that there is so much talent in every corner of the county. Guards that can penetrate, big men that can move and score and guys who can make their free throws. So what's our problem? Bad recruiting or bad coaching or both? Despite our issues, a turnaround is not impossible. Utah had 6 wins a few years ago and they turned it around.
The NCAA Tournament has proved to me...
- Thread starter We Are RU
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That's why teams with subpar talent have won the last 20 championships .
Witchita State just beat Kansas. The difference in talent is not that great. The difference is Kansas has highly ranked recruits.
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This post was edited on 3/22 7:32 PM by RU-Choppin-Ohio
Kansas is a little young but they have more talent than Wichita
UConn was not the most talented last year but Ollie did a helluva job coaching
Recruiting matters so dont twist my words but coaching is the difference maker...great coaches overacheive with their talent.....Few Smart Marshall Stevens and Ryan are the notable examples
UConn was not the most talented last year but Ollie did a helluva job coaching
Recruiting matters so dont twist my words but coaching is the difference maker...great coaches overacheive with their talent.....Few Smart Marshall Stevens and Ryan are the notable examples
To be good, really good, you either exceptional talent, or talent and coaching. Coaching alone won't do it. Give me an average coach who can bring in crazy talent and I will be happy.
Problem is, no proven good coach is coming to Rutgers without facilities. No exceptionally talented players are coming to Rutgers without adequate facilities.
Facilities are the key. It is the only way to get a good coach or good players or both.
As it is, we aren't in the game right now.
Lastly, to get those players at every corner, you need recruiting budget. Ours is not adequate.
Facility upgrades and more support. Outside of winning the lottery, that is the only way this happens.
Problem is, no proven good coach is coming to Rutgers without facilities. No exceptionally talented players are coming to Rutgers without adequate facilities.
Facilities are the key. It is the only way to get a good coach or good players or both.
As it is, we aren't in the game right now.
Lastly, to get those players at every corner, you need recruiting budget. Ours is not adequate.
Facility upgrades and more support. Outside of winning the lottery, that is the only way this happens.
Facilities, talent, coaching. The big 3.
1. FACILITIES: I agree with C. Vivian here. RAC upgrade not enough. RU needs a spanking new arena. The Johnson and Johnson Center sounds good to me. Mulitbillion dollar corporation in our back yard. Louisville has the Yum Yum Center. I'll even give up my life long Giants fandom, and root for the Jets!
2. TALENT: Not true that we haven't attracted talent here. Hill and Rice brought in some very good players. Even Bannon and Waters. Keeping them here has been more the problem.
3. COACHING: Probably the number 1 reason RU has sucked for so long. For reasons known all too well. So now we have Eddie Jordan, and the real question is, Can he adjust to the college game? But what's frustrating to me, is that we all knew this 5 years ago when his name was brought up in the last coaching search. I would have given Danny Hurley 10 years if I was in charge. With his pedigree and his Jersey ties. I mean right now RU as the State University has not ONE single scholarship player from New Jersey. Especially with no recruiting budget, that's ridiculous.
1. FACILITIES: I agree with C. Vivian here. RAC upgrade not enough. RU needs a spanking new arena. The Johnson and Johnson Center sounds good to me. Mulitbillion dollar corporation in our back yard. Louisville has the Yum Yum Center. I'll even give up my life long Giants fandom, and root for the Jets!
2. TALENT: Not true that we haven't attracted talent here. Hill and Rice brought in some very good players. Even Bannon and Waters. Keeping them here has been more the problem.
3. COACHING: Probably the number 1 reason RU has sucked for so long. For reasons known all too well. So now we have Eddie Jordan, and the real question is, Can he adjust to the college game? But what's frustrating to me, is that we all knew this 5 years ago when his name was brought up in the last coaching search. I would have given Danny Hurley 10 years if I was in charge. With his pedigree and his Jersey ties. I mean right now RU as the State University has not ONE single scholarship player from New Jersey. Especially with no recruiting budget, that's ridiculous.
Needs to be in New Brunswick. Part of Devco redevelopment. Many years away. Practice facility first
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Whatever the reason, the teams out there prove that it can be done!!!! It's not as if there are only a handful of teams that are capable of being very good. There is room for us too. So it's frustrating and promising at the same time. Enough is enough...do it right or don't do it at all!
What would a new arena and practice facility cost? $100 million? The investment would be well worth it in my opinion because right now we are just throwing the money we are spending down the drain.
This post was edited on 3/22 9:09 PM by We Are RU
What would a new arena and practice facility cost? $100 million? The investment would be well worth it in my opinion because right now we are just throwing the money we are spending down the drain.
