Get used to it ...the Schiano defense and identity is gone

[Scarlet Shack]

That is the bottom line

Flood has made progress on offense in this program. However the defense has no identity.

Better, worse or indifferent, Schiano had a way we want to play of defense and we were going to play that way. Yes he drove me nuts sometime in his philosophy and looking at that down and distance card too much and not feeling the game, but the defense had a clear identity and people had to gameplan to adjust to beat us.

We said we are going to do this...find a way to beat us

Instead now...we say run you offense and we will adjust to you

We are starting to establish an offensive identity and improving results are following.
Not there yet ...but progressing

The defense is major problem. The progress in the front 7 is not materializing as we hoped

And we scheme little to make teams adjust to us

The Schiano era of pressure the Qb with blitzes and jamming the line with 8 is over.

It's different now...and I don't see us progressing until we change what we are going to do

 

[RUTBAY]

The defenses identity is coaching the Arkansas. Whatever Robb Smith was asking for we should have paid. Period.

 

[rufeelinit]

So what is our identity on offense and how has it changed since Schiano left? I think both KF and GS value the same things offensive. Be able to run the ball and no turnovers. The passing game ideally is set up by the ability to run the ball. I agree the defense has lost a lot of aggressiveness but obviously Rossi is playing a more of bend but don't break style believing its his best chance with the green secondary.

 

[RU-05]

Dudes and their love of Schiano. No kidding he's gone. But do people not remember the last 3 years he was here? Flood's first 3 years were better.

I could absolutely see a scenario where Flood is not the coach next year. But please no Schiano.

 

[JoeRU0304]

Spot-on and it's not just the defense...these last 3 seasons (including yesterday) are the most penalized Rutgers teams I can remember. While all coaches have recruiting 'misses', I also can't remember such a quick/large attrition rate as well, which leads us to our 'forever young' syndrome. Our staff has its strengths but it's weaknesses are pretty much 'billboard in Times Square' apparent right now...add in the decision at QB and it doesnt take Nostradamus to foretell a lousy year that's REALLY going to get ugly against the unforgiving part of our schedule.


Joe P.

 

[RUBand]

Is my observation correct in that when we blitzed yesterday we put pressure on their qb?

 

[rutgersal]

The cover 2 we saw yesterday was not dissimilar to the Schiano defense we employed against ASU in 2005. Not sure Schiano would have fared better, yesterday, as a coach like Leach is the type of coach that would typically out coach Schiano. Rich Rod and Brian Kelly are others.

 

[RU-05]

Is my observation correct in that when we blitzed yesterday we put pressure on their qb?

Meh, I saw at least a few 5 man rushes that were stuffed. Can't recall the outcomes of those plays, but it was def not a sack.

 

[RUTBAY]

Is my observation correct in that when we blitzed yesterday we put pressure on their qb?

We blitzed about 5 or 6 times. Resulting in one completion.

Rossi sentenced our DBs to a death of a thousand cuts. Better to send a guy or two and if you get burned then deal with it. It would have been an unsure thing but better than the sure thing of them abusing the middle of our defense all night.

LBs covering WRs and RBs on every play was completely ineffective. With the amount of time their QB was getting it eventually they would get open. If you are going to effectively take them out of the play at least add in the chance that we get to the QB with them and instead force a bad decision. It was frustrating sitting in that stadium watching. I can't even guess what it felt like watching on TV where you could get a better look at what was going on.

 

[RUsojo]

Dudes and their love of Schiano. No kidding he's gone. But do people not remember the last 3 years he was here? Flood's first 3 years were better.

I could absolutely see a scenario where Flood is not the coach next year. But please no Schiano.

Floods talent level on the 2Deep blows Schianos talent those years out of the water...thanks to Schiano. Unfortunately, Flood will leave his successor with the gifts Greg left him. This is the problem for the program.

 

[thad23]

The defenses identity is coaching the Arkansas. Whatever Robb Smith was asking for we should have paid. Period.

You mean the D that lost to Toledo!?!?!

And I agree that GS had trouble with these types of offenses too.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

The cover 2 we saw yesterday was not dissimilar to the Schiano defense we employed against ASU in 2005. Not sure Schiano would have fared better, yesterday, as a coach like Leach is the type of coach that would typically out coach Schiano. Rich Rod and Brian Kelly are others.

Rutgers Al

It was anything but

Schiano lost to Rrod...but it was not for sitting badk and waiting to be carved out

We played a lot of man one against WVU. Made them beat us

 

[ILOVERUTGERS]

Agree with Op. I actually thought Gregs scheme would have rubbed off by last year but it's officially gone now.

