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A WATERSHED MOMENT

RUMassAlum

Sophomore
Jun 7, 2005
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Sometimes a single game is a watershed moment for a team, an event that all by itself indicates that things won’t be the same going forward. It can be a good thing, as in a landmark, awe-inspiring win, or it can be very bad, as in the Rutgers-Seton Hall game last Saturday. The hammering that RU took from the Pirates wasn’t just a bad game; it stripped us bare of any pretensions for the season. To be sure, the absence of Freeman was huge, as was to a much lesser degree that of Doorson, and the team of course is ridiculously inexperienced. Having said that, RU MBB’s performance was still head-shakingly inept in every aspect of the sport of basketball. Not the slightest adjustment to instill a little fire or basketball sense into these players, offensively or defensively. A moment when we knew that the emperor had no clothes. Way too little talent to compete in any top conference, or even in some mid-majors. Not much indication that this team will get significantly better this year.

Having followed RU MBB for 45 years, I remember the steep decline when Tom Young left after 12 years without a sub-.500 record, 4 NCAA’s, 4 NIT’s, the Final 4, the construction of the RAC, etc., albeit it in the so-so Atlantic 10 The program dropped off the cliff under Craig Littlepage (a much better AD than coach), culminating in his dismissal after year 3, when the record declined to 7-22, with 3 conference wins. But here is what a lot of fans don’t know: the very next season (under Wentzel), we made the NCAA tournament. Does any human being on planet earth think that’s going to happen with this team? Not saying it was all due to Wentzel’s brilliant coaching; just citing a sharp historical contrast between then and now.

It is conceivable—I hope this doesn’t happen—that things could deteriorate into a 6 or 7 win season. If that happens, I do not see Sanders staying. Then we are really in trouble. We’ll have a depleted roster, way too little talent and probably few prospects coming in. If, on the other hand, we show just a modest little bit of progress and do better than that, there might be a reason to keep Eddie for one more make or break year. I love and am grateful to EJ, but he probably is not the guy to get the job done here in the long run. So…here are a few steps that I would hope Pat Hobbs could initiate for MBB:

1) Take the existing architectural renderings and feasibility studies for a RAC expansion/upgrade and a new practice facility, the Pernetti/Hermann plans, and give them massive new publicity in all media. Keep publicizing the plans and fundraising through news media, online and social media sources, so the public and recruits can keep it in their minds..

2) Concurrently, initiate a massive, well organized and aggressive capital funding and fundraising campaign for the facility, private and public sources.

3) If EJ has to go, prioritize candidates who are young, upcoming, hungry, willing to work for less than top dollar, and, above all, with strong RECRUITING connections in particular geographic locations, hopefully including NY/NJ. In other words, a Mike Rice, sans the crazy behavior, of course.

Don’t know what else to suggest; unlike some who think the turnaround can be affected fairly quickly, I think this damaged program is going to take quite some time to rebuild. Thoughts, criticisms, ideas welcomed.
 
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A WATERSHED MOMENT
Sometimes a single game is a watershed moment for a team, an event that all by itself indicates that things won’t be the same going forward. It can be a good thing, as in a landmark, awe-inspiring win, or it can be very bad, as in the Rutgers-Seton Hall game last Saturday. The hammering that RU took from the Pirates wasn’t just a bad game; it stripped us bare of any pretensions for the season. To be sure, the absence of Freeman was huge, as was to a much lesser degree that of Doorson, and the team of course is ridiculously inexperienced. Having said that, RU MBB’s performance was still head-shakingly inept in every aspect of the sport of basketball. Not the slightest adjustment to instill a little fire or basketball sense into these players, offensively or defensively. A moment when we knew that the emperor had no clothes. Way too little talent to compete in any top conference, or even in some mid-majors. Not much indication that this team will get significantly better this year.

Having followed RU MBB for 45 years, I remember the steep decline when Tom Young left after 12 years without a sub-.500 record, 4 NCAA’s, 4 NIT’s, the Final 4, the construction of the RAC, etc., albeit it in the so-so Atlantic 10 The program dropped off the cliff under Craig Littlepage (a much better AD than coach), culminating in his dismissal after year 3, when the record declined to 7-22, with 3 conference wins. But here is what a lot of fans don’t know: the very next season (under Wentzel), we made the NCAA tournament. Does any human being on planet earth think that’s going to happen with this team? Not saying it was all due to Wentzel’s brilliant coaching; just citing a sharp historical contrast between then and now.

