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McMurphy: Golden & Ash are ....

I would take Golden over Ash for three reasons:

1. He is known throughout the Northeast
2. He will recruit well (something this team badly badly badly needs)
3. He has been a HC for...what almost 10 years?
 
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Veiox said:
So that is good thing, huh? We deserve another 30 years of garbage athletics with the dopes in this fan base. Al Golden was Miami's version of Kyle Flood and he is going to take us to the promised land? Playing in the BIG East? What a joke.
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Dude, you were a loyal Flood supporter until 4-6 weeks ago. Nothing could be said about Flood without you defending it but you are going to bash Al Golden? I don't get it.
 
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S.B. Crumb said:
Some of you guys really fall for the snake oil salesman bit. You hear "recruits well" and pop a woody and don't think about anything else. Golden will not recruit here any better than GS and then we'll have decent players with an even shittier coach.
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Thank you! A voice of a reason in the wilderness. What a bunch of fools...Al Golden...I can't stop laughing hysterically.
 
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RUskoolie said:
Dude, you were a loyal Flood supporter until 4-6 weeks ago. Nothing could be said about Flood without you defending it but you are going to bash Al Golden? I don't get it.
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Prove it, the history is saved. Go through my posts and show your work. I thought Flood should be fired since early Sept.

In fact, I had discussions here in late August after the arrests with JoeRU0304 that Flood needed to go. That culminated for me at the WSU game. Since that day I have said he needed to be done here.
 
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Veiox said:
Here is what a Cane fan has to say about Golden:

I'll give you some reasons from a canes pov:
_____________________________________
- very average gameplanner.
- intractable philosophy on defense - square peg round hole
- micromanaged his staff
- didn't understand how to recruit sofla talent
- beefed up his players unnecessarily to fit an antiquated plodding scheme that was slow to react
- teams consistently had mental mistakes
- evolved into a spin master/car salesman kind of guy
- always said "starts with me" but proceeded to throw players under the bus

I'll give him his due - he stuck it out through some tough times and is a tireless worker but I question where his work efforts were aimed at (his ridiculous infamous 300 page binder that's filled with newspaper clippings, quotes, rules on how to be gentlemen, etc).

________________________________________
Sounds like a lousier version of Greg Schiano
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I hope our coaching hire doesn't rest on the thoughts of some random Miami fans post on a message board.
 
I'm not happy but if this what we have to live with Golden better say..

"I was young and stupid, jealous of the success Rutgers was having as it transitioned to a formidable D1 program, and now I'm happy to be apart of it"...when the first question he gets asked is in reference to speaking poorly about Rutgers in his past.

But hey, lets not give up yet. @waveslider said we are talking to Chip Kelly amongst other candidates who have done bigger things than Greg Schiano...
 
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KJ_RU said:
I hope our coaching hire doesn't rest on the thoughts of some random Miami fans post on a message board.
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Who suggested that? Just pointing out the thoughts of an avid fan and his opinion.

As for myself, an avid CFB fan and who watches as many games as possible, I think Al Golden is not much of an upgrade on Flood. He is a mediocre coach. It sure is not going to fill our stadiums with new fans excited to see this exciting product.
 
Sorry guys, but without being too technical, the same things you guys were going through on game days with RU under coach Flood, is the same thing I was going through on game days watching Al Golden led Canes. Seriously as a fan, it was very very hard to watch the teams play like that. Even the average fan could see the results of poor coaching, poor game day planning, and poor half time adjustments. Does that mean 100% that he won't succeed in the B1G, absolutely not. But all signs point to it. I sincerely hope that RU doesn't hire him. And I have a gut feeling that the banner plane will be over your first game just out of spite.
 
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derleider said:
I dont know that they are VERY good hires - but they are the kind of hire that a mid-level P5 program makes. MD has already done it. Illinois and Minnesota didnt even get that far - they promoted assistants from within (i.e. they took coordinators from middling to bad teams instead of top teams). Missouri is looking at MWC HCs - but the MWC is very down right now - Boise is the highest ranked in Sagarin at 50 - it would be like us looking at Willy Taggert and Bob Diaco. Virginia is still aiming higher - but lets see how that ends up. Iowa State and Syracuse have or likely will end up with MAC flavor of the year types. Is South Carolina going to do better than an assistant from a high end P5 school? Doesnt look like it.

Reality is that there just arent that many high end coaches that are willing to move to mid-level schools even if there is money. Maybe we get lucky and Dan Mullen just is dying to get back into this area and we throw a ton of money at him - but short of that who is there that would turn heads - Rhule and Herman seem fine waiting another year. Richt looks like hes going to stay in the South if he coaches at all next year. Are there other top 25ish P5 coaches who would take alot of money to come to RU? I cant think of any obvious choices who would want to rebuild a program in an impossible division rather than continue with whatever success got them RUs attention in the first place.

