“I’m worried for Steve Pikiell”: Coaching Ace Bailey and Dylan Harper might be challenging for Rutgers HC, claims basketball analyst
- Thread starter Tango Two
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The on ball defense was fine. Obviously they have length. Need to stay engaged off the ball and have a nose for loose balls and rebounds.
I have said before practices began it was going to be a lot to ask Dylan to be a scorer, play defense, and be the primary PG that facilitates the offense.
I really think you will end up seeing a lot of J Williams as the primary PG. when we get inthe red zone (close game with a few minutes left) that changes
I hope that’s the case because I think it makes sense.
That guy has always been bit of a clown. But it's true unchartered territory here with two guys just stepping stone here for a year, there is no molding, buying in to whatever Pike wants to do,etc. They are playing for draft stock and having a good time as bmoc for a year.
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The answer is probably in between these thoughts, my thoughts and those who won't acknowledge it as a concern. These 2 could have went anywhere they wanted but chose this program and coach. I am also hopeful that their draft stock could be partially dependent on their "motors" and quality as men. Obviously putting the ball in the basket at a high rate and efficiency is most important for their draft stock.
Getting hazy but I do recall stuff that both Ace and Dylan said at various times they wanted to come to Rutgers to learn D because that's what they thought they needed to show that they were NBA ready. So I think they are assuming they have the scoring efficiency as a given.
I'll go one further. If JWill and Dylan can learn to work well together and set each other up, and share the ball, we will be a very good team.
Green Rice FIG, I don't think any reasonable fan doesn't recognize that there are questions marks about this team. There was a huge roster turnover. How will the pieces fit together? Will the superstar freshman live up to the hype? Will we get any rebounds 🙂? It will take time for those questions to be answered. In my opinion, Pike is a very good coach and I tend to be an optimistic fan, so I believe that ultimately those questions are going to be answered positively. Based on everything I've seen and heard, I certainly don't think Dylan and Ace are going to turn out to be un-coachable prima donnas.
In any case, whether it's a college or NBA team, it takes actual experience playing together to work things out. It isn't reasonable to expect that we'd have a finished product the first time the coaches rolled the ball out on the court to start practice. My biggest issue is simply people putting too much emphasis on an exhibition game played three weeks before the start of the regular season (at a time when not too long ago we'd be holding midnight madness and celebrating the official start of practice) against what I think will turn out to be a pretty damn good power 5 team in a game played at a very fast pace. Were there issues that need to be addressed? Absolutely, that's the advantage of playing an early exhibition game. I also saw a lot of very positive things in that game.
The team is going to be really tested by the end of November. Hopefully they'll have enough time to gel somewhat in the games leading up to ND. No matter how good we're going to be at the end of the day, we may take some lumps in Vegas. Ultimately the season is going to come down to how we do in conference play. I think we're going to have a different team in late January than we had on October 17th. That's the beauty of sports, we're going to play the games and we'll find out exactly who we are as the season progresses.
I understand having some concerns. I've been a season ticket holder for more than 35 years so god knows I've got plenty of reasons to be concerned deeply ingrained in me. But I'm viewing this season in a very positive way right now. I can't wait to see how the team grows and comes together. I'm looking forward to the excitement Dylan and Ace are going to bring and to following their development. I can't wait to see all of the newcomers and returning players and what they all bring to the table. I'm also going to go on the record again and predict that Emanuel is going to contribute more than a lot of people think.
It's going to be a fun and exciting season. Part of the fun for me is seeing how the coaches and players deal with and adapt to adversity. I can't wait for the season to start. Go RU!
One other consideration here is the competitive fire Ace and Dylan both have. From all I've seen and read, they have that "Eye of the Tiger" type of competitiveness that drives highly talented players to be special. So even if they're only here 9 months and Rutgers is a stepping-stone to the NBA, these are kids that (1) WANT to get better; (2) WANT to WIN; and (3) seem to trust Pike to get to nos. 1 and 2.
I understand what Green, Rice, Farmer, Inman and Griffin is getting at. While I don't think the "I'm too good to listen to you" attitude will prevent us from being a good team this year, I do wonder if egos will get in the way at times.
During the scrimmage, I saw 2 moments that made me go "Hmmmm.".
1. Ace appeared to be arguing with one of the coaches. I don't know if they were commenting on shot selection or if Ace was frustrated over a foul called on him. If he was arguing with the coach, and not listening to the coach, that's a little concerning.
2. I noticed a time Pike was trying to talk to Dylan and "coach him up" after a mistake/poor decision and Dylan was looking the other way and never even looked at Pike. Now he may have heard him but he didn't acknowledge anything Pike told him. No little nod to communicate understanding or anything.
Safe to say The staff has a new challenge this year.
If he trained at Bucky's in Finderne, he could handle Italian AND Chinese.
I didn't listen, but there are concerns for Pike, although I'm not sure they are the ones discussed.
Pike's never recruited this type of talent before. If it doesn't go well, or God forbid, one of the two drop in the draft rankings, he won't be able to recruit this high level kid again. He needs them to hold their draft value. Come out of the season even better, more well rounded players would be even better.
Pike's never recruited this type of talent before. If it doesn't go well, or God forbid, one of the two drop in the draft rankings, he won't be able to recruit this high level kid again. He needs them to hold their draft value. Come out of the season even better, more well rounded players would be even better.
