OT: Does anyone know anyone who has tested positive?
- Thread starter Greene Rice FIG
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but why can normal people realize there is a middle ground...like funding a task force to deal with stuff like this. that would seem pretty smart right? and I guarantee this will happen after this is over.
comparing being *more* prepared for situations like this vs preparing for an asteroid strike or alien invasion is faulty logic of the worst kind. public health officials have been saying stuff like this was going to happen for a while. and it will happen again...are you saying that you would be fine to be just as prepared the next go around?
I do agree with your first statement...its the same issue a CEO has managing a company Q to Q vs. long term...it's a challenge for sure. but I think your last part is hyperbole and not practical...and not what any reasonable person would expect anyway.
To be fair to both cuomo and trump I think they are just trying to push hard and by setting dates and talking dire predictions it makes people push harder... I feel trump is doing this with his Easter date. He put a date out there now people have to work to the date instead of having everything open ended. When Easter comes I think they will make the right choice... cuomo same thing. He wants the best for his state so he is going to b*tch and complain about not having resources knowing that he has enough but he needs to keep the pressure on the federal government... the only problem with cuomo is that some people could panic thinking if they wait to go to hospital when symptoms get very serious they may die with out a ventilator... so that was probably a miscalculation.
I worked in nyc construction for awhile for a big time construction management firm. Throughout our projects we would pick dates where certain phases needed to be done. We would act like the world was ending if it didn’t get done. Next thing you know the subcontractors would throw money at the problem, allocate more resources and start working some OT. The date would come and we wouldn’t be done but we were in a much better situation than we would have been if we didn’t make a push for those dates... I think this is what cuomo(knowing he has the ventilators) and trump are doing... just trying to make sure this isn’t opened. Everyone drives to the finish line.
I heard Giuliani talking last night and he obviously knows trump and cuomo well and said he feels that regardless f their flaws they are both doing their best to make the right choices even though some may be wrong. I thought that was pretty well said.
I worked in nyc construction for awhile for a big time construction management firm. Throughout our projects we would pick dates where certain phases needed to be done. We would act like the world was ending if it didn’t get done. Next thing you know the subcontractors would throw money at the problem, allocate more resources and start working some OT. The date would come and we wouldn’t be done but we were in a much better situation than we would have been if we didn’t make a push for those dates... I think this is what cuomo(knowing he has the ventilators) and trump are doing... just trying to make sure this isn’t opened. Everyone drives to the finish line.
I heard Giuliani talking last night and he obviously knows trump and cuomo well and said he feels that regardless f their flaws they are both doing their best to make the right choices even though some may be wrong. I thought that was pretty well said.
He did. Cuomo had the state health department put together a pandemic task force in 2015. They came back and told him to buy 30,000-35,000 ventilators. He said, "no" and instead told them to come up with a set of protocols on who would get ventilators (and who would not) if they ever saw a pandemic and ran out of ventilators.
Here we are. I cannot confirm whether or not the task force recommended Cuomo blame it on the federal government if it ever happened ... or if he came up with that one on his own.
Cuomo had more good news today. The number of icu admissions went down yesterday...
In matter of two days we found out that NYC is not short on ventilators and icu admissions went down. That doesn’t mean it will decline daily but it went down... we are also seeing that not all hospitals in NYC are “war zones” like they are being described on tv. Very important we keep everything in perspective and not panic.
Also saw that only 2% of people who died in NYC so far had no underlying conditions. That means 98% of people who have passed away had underlying conditions or their condition is pending. People dying is certainly not good but the more information we have the more we can put good policies into action....
In matter of two days we found out that NYC is not short on ventilators and icu admissions went down. That doesn’t mean it will decline daily but it went down... we are also seeing that not all hospitals in NYC are “war zones” like they are being described on tv. Very important we keep everything in perspective and not panic.
Also saw that only 2% of people who died in NYC so far had no underlying conditions. That means 98% of people who have passed away had underlying conditions or their condition is pending. People dying is certainly not good but the more information we have the more we can put good policies into action....
It's much easier being prepared for something you've seen then something that has happened in the distant past (generations ago).
For sure after this we'll be more prepared for something like this. We're always fighting yesterday's wars.