This post was edited on 3/22 9:09 PM by We Are RU
Great coaches are great in part because of the commitment from the university and program they coach. Show me a great coach and you will see a school that supports the program.
Great coaches aren't coming to Rutgers unless there is support. Zero chance of that. It doesn't matter how much you pay them, which by the way, is about 3 to 4 x what Eddie makes. They will be able to make that much money somewhere else AND have support and facilities.
Frankly speaking, forgetting Eddie's coaching ability, Rutgers was lucky to have someone with his resume. Most guys in his position would never touch Rutgers. He just happens to be an alum.
Great coaches aren't coming to Rutgers unless there is support. Zero chance of that. It doesn't matter how much you pay them, which by the way, is about 3 to 4 x what Eddie makes. They will be able to make that much money somewhere else AND have support and facilities.
Frankly speaking, forgetting Eddie's coaching ability, Rutgers was lucky to have someone with his resume. Most guys in his position would never touch Rutgers. He just happens to be an alum.
coaching is huge!
Put Izzo or Huggins on RU for the last 2 years and the results would be a lot different. The standard they have is so different than Jordan.
Put Izzo or Huggins on RU for the last 2 years and the results would be a lot different. The standard they have is so different than Jordan.
It wouldn't be that different. They wouldn't get the players they have at those schools. Not to mention, it is a pipe dream to get a guy like Izzo. Guys like him aren't going to a school that doesn't have support. They know what it takes to win, and it is a lot more than just them.
This post was edited on 3/23 12:05 AM by Caliknight
This post was edited on 3/23 12:05 AM by Caliknight
EJ makes 1.2 mil. You don't have to get a GREAT coach to a program around. Give someone 2.4. Calipari makes like 5 mil. Not asking for a calipari type coach, just somoene to get us above .500.
I would agree in a sense though Caliknight, these coaches don't want to come to Rutgers with these facilities. Someone will come here for 3 mil though. Also, facilities is far from the reason we haven't been good. We haven't been good because we lose, and even if Rutgers has a facility a recruit isn't going to come to a school with our kind of losing record. I am for facilities, but i don't see it as more important than a solid head coach.
Recruits would come here if we were winning. Ill take a great HC over anything anyday of the week. And it could happen a heck of a lot quicker than financing a facility and building it.
I would agree in a sense though Caliknight, these coaches don't want to come to Rutgers with these facilities. Someone will come here for 3 mil though. Also, facilities is far from the reason we haven't been good. We haven't been good because we lose, and even if Rutgers has a facility a recruit isn't going to come to a school with our kind of losing record. I am for facilities, but i don't see it as more important than a solid head coach.
Recruits would come here if we were winning. Ill take a great HC over anything anyday of the week. And it could happen a heck of a lot quicker than financing a facility and building it.
No coach worth their salt who makes $2.5M a year is going to come here, unless it was a complete last resort. Coaches aren't smart. They need facilities to recruit. Their names alone help, but they need a lot more support than what they get at Rutgers, and facilities is a big part of that.
Pick a random Sweet 16 school and check out what they have. Outside of Gonzaga, which is an anomaly, with a coach who has stayed despite much larger offers, I doubt you will find one without far better facilities than we have. Hell, pick a tourney team and I bet you will be hard pressed to find one without vastly better facilities.
What is going on at RU is embarrassing at this point. There is zero support or pride in the program.
Pick a random Sweet 16 school and check out what they have. Outside of Gonzaga, which is an anomaly, with a coach who has stayed despite much larger offers, I doubt you will find one without far better facilities than we have. Hell, pick a tourney team and I bet you will be hard pressed to find one without vastly better facilities.
What is going on at RU is embarrassing at this point. There is zero support or pride in the program.
Biggest difference between Wichita State and KU was that the Shockers had more experienced upperclassmen vs some high ranked but young KU players.Originally posted by RU-Choppin-Ohio:
That's why teams with subpar talent have won the last 20 championships .
Witchita State just beat Kansas. The difference in talent is not that great. The difference is Kansas has highly ranked recruits.
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This post was edited on 3/22 7:32 PM by RU-Choppin-Ohio
Players can develop over 3-4 years at places like Wichita State, Gonzaga, etc...while top programs like KU, etc...go after some 1 or 2 and dones...some great, great, players...but sometimes they don't jell that great as a team in that short of time.
True about the practice facility but ND will apparently finally get one with the renovated Rolfs Student Center being converted when the new additions to the football stadium are completed.
