everyone wants to just continue on like nothing ever happened but at some point, the bill must be paid. Germany and others want Greece to pay their debts in full, while Greece can't even pay the interest on those debts.
 
rurichdog said:
It's not politics, it's math.

The ECB doesn't want the banking system to be insolvent, and the Greeks don't want to keave the Euro and don't want austerity. Everyone wants to just continue on like nothing ever happened but at some point, the bill must be paid. Germany and others want Greece to pay their debts in full, while Greece can't even pay the interest on those debts.
Click to expand...

There's just something friggin hilarious about the Germans bitching about other nations paying their bills in full.
They can never repay the bill that THEY ran up back in the 40s.
 
This is what is going to happen in the US if social programs and pensions don't under control.
 
Seriously, no one seems concerned here. I only know about the crisis from this message board, and the occasional concerned email from family and friends! Life on the islands seems pretty far removed from the politics going on in Athens...
 
Caliknight said:
This is what is going to happen in the US if social programs and pensions don't under control.
Click to expand...

We get it. You don't like social welfare programs...and apparently pensions either.
But there is absolutely no comparing the Greek economy to the U.S. economy. We probably spend more on toilet paper for the military...and of course the Afghan and Iraqi military too...than Greece does on social welfare. Remind me again how many aircraft carriers does Greece have ? How many other countries does Greece have bases in ? How big is their military budget ?
And our economy is not centered around tourism, feta cheese, and olives. No comparison.
I suggest you stick to the "handouts make them lazy" rap.
 
Kbee3 said:
We get it. You don't like social welfare programs...and apparently pensions either.
But there is absolutely no comparing the Greek economy to the U.S. economy. We probably spend more on toilet paper for the military...and of course the Afghan and Iraqi military too...than Greece does on social welfare. Remind me again how many aircraft carriers does Greece have ? How many other countries does Greece have bases in ? How big is their military budget ?
And our economy is not centered around tourism, feta cheese, and olives. No comparison.
I suggest you stick to the "handouts make them lazy" rap.
Click to expand...

US economy is clearly much larger and much more diversified than Greece, but the Greeks want all the benefits of being a wealthy nation without actually producing much of anything. When a hair stylist can retire at 50 with a full pension (at 50 because the job is classified as hazardous), that is a problem. There has to be some connection to the amount produced/earned and the benefits taken out of the system. The reality for Greece is that they have more debt than their economy can handle, no reasonable way of paying it off, they don't want to cut benefits/social programs, and they are stuck with a currency that has a much higher value than is good for their economy. If they stay in the Euro, they are destined for pain, if they leave the Euro they are also destined for pain, but a devalued drachma would at least allow their country to be 'inexpensive' enough for outsiders to come back in, buy their goods (if they make anything), attract tourists, and allow them to get on their feet again.
 
rurichdog said:
Educate me, and show your work.
Click to expand...

http://www.vox.com/2015/6/30/8868363/greece-crisis-default-austerity
You can start here. You are basing your statements on Greece not wanting to pay anything back on repeated talking points that are convenient from the pro-Germany talking heads.

For example - Taxes vs. Pensions. The banks want pensions cut even further. Greece would rather tax the super-rich at higher amounts (not a shocking stance considering Syriza is a leftwing party). However, since tax collection rates in Greece are not optimal, they wanted to use some of last year's surplus to boost tax collection. The banks would not budge off their stance and would only push the pension cuts.

So, basically, the banks/Germany want to hang Greece on their lax ways but not allow them to try to fix their system. The German way is pain - and only pain - to set Greece up as an example for Portugal, Spain and Italy.
 
they're rioting there, molotov cocktails and tear gas in Syntagma Square.
 
What did you expect? The government said "We'll hold a referendum, and do what the people demand". 61% of the people said "No". The government promptly rolled over and said "We'll go forward with it anyway". They should be rioting.
 
another incorrect post by rurichdog ... you are not actually following this, are you?
 
The answer is much more complex than that. The referendum meant different things to different people. Even though the vote was 60/40 'no' - the exit polls overwhelmingly came out in support of staying in the EU.

The protests are not against the capitulation of the Tsipras/SYRIZA government ... though I am sure some of the protestors fall into this category. Rather, the protests are more out of anger at Germany (primarily) who have forced this secondary round of austerity on the country... a program which has never worked I might add.

btw - about 2 weeks ago you asked me to "show my work" ... I did that time and you never replied.
 
knight_ru said:
btw - about 2 weeks ago you asked me to "show my work" ... I did that time and you never replied.
Click to expand...

You could have just shown Paul Krugman's work. While it is certainly a bit of hyperbole to equate austerity without debt relief to blood letting his point is spot on. What Germany is proposing is punishment not a viable solution. It simply does nothing other than punish Greece and scare the piss out of anyone else who may default.


http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/06/opinion/paul-krugman-ending-greeces-bleeding.html


http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/07/15/an-unsustainable-position/
 
It is obvious that part of the reason why Merkel kept such a hard stance was to issue a warning to Spain. Their elections are coming up in a few months and a similar left-wing party is rising in the polls. Unemployment in Spain is about 23% currently (not as bad as in Greece, but not good either). If Merkel caved here, she knew Spain and Portugal would be next looking for help.

I am hoping that the growing voice of the IMF (new report released today which basically says the plan for Greece is unworkable unless there is a debt haircut) will sway some of the other EU countries (Slovakia, Finland, etc).
 
knight_ru said:
It is obvious that part of the reason why Merkel kept such a hard stance was to issue a warning to Spain. Their elections are coming up in a few months and a similar left-wing party is rising in the polls. Unemployment in Spain is about 23% currently (not as bad as in Greece, but not good either). If Merkel caved here, she knew Spain and Portugal would be next looking for help.

I am hoping that the growing voice of the IMF (new report released today which basically says the plan for Greece is unworkable unless there is a debt haircut) will sway some of the other EU countries (Slovakia, Finland, etc).
Click to expand...

Tough situation. The Greeks agreed to abide by a set of rules that they clearly violated (purposely hide their fiscal deficits). They benefited by being able to borrow at a lower cost and they took full advantage to improve their social welfare system. The Germans benefited by the reduced cost of their exports to Greece. If the Greeks are allowed debt forgiveness, and are allowed to stay in the EU, others will be tempted to follow this path. If they default and leave the euro, the debt situation will be resolved but they will face much higher future borrowing costs and their citizens will take a large pay cut as the new currency will be worth much less than the euro. The status quo is unsustainable. Those pensions will either have to be reduced or Mr. Market will reduce them in euro terms post default.
 
I'm still alive. I've been back for a week. My flight back home was right after the Greek NO vote was made. I suspect things could become heated on the mainland, but I can't imagine any rioting on the islands. The tourism industry is too important, and almost everybody's job on the islands depend on the tourists.
 
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