Basically - unless you get really lucky - as a mid-level program its a crap shoot even if you have money to throw around because as Ive said a million times - if you have the money to lure a high end coach, so does someone else who is better than mid-level.
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I think the trick is you have to overpay. If you are paying market rate, I think you are right. But if you make them an offer they can't refuse, they will be here. That's how every other business works, I refuse to believe it stops working in college football. Based on yesterday's information, which so many people seemed to corroborate, I was hopeful we were, in fact, willing to pay what it would take to make a splash and change the national perception of Rutgers.

The rumors of today seem to be moving in a decidedly different direction. Yesterday was either total BS, or they thought they could get the big names in the door with market rate, or even low ball offers, which would be a very Rutgers thing to do. None of the names surfacing today is "bigger than GS, someone who has actually done something." Instead these are the types of people everyone expects Rutgers to hire. Mid to low level retreads or up and comers tied to Schiano or Paterno. Same ole same ole.

Seriously, f*ck me. Al Golden. WTF. I'd rather have Flood coming back, because at least then I would be hopeful of change next year.
 
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"If Golden gets hired here don't worry, his D-coordinator from Miami is not coming with him."

"If the last sentence is true then I am not as upset"

Maybe he'll just keep Flood's guy? :scream:
 
Ole Cabbagehead said:
I think the trick is you have to overpay. If you are paying market rate, I think you are right. But if you make them an offer they can't refuse, they will be here. That's how every other business works, I refuse to believe it stops working in college football. Based on yesterday's information, which so many people seemed to corroborate, I was hopeful we were, in fact, willing to pay what it would take to make a splash and change the national perception of Rutgers.

The rumors of today seem to be moving in a decidedly different direction. Yesterday was either total BS, or they thought they could get the big names in the door with market rate, or even low ball offers, which would be a very Rutgers thing to do. None of the names surfacing today is "bigger than GS, someone who has actually done something." Instead these are the types of people everyone expects Rutgers to hire. Mid to low level retreads or up and comers tied to Schiano or Paterno. Same ole same ole.
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I'm perfectly fine with up and comers but I'm desperately wanting to get away from that whole Paterno line of coaches both direct and indirect offshoots. Golden/Schiano/Fleck/Cristobal.. let's try something new.
 
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what was Miami's final record this year -8-4? he did get some talented players.
 
ru66 said:
what was Miami's final record this year -8-4? he did get some talented players.
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They were 4-3 and 1-2 in conference when he got fired. They went 4-1 after he left. Everyone gets talented players to Miami. Miami's problem isn't getting talented players, it's coaching them up.

Forget about winning the ACC, he didn't make the champ game of the ACC and that's with all the advantages Miami has in attracting talent. FSU/Clemson the lastest top teams in the ACC are on the other side too. If UNC/GT can make the champ game from his half he should have as well.

I don't want him but I can come around depending on the coordinators. That's a problem too though because his track record of choosing coordinators isn't the best.
 
I'll throw this out there for what its worth. I heard from a Cane fan that Golden never "got" south FL. He never connected with the type of players he was recruiting or coaching and that he wasn't the right type of coach needed at "da U". If you were to allow yourself to believe any of that, it could be that Golden is more of a northeast type of coach and might actually do better at RU than he did in an environment that didn't fit his coaching style. Not defending him, just something I heard and thought it made some sense...
 
Well, if we tried to spend a lot more money and hail in bigger fish, and we couldn't, then retread like MC and AL and GS would be the next tier choices. It's pretty simple. We cannot risk the B1G entry with an unknown at this point IMO.

Ash and Warriner may be good picks with lots of upside but even if this is a bigger role for them, they can still say no.

So ultimately it's not so much about what we can afford, but that plus who actually wants the job. Do you think AG at UVA is good for RU?

The administration is trying to get the best candidates and lets see them through. We need to accept that many or most may not want to come here...

KF was a complete disaster on every level and I agree with a previous poster that he was basically a bag of rocks. Completely clueless on every level and i am sure he is is a nice guy, etc. He has done immense damage to the program and 2015 was worse than 2013...when most agree he should have been fired if we could.

Bottom line for me is that AG is getting interviews for P5 schools at least..ummmm....who is going to interview KF for a head coaching job folks? No one. So let's not put AG or anyone down yet.

We could all be pleasantly surprised at the results, let's wait and see.
 
tleeten said:
I'll throw this out there for what its worth. I heard from a Cane fan that Golden never "got" south FL. He never connected with the type of players he was recruiting or coaching and that he wasn't the right type of coach needed at "da U". If you were to allow yourself to believe any of that, it could be that Golden is more of a northeast type of coach and might actually do better at RU than he did in an environment that didn't fit his coaching style. Not defending him, just something I heard and thought it made some sense...
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This is what I was talking about yesterday in terms of the right fit, understanding a culture, and how Golden was all wrong for the U. But he can coach. And I actually think in terms of fit, he's ideal for Rutgers. The package a coach brings is not translatable to every job; it works better in some than others.
 
