NYT: Alabama makes 95M a year on football, spotlight on NJ student attending

[NotInRHouse]

Are you listening Barchi? A fraction of that would pay off the precious subsidy and lure more OOS students with their cash.

"The athletic director and the salesman, the football coach and the sorority sister, have all taken their places for what, at least seven Saturdays here each year, becomes the center of the Alabama universe: game day. It is equal parts war on the field and worship service, and it serves as the centerpiece of Alabama Football Inc., an enterprise that generates more than $95 million annually."

"In the last decade, enrollment has increased by more than 55 percent, to a record 37,100 students this fall, and more than half of the students now are from out of state, another seismic shift. The acceptance rate in the last decade fell to 54 percent, from 72 percent. This year, 2,261 freshmen are enrolled in its Honors College, two and half times the number 10 years ago. Its 174 National Merit and National Achievement finalists rank Alabama among the top five public universities."

"Many newcomers are like Molly Brautigan, 18, who says Saban and his football team brought her south from Montclair, N.J. She wanted to spend Saturday mornings like this one — trying on and discarding outfits — for a brunch date at the Pi Kappa Alpha fraternity house. She wanted to tailgate in the afternoons in the quad, tent-hopping among the young men in blue blazers and pink button-down Oxfords while dressed to the nines with her Pi Beta Phi pledge sisters."

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/07/s...ama-crimson-tide-football-marketing.html?_r=0

 

[CuredbywinningRU]

This article says a lot, especially noting the acceptance rate - I am very familiar with the college application process and acceptance rates generally and that acceptance rate is very low relative to other state U's outside the elite ones and near elite ones and is certainly better than RU. The National Merit Scholar # is phenomenal. This article should be required reading for anyone who doubts the economic and other returns that accompany success in college football and the need for smart leadership at the helm of an Athletic Department and a University.

 

[NotInRHouse]

To be fair, I think some of those scholarships are regional- as I remember WVU loved to tout a similar statistic.

But it should be taped to Barchi's forehead. The difference a coach who could compete in this conference could make...and btw, it doesn't have to be Harbaugh or Meyer, just not Flood!

 

[ru8081]

Bingo! Please someone cite an example of a University that invested in big time athletics and lost money and their academic reputation declined. This assumes a reasonably intelligent game plan on investing.

 

[srru86]

Every member of the faculty should be required to read that before they get their next salary increase.

 

[knightfan7]

As far as Football $ goes, most if not all B1G schools had revenues over $50 million as far back as 2008 with OSU, Michigan, PSU, Wisconsin, Iowa, Nebraska, and MSU all over $70 million.

 

[LevaosLectures]

Jesus Christ, why would anyone want to spend their Saturday doing that? Thank God I don't live in Alabama.

 

[MozRU]

Football makes a school relevant? That is a lie. BHAHAHAH

The true example (look at their applications before and after this guy arrived).

 

[knightfan7]

Jesus Christ, why would anyone want to spend their Saturday doing that? Thank God I don't live in Alabama.

If you're serious, it's call Tradition. That's something that's lacking in the northeast and I believe one of the reasons why Rutgers is always fighting an uphill battle. I know we all think we're so much smarter and cooler than the rest of the country but Rutgers fans could learn a lot about supporting their teams and school from these folks.

As I said, if you're serious you're pretty closed minded for a college professor. Students having fun in a manner of their choosing? Damn, what's wrong with them?

 

[mdk01]

Isn't Rutgers rather loath with respect to increasing the % of out of state students? And it's not Barchi, iirc it's been policy for a long, long time.

 

[MozRU]

If you're serious, it's call Tradition. That's something that's lacking in the northeast and I believe one of the reasons why Rutgers is always fighting an uphill battle. I know we all think we're so much smarter and cooler than the rest of the country but Rutgers fans could learn a lot about supporting their teams and school from these folks.

As I said, if you're serious you're pretty closed minded for a college professor. Students having fun in a manner of their choosing? Damn, what's wrong with them?

