correct. Attacking players is commonplace here. Critical conversations are almost nil. The fact that some fans are still knocking the kid who is gone says a lot. Move on. It's the Greeks time to lead us.
Athan Kaliakmanis "Clearly Won" the Starting Job Per Greg Schiano
- Thread starter Knight Shift
- Start date
Once again, I never said that people have to stick to highlighting positives. In the sentence you quoted above, I am not telling anybody what to do or how to post.
Here's the entirety of why I posted in this thread...
1. Someone posted that people who defended GW look stupid now.
2. I responded that they do not look stupid, that nobody that defends our players looks stupid for doing so. People look classy for defending our players.
That's it. Everything else is people reading all kinds of meanings into what I wrote that I didn't write and don't think I implied, but certainly didn't intend to imply in any event.
The definition of classlessness is ancillary to my point. But since you asked...
I think the degree of classlessness in pointing out players shortcomings depends entirely on how it's stated. On one end of the spectrum is saying nothing negative at all about the team, which is, IMO, the classiest thing to do. One the opposite end of the spectrum is posting stuff like "so and so sucks" or worse, which is entirely lacking in class.
That's not me telling people how to behave. It's me saying what I think.
You think that saying "nothing negative at all about the team" is "the classiest thing to do." I differ, and I think probably many other posters (even very classy ones) would agree with me.
Schiano said that the OL couldn't block long passes and Kirk designed an offense without a long game.
That hurts because stretching the field helps every aspect of offense.
Rutgers is a VERY simple pass game to defend.
Most passes go to sideline, corners and zone seams.
Kelce make a lot of medium passes because KC is still dangerous long so border between long and medium is soft.
Dremel was good in slot
He had hands and quickness to snag passes on weak seams as he crossed zones (Kelce also good at that)
The middle zone is the friendliest and announcers used to comment that area was GWs fav pass.
Leading a receiver across a short field is an easier pass than judging a long pass with contested catch likely.
Dremel was best catching shorter balls on the fly and relatively free of contests.
Sanu would not only win contested balls - he would leave defender crumpled on the ground
RU had nobody like that last year
A problem was that after a few games, teams saw film and knew what to stop.
Take away the short sidelines and soft horizontal over the middle, and nothing much was left in RU bag.
DBs hate is to see WRs line up close to each other - DBs don't know how WRs will break.
RU doesn't do things like that - just an occasional screen pass that usually didn't work well.
My overall take isn't so much about players but that RU offenses play not to lose.
A smart coach would fit offense to players and not vice versa but GS wants a plug/play machine.
Wimsatt's best skill was as a game breaking runner - he could do the 40-60 yd runs easy.
Notre Dame and Oregon knew that - it took the offensive geniuses at RU to minimize best asset on a team that couldn't block long for a player who probably had good long pass
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Daniel Jackson was a legit great WR who probably lands in NFL (like 2019 WRs).
On another team he probably has more stats.
Jackson wasn't a "compiler" as Francesca would say
We have to memorize how to spell Kaliakmanis, we can't keep calling Athan AK. Kaliakmanis is probably the coolest name in college football.
Daniel Jackson was a legit great WR who probably lands in NFL (like 2019 WRs).
On another team he probably has more stats.
Jackson wasn't a "compiler" as Francesca would say
It’s not like he was a stud the year before with Tanner Morgan. Strong caught some passes like the picture too from my memory. You continue to try hard here to find things that aren’t there.
Again - only one apples to apples comparison - spring training. The coaches said AK stood out clearly as better. It was head to head. Move on.
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But remember, in Ashokan's eyes, everything Deion does is perfect. Just weird takes all around.
Dare I say maybe a reason why Minn took a step back in AK's first full year as a starter as a team/on O was that they graduated their first team all-american center Schmitz? 2nd round pick with the Gmen started 13 games and was named to many an all rookie team/'steals of the draft' list.