Maybe we would be better off…..
Maybe the way to win in 2025 and beyond hoops is with 22 year olds that have experience playing in college.
People love to make things up in their head aka called assumptions
The answer doesn't lie in the middle - it's just that you are way out in left field. Especially with that nonsensical Italian restaurant / burrito analogy.
Don't conflate their ability to create shots with selfishness. Did you see Eli Carter-esque dribbling out the shot clock and jock up a contested 3? No. They create shots they're comfortable with, in the flow of the offense.
By all accounts they've been eager to pass the ball, and work hard to improve their defense. You have a preconceived notion that because they are 5* recruits, they are self-oriented rather than team-oriented.
Also, Jeff Goodman is a hack.
Of course I do. Do you realize how much money both of these guys are going to make in 8 months? We are both fans so i don't want to be a jerk....but you may be Alex Verdugo here. Have fun playing golf today and sorry you made the last out.
Without knowing them personally you're basically denigrating their integrity by saying that Ace and Dylan are only about the money they are about to earn and by proxy do not care about effort, team or winning. Also you indicated that you didn't want to be a jerk and then proceeded with something that a jerk would say.
It isn't binary....there is somewhere in between. Saying they aren't going to dive for loose balls or not play 100% every possession isn't saying they are only about the money.
One exhibition game is a small sample, but both players didn't have any rug burns from diving on the floor, didn't see any charges, and they certainly didn't go hard for loose balls and rebounds. If both of these guys are playing 35 minutes and playing hard we shouldn't be destroyed on the defensive glass.
I don't know if you're right or wrong on this, and I respect your fandom, but geez man, you're a real...
not once the game startsI don't know if you're right or wrong on this, and I respect your fandom, but geez man, you're a real...
Ace also shot 45% from three, so I guess we do not have to worry about his three point effectiveness.
I ain’t reading this thread or watching the video.
All i know is our two lottery picks before they become great Rutgers team players are going to struggle
All i know is our two lottery picks before they become great Rutgers team players are going to struggle
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Of course it's not binary. Why then go the character assassination route and making definitive projection assumptions after one exhibition?
In terms of scappiness and diving for loose balls here's a question. Would you rather have a 3rd year Simpson and Derdack starters on this roster who give you what you want on D and scrapiness or a first year Harper and Ace in the same starter roles who are relative unknowns with question marks on D and diving for loose balls? These would represent the most probable situational replacements on a typical Pike roster at RU.
I’ll say this about our stud freshmen, you can’t give either of them any space or they’ll burn you, from deep, midrange, and in the lane or at the rim,
Don’t even get me started on fast breaks.
We keep talking about their defense, which will no doubt improve as the year progresses. But how will they be stopped from scoring?
Play them too tight and it opens up other possibilities, as both are capable passers.
We don’t seem to be grasping the enormity of having not one but TWO lottery picks on our team!
Don’t even get me started on fast breaks.
We keep talking about their defense, which will no doubt improve as the year progresses. But how will they be stopped from scoring?
Play them too tight and it opens up other possibilities, as both are capable passers.
We don’t seem to be grasping the enormity of having not one but TWO lottery picks on our team!
I do think it’s unfounded to suggest Ace and Dylan’s intent will be anything other than to give 100% for their team. Especially at the start of the season and especially if the season is going well.
But, there is a very high likelihood that should a kyrie type situation occur, that these guys will take the kyrie path. That’s just the reality of the landscape of basketball in our country when it comes to lottery picks. Nothing, absolutely nothing, is more important than not jeopardizing getting to their second NBA contract. I am much more worried about Ace slightly tweaking a knee or Dylan rolling an ankle and shutting it down in the beginning of December. These short CBB seasons come and go quick. They have no incentive to rush back. It happens less likely than it doesn’t, don’t get me wrong.
The other scenario, should we fail to be on track to be a tournament team in late January, would be making assumptions we just don’t know how they would react yet.
What are you talking about ? Kyrie returned for Duke after an injury when he could have just shut it down
IIRC he shut it down for the whole reg season.
There would only be reg season in our scenario of him or Ace getting hurt early.
Clearly these guys came to Rutgers because it means something to them. They could have gone anywhere in the country and they chose a defense-first program that lacks significant historic success.
To suggest at this point — with all current evidence to the contrary — they may mail it in at some point or be hesitant to do whatever it takes to win is just odd.
To suggest at this point — with all current evidence to the contrary — they may mail it in at some point or be hesitant to do whatever it takes to win is just odd.
The D really only became a big problem when Dylan was playing with 4 fouls. Total collapse at that point. The D in the first half of the game was fine. I also think for all the complaints about Ogbole - another question is whether he can play closer to 30 mpg against teams with physical centers without getting into foul trouble. He’s no super star, but there looks to be a major drop off on the defensive end when he’s on the bench. And maybe they’ll prove me wrong, but I’m not seeing a massive boost in offense from swapping him for Lathan or Martini. We’re not looking to run offense through our center position. And Martini is way too small to go head to head with most 5s at the major conference level.
Agree with everything you say, except the BOOMER take. It’s a stupid take. It’s a biased, throwing shade take. It’s not a boomer take.
When do you have optimism, Greene? I must have missed that! Lol