It is conceivable—I hope this doesn’t happen—that things could deteriorate into a 6 or 7 win season. If that happens, I do not see Sanders staying. Then we are really in trouble. We’ll have a depleted roster, way too little talent and probably few prospects coming in. If, on the other hand, we show just a modest little bit of progress and do better than that, there might be a reason to keep Eddie for one more make or break year. I love and am grateful to EJ, but he probably is not the guy to get the job done here in the long run. So…here are a few steps that I would hope Pat Hobbs could initiate for MBB:

1) Take the existing architectural renderings and feasibility studies for a RAC expansion/upgrade and a new practice facility, the Pernetti/Hermann plans, and give them massive new publicity in all media. Keep publicizing the plans and fundraising through news media, online and social media sources, so the public and recruits can keep it in their minds..

2) Concurrently, initiate a massive, well organized and aggressive capital funding and fundraising campaign for the facility, private and public sources.

3) If EJ has to go, prioritize candidates who are young, upcoming, hungry, willing to work for less than top dollar, and, above all, with strong RECRUITING connections in particular geographic locations, hopefully including NY/NJ. In other words, a Mike Rice, sans the crazy behavior, of course.

Don’t know what else to suggest; unlike some who think the turnaround can be affected fairly quickly, I think this damaged program is going to take quite some time to rebuild. Thoughts, criticisms, ideas welcomed.
93-32, or whatever the score was, is/was the watershed moment.
I cannot disagree one bit, Greene Rice; I almost cited that 92-31 loss in 2014 to mighty Louisville in the AAC conference tourney, but my message was getting very long so I didn't. But you are a knowledgeable poster and wonder what you thought of my perceptions for the short term future of the program?
 
My thoughts haven't really changed in the past 18 months. The recruitment of Sanders and Freeman made me pause and gave me hope.

I have been waiting for "culture change" in the program. Was trying to hold my hat on the fact Rices guys were gone there would be a new Eddie. There has been some flashes of Eddie and the team showing passion, but nothing sustained.

Without bashing individual players.....too many players not willing to give the effort possession after possession. Maybe youth??? Prob not. We don't win 50/50s and no one (that I can remember) has sacrificed their body to take a charge.

How many charges have we taken? I can't recall 1. Could be wrong here.
 
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My thoughts haven't really changed in the past 18 months. The recruitment of Sanders and Freeman made me pause and gave me hope.

I have been waiting for "culture change" in the program. Was trying to hold my hat on the fact Rices guys were gone there would be a new Eddie. There has been some flashes of Eddie and the team showing passion, but nothing sustained.

Without bashing individual players.....too many players not willing to give the effort possession after possession. Maybe youth??? Prob not. We don't win 50/50s and no one (that I can remember) has sacrificed their body to take a charge.

How many charges have we taken? I can't recall 1. Could be wrong here.

Agreed. But passion and intensity have to start from the top down and they are sorely lacking on this coaching staff. There seems to be no accountability and no ability to get the most out of college kids.
 
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Agreed. But passion and intensity have to start from the top down and they are sorely lacking on this coaching staff. There seems to be no accountability and no ability to get the most out of college kids.

for the most part, players play based on their talent and experience.

I heard a comment by North Carolina coach Roy Williams.....He said, " I'm a better coach when Marcus Paige is on the floor". Marcus Paige recently played his first game.

Rutgers will have a better coach next year with more experienced players and another athlete like Nigel Johnson on the court and Bishop Daniels gone..........lol
 
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for the most part, players play based on their talent and experience.

I heard a comment by North Carolina coach Roy Williams.....He said, " I'm a better coach when Marcus Paige is on the floor". Marcus Paige recently played his first game.

Rutgers will have a better coach next year with more experienced players and another athlete like Nigel Johnson on the court and Bishop Daniels gone..........lol

Disagree 1000%...Tom Izzo would have this team playing at a much higher level....His players would box out on the foul line.
 
