Edelson Calls for Eddie to Be Fired.

[bac2therac]

I only brought up Flood not to compare football to basketball but to say people said the same thing...wahhhhh we cant fire him because no one is coming here. Hobbs is our AD, I have confidence he is going to identify the proper candidates. You don't need Coach K to win at basketball. This program is ranked last in NJ...it beat FDU but would lose to the rest of the schools, lets start with getting someone who knows the college game and can coach college kids. Its not the NBA and recruiting is a full time job

 

[RUsojo]

Nuts. He let these kids in the program knowing they were risks.

So? That's not "losing control" of a program, EVERYBODY takes risks at this level, shit even the Ivies have gotten "riskier" over the years. Again, I'm not supporting Eddie right now - at all - I just can't get behind the commentary that he's "lost control" of the program.

FIG you can't have it both ways. Do you want to win or not?

 

[RutgersYay]

Your comparison for football is so simple minded. Football has been a program that has gone to 9 bowls in 11 years. Basketball has a 10 year losing record and no NCAA in 25 years. Even though Flood and his less than Big time staff were overmatched , they still beat some good teams along the way ,like Arkansas, NorthCarolina, and competed against Fresno State and Louisville and Michigan State . The talent in the program is better than people think and we continue to send players to the NFL. Basketball's last NBA guy is Douby 10 years ago . You think someone like Chris Ash , from Ohio State no less, is coming here for basketball. Like Calipari or Coach K's top assistant is coming here. You are crazy. You also do not realize how hard it is to win in this league especially on the road where on an average night you are playing in front of 15,000 fans. If you think the next coach is going to succeed here and get us to the NCAA , I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

Ok. Let's just keep going the way we are going, blow out after blow out and not even try.

 

[ruman]

You guys are going to get exactly what you deserve.

We might fire a coach who hasn't reached 30 wins in three years? I'll take the risk

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

FIG you can't have it both ways. Do you want to win or not?

Of course i want to win....and yes you can build a foundation and win without sacrificing other things.

Get guys in here that are coachable, will play D and dive on the floor, and are apt to stay 4 years.

 

[ruman]

Ok. Let's just keep going the way we are going, blow out after blow out and not even try.

Exactly. Because the school is in a tough place for basketball, let's keep the worst coach imaginable because he is an alum. Got it.

 

[goru7]

I only brought up Flood not to compare football to basketball but to say people said the same thing...wahhhhh we cant fire him because no one is coming here. Hobbs is our AD, I have confidence he is going to identify the proper candidates. You don't need Coach K to win at basketball. This program is ranked last in NJ...it beat FDU but would lose to the rest of the schools, lets start with getting someone who knows the college game and can coach college kids. Its not the NBA and recruiting is a full time job

No one and I mean no one said if Flood was fired no one was coming here. As Coach Ash has stated he sees tremendous potential in the program, otherwise he would be committing coaching suicide trying to go up against Ohio State, Michigan State and now Michigan every year. Tons of coaches would have lined up for the football job, more importantly at least 10 legitimate big time coaches
No big time coach is coming here for basketball period. No facilities, no support, no recent history of winning,etc....
You keep on hammering at Eddie but the next hire will not do better and in 3 more years I and the rest of this board will get to hear your constant relentless bitching about the coach.

 

[goru7]

Ok. Let's just keep going the way we are going, blow out after blow out and not even try.

Do you even understand basketball?

 

[goru7]

Exactly. Because the school is in a tough place for basketball, let's keep the worse coach imaginable because he is an alum. Got it.

Being an alum as you say is not the point. He has signed some decent recruits, who have shown they can play in the Big 10. The best point guard in at least 10-15 years. A top Juco player! There will be depth for the first time in forever. You blow all that up without a chance to see if it can succeed bc we know what happens when Eddie is let go. You want change for change sake.

 

[RutgersYay]

Do you even understand basketball?

Yes. More than you do. Especially college basketball where defense matters.

 

[TDIrish27]

An Assistant from a high end D-1 Program would jump to be the HC at a Big Ten School IMO.

The normal career track for them is to begin as a HC at a mid major.

Collins left Duke for NW .

 

[goru7]

Ok. Let's just keep going the way we are going, blow out after blow out and not even try.

Are you saying that the remaining kids that are left have not been trying? What team do you watch? The remaining players are trying but are limited. The starters now or major contributors now will either be coming off the bench to contribute or see less time and provide depth in case of foul trouble or to give the main guys a blow. That is how a fully healthy team is assembled and where Eddie is heading

 

[RUJMM78]

Of course i want to win....and yes you can build a foundation and win without sacrificing other things.