 

[Knight Shift]

Meh, I saw at least a few 5 man rushes that were stuffed. Can't recall the outcomes of those plays, but it was def not a sack.

Also, is the observation that WSU's OL looked huge in comparison to our DL? I can count on one hand the number of times Falk was pressured.

 

[RUTBAY]

You mean the D that lost to Toledo!?!?!

And I agree that GS had trouble with these types of offenses too.

Look at the score. I would assert that the offense lost to Toledo. You are not seriously going to argue with me that Smith is not a better DC than Rossi are you?

 

[Knight Shift]

The defenses identity is coaching the Arkansas. Whatever Robb Smith was asking for we should have paid. Period.

Losing to Toledo yesterday does not look good on the resume. Although if one game means anything, maybe Toledo's defensive coordinator is a genius for holding the Razorbacks to 12 points?

 

[rutgersdave]

Dudes and their love of Schiano. No kidding he's gone. But do people not remember the last 3 years he was here? Flood's first 3 years were better.

I could absolutely see a scenario where Flood is not the coach next year. But please no Schiano.

Flood first year was terrible with the exception of Schiano defense with Robb Smith. The defense was ranked 3rd in the nation and in 2011, Schiano defense was 12th in the nation. 2013, we were 93th in the nation and we fired the DC. In 2014, our defense was actually worse than 2013 in points allowed and yardage but NOva was great so we won more because of Nova and ignored the fact that the defense sucks.

In Flood first year, he ran on every play even when we needed 20-25 yards. I don't want Schiano back but he was our greatest coach and Flood is not even close.

 

[RU-05]

Also, is the observation that WSU's OL looked huge in comparison to our DL? I can count on one hand the number of times Falk was pressured.

I didn't really see them as being huge, maybe they were, but it didn't stand out. But they did their job tough, no question about it. I thought our pass rush would be a big factor, it was a non factor.

 

[saran]

I don't mean to really really defend the defense but people were saying all the same things last year after WSU game. There was no aggression, sacks, blitzes etc. Then Rossi was calling more agressive defense after that and people were praising him again. RU just isn't very good vs the quick-release hike-n-strike. Yesterday looked like one of those Baylor vs TCU Big 12 free-for-alls.

 

[withoutregard]

agree with the OP, GS's defenses would never sit back, they attacked, and yes would get burned occasionally, but that happens when you attack, you accept it, and can't recall DB's giving 10+ yard cushions at the start of a play

 

[RUTBAY]

Please don't mistake my advocacy of Smith as an endorsement for bringing back Schiano.

For the life of me though I don't see how Rossi thought that with two timeouts and over 2 minutes left that we were going to stop them when effectively they had four downs to get ten yards at the end playing the defense we did.

Better to take a risk or two and hope for a mistake. At worst they score quickly and give our offense a chance at one more drive. As it was we ended up with 13 second and a Keystone Cops episode on the ensuing kickoff.

 

[rutgersdave]

I think our offense can be salvaged and might be considered good but our defense is terrible with less hope.

 

[KingHigh]

Our secondary watched the game from Middlesex County Correctional Institution. And we played one of the best teams in the nation at protecting the qb, one which can throw on a lot of teams. We still should have won by double digits. The GameDay coaching is doing fine.

Nothing like a tough loss to inspire the assholes to come out en masse.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

Excuse me king high ?

 

[198hamilton]

You mean the D that lost to Toledo!?!?!

I think he meant the D that only gave up 14 to Alabama, 17 to Miss. St., 0 to LSU, 0 to Ole Miss and 7 to Texas. That D. Rossi couldn't carry Smith's jockstrap.

 

[Armor and Sword]

Losing to Toledo yesterday does not look good on the resume. Although if one game means anything, maybe Toledo's defensive coordinator is a genius for holding the Razorbacks to 12 points?

Looks like the Hogs offense lost this game.

http://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2015/sep/13/hogs-red-faced-in-red-zone-20150913/

 

[mikefla]

For everyones nostalgic woe-is-me's we still had plenty of opportunities to win this game.

-w/o for Mullers holding call we would have had 7 more points and be celebrating.
-Had Hicks not held we would also be celebrating
-If a db held ON to a near INT we wold also be celebrating
-Had the D been able to play D for the last 1 minute and 39 seconds we would now be celebrating

We lost in a variety of ways......

 

[rutgersdave]

The GameDay coaching is doing fine.

Lol

 

[RUTBAY]

Our secondary watched the game from Middlesex County Correctional Institution. And we played one of the best teams in the nation at protecting the qb, one which can throw on a lot of teams. We still should have won by double digits. The GameDay coaching is doing fine.

Nothing like a tough loss to inspire the assholes to come out en masse.