I don't know how you can disagree 1000%? Do you disagree that if Eddie had Carolina's players we would be winning? I agree that I do not think that Eddie demands defensive intensity from this team. I agree with that 1000%, but that alone would not make this a great team. I have been criticizing Eddie lately but without Freeman we are asking freshman(Sanders), freshman(Laurent), sophomore(Williams-shooting poorly), sophomore(Foreman), freshman(Diallo), freshman(Goode) and unproductive senior Lewis to be successful. Look I think Eddie doesn't stop other teams' runs with timeouts at all and it has cost us games in the last 3 years(St Johns for one) and I don't think he is an effective motivator at the college level, but this isn't all about coaching up this young group. I am not sold on Eddie, but I am rooting for him this year to be respectable to set up for an improvement in wins and losses next year to see if he can turn this thing. No significant progress with the record next year and you then move on.
 
I don't know how you can disagree 1000%? Do you disagree that if Eddie had Carolina's players we would be winning? I agree that I do not think that Eddie demands defensive intensity from this team. I agree with that 1000%, but that alone would not make this a great team. I have been criticizing Eddie lately but without Freeman we are asking freshman(Sanders), freshman(Laurent), sophomore(Williams-shooting poorly), sophomore(Foreman), freshman(Diallo), freshman(Goode) and unproductive senior Lewis to be successful. Look I think Eddie doesn't stop other teams' runs with timeouts at all and it has cost us games in the last 3 years(St Johns for one) and I don't think he is an effective motivator at the college level, but this isn't all about coaching up this young group. I am not sold on Eddie, but I am rooting for him this year to be respectable to set up for an improvement in wins and losses next year to see if he can turn this thing. No significant progress with the record next year and you then move on.
If Eddie had Carolina's players, people would be wondering how RU lost to Seton Hall by 30 with all that talent.
 
Disagree 1000%...Tom Izzo would have this team playing at a much higher level....His players would box out on the foul line.
Did your account get hacked,or am I missing the sarcasm? They even screwed up your great (and we all appreciate the effort/energy/time you and your wife commit to it)
Club's presence in the RAC that was last sold out for a HS game I was told.

If you want to pick a Coach that would improve rebounding, that would be Coach Huggins; Coach Izzo would make sure any player he
put in the game could play 4 consecutive minutes of defense in passing lanes, etc.
 
Whoa, so Nigel Johnson will be the savior because he's tearing it up in practice?

Yeah, I remember when guys thought that Clarence Pittman would win the Heisman because he was so good when he was red-shirting. And Wally Judge was just, you know, AWESOME when he was sitting out too.

Geez, Johnson better be lights out if he's being guarded by Sanders, Williams, Daniels and Goode in practice. Kids from RU-Newark and CCSU light up those guys too. When will Rutgers fans learn to not judge kids on how they perform in practice against other Rutgers kids?
 
Whoa, so Nigel Johnson will be the savior because he's tearing it up in practice?

Yeah, I remember when guys thought that Clarence Pittman would win the Heisman because he was so good when he was red-shirting. And Wally Judge was just, you know, AWESOME when he was sitting out too.

Geez, Johnson better be lights out if he's being guarded by Sanders, Williams, Daniels and Goode in practice. Kids from RU-Newark and CCSU light up those guys too. When will Rutgers fans learn to not judge kids on how they perform in practice against other Rutgers kids?
They will never learn. This program has been an endless parade of practice All-Americans.
 
Thanks GreeneRice, can't disagree with anything you said. No real change in MBB culture.
A couple of good additions to roster but no spirit or fierceness on D, no cohesion on O.
I've been a fan of MBB since ''69'' and enjoyed some great seasons but stopped following a few seasons after Roy Hinson left...Gary Waters was ok but nothing to rejuvenate more than casual interest....lately and esp after Schiano got here RUFB became my passion along with CVS and WBB...RIGHT...WBB but not the men...its shameful how far we've dropped in hoops....I loved EJ as a player and tried to buy into his sincerity as a HC but he's just collecting a paycheck and without seeing any passion i'm done until i see caring...show me we care or were a FB school...the Barn used to tremble out into the street and strike fear into the opposition...
 
Did your account get hacked,or am I missing the sarcasm? They even screwed up your great (and we all appreciate the effort/energy/time you and your wife commit to it)
Club's presence in the RAC that was last sold out for a HS game I was told.

If you want to pick a Coach that would improve rebounding, that would be Coach Huggins; Coach Izzo would make sure any player he
put in the game could play 4 consecutive minutes of defense in passing lanes, etc.

Huh?
 
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