Get guys in here that are coachable, will play D and dive on the floor, and are apt to stay 4 years.

You aren't going to win in a power conference without balanced scoring .Defense will help teams win championships but without scorers the bottom of league rankings is where Rutgers will always be.

 

[goru7]

Yes. More than you do. Especially college basketball where defense matters.

You probably have never played on your life

 

[goru7]

An Assistant from a high end D-1 Program would jump to be the HC at a Big Ten School IMO.

The normal career track for them is to begin as a HC at a mid major.

Collins left Duke for NW .

Coach k assistants stay and learn with him for 7-10 years before they carefully select where they are going. Dawkins went to Stanford, Amajer at Harvard and Seton Hall before that, Wojo at Marquette, either schools with high academic reputations or basketball only schools with some semblance of a recent winning tradition. If you asked Jeff Capel or Jon Shyer his current assistants if they would consider Rutgers now that they are in the Big 10, I would bet the ranch both say they wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole .

 

[RUsojo]

Of course i want to win....and yes you can build a foundation and win without sacrificing other things.

Get guys in here that are coachable, will play D and dive on the floor, and are apt to stay 4 years.

I would love for you to cite a P5 example? Because teams who win like that still have recruited we couldn't dream of pulling in.

 

[ScarletRunner]

Are you saying that the remaining kids that are left have not been trying? What team do you watch? The remaining players are trying but are limited. The starters now or major contributors now will either be coming off the bench to contribute or see less time and provide depth in case of foul trouble or to give the main guys a blow. That is how a fully healthy team is assembled and where Eddie is heading

I am beyond amazed Eddie still has this kind of support. The go-to joke would be to refer to the poster as "Mrs. Jordan" but clearly she has less affection for him that this guy.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

I would love for you to cite a P5 example? Because teams who win like that still have recruited we couldn't dream of pulling in.

the way the Pitt program was built

 

[bac2therac]

Are you saying that the remaining kids that are left have not been trying? What team do you watch? The remaining players are trying but are limited. The starters now or major contributors now will either be coming off the bench to contribute or see less time and provide depth in case of foul trouble or to give the main guys a blow. That is how a fully healthy team is assembled and where Eddie is heading

are you kidding me with this...where is the talent coming in. We have Sanders and Freeman..possibly and big if with Johnson. The rest would be playing 5-10 minutes a game on most schools in this league

 

[RUsojo]

the way the Pitt program was built

If I'm not mistaken PITT had a player suspended an entire season at the start of last season.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

Nuts. Why did Corey Sanders end up here?

Because we took chance on him just like 100's of other schools take chances on a player, or two, every single year. I'd like to know since when "taking a chance" on a kid, or two, constitutes running a program that is "out of control"? KIDS SMOKE POT....KIDS GET BAD GRADES....it's not like these kids are conspiring to commit crimes, like their coach is sneaking around and lying about attempted grade changes, or that they're in cahoots to skate around drug tests. Might want to think about that for a second my friend.

 

[B1GNJHoops]

Pitt had Howland and Slice. They recruited tough NYC kids to Pitt but that's a powerful duo.

 

[TDIrish27]

Believe Capel has been a HC----not a real good one either.

Not sure if you're aware that Amaker was the HC at Michigan------not real good there.

Collins taking the NW job shoots a big hole in your theory. Not many schools can match their basketball futility.

Oh wait a minute .

 

[goru7]

are you kidding me with this...where is the talent coming in. We have Sanders and Freeman..possibly and big if with Johnson. The rest would be playing 5-10 minutes a game on most schools in this league

You need 3 big time scorers and Big 10 type starters and Corey, Nigel and Deshawn fit that bill. The rest of the players have to be solid contributors and know their roles and do the dirty work, Mike,DJ , Shaquille, Jon , Diallo fit that bill. You of all people have no clue how the 3 freshman will be, but they are long and athletic. If we get 2-5 minutes of positive contributions from the frosh , then you have a complete team that has a good chance to compete and when they get a little older then contribute even more.
Plus the lineup I just gave you is not just together for 1 year but 2 since we will have no seniors next year.

 

[B1GNJHoops]

You need 3 big time scorers and Big 10 type starters and Corey, Nigel and Deshawn fit that bill. The rest of the players have to be solid contributors and know their roles and do the dirty work, Mike,DJ , Shaquille, Jon , Diallo fit that bill. You of all people have no clue how the 3 freshman will be, but they are long and athletic. If we get 2-5 minutes of positive contributions from the frosh , then you have a complete team that has a good chance to compete and when they get a little older then contribute even more.
Plus the lineup I just gave you is not just together for 1 year but 2 since we will have no seniors next year.