Then I guess I'm just an asshole. But I'm not crazy per the definition of doing the same thing over and over but expecting different results.

This is exactly what describes Rossi on the last drive. Look, I understand the issues with a young defensive backfield and playing what looked like some bastardized version of a Cover-2 but on the last drive he hung them out to dry.

 

[Panthergrowl13]

Look at the score. I would assert that the offense lost to Toledo. You are not seriously going to argue with me that Smith is not a better DC than Rossi are you?

True enough.

Remember Arkansas OC Jim Chaney left last year and is now the OC at Pitt.

Arkansas was very successful with Chaney as OC. However, in discussing his leaving with Southern, he was of the opinion that it was no big deal.

Still early in the season but we will see what the loss of the OC has on Arkansas performance.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[Zombo NJ]

For everyones nostalgic woe-is-me's we still had plenty of opportunities to win this game.

-w/o for Mullers holding call we would have had 7 more points and be celebrating.
-Had Hicks not held we would also be celebrating
-If a db held ON to a near INT we wold also be celebrating
-Had the D been able to play D for the last 1 minute and 39 seconds we would now be celebrating

We lost in a variety of ways......

I don't follow....
1- an exhale was coming not a celebration...except for Grant's tremendous game
2- how does an accurate reference to a distinct change in D philosophy not apply when it had a lot to do with outcome..that passive scheme was embarassing
3- pointing out some of the other myriad of mistakes....and damn there were a lot...only adds to the ongoing question of this teams current state...a state where discipline is sorely lacking on both sides of ball

so yeah it was a team loss debacle against a weak opponent...but I still agree with many points stated in this thread and the real woe is me comes from minimal confidence it will get better...gonna be a long year

 

[ag67]

Schiano always had problems with spread offenses. His defenses were great otherwise.

 

[KingHigh]

Schiano always had problems with spread offenses. His defenses were great otherwise.

I still have nightmares about cincy 07

 

[Knightmoves]

For everyones nostalgic woe-is-me's we still had plenty of opportunities to win this game.

-w/o for Mullers holding call we would have had 7 more points and be celebrating.
-Had Hicks not held we would also be celebrating
-If a db held ON to a near INT we wold also be celebrating
-Had the D been able to play D for the last 1 minute and 39 seconds we would now be celebrating

We lost in a variety of ways......

The dropped INT by the RU DB along the sidelines on the last series was big IMO. The game is over if he makes that play. And I believe he does make it 90% of the time. When I saw that drop I felt like we'd come up short in the end. You can only give the other team so many opportunities.

Players have to make key plays in order to win. Unfortunately we gave that game away a number of times. Hope that one of our upcoming opponents does the same for us this season. But I won't count on it.

 

[beaced]

Meh, I saw at least a few 5 man rushes that were stuffed. Can't recall the outcomes of those plays, but it was def not a sack.

,Sending 5 is not really blitzing. Going FULL HOUSE all out is what works.Not on every down but for sure on third and long and at unexpected times. Throws their timing and play calling way out of whack.

 

[Knight Shift]

Can one of the X's and O's gurus answer why a blitz from the edge would or would not have worked, if nothing else to rattle WSU's QB?

 

[DHajekRC84]

Can one of the X's and O's gurus answer why a blitz from the edge would or would not have worked, if nothing else to rattle WSU's QB?

it may not have resulted in a sack....but sure would have forced their QB to throw the ball about 2-3 seconds less then he was doing ALL DAY. The FEW times he had to move or release fast he wasn't very successful. NO TEAM can play a zone and let a QB have 4-5 seconds to throw. NEVER going to stop anyone with that plan. Just a terrible weak game plan on the D side.

 

[rurichdog]

Our tackling was poor, so sending a corner blitz was out of the question. That means a LB or S, but they were covering inside zones where we were getting killed all day.

 

[RUfromSoCal?]

we knew the DBs were going to be a weakness this year. They actually did a fairly good job of bending, not breaking through 3.5 quarters - forcing FGs or Punts and not TDs...

But, no pressure from the 4 man rush was the killer....

 

[Scarlet Shack]

I said on the round table the key to the game was how the lbs played in space

The coners adtually played solid. And that is whee we were decimated by attrition

The lbs and safeties needed to show yesterday and still really struggled in space. Against a team that does run
And the linebackers had no concern about the run yesterday.

Flood is an offensive coach in background and to his credit he had the offense moving in the right direction. The offense in the last three years with Schiano after teel graduated was a mess and flood has fixed the offensive line and we have some nice skilled players

But as much as the offense has progressed...the defense has regressed

We can win mid level with flood like we did Greg with being really solid on one side of the ball

If you want to win big ....need to be good on both sides of the ball.