But you are right. There is a middle ground and we should have taken what was going on in china more seriously than we did and we lost valuable time. Even if we hadn't ramped up ventilator production we could have explored potential gaps and start discussions on how we'd close them.
Except it wasn't generations ago. The federal government initiated preparation plans after the Ebola epidemic in Africa in anticipation of a larger scale epidemic that could hit the US, complete with mock pandemic exercises across branches of government, playbooks on how to coordinate across silos and partner with private industry, timelines of when to ramp up production of PPE/tests/equipment, etc. The government learned from the Ebola event and prepared itself so that it wouldn't be flatfooted when a pandemic hit our shores, and they put an entire system of mechanisms in place for a future administration to follow
All they had to do was maintain the structures put in place and follow the script.
So cdc ignored all of this? I can’t imagine they had it and said screw it let’s not do any of this. Would be helpful to see the document as well...
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You make zero sense here. He should wait until he doesn’t have enough to complaint? Are you watching the news? The number of infected are not increasing in linear fashion.
It was published by Vox a couple days ago. The executive branch team that was supposed to coordinate all of this was let go last year. The administration has been running largely off book, with experts like Fauci having constantly correct and contradict communications coming out of the White House.
No cuomo has been talking about not having enough ventilators for days. Which turns out to be a lie. He has enough ventilators and currently has a couple thousand sitting in storage... so people are panicking thinking they are going to die on the hospital floor which right now is 100% not true! Talking like this is why people are scared and panicked and overwhelming hospitals. They think if they wait to long before going they are not going to get the proper care which again is bs.
When Dr. Birx set the record straight and told everyone that New York has enough for right now a reporter finally asked cuomo about it and cuomo said he doesn’t have enough for the peak... He had to cover his a**.
the number of infected are going up because we are testing more and more people everyday. we know that the majority of people will experience mild symptoms some people will never even know they had it therefor do not take up an icu bed or ventilators..... this is a good thing.
We are learning more and more by the day but most importantly we are learning that you should not panic, that you will get the proper care you deserve and for the overwhelming majority of people this is not deadly...
Interesting. I need to do a little googling!! Hopefully they get asked about it in these pressers... the one thing I do know is administration had different people saying different things early on and they made a decision to say everything had to go through pence so it can be a coordinated message and people accused them of muzzling the experts....
I bold the relevant part for you. That’s great if you don’t think the numbers are going down. But the fact is, the worst is expected to come in the next 2 weeks. I’m happy we have enough for right now but Cuomo is planning ahead like a leader should.
Agreed but tell the truth... say we have enough ventilators for now but we need more to match the expected demand. I am ok with him pushing for more but be honest... telling people we don’t have enough makes it seem like we are in worse shape than we are.
I guess Trump is over reacting by using the defense production act ordering GM to build ventilators. We have enough right now. Just stop. You know what’s coming or maybe you don’t.
First off trump is completely wrong with how he went after GM.
Second it is different trump isn’t saying that hospitals are being overrun and they have ZERO ventilators. He says we need more ventilators. He is not implying people will die if he doesn’t get them.... cuomo implies that they have none... then a reporter asked him about the extras and he started studdering...
listen I think cuomo is doing a good job. This is minor. politician being a politician. My biggest problem is we are being sensational and bringing people to panic instead of choosing our words wisely and being a calming influence.
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It's published in its entirety - it wasn't written by Vox, just released online by them.
And, fwiw, it's in the "reliable for news" box in the media bias chart published each year, so it's not as partisan as you think. https://www.adfontesmedia.com/?v=402f03a963ba
Agree. Step one is stop wasting resources on gun violence. It's not a disease. Let the ATF and FBI handle it.
No disaster plan could fix New York’s problems
Trump can only do so much for New York. -Trump has made mistake but not to the detriment of ny. Cuomo and de Blasio need to take the lead and they have.. when they want to make decisions that contradicted trump they did it when they wanted stuff from government they complained and got it
the one thing we know for sure is that New York has been horribly managed for years and the coronavirus is showing this... tho disaster plan could fix this
Governor cuomo was told 3 years ago he was short on ventilators and should buy more.. he said no then set up a rationing plan.... A RATIONING PLAN. Anyone who says New York doesn’t have enough and people are dying should look to cuomo and ask if this was an acceptable plan
Govenor cuomo is on record saying that shutting down colleges and schools sending them home to isolate old people with younger people may not have been the best public health policy and the reason he did it is because he needed to act...
govenor cuomo had international travelers entering his state without any checks or restrictions... he basically said this is a big reason why nyc was hit hard
De Blasio and his administratiom are on record telling people to go to parades in mid feb and then telling them to go to restaurants and movies in to March..