Their running game stunk without Taylor. My opinion is that kid will be a stud. When he got hurt, they had nothing, and yes, a significantly weaker line overall. It gets lost upon folks that AK averaged 4.1 ypc on rushes the season before in 2022. He’s not a statue.
Most importantly, lost their experienced offensive coordinator.
I'm all in on AK. Let's go.
He's our guy now and looking for reasons why he won't be good is stupid IMO. I'm looking for reasons he will help us win games. With our D and run game and softer schedule of opposing Defenses I am looking for big things from RU this year.
He's our guy now and looking for reasons why he won't be good is stupid IMO. I'm looking for reasons he will help us win games. With our D and run game and softer schedule of opposing Defenses I am looking for big things from RU this year.
Can pick up first downs, yes. Won’t gash teams for big gainers but now the WR and RB (Kenny Fletcher should also have a big season because there’s absolutely no video of the TE getting used much since Ito was kicking FG’s) rooms have spurtability.
I begin ONLY with "things that are there."
Minn was 126th for passing offense (at 127th RU made one step up).
Many media articles focused on Minn's poor passing and AK being a dud.
Minn let AK go - according to some fans he was told he would never be a starter again.
"For Minnesota, the passing ineptitude is surprising because the talk before the season was all about how the aerial attack would be a big improvement from 2022 when the Gophers averaged 182.2 passing yards per game.
Athan Kaliakmanis was the big-armed quarterback Minnesota thought would produce bigger numbers with what appeared to be an upgraded receiving corp with transfers Corey Crooms and Elijah Spencer joining Daniel Jackson and tight end Brevyn Spann-Ford.
Kaliakmanis has struggled mightily with just 797 yards, six touchdowns and six interceptions in six games, and his 110.8 passer rating ranks 147th in the country among 150 qualified passers. He passed for 52 yards against Michigan on Saturday including two interceptions that were returned for touchdowns.
"I think I just gotta be more accurate in those situations," Kaliakmanis said Saturday night abou this interceptions."
Minnesota's passing offense really is as bad as it looks - Sports Illustrated Minnesota Sports, News, Analysis, and More
Only Air Force, Navy and Iowa have worse passing attacks.
www.si.com
So you see there is/was really nothing to substantiate that AK is some sort of savior QB. RU is going down a path Minn already went down. Do I want AK to fail? Not at all. But if he messes the bed, RU needs to get real about RUs hideous offensive coaching aside from OL. Greg is a horrible offensive mind who cant score well in red zone - and he hires other weak links. RU is one of worst passing offenses in cfb, and Minn has been right next to them. Many if not most good DCs are bad at offense (see NY Jets for best examples)
I know RU football well enough to not get excited over preseason chatter about the offense.
I remember when most people were super high about GW but I posted he wasn't a great passer as yet (threw too high ).
nothing in a vaccumI begin ONLY with "things that are there."
Minn was 126th for passing offense (at 127th RU made one step up).
Many media articles focused on Minn's poor passing and AK being a dud.
Minn let AK go - according to some fans he was told he would never be a starter again.
"For Minnesota, the passing ineptitude is surprising because the talk before the season was all about how the aerial attack would be a big improvement from 2022 when the Gophers averaged 182.2 passing yards per game.
Athan Kaliakmanis was the big-armed quarterback Minnesota thought would produce bigger numbers with what appeared to be an upgraded receiving corp with transfers Corey Crooms and Elijah Spencer joining Daniel Jackson and tight end Brevyn Spann-Ford.
Kaliakmanis has struggled mightily with just 797 yards, six touchdowns and six interceptions in six games, and his 110.8 passer rating ranks 147th in the country among 150 qualified passers. He passed for 52 yards against Michigan on Saturday including two interceptions that were returned for touchdowns.
"I think I just gotta be more accurate in those situations," Kaliakmanis said Saturday night abou this interceptions."