All the negative comments are not serious. Only our brain dead president can't see the link between BIG TIME FOOTBALL and BIG TIME APPLICATION RATE. Unless you are some elite Div III college or an Ivy, you need football. Our president's retirement can't come soon enough.

Someone will unlock the BEAST OF THE EAST

 

[ru8081]

In defense of Barchi, maybe our elected officials (legislature & Governor) can't grasp this simple concept.

 

[ru8081]

This is a study from UC Berkeley, June 2015

For FBS schools, our results reveal that winning football games increases alumni athletic donations, enhances a school’s academic reputation, increases the number of applicants and in-state students, reduces acceptance rates, and raises average incoming SAT scores. The estimates imply that large increases in team performance can have economically significant effects, particularly in the area of athletic donations. Consider a school that improves its season wins by three games (the approximate difference between the median team and an 85th percentile team). Changes of this magnitude occur approximately 20% of the time over a one-year period and 27% of the time over a two-year period. This school may expect alumni athletic donations to increase by $409,000 (17%), applications to increase by 406 (3%), the acceptance rate to drop by 0.9 percentage points (1.3%), in-state enrollment to increase by 46 students (1.8%), and incoming 25th percentile SAT scores to increase by 2.4 points (0.2%).17 These estimates are approximately twice as large as comparable estimates from the existing literature. For example, among studies that used fixed effects with panel data, a 3-win increase in team performance was associated with a 1.5% to 1.7% increase in applications (Murphy and Trandel 1994; Pope and Pope 2009), while our estimates suggest a 3% increase.

http://are.berkeley.edu/~mlanderson/pdf/Anderson College Sports.pdf

 

[PhDKnight]

Football and in a few cases men's basketball are the marketing arm of a university. Unless you are an Ivy, MIT, CalTech Duke or similar you need big time athletics and even some of those guys have embraced the value of football. Even the Ivy League has a TV deal on NBCSN these days.

How many academically relevant state universities are there in the top 50 that are also not relevant athletically - UCSD? Maybe there are 2-3 others?

 

[RutgersROB]

Are you listening Barchi? A fraction of that would pay off the precious subsidy and lure more OOS students with their cash.

"The athletic director and the salesman, the football coach and the sorority sister, have all taken their places for what, at least seven Saturdays here each year, becomes the center of the Alabama universe: game day. It is equal parts war on the field and worship service, and it serves as the centerpiece of Alabama Football Inc., an enterprise that generates more than $95 million annually."

"In the last decade, enrollment has increased by more than 55 percent, to a record 37,100 students this fall, and more than half of the students now are from out of state, another seismic shift. The acceptance rate in the last decade fell to 54 percent, from 72 percent. This year, 2,261 freshmen are enrolled in its Honors College, two and half times the number 10 years ago. Its 174 National Merit and National Achievement finalists rank Alabama among the top five public universities."

"Many newcomers are like Molly Brautigan, 18, who says Saban and his football team brought her south from Montclair, N.J. She wanted to spend Saturday mornings like this one — trying on and discarding outfits — for a brunch date at the Pi Kappa Alpha fraternity house. She wanted to tailgate in the afternoons in the quad, tent-hopping among the young men in blue blazers and pink button-down Oxfords while dressed to the nines with her Pi Beta Phi pledge sisters."


I thought Freshman cant pledge sororities

 

[mdk01]

In defense of Barchi, maybe our elected officials (legislature & Governor) can't grasp this simple concept.

Aren't they, and I mean multiple administrations and legislatures, as opposed to Barchi, the driving force behind the comparatively low % of out of state students?

 

[CNJKnight]

We've talked about the application rates, etc. for when we started winning in 2005 and up. Does the administration see what happened to these rate pre-2005 and 2005- to know that it can only go up with a strong athletic program? Look at the money the UA athletics donated BACK to the school? Isn't that enough to do something NOW to get to a level like that???

 

[jtung230]

we are in the Northeast. No one is sending their kid to a school based on Sports teams.