NYC hospitals have been overcrowding forever, Medicaid has been underfunded forever, nyc has had issues forever
Trump can only do so much for New York. -Trump has made mistake but not to the detriment of ny. Cuomo and de Blasio need to take the lead and they have.. when they want to make decisions that contradicted trump they did it when they wanted stuff from government they complained and got it
the one thing we know for sure is that New York has been horribly managed for years and the coronavirus is showing this... tho disaster plan could fix this
Governor cuomo was told 3 years ago he was short on ventilators and should buy more.. he said no then set up a rationing plan.... A RATIONING PLAN. Anyone who says New York doesn’t have enough and people are dying should look to cuomo and ask if this was an acceptable plan
Govenor cuomo is on record saying that shutting down colleges and schools sending them home to isolate old people with younger people may not have been the best public health policy and the reason he did it is because he needed to act...
govenor cuomo had international travelers entering his state without any checks or restrictions... he basically said this is a big reason why nyc was hit hard
De Blasio and his administratiom are on record telling people to go to parades in mid feb and then telling them to go to restaurants and movies in to March..
NYC hospitals have been overcrowding forever, Medicaid has been underfunded forever, nyc has had issues forever
I tried to find the pandemic plan but could not find the actual plan. Business insider wrote about politico’s article about it. It seems that it was never made official and no one really took it seriously...
1) A NSC official told Politico that the playbook is "quite dated and has been superseded by strategic and operational biodefense policies published since," adding, "The plan we are executing now is a better fit, more detailed, and applies the relevant lessons learned from the playbook and the most recent Ebola epidemic in the [Democratic Republic of the Congo] to COVID-19."
2) Politico reported that another factor limiting the Trump administration's ability to fully implement the 2016 pandemic playbook was that the document never underwent the proper interagency vetting and approval processes to become an official part of the White House's strategy, despite former homeland security adviser Tom Bossert expressing interest in making it a permanent fixture of the US' policy toolkit when it came to pandemics.
3)Indeed, another official who worked in both administrations told Politico that the playbook "just sat as a document that people worked on that was thrown onto a shelf" and wasn't even sure that "senior leaders at agencies were even aware that this existed."
Vox a true voice of the people... You actually believe them?... total garbage .
Couple things, after I went and looked it up again.
First off, I was wrong - it wasn't Vox, it was Politico that had posted it. The story was subsequently picked up by multiple outlets.
Second, it's a primary source document. You can ignore all the article around it if you like - every word written by whatever person works for Politico. Unless you believe they fabricated a 69-page US Government document in its entirety, in which case, I don't know what to tell you.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/25/trump-coronavirus-national-security-council-149285
Yeah that’s soooo much better...people excoriate Trump but swear to the high heavens on these bull shat media rags... very seldom can we believe CNN, MSNBC or FOX ... they have their own bias... people seldom think for themselves... it’s like a college class where the prof or teaching assistant loves when you regurgitate their thoughts back... and that is found at particularly at most colleges and universities since the 50-60’s...
^^^Sooo, apparently he is insisting it's a fake 69-page US Government document.
How many documents or reports do you think the government puts out every year? I am not denying that there is a report just questioning how much stock to put into the report. I put a couple quotes from the article with an NSC official saying it was basically kicked around never becoming an official report.
trump is not obligated to adhere to every document every previous administration puts out. he has experts who have been lifers im the government who probably helped write the report advising him.
trump is not obligated to adhere to every document every previous administration puts out. he has experts who have been lifers im the government who probably helped write the report advising him.
It was never adopted by the current administration as their policy. But it was also never officially replaced by a new plan. The White House team that was in place to respond to pandemics and coordinate response was disbanded. The ongoing database that was maintained for years was allowed to lapse.