Minnesota's passing offense really is as bad as it looks - Sports Illustrated Minnesota Sports, News, Analysis, and More
Only Air Force, Navy and Iowa have worse passing attacks.
So you see there is/was really nothing to substantiate that AK is some sort of savior QB. RU is going down a path Minn already went down. Do I want AK to fail? Not at all. But if he messes the bed, RU needs to get real about RUs hideous offensive coaching aside from OL. Greg is a horrible offensive mind who cant score well in red zone - and he hires other weak links. RU is one of worst passing offenses in cfb, and Minn has been right next to them. Many if not most good DCs are bad at offense (see NY Jets for best examples)
I know RU football well enough to not get excited over preseason chatter about the offense.
I remember when most people were super high about GW but I posted he wasn't a great passer as yet (threw too high ).
will you concede the OC played a huge role in this?
I don't see anything wrong with this post. I think AK will outperform expectations but pointing out that Schiano hasn't exactly been Bill Walsh is in bounds IMO.I begin ONLY with "things that are there."
Minn was 126th for passing offense (at 127th RU made one step up).
Many media articles focused on Minn's poor passing and AK being a dud.
Minn let AK go - according to some fans he was told he would never be a starter again.
"For Minnesota, the passing ineptitude is surprising because the talk before the season was all about how the aerial attack would be a big improvement from 2022 when the Gophers averaged 182.2 passing yards per game.
Athan Kaliakmanis was the big-armed quarterback Minnesota thought would produce bigger numbers with what appeared to be an upgraded receiving corp with transfers Corey Crooms and Elijah Spencer joining Daniel Jackson and tight end Brevyn Spann-Ford.
Kaliakmanis has struggled mightily with just 797 yards, six touchdowns and six interceptions in six games, and his 110.8 passer rating ranks 147th in the country among 150 qualified passers. He passed for 52 yards against Michigan on Saturday including two interceptions that were returned for touchdowns.
"I think I just gotta be more accurate in those situations," Kaliakmanis said Saturday night abou this interceptions."
Minnesota's passing offense really is as bad as it looks - Sports Illustrated Minnesota Sports, News, Analysis, and More
Only Air Force, Navy and Iowa have worse passing attacks.
So you see there is/was really nothing to substantiate that AK is some sort of savior QB. RU is going down a path Minn already went down. Do I want AK to fail? Not at all. But if he messes the bed, RU needs to get real about RUs hideous offensive coaching aside from OL. Greg is a horrible offensive mind who cant score well in red zone - and he hires other weak links. RU is one of worst passing offenses in cfb, and Minn has been right next to them. Many if not most good DCs are bad at offense (see NY Jets for best examples)
I know RU football well enough to not get excited over preseason chatter about the offense.
I remember when most people were super high about GW but I posted he wasn't a great passer as yet (threw too high ).
Newsflash, when you are done shitting all over Greg, he does not run the offense. Kirk C runs the offense.I begin ONLY with "things that are there."
Minn was 126th for passing offense (at 127th RU made one step up).
Many media articles focused on Minn's poor passing and AK being a dud.
Minn let AK go - according to some fans he was told he would never be a starter again.
"For Minnesota, the passing ineptitude is surprising because the talk before the season was all about how the aerial attack would be a big improvement from 2022 when the Gophers averaged 182.2 passing yards per game.
Athan Kaliakmanis was the big-armed quarterback Minnesota thought would produce bigger numbers with what appeared to be an upgraded receiving corp with transfers Corey Crooms and Elijah Spencer joining Daniel Jackson and tight end Brevyn Spann-Ford.
Kaliakmanis has struggled mightily with just 797 yards, six touchdowns and six interceptions in six games, and his 110.8 passer rating ranks 147th in the country among 150 qualified passers. He passed for 52 yards against Michigan on Saturday including two interceptions that were returned for touchdowns.
"I think I just gotta be more accurate in those situations," Kaliakmanis said Saturday night abou this interceptions."