Freeman's a nice player but what were his stats against non-low major teams this year? I would not use the term "big time scorer" to describe him or Nigel. We just don't know how Nigel will do against the Big Ten. He'll play off the ball, and he was a sub-30 percent shooter from 3.

 

[goru7]

Believe Capel has been a HC----not a real good one either.

Not sure if you're aware that Amaker was the HC at Michigan------not real good there.

Collins taking the NW job shoots a big hole in your theory. Not many schools can match their basketball futility.

Oh wait a minute .

Collins is from Chicago and has a ton of contacts there as does his father and if you do not know NW happens to be a real good academic school .
Not sure what your Capel and Amajer points were. Capel waited and took Oklahoma and Amaker went to Michigan , which last I checked were not mid majors but they are no where near where we are in. Basketball than when they were selected. You are drastically underestimating the coaching graveyard this has become.

 

[B1GNJHoops]

Do you even understand basketball?

That's not an answer and please stop acting like you're smarter than everyone else about basketball.

Eddie played, was an assistant and an NBA coach.

And what's his record at Rutgers?

Brad Stevens didn't play in the NBA or NCAA.

What's Brad Stevens record at Butler and now with the Boston Celtics?

Yeah, thought so.

 

[goru7]

Freeman's a nice player but what were his stats against non-low major teams this year? I would not use the term "big time scorer" to describe him or Nigel. We just don't know how Nigel will do against the Big Ten. He'll play off the ball, and he was a sub-30 percent shooter from 3.

Okay let's go by his Juco stats , which are Big 10 worthy , or his 6-7 game stats, the last 2 games playing hurt, at 13.3 per game.
I am going to rely on Bob Wenzel and others I know that have seen Nigel this year and believe he will be a player in the Big 10 , not listen to you and the other negative guys looking at life without any hope forever in every post that is made.

 

[B1GNJHoops]

Okay let's go by his Juco stats , which are Big 10 worthy , or his 6-7 game stats, the last 2 games playing hurt, at 13.3 per game.
I am going to rely on Bob Wenzel and others I know that have seen Nigel this year and believe he will be a player in the Big 10 , not listen to you and the other negative guys looking at life without any hope forever in every post that is made.

We've heard the best side of every recruit On the Banks and we haven't made the tournament since 1991.

Something's not adding up.

 

[goru7]

That's not an answer and please stop acting like you're smarter than everyone else about basketball.

Eddie played, was an assistant and an NBA coach.

And what's his record at Rutgers?

Brad Stevens didn't play in the NBA or NCAA.

What's Brad Stevens record at Butler and now with the Boston Celtics?

Yeah, thought so.

When some poster states
Blowout after blowout and saying the kids are not even trying with this roster, that suggests to me someone who doesn't understand who we have left playing, nor height differences, or gassed guys, or anything about basketball. You do not have to know much about basketball to understand that simple fact. Sorry you weren't offended by his post. I talk substance which are what these boards are supposed to discuss, not citing a number in a vacuum.

 

[goru7]

We've heard the best side of every recruit On the Banks and we haven't made the tournament since 1991.

Something's not adding up.

What does that mean? You are blaming Eddie for 22 years of neglect, cheap hires, lack of support and facilities. Put the blame where it belongs not your scapegoat

 

[B1GNJHoops]

You don't need to be a former player to criticize Jordan. You sound like Jordan when he said "fans don't understand how it works."

There's more to the job, especially at Rutgers, then being Eddie Jordan, the former Rutgers star basketball player and "hey I also coached NBA!"

 

[B1GNJHoops]

What does that mean? You are blaming Eddie for 22 years of neglect, cheap hires, lack of support and facilities. Put the blame where it belongs not your scapegoat

Eddie accepted a nice salary and he was aware of the huge hurdles. What did he expect?

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

If I'm not mistaken PITT had a player suspended an entire season at the start of last season.

talking PITT Howland to Dixon....that is how program is built

 

[RutgersYay]

When some poster states
Blowout after blowout and saying the kids are not even trying with this roster, that suggests to me someone who doesn't understand who we have left playing, nor height differences, or gassed guys, or anything about basketball. You do not have to know much about basketball to understand that simple fact. Sorry you weren't offended by his post. I talk substance which are what these boards are supposed to discuss, not citing a number in a vacuum.

Not saying the kids aren't trying. But I'm also not only talking about this year. We have sat through three years of this with little sign of improvement. Kids are playing hard but they are not well coached.

You can't say "Oh well no one else is gonna coach here" and throw up you hands and keep Eddie. That's where you have to try. 90% of other coaches will walk in here and teach D, making this program look not lost on the court (and not just this year...lost for 3 years.).