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tleeten said:
I'll throw this out there for what its worth. I heard from a Cane fan that Golden never "got" south FL. He never connected with the type of players he was recruiting or coaching and that he wasn't the right type of coach needed at "da U". If you were to allow yourself to believe any of that, it could be that Golden is more of a northeast type of coach and might actually do better at RU than he did in an environment that didn't fit his coaching style. Not defending him, just something I heard and thought it made some sense...
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If this is the case, at what point is it on him to figure out his players and environment in an attempt to maximize their potential? These kids are all individuals and have different buttons that need to be pushed...if he comes to Rutgers and has mostly northeast kids (I assume S. Florida kids are not coming here to play for him), he shouldn't assume that they can all be treated identically as well.

My uncle was a team doctor for the Giants under Parcells and he said Parcells absolutely treated different guys differently, and I think as a coach, getting to know your players and learning how to push, prod, encourage, and treat everyone is one of the biggest challenges. Maybe he isn't good at it?
 
"Miami's version of Kyle Flood?" Worst season was 6-7. First two seasons he was dealing with the effects of sanctions and turned around and went 9-4 in his third year. Temple was 1-11 his first year and 9-4 and 8-4 his last two.

Is he my first choice? No, not at all. But damn we could do a lot worse. And there are some things that make this job better suited for him than Miami, and it should be easier to recruit here than Temple.

I will not be pissed off or dejected if it comes down to Al Golden. Not thrilled, maybe, but I'd be OK. And ready for September.
 
Veiox said:
So that is good thing, huh? We deserve another 30 years of garbage athletics with the dopes in this fan base. Al Golden was Miami's version of Kyle Flood and he is going to take us to the promised land? Playing in the BIG East? What a joke.
Click to expand...

I'm just saying everyone is exaggerating how bad he is. The whole country is not 2 cities.

He was hated in Miami. 7-5 there wouldn't cut it. 7-5 here in year 1 and he's a god.
 
jmc11201 said:
If this is the case, at what point is it on him to figure out his players and environment in an attempt to maximize their potential? These kids are all individuals and have different buttons that need to be pushed...if he comes to Rutgers and has mostly northeast kids (I assume S. Florida kids are not coming here to play for him), he shouldn't assume that they can all be treated identically as well.

My uncle was a team doctor for the Giants under Parcells and he said Parcells absolutely treated different guys differently, and I think as a coach, getting to know your players and learning how to push, prod, encourage, and treat everyone is one of the biggest challenges. Maybe he isn't good at it?
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I agree that coaches have to be able to figure out their players to maximize their productivity and potential. Some are better at this than others. I think Parcells was absolutely known for pushing buttons but I also think Parcells was a master at that and partly why he was so successful. For coaches that aren't as skillful in this area, they could still be successful if they can relate to the players more easily or more naturally. It does seem to make some sense that someone like Golden wouldn't fit the culture of south FL as easily as someone that grew up there and/or went to school there.

Of the coaches in play and actually attainable, I like AG because of his HC experience, his recruiting ability, and the fact that he's from NJ (RBC HS).
 
Veiox said:
So that is good thing, huh? We deserve another 30 years of garbage athletics with the dopes in this fan base. Al Golden was Miami's version of Kyle Flood and he is going to take us to the promised land? Playing in the BIG East? What a joke.
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Please not Golden!
Day late & a $ short. We should have hired Herman last year. Now he's unaffordable.
 
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jmc11201 said:
If this is the case, at what point is it on him to figure out his players and environment in an attempt to maximize their potential? These kids are all individuals and have different buttons that need to be pushed...if he comes to Rutgers and has mostly northeast kids (I assume S. Florida kids are not coming here to play for him), he shouldn't assume that they can all be treated identically as well.

My uncle was a team doctor for the Giants under Parcells and he said Parcells absolutely treated different guys differently, and I think as a coach, getting to know your players and learning how to push, prod, encourage, and treat everyone is one of the biggest challenges. Maybe he isn't good at it?
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Put another way, maybe he isn't good at it, but maybe he doesn't have to be if he coaches at a school that is more of a natural fit for him because he's in a familiar environment, he's in his element, and he's (literally) at home there.. sometimes just changing the environment of a player or coach can do wonders for their career. Sometimes, not all the time or even most of the time...
 
Chris Ash, as a DC of a SEC team, gave up 5 passing TDs to Nova at home. Let that sink in. He was then fired at the end of the season.
 
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It's a shame Golden won't be able to recruit Boys Homes if he comes here
 
RUvictory said:
Chris Ash, as a DC of a SEC team, gave up 5 passing TDs to Nova at home. Let that sink in. He was then fired at the end of the season.
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Exactly! Seems odd Ohio State being pushed down our throats.
 
Sargeant tweeting that Brown is tight with Barry Alvarez. I didn't know that. Come on Barry forget about your old DC, send us your current one. :smiley:

Keith Sargeant ‏@KSargeantNJ 2h2 hours ago
Ohio St DC Chris Ash held same job at Wisconsin previously. Greg Brown, who is helping run Rutgers search, is tight w/ Wisc AD Barry Alvarez
 
G- RUnit said:
Exactly! Seems odd Ohio State being pushed down our throats.
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UM is going push his guys for jobs just like most HCs would for their assistants. About the only thing they'll do is give advice and say this job might not be the right fit for you or good enough like Paterno did with Schiano even though Schiano took it. Outside of that any HC would do the same.
 
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