Minnesota's passing offense really is as bad as it looks - Sports Illustrated Minnesota Sports, News, Analysis, and More
Only Air Force, Navy and Iowa have worse passing attacks.
So you see there is/was really nothing to substantiate that AK is some sort of savior QB. RU is going down a path Minn already went down. Do I want AK to fail? Not at all. But if he messes the bed, RU needs to get real about RUs hideous offensive coaching aside from OL. Greg is a horrible offensive mind who cant score well in red zone - and he hires other weak links. RU is one of worst passing offenses in cfb, and Minn has been right next to them. Many if not most good DCs are bad at offense (see NY Jets for best examples)
I know RU football well enough to not get excited over preseason chatter about the offense.
I remember when most people were super high about GW but I posted he wasn't a great passer as yet (threw too high ).
Passing yards per game under Kirk C while at Minnesota
2017 126.1
2018 208.1
2019 253.3 (Tanner Morgan's best year)
2020 (not Kirk C) 199.1
2021 (not Kirk C) 162.1
2022 182.2
----
2023 (post Kirk C)- 143.4
You can see a similar trend of Kirk C's passing offense at WMU with PJ- it progressively improved.
And your narrative on "Greg is a horrible offensive mind" is bullshit.
Here are some stats to ponder.
2006 - 27.9 points per game (11-2)
2007- 32.5 points per game (8-5)
2008- 28.4 points per game (8-5) (Teel's senior year)
2009- 28.4 points per game
2010- lost year
2011- 26.4 points per game
2012- 21.5 points per game (Flood)
2013- 26.5 points per game (Flood)
2014- 28 points per game (Flood with Friedgen)
2015- 27.3 points per game
ASH ERROR
2019- 19.9 points per game
2020- 26.9 points per game
The offense fell off in 2021-23 largely because of bad OL recruiting and depth under Ash, but it is trending up. The offense has also been hobbled by QB play. GW was Greg's first QB recruit out of HS.
Athan Kaliakmanis' numbers are on par with Teel's first two years.
Kirk C worked well with Teel and a talented crop of WRs, and in 2008, Teel threw for 3413 yards, 61.4% 25 TD and 13 INTs vs. 50.5% and 2 TD and 10 INT his freshman year.
Give it a rest with your negativity and let things play out.
Mike Teel Career Stats - NCAAF - ESPN
Complete career NCAAF stats for Rutgers Scarlet Knights Unknown Mike Teel on ESPN. Includes scoring, rushing, defensive and receiving stats.
Athan Kaliakmanis Career Stats - NCAAF - ESPN
Complete career NCAAF stats for Minnesota Golden Gophers Quarterback Athan Kaliakmanis on ESPN. Includes scoring, rushing, defensive and receiving stats.
Yep - and again, even if every single thing mentioned in that lengthy post was accurate, none of it is apples to apples anyway. You cannot compare QBs playing for 2 different teams in 2 different systems.Newsflash, when you are done shitting all over Greg, he does not run the offense. Kirk C runs the offense.
Passing yards per game under Kirk C while at Minnesota
2017 126.1
2018 208.1
2019 253.3 (Tanner Morgan's best year)
2020 (not Kirk C) 199.1
2021 (not Kirk C) 162.1
2022 182.2
----
2023 (post Kirk C)- 143.4
You can see a similar trend of Kirk C's passing offense at WMU with PJ- it progressively improved.
And your narrative on "Greg is a horrible offensive mind" is bullshit.
Here are some stats to ponder.
2006 - 27.9 points per game (11-2)
2007- 32.5 points per game (8-5)
2008- 28.4 points per game (8-5) (Teel's senior year)
2009- 28.4 points per game
2010- lost year
2011- 26.4 points per game
2012- 21.5 points per game (Flood)
2013- 26.5 points per game (Flood)
2014- 28 points per game (Flood with Friedgen)
2015- 27.3 points per game
ASH ERROR
2019- 19.9 points per game
2020- 26.9 points per game
The offense fell off in 2021-23 largely because of bad OL recruiting and depth under Ash, but it is trending up. The offense has also been hobbled by QB play. GW was Greg's first QB recruit out of HS.
