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Can Ash game coach?

R

RU_bhustlin

Redshirt
Jan 6, 2014
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Hi guys, I'm a long-time season ticket holder and infrequent poster.

Fourth down decisions to punt from the UW 44 and the EMU 37 on fourth down set off alarm bells in my mind. As football analytics prove out convincingly, it is a no-brainer to go for it in both of those situations. See, e.g. http://www.advancedfootballanalytics.com/index.php/home/research/game-strategy/120-4th-down-study). I'm very concerned that Ash does not have the chops to make important game decisions. Please convince me otherwise.
 
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I'm with you two guys. Ash is doing a great job on everything, but game day is a huge question mark right now. Will we see any faked punts or FGs or any trick plays this year to spark something on the field? Nothing ventured, nothing gained. And this is from one of the biggest sunshine pumper fans on this board. Watching EMU was like watching paint dry.
 
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yes he can coach. Too many well respected guys at major programs have hired him. The idea he can't coach is silly. You can show all the analytics you want....most coaches still punt on 4th down. I personally don't like the decision but it's not uncommon and I think you need to take each individual situation into account. For example, against Washington we were playing not to get blown out. Ash wanted to play the filed position game and thinks of his punter as a weapon. EMU I think he felt we would eventually wake up or the D would hold and we'd have great field position. I'm not saying I agree just my gut.
 
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Not looking to flame here but a solid Head Coach with good instinctive skills might have won the Washington game or at the very least kept the final score to a one TD difference. That identical coach would have won the EMU game. Not sure how D.C skills translate to HC skills but if coach Ash's performance to date is any indication he won't be here after 2018.
 
RU31trap said:
Not looking to flame here but a solid Head Coach with good instinctive skills might have won the Washington game or at the very least kept the final score to a one TD difference. That identical coach would have won the EMU game. Not sure how D.C skills translate to HC skills but if coach Ash's performance to date is any indication he won't be here after 2018.
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How many games has CA been a HC?

He will learn and improve, he has a great football mind and is passionate/tireless worker.
 
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RU31trap said:
Not looking to flame here but a solid Head Coach with good instinctive skills might have won the Washington game or at the very least kept the final score to a one TD difference. That identical coach would have won the EMU game. Not sure how D.C skills translate to HC skills but if coach Ash's performance to date is any indication he won't be here after 2018.
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Can you expand on head coach instincts?
 
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vkj91 said:
yes he can coach. Too many well respected guys at major programs have hired him. The idea he can't coach is silly. You can show all the analytics you want....most coaches still punt on 4th down. I personally don't like the decision but it's not uncommon and I think you need to take each individual situation into account. For example, against Washington we were playing not to get blown out. Ash wanted to play the filed position game and thinks of his punter as a weapon. EMU I think he felt we would eventually wake up or the D would hold and we'd have great field position. I'm not saying I agree just my gut.
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I still think he is driven more by fear of making mistakes than the potential upside of making plays (i.e. winning through mistake avoidance as opposed to winning through making plays). I don't know that any of us want him to be reckless, but you have to take some calculated risks now and then and 'bet' on your players to make plays. I'd prefer to lose trying to win than to lose not trying to lose.
 
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RU_bhustlin said:
Hi guys, I'm a long-time season ticket holder and infrequent poster.

Fourth down decisions to punt from the UW 44 and the EMU 37 on fourth down set off alarm bells in my mind. As football analytics prove out convincingly, it is a no-brainer to go for it in both of those situations. See, e.g. http://www.advancedfootballanalytics.com/index.php/home/research/game-strategy/120-4th-down-study). I'm very concerned that Ash does not have the chops to make important game decisions. Please convince me otherwise.
Click to expand...
I don't think going for it on 4th down is a no brainer.
 
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vkj91 said:
yes he can coach. Too many well respected guys at major programs have hired him. The idea he can't coach is silly. You can show all the analytics you want....most coaches still punt on 4th down. I personally don't like the decision but it's not uncommon and I think you need to take each individual situation into account. For example, against Washington we were playing not to get blown out. Ash wanted to play the filed position game and thinks of his punter as a weapon. EMU I think he felt we would eventually wake up or the D would hold and we'd have great field position. I'm not saying I agree just my gut.
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In light of EMU I'm not sure this narrative still stands. He's just playing super conservative. Which is maybe a comforting thought in that he was not conceding a win vs Washington in favor of a respectable loss, which would be pretty lame.

I do think last year and Mehringer's "get your offense off the field as quickly as possible" philosophy has left him gun shy. The pendulum has swung too far to the other side.

I do like a conservative ball control offense, but he needs to learn when to let lose a little.

I think he will, I mean, it's pretty obvious he needs to.
 
jmc11201 said:
vkj91 said:
yes he can coach. Too many well respected guys at major programs have hired him. The idea he can't coach is silly. You can show all the analytics you want....most coaches still punt on 4th down. I personally don't like the decision but it's not uncommon and I think you need to take each individual situation into account. For example, against Washington we were playing not to get blown out. Ash wanted to play the filed position game and thinks of his punter as a weapon. EMU I think he felt we would eventually wake up or the D would hold and we'd have great field position. I'm not saying I agree just my gut.
Click to expand...
I still think he is driven more by fear of making mistakes than the potential upside of making plays (i.e. winning through mistake avoidance as opposed to winning through making plays). I don't know that any of us want him to be reckless, but you have to take some calculated risks now and then and 'bet' on your players to make plays. I'd prefer to lose trying to win than to lose not trying to lose.
Click to expand...