There was a lot of work that went into preparing for a major epidemic on US soil, but in the moment none of it was used.
History will not look favorably on our response to this crisis.
this is fake news. Disband and reorganize are two completely different things. Anyone who says that it was disbanded is not saying it in good faith.
Obama is not the president. every former obama official thinks that trump should follow everything they do... it is no surprise that former obama officials talk about their report, even though it was never made official), would save the world.
I agree history will look back unfavorably. The amount of panic that was injected into people’s minds is truly remarkable. The stimulus will go down as the worst bill in American history... one thing I know for sure though is that the people who predicted 2M dead will some how still have jobs.
One thing is also true if we are doing a bad job China, France, Italy, Spain... are doing a terrible job.
that being said I think it is very important to keep things in perspective however with trump president I fear that will never happen. People hate him to much.
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It existed at the start of 2017, and then it didn't exist anymore and there was nothing comparable put in its place. You can call that whatever you like, but at the end of the day the people who were in place to respond to a pandemic at the executive branch level at to start of 2017 were not in place at the start of this. Funding for monitoring epidemics in China was also eliminated at the same time, which was intended to provide early warning.
The US government took actions to prepare itself for an epidemic outbound of Ebola, so it's not accurate to say this was unforeseen or that it hadn't been seen in generations. There was a plan, there were preparations made in teams built.... and then our actual response to the crisis ended up bearing little resemblance to all of that preparation.
At this point in the game, though, the fire has started. Too late to go back and talk about who did or didn't replace the batteries in the fire alarms or how many fire drills were run in the past... it's now a matter of keeping people safe and out of harm's way. Once the fire is over, we can double back and hold responsible any parties that hindered our response effectiveness.
To follow on that metaphor, though... This thread is about if anyone knew anyone burned or who is still in the burning building.
Ha, I got caught reading the back and forth and forgot what the title even was.
But to the OP, I do know someone, police chief in the town I work, known him as an acquaintance for years, gave me a ticket for speeding once.
Jersey City Fire Dept has been hit pretty hard. Around 20 positive tests and counting. After apparently spending $75,000 to professionally deep clean a house the first positive came from, the city doesn't have the money to clean the houses other than giving us pine sol and some basic sanitizers to use ourselves. We're also being instructed to return to work in those houses even if we've been in direct contact, as long as we have no symptoms. Most positive tests were showing no symptoms. This whole thing is bad and these bigger cities have no idea how to handle this in the public safety depts. Not sure what will be happening in the coming weeks.
Well my friends, I just found out a past coworkers fiancé who works in the medical field just passed from the virus, my former coworker is a genuine nice guy and gentle giant , he starting working as a bus driver in the city a year ago and had brought a house with his girlfriend and future wife , they were living the dream . What’s even worse is they couldn’t even visit her physically so she passed being alone. Please be safe everyone this is a scary time.
Very sorry to hear.
This is touching many around me including family.
Several local restaurants have closed suddenly in the last couple of days after aggressively advertising dinner specials. Posted messages about taking time out to disinfect. One can only surmise that someone turned up positive. Both local ShopRites have had positive tests in the last couple of days, but remain open.
Colleague at work in the hospital right now and not good. I think there is a chance I had it 3+ weeks ago. I work(ed) in NYC so likely was exposed.
Showed few symptoms besides loss of smell. It wasn't a symptom at the time and I remember constantly looking it up because it was so strange. Later found out people I was with experienced similar thing and one got quite sick. Was just added as a symptom and docs are finding it quite common especially as an isolated symptom.
Hopefully a test get out there soon that gives A) quick results B) prior exposure. Both will help us treat and understand that virus. I'm afraid it is going to be a tough time until there is a vaccine especially for us sports junkies.
Showed few symptoms besides loss of smell. It wasn't a symptom at the time and I remember constantly looking it up because it was so strange. Later found out people I was with experienced similar thing and one got quite sick. Was just added as a symptom and docs are finding it quite common especially as an isolated symptom.
Hopefully a test get out there soon that gives A) quick results B) prior exposure. Both will help us treat and understand that virus. I'm afraid it is going to be a tough time until there is a vaccine especially for us sports junkies.