Athan Kaliakmanis' numbers are on par with Teel's first two years.
Kirk C worked well with Teel and a talented crop of WRs, and in 2008, Teel threw for 3413 yards, 61.4% 25 TD and 13 INTs vs. 50.5% and 2 TD and 10 INT his freshman year.
Give it a rest with your negativity and let things play out.
Mike Teel Career Stats - NCAAF - ESPN
Complete career NCAAF stats for Rutgers Scarlet Knights Unknown Mike Teel on ESPN. Includes scoring, rushing, defensive and receiving stats.www.espn.com
Athan Kaliakmanis Career Stats - NCAAF - ESPN
Complete career NCAAF stats for Minnesota Golden Gophers Quarterback Athan Kaliakmanis on ESPN. Includes scoring, rushing, defensive and receiving stats.
You CAN, as a coach, compare the performance of 2 QBs rotating between the same first and second team personnel on the same damn team in training camp. This is the only apples to apples comparison available and Greg came out and said AK won and it wasn’t close. If there was any doubt, he would not say that publicly. Greg is not an idiot. It’s not like there wasn’t an entire team of witnesses there observing. I’m confused about why there’s any more to this than that…
Yes - he's a chip off the Schiano/Fleck block and I think he wanted AK to start well before the spring game excuse. All the "third year is for mastery " butt smoke vanished. Team Schiano hates running QBs aside from Sanu wildcat and "Jabu Package" boutique plays.
I don't think they knew what to do with GW. Their idea of "player development" is based on repetitions. Just keep doing something and you get better and better until the unicorns and fairies sing. GW had a mechanical issue (like many gangly players) that just repetition would not fix - and that was on top of mostly ignoring his best skill.
I like Greg a lot but the only time I lost respect for him was the way he handled Dodd. Nova had a stronger arm but he was notorious for overreaching on longer throws when RU was struggling. In HS he could wizz balls past defenders and get a completion. In college Nova would try the same thing and burn passes into triple coverage downfield just to get picked-off by the quicker DBs.
Its not like Nova always had a lot of INTs but he had a skill for getting them at bad times. Dodd was more skilled at the reads and position strategy. I blamed Schiano for the near USF loss that Dodd saved. Nova was only benched when the crowd started loud and sustained booing. Then Dodd hit Sanu for a circus catch on the ground . A sloppy pass for sure but Nova would have likely been picked under that same stress. I figured the Bosco connection explained the endless tolerance for turnover prone play.
Between Dodd and Savage I realized RU was not a good team for QB coaching. I feel like I've seen it again with the GW failure and AK butt smoke. Of course the biggest measure for me is red zone production. I don't care if 2 WRs each have 1000 yds (like Britt and Underwood) if the red zone sucks and FGs rule . At least GW could run well in RZ (he was stronger running into piles than people acknowledge).
I was also not impressed with GS "helping" GW get into the portal on time. Most coaches hate QB controversies and I'm 100% sure coaches are glad not to have QB speculations. The decision to jettison GW was made well before the spring game - a game GS said (right after play) that he couldn't make any QB decision because it was not a meaningful measure for QBs. The 15 practices weren't much and spring game was "mostly an exhibition for the fans."
Newsflash, when you are done shitting all over Greg, he does not run the offense. Kirk C runs the offense.
Passing yards per game under Kirk C while at Minnesota
2017 126.1
2018 208.1
2019 253.3 (Tanner Morgan's best year)
2020 (not Kirk C) 199.1
2021 (not Kirk C) 162.1
2022 182.2
----
2023 (post Kirk C)- 143.4
You can see a similar trend of Kirk C's passing offense at WMU with PJ- it progressively improved.