And I've been to the RAC. After renovations a few years ago, the Purcell Pavilion is nicer than the RAC.
Then respectfully I would question how many High School games you go to.
Does it pale versus most of the teams in the Big Ten they play against------absolutely.
But there are many schools playing in arenas that are a ton worse than the RAC.
What I would say is it's an average mid major facility.
Does it pale versus most of the teams in the Big Ten they play against------absolutely.
But there are many schools playing in arenas that are a ton worse than the RAC.
What I would say is it's an average mid major facility.
I never suggested that the RAC was the worst in basketball. Nice strawman.
Just pointing out that when you came here to what appears to be somehow propping up ND in a perverse way (see guys, ND has a bad arena and they still win!!!!!) claiming they don't have a great arena and that's it no better than the RAC, that you were stretching reality.
ND's arena is no great shakes and not one of the best around. So don't go down that road and create another strawman. But with the renovation of the JACC including a new floor, new scoreboard over the floor, removal of bleachers for permanent seating, upgraded lighting, the addition of suites, a brand new, elaborate entranceway with new ticket office, merchandise store, upgraded food stands, etc............ it's nicer than the RAC.
This post was edited on 3/23 10:23 AM by Ty Webb
Coaching counts - absolutely it does.
But I always recall how John Thompson III could never beat a couple of RU coaches during his tenure at Princeton. Then he goes to Georgetown and we never could beat him. I don't suppose the coaching maturation caused by his move to DC explains the difference in results entirely for JTIII.
But I always recall how John Thompson III could never beat a couple of RU coaches during his tenure at Princeton. Then he goes to Georgetown and we never could beat him. I don't suppose the coaching maturation caused by his move to DC explains the difference in results entirely for JTIII.
Notre Dame has a national reputation that attracts top recruits and winning coaches. Accountability is in place and if the coaches fail to meet expectations they are fired regardless of the sport.At Rutgers there is no sense of urgency because there are always financial constraints so the status quo rules.
Good points, Cali. Like you said, they aren't smart and need help to recruit. This is a long shot but there is some high school coach who has done very well the past four years and might take 4 million a year to coach at this level. Your points still stand very strong though.
I would much rather a coach from HS come to this program than a coach come down from the NBA. Two very different leagues. One is still interacting with players, the other isn't.
I would much rather a coach from HS come to this program than a coach come down from the NBA. Two very different leagues. One is still interacting with players, the other isn't.
It really isn't that hard to figure out. Not sure why this is even a discussion, other than some people just like to argue that the hardest way possible to do something is the best way. Yes, there are anomalies out there. Rutgers isn't one of those. Therefore, to get a great coach, you need facilities or they won't come. To get great players, you need great facilities and/or an exceptional coach, or they won't come.
Bottom line. Get great facilities. I will say it again also, great facilities are the baseline. Most every program has them now. It still doesn't mean you will automatically win, but it puts you in the game.
Bottom line. Get great facilities. I will say it again also, great facilities are the baseline. Most every program has them now. It still doesn't mean you will automatically win, but it puts you in the game.
Calipari makes more than that now.
His new 7 year, $52 Million contract pays him:
2014-2015: $6.5 Million
2015-2016: $7 Million
2017-2018: $7.25 Million
2018-2019: $7.75 Million
Then $8 Million for his final 3 seasons.
Of course, if Cal wins another National Championship again this season, UK will probably tear up the above contract and give him another raise.
In regards to paying a coach for $2.4 Million....a coach in that range without much post-season success but has a pretty strong fan base is Memphis, who pays their coach Josh Pastner $2.65 Million a year.
$2.4 Million won't land you a Top 10 or even a Top 20 Coach...especially at a school without much support or without top facilities to help land recruits.
Higgins over the years I've found that wishing for things I'm not going to get just makes you grouchy.
Case in point------would like my youngest daughter to settle down and get married.
Not going to happen unless she finds someone who's into 40 mile bike rides , mountain climbing and kayaking.
Just dropped on us the other day that this summer she's hiking Mt Kilimanjaro----------terrific.
Case in point------would like my youngest daughter to settle down and get married.
Not going to happen unless she finds someone who's into 40 mile bike rides , mountain climbing and kayaking.
Just dropped on us the other day that this summer she's hiking Mt Kilimanjaro----------terrific.
If Izzo came here he would demand a practice facility, it would almost certainly be written into his contract. A high profile coach would never come here without those assurances, and an opt out clause in his contract if it didn't happen. Schiano had that sway with football. EJ does not have that pull. Im sure this had to do with losing out on Hurley.
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