 

[jason21psu]

we are in the Northeast. No one is sending their kid to a school based on Sports teams.

Well I grew up in South Jersey and applied to 2 schools, Penn State and University of Miami b/c they were the only schools on the east cost that met my criteria of my desired major and having a big time football program. 5 year later my brother followed me to PSU and he wasn't a football fan or did he have as selective of a major. So PSU having big time football pulled 2 (1 directly, 1 indirectly) NJ high school seniors out of state. We both graduated top 5% of our class too. This was in 1995/2000.

So yeah it matters even in the northeast.

 

[jtung230]

Well I grew up in South Jersey and applied to 2 schools, Penn State and University of Miami b/c they were the only schools on the east cost that met my criteria of my desired major and having a big time football program. 5 year later my brother followed me to PSU and he wasn't a football fan or did he have as selective of a major. So PSU having big time football pulled 2 (1 directly, 1 indirectly) NJ high school seniors out of state. We both graduated top 5% of our class too. This was in 1995/2000.

So yeah it matters even in the northeast.

That's funny because I told all four of my kids I would not pay for either Of those schools. Would you pick Rutgers if they had a top 25 football? It sounds like you and your brother just wanted to go away for college and your parents were willing to pay for it. Let me ask a follow up question, what schools did you turn down because they didn't have a big time football program? I'm guessing no Ivy League schools, MIT, Or Duke.

My point is academic reputation far out weights football success. I grew up in VA and no one picked Va Tech over UVA because they had a better football team.

 

[RUinPinehurst]

No offense, but what the hell else is there to do in Alabama? College football is king. And there is little else to compete with it. In Rutgers market, there are many fan options, more than anywhere else in the nation

 

[LevaosLectures]

If you're serious, it's call Tradition. That's something that's lacking in the northeast and I believe one of the reasons why Rutgers is always fighting an uphill battle. I know we all think we're so much smarter and cooler than the rest of the country but Rutgers fans could learn a lot about supporting their teams and school from these folks.

As I said, if you're serious you're pretty closed minded for a college professor. Students having fun in a manner of their choosing? Damn, what's wrong with them?

I'm not speaking as a college professor, but an ex student. The southern tradition garbage just makes me laugh my ass off. The plantations are all shut down, Rhett and Scarlet. Lame.

 

[NotInRHouse]

we are in the Northeast. No one is sending their kid to a school based on Sports teams.

TTFP says hi. Even Villanova.

RU recently only started winning those battles (not with recruits in the past 4 years) but with other students.

When mom and dad are rich, as many NJ parents are, you need to offer something else than just being the state school. And to be sure, RU does, but there is no reason why our football team should not be attractive, because it has been previously.

 

[NotInRHouse]

No offense, but what the hell else is there to do in Alabama? College football is king. And there is little else to compete with it. In Rutgers market, there are many fan options, more than anywhere else in the nation

Sure. Maybe instead of $95M, we make $10M. Not sure if you've noticed, but money is a perennial issue here, and we are going to make any with the current product.

 

[NotInRHouse]

I'm not speaking as a college professor, but an ex student. The southern tradition garbage just makes me laugh my ass off. The plantations are all shut down, Rhett and Scarlet. Lame.

OK. Plenty of B1G schools do something similar as do the PAC12. Fans support when there is something to support.

 

[anon_ivydyf0amkzay]

I'm not speaking as a college professor, but an ex student. The southern tradition garbage just makes me laugh my ass off. The plantations are all shut down, Rhett and Scarlet. Lame.

Good thing you're not speaking as a professor because that's a remarkably dumb thing to say...laughably absurd, in fact!

 

[jtung230]

TTFP says hi. Even Villanova.

RU recently only started winning those battles (not with recruits in the past 4 years) but with other students.

When mom and dad are rich, as many NJ parents are, you need to offer something else than just being the state school. And to be sure, RU does, but there is no reason why our football team should not be attractive, because it has been previously.

sorry, I don't get your point. The thread is about winning football programs can help attract better students. My point is that it will not. It might increase applications but not better students. As a football fan, I want to see the team do better. However, the school's main focus should be on improving academic reputation. I think the honors college is a good start.