And your narrative on "Greg is a horrible offensive mind" is bullshit.
Here are some stats to ponder.
2006 - 27.9 points per game (11-2)
2007- 32.5 points per game (8-5)
2008- 28.4 points per game (8-5) (Teel's senior year)
2009- 28.4 points per game
2010- lost year
2011- 26.4 points per game
2012- 21.5 points per game (Flood)
2013- 26.5 points per game (Flood)
2014- 28 points per game (Flood with Friedgen)
2015- 27.3 points per game
ASH ERROR
2019- 19.9 points per game
2020- 26.9 points per game
The offense fell off in 2021-23 largely because of bad OL recruiting and depth under Ash, but it is trending up. The offense has also been hobbled by QB play. GW was Greg's first QB recruit out of HS.
Athan Kaliakmanis' numbers are on par with Teel's first two years.
Kirk C worked well with Teel and a talented crop of WRs, and in 2008, Teel threw for 3413 yards, 61.4% 25 TD and 13 INTs vs. 50.5% and 2 TD and 10 INT his freshman year.
Give it a rest with your negativity and let things play out.
Mike Teel Career Stats - NCAAF - ESPN
Complete career NCAAF stats for Rutgers Scarlet Knights Unknown Mike Teel on ESPN. Includes scoring, rushing, defensive and receiving stats.
Athan Kaliakmanis Career Stats - NCAAF - ESPN
Complete career NCAAF stats for Minnesota Golden Gophers Quarterback Athan Kaliakmanis on ESPN. Includes scoring, rushing, defensive and receiving stats.
Kirk (fired at RU and after 0-5 statr at PSU) runs the offense the way Greg likes -and the way Fleck liked - they are peas in a pod.
Minny was lucky in 2019 - their WRs had a great season. KC had a reputation as a QB developer after Tanner Morgan's 2019 but he fell apart when star WR left. No "mastery" remained
Minny continued to stink due to continuing KC's offense after he left. Fleck liked the same weak sauce offense that Kirk and Greg like.
Read Minny media criticism of offense and its easy to see RU's offensive weaknesses
"Minnesota Football: Time for some hard conversations about the Gopher offensive philosophy and it starts with the head coach."
"The Gopher offense is predicated on taking very few risks, running the ball really well and then relying on your defense and special teams to do their jobs well. The problem here is that unless you have an incredibly talented team, you are putting tremendous pressure on those two units...
In all four games (Northwestern, Iowa, Michigan State and Illinois), the offense did nothing to win any of those games, doing enough to not lose them. Which then means you are very reliant on the defense to win it for you. Minnesota failed to get a game-clinching first down in all of those games.
I struggle to think of an example in recent seasons where the offense has won a game for us. Probably Wisconsin to end the regular season last year. Of course, it has happened, but what we are seeing this season is becoming all too familiar.
The problems are systemic. The play-calling has been suspect at times. The improvement of the team’s quarterback (AK) has been slow and frankly questionable. The lack of a mid-range passing attack is infuriating. And more than anything, it would be refreshing to have an offense that is capable of winning a game, not, not losing one."
There you are ^^^ Rutgers to the letter.
Greg and Fleck would be better off just running the option instead of a de-balled ("half-pregnant") pro offense they struggle to keep together one year to the next
The Monday Perspective thinks changing your best applies to everyone, including the head coach
Time for some hard conversations about the Gopher offensive philosophy and it starts with the head coach.
www.thedailygopher.com
I'm merely suggesting that the OC situation there played a significant role in how AK performed is all. I don't think he's Tom Brady but also think he's going to be significantly better than Gav
It’s the surrounding players too. He did better with better players on the OL the year before. Look at the difference between Vedral with Reggie Sutton and a healthy Saquon O’Neal and after those injuries. Same thing. Game managers need nucleus’ around them to be successful.