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Because we took chance on him just like 100's of other schools take chances on a player, or two, every single year. I'd like to know since when "taking a chance" on a kid, or two, constitutes running a program that is "out of control"? KIDS SMOKE POT....KIDS GET BAD GRADES....it's not like these kids are conspiring to commit crimes, like their coach is sneaking around and lying about attempted grade changes, or that they're in cahoots to skate around drug tests. Might want to think about that for a second my friend.

where is that most likely going to get us?

Program needs glue, not glitter.

We have Corey Sanders and still we are the worst team in P5 basketball by FAR!!!!!

we need 4 year guys....not individuals..not guys dancing at halftime warmups down 20.

 

[goru7]

Not saying the kids aren't trying. But I'm also not only talking about this year. We have sat through three years of this with little sign of improvement. Kids are playing hard but they are not well coached.

You can't say "Oh well no one else is gonna coach here" and throw up you hands and keep Eddie. That's where you have to try. 90% of other coaches will walk in here and teach D, making this program look not lost on the court (and not just this year...lost for 3 years.).

If you read what I previously posted about the lack of focus and priority of defense by Eddie , which is he has to drastically change it, then we can have an area of agreement. But part of the problem on defense has to do with the roster depletion , not being tall enough to grab rebounds that has led to second and third chances and open shooters. Some is because his guards are going over screens instead of fighting thru them. That has to change. When I said that should change now, someone made a good point that they do not have the legs to fight thru screens and again the depleted roster explains some of it .
I have said it before that Eddie believes or believed that his offense can outscore teams. He has been proven wrong. He has to switch his defensive philosophy. I have seen Eddie as a player and he was one of the best defenders around so I know he knows how to play and coach defense . I think his full roster next year will be able to play defense a hell of a lot better. Even this depleted roster has played better defensively in the last few games.

 

[RUsojo]

talking PITT Howland to Dixon....that is how program is built

Ok. Just commenting on "the right way" and "without making sacrifices".

In the end I'm pretty confident Eddie is not going anywhere. Nothing has changed except for one member of the local media and one fan with a blog writing anti-Eddie pieces to attempt to inflame members of the board or general public. Eddie took over to maintain stewardship of the program. Time heals all. Let him get the program back to a level (in Rutgers terms) playing field by filling the roster.

I've never seen any coach win games with the roster we have now. But like many say, even winning a small handful means nothing. The team needs time to develop and that's when real progress can be made and any coach will tell you the same.

Idk I'm trying to detach myself because the change we want really cannot be achieved in the time frame most want it. Staying aggressively and emotionally invested in this circumstance with no means to affect change is just not smart.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Ok. Just commenting on "the right way" and "without making sacrifices".

In the end I'm pretty confident Eddie is not going anywhere. Nothing has changed except for one member of the local media and one fan with a blog writing anti-Eddie pieces to attempt to inflame members of the board or general public. Eddie took over to maintain stewardship of the program. Time heals all. Let him get the program back to a level (in Rutgers terms) playing field by filling the roster.

I've never seen any coach win games with the roster we have now. But like many say, even winning a small handful means nothing. The team needs time to develop and that's when real progress can be made and any coach will tell you the same.

Idk I'm trying to detach myself because the change we want really cannot be achieved in the time frame most want it. Staying aggressively and emotionally invested in this circumstance with no means to affect change is just not smart.

I like 90% of what you say...real difficult to have any confidence in waiting for the team to develop when the meat of the team is currently suspended.

 

[RutgersYay]

[QUOTE="goru7, post: 1596038, member: 2194" I have seen Eddie as a player and he was one of the best defenders around so I know he knows how to play and coach defense . .[/QUOTE]

But you're wrong, the stats bear it out. He is a terrible defensive coach both here and in the pros.

Listen, I get it, you like Eddie. That's great. But the eye test and the statistics of the past 3 years, not to mention the record do to trend toward him ever having a successful team here. Next year, when he finds 4 Big Ten wins because has depth--and maybe he schedules enough cupcakes in the OOC to get to thirteen wins--we'll be having the same conversation. It's better to cut things off now and start the real rebuild now instead of delaying a year.

Eddie came here when things were bad and calmed the waters. But now, he is ruining the brand again--do you think anyone takes Rutgers seriously or thinks Eddie is going to turn things around? On his resume he has a 61 points loss, a 50 points loss, a 15 game losing streak, a 13 game ongoing losing streak... it's terrible.

But hey, if he stays, we'll be here again having this conversation and I'm sure you'll find another injury or chemistry problem to blame.