 

[jason21psu]

That's funny because I told all four of my kids I would not pay for either Of those schools. Would you pick Rutgers if they had a top 25 football? It sounds like you and your brother just wanted to go away for college and your parents were willing to pay for it. Let me ask a follow up question, what schools did you turn down because they didn't have a big time football program? I'm guessing no Ivy League schools, MIT, Or Duke.

My point is academic reputation far out weights football success. I grew up in VA and no one picked Va Tech over UVA because they had a better football team.

Rutgers could have been a possibility if there was football. I did want to go away to school but Rutgers would have been far enough from where I grew up to qualify, exit 0. PSU had a 100% job placement in my field as well so that had bearing. But for me it was does a college have a) my major and b) football. And that's the great thing, there are plenty of universities that could offer both. In 95 Rutgers did not. Because I'm not 18 I can't say if I'd of considered Rutgers if I was a HS senior today. If I would guess I'd say yes but Illinois is a great Engineering school and they never were on my radar.

I wouldn't say I turned down any Ivies b/c I didn't apply. My English SAT probably would have kept me from being accepted but maybe not. If Ivies were one of my goals I would have done what I needed to to boost my English SAT. But I wanted a certain college experience. K State was a school I turned down based on no football even though a degree in my major was highly regarded there.

TL;DR version I wanted to go to a college that had both high level academics and high level football. PSU offered that in 95 and Rutgers didn't. Remember in 94/95 PSU had an undefeated season.

 

[ScarletStateofNJ]

Bingo! Please someone cite an example of a University that invested in big time athletics and lost money and their academic reputation declined. This assumes a reasonably intelligent game plan on investing.

Only 20 D1 schools turn a profit (2014). The remaining 100 lose money. Even in the P5, the average net is a loss of $2.4 million.

For the record,Rutgers athletics had one of the worst returns losing $36 million in 2014, while not garnering one team conference championship.

 

[jtung230]

Rutgers could have been a possibility if there was football. I did want to go away to school but Rutgers would have been far enough from where I grew up to qualify, exit 0. PSU had a 100% job placement in my field as well so that had bearing. But for me it was does a college have a) my major and b) football. And that's the great thing, there are plenty of universities that could offer both. In 95 Rutgers did not. Because I'm not 18 I can't say if I'd of considered Rutgers if I was a HS senior today. If I would guess I'd say yes but Illinois is a great Engineering school and they never were on my radar.

I wouldn't say I turned down any Ivies b/c I didn't apply. My English SAT probably would have kept me from being accepted but maybe not. If Ivies were one of my goals I would have done what I needed to to boost my English SAT. But I wanted a certain college experience. K State was a school I turned down based on no football even though a degree in my major was highly regarded there.

TL;DR version I wanted to go to a college that had both high level academics and high level football. PSU offered that in 95 and Rutgers didn't. Remember in 94/95 PSU had an undefeated season.

College choice is very personal. Most parents I know are focused on academics only. Vanderbilt is a hot school right now and it's not because of their football team.

 

[jason21psu]

College choice is very personal. Most parents I know are focused on academics only. Vanderbilt is a hot school right now and it's not because of their football team.

Agreed it's personal but I picked where I wanted to go, not my parents. My parents paid for the bulk of my college but I worked while in school, got student loans, and scholarship money. I think by the time I left for college the grocery bill going down was enough to cover tuition :)

 

[MADHAT1]

Here's two articles to think about if you think sports related issues doesn't help a school draw more student applications;

Rutgers applications reaching record heights after Big Ten, CIC entry (2015 article)
>Here is a helpful hint: In the ninth months since the school became a member of Big Ten Conference (B1G) athletics and the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (CIC) for academic research, Rutgers admissions has become more selective.