Our talent level is still abysmal. Better than last year, slightly, but still bad.

You HAVE to play this way against teams when you're as bad as we are.

You want us to take risks, be prepared to lose that Washington game by 40 points.
 
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While some may always think it's soley the head coach's decision often it's one supplemented by staff input as well as the overall game plan. Of course any final decision falls on the head coach.
 
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End of game/quater management is not that of an experienced HC. The punting on 4th from EUM's 37 is a real head scratcher.

There is a big difference making those calls in real time on the sidelines then there is sitting in a booth organizing a defense.

Ash looks like a rookie on game day. Because he is. Question is, can he learn.

Like always, we will see.
 
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vkj91 said:
yes he can coach. Too many well respected guys at major programs have hired him. The idea he can't coach is silly. You can show all the analytics you want....most coaches still punt on 4th down. I personally don't like the decision but it's not uncommon and I think you need to take each individual situation into account. For example, against Washington we were playing not to get blown out. Ash wanted to play the filed position game and thinks of his punter as a weapon. EMU I think he felt we would eventually wake up or the D would hold and we'd have great field position. I'm not saying I agree just my gut.
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Terry Shea

I could go on with respected people who think highly of people within their profession to only be proven wrong
 
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On the TV broadcast he looked like a deer in the headlights at times. Agree that early timeouts and late game clock management hint at a staff that has not worked together for long. Hopefully we can someday achieve continuity.
 
MYHATINTHERING said:
Terry Shea

I could go on with respected people who think highly of people within their profession to only be proven wrong
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Terry Shea was a bad HC not a bad coach. Before my time but as I understand he sucked Sun-Friday. This isn't a concern with Ash. After leaving RU Shea spent 8 more years in the NFL. Only on this forum would people say he is a bad coach.
 
Using the word chops to describe acumen is super annoying! i wouldn't judge someone by a couple of mistakes (assuming it's fair to call those mistakes) but I wish he had gone for it in both games.
 
vkj91 said:
Terry Shea was a bad HC not a bad coach. Before my time but as I understand he sucked Sun-Friday. This isn't a concern with Ash. After leaving RU Shea spent 8 more years in the NFL. Only on this forum would people say he is a bad coach.
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Cmon, u are smarter than that
 
Proud NJ Sports Fan said:
How many games has CA been a HC?

He will learn and improve, he has a great football mind and is passionate/tireless worker.
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All good but the bottom line is wins, how long do you wait? the team has regressed since last year, we lost comitted recruits that are doing great at other programs, he has to show some improvement after the morgan st game to prove the the washington game wasn't a fluke
 
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If you think he's been a good gameday coach, you're delusional. If you think he can't be a great gameday coach, you're equally delusional. Yes he's been bad on the field, but he's young. Give him time
 
You can watch and have notebooks filled with things you would do in every situation, but until you are on that sideline expected to do them, it isn't the same.

It's said that between the first week and the second week is when a team makes a big jump. Saw it with my other team, USC. They looked horrible first week, NC the next.

We looked pretty good first week with things to clean up...second week, horrible making similar if not more of the same mistakes. That's a red flag in my book.
 
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I was intrigued by Ash's defensive background.
You'd think he'd instruct his OC to run an offense that's very unpredictable and uses the entire field...because it's hard to defend.

As a D coordinator, wouldn't you love to play a team that doesn't go for it in your own territory, runs primarily between the tackles, uses very few screens, doesn't get their backs involved in the passing game and runs very few crossing patterns?
 
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He certainly seems to be risk-adverse on game day. Avoid taking risks that may lead to immediate set-backs and play it safe. Sometimes I think he has less confidence in his staff/team than he should....

I'm more concerned with the poor time management / timeout usage over the last 14 games... Game day control needs to improve....
 
Scarlet_Monster said:
His time management is still atrocious.
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Caliknight said:
End of game/quater management is not that of an experienced HC. The punting on 4th from EUM's 37 is a real head scratcher.

There is a big difference making those calls in real time on the sidelines then there is sitting in a booth organizing a defense.

Ash looks like a rookie on game day. Because he is. Question is, can he learn.

Like always, we will see.
Click to expand...

We couldn't kick a field goal from there, and he didn't want to turn it over on downs from there. If the offense was generating any type of consistency and drives, he probably would have went for it. Game was still winnable and he didn't want to give them a better chance to score
 
zappaa said:
I was intrigued by Ash's defensive background.
You'd think he'd instruct his OC to run an offense that's very unpredictable and uses the entire field...because it's hard to defend.

As a D coordinator, wouldn't you love to play a team that doesn't go for it in your own territory, runs primarily between the tackles, uses very few screens, doesn't get their backs involved in the passing game and runs very few crossing patterns?
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BINGO! We have a winner!
 
Ash can't game coach, it is not even debatable. EMU started right in with the hurry up because they knew the team would be unprepared and this would cause confusion. The question should be can he learn to game coach.
 
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