The school experienced a 12 percent increase in applicants and a 15 percent increase in out-of-state applicants – especially concentrated in the Midwest – compared to 2013-14 data, according to the admissions office.
"This increase is the largest that I've ever seen in one year," said Courtney McAnuff, Rutgers vice president for enrollment management. "Typically, if you go up one or two percent that's a good year."<
http://www.app.com/story/sports/col...plications-record-big-ten-cic-entry/70652936/

Rutgers is reaping rewards of winning Football glory draws visitors, donations. (2006 article)
>A winning football season is translating into increased interest - interest by prospective students, interest in Rutgers gear, even interest from donors.<
http://articles.philly.com/2006-11-...utgers-students-rutgers-university-foundation

 

[RUboston]

Interesting. The town I live in in MA, Duxbury, has a highly rated school system with nearly 100% of the graduating class going on to 4 year colleges, many of them good schools. A popular school with the kids is now Alabama. In last year's graduating class, 5 kids went to Bama. More are applying this year. My son, a HS junior, recently received an invitation from Alabama to attend two informational programs that were held on two nights in October at hotels up here in MA to learn about the university, majors, and the admissions process. Many of my son's friends attended and plan on applying to Alabama.

Last year, no Duxbury students chose to go to Rutgers, which is a mere 4 hours away and 40 minutes outside of NYC. Every year the town newspaper has a graduation issue that lists the colleges kids will be attending and every year there is no Rutgers. When I talk to my son's friends (juniors and seniors) about their college plans, Rutgers is not even on their radar. Most don't even realize it is a Big Ten school. But they are talking about Alabama.

I know Rutgers is the State University of NJ and it must cater to NJ residents, but Rutgers really needs to attract more high quality out of state students. There are very few undergraduate students on the New Brunswick campus from the six New England states (CT, RI, MA, VT, NH and ME). That's ridiculous.

 

[redlinehw]

Alabama does a good job pursuing highly qualified students in the northeast. Sent my daughter many letters and accepted her with full scholarship in their honors college based on test scores only. They did a nice job recruiting her.

 

[NickyNewark51]

In defense of Barchi, maybe our elected officials (legislature & Governor) can't grasp this simple concept.

You mean that ''fat'' guy wasting his and our time shmoozing in NH when he has no shot and in box seats in Dallas...lol..

 

[KevH]

Every member of the faculty should be required to read that before they get their next salary increase.

I've always wondered how so many so-called educated people could be so clueless when it comes to the importance of marketing/branding and the positive impact that successful sports programs can have on the university as a whole. Look no further than the fact that we're B1G.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

we are in the Northeast. No one is sending their kid to a school based on Sports teams.

I thought the numbers were clear.....Since 2006, when the football program took off, applications are up and higher quality students are applying. Am I incorrect ?

 

[czxqa]

Only 20 D1 schools turn a profit (2014). The remaining 100 lose money. Even in the P5, the average net is a loss of $2.4 million.

For the record,Rutgers athletics had one of the worst returns losing $36 million in 2014, while not garnering one team conference championship.

And this is what is so frightening about the constant drumbeat from New Brunswick about athletics being self-supporting. Only the truly elite are and to make that our goal without making the commitment to elevate the program to the level it needs to be to achieve that goal is just mind-boggling. How stupid can these people be?

 

[jtung230]

I thought the numbers were clear.....Since 2006, when the football program took off, applications are up and higher quality students are applying. Am I incorrect ?

The applications are up but not sure the quality of students applying is going up. The Alabama fever has not caught on in my town. NESCAC and Vandy are very popular after the top tier schools. If any school is offering you a free ride, you should consider it. But I personally wouldn't pay out of state tuition for Bama over In-state Rutgers.

 

[PhDKnight]

No offense, but what the hell else is there to do in Alabama? College football is king. And there is little else to compete with it. In Rutgers market, there are many fan options, more than anywhere else in the nation

So what? I hear there are even more things to do in LA and the weather is better (sarcasm) and USC and UCLA pull in over 75k most games and seem to do OK.

Said this in other threads - we need a coach that embraces the NYC market like PC embraced the LA market.