OT: Interesting article on unsupervised play and kids

[RU848789]

Many of us of a certain age (over 40 at least and probably over 50 especially) remember childhoods filled with unsupervised play - the sports of the season, made up games, building forts and treehouses, getting into mischief, riding bikes wherever we wanted, etc. And many of us as parents have seen kids over the last 20+ years being subjected to supervision in almost every way, mostly in the name of safety, driven by media, lawyers and parents (especially moms). I understand not wanting your kid to die in a tragic accident, but I also hate the fact that so many kids never get to take any risks at all on their own.

Most kids have far less unsupervised time to do whatever they want to do, which has always seemed sad to me and was why, as parents, my wife and I at least tried to reverse that tide ourselves a bit. Our house was the play house for a lot of local kids, with one of those big swing sets/forts in the yard and a basement that was 100% free from any adults, but we didn't go nearly as far as kids in our day, at least with regard to letting them go wherever they wanted in town (the other parents drew the line there). Well, here's a guy in California trying to go further than that, at least in his neighborhood, with mixed success. Interesting article...

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/23/m...t-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=1

 

[RU4Real]

Summer at my house prior to age 16:

0830: Out of bed
0930: Breakfast had, chores done
1000: Mandatory "out of the house"
1700: Mandatory dinner, unless prior arrangements made for absence
Streetlights on: Within hailing distance
2100 - 2200 (depending on age): Home

Between 1000 and 1700 there was no specific requirement that my whereabouts be known. The general rule was that if I wound up someplace completely and totally different from where I said I was going, I was supposed to call.

 

[FanuSanu52]

I feel like this is as much geographical as it is generational. Read this story on here all the time, and don't doubt it's happening, but I just don't see it. Kids in my neighborhood and town are out playing unsupervised all the time, riding bikes, hiking trails, making up games at the local park, etc. It's not all that different from when I was a kid.

My favorite recently was seeing kids playing front yard football with a makeshift field all decorated for the local rivalry game taking place that night.

 

[Tango Two]

Hopefully Rutgers beats Minnesota!

 

[RUInsanity]

Summer at my house prior to age 16:

0830: Out of bed
0930: Breakfast had, chores done
1000: Mandatory "out of the house"
1700: Mandatory dinner, unless prior arrangements made for absence
Streetlights on: Within hailing distance
2100 - 2200 (depending on age): Home

Between 1000 and 1700 there was no specific requirement that my whereabouts be known. The general rule was that if I wound up someplace completely and totally different from where I said I was going, I was supposed to call.

Pretty much the same except Dinner at 6 PM and inside by 8 PM and usually we were Hailed by my mother's shout of "Dinner"....carried across almost the entire neighborhood.

 

[retired711]

a part of it is that families no longer have as many children as they used to -- I was one of four, as was my mother, and my father was one of nine. (one of whom in fact died in adolescence). The fewer the children -- and the more planned they are (I was a "surprise," but I think that's less common these days) -- the more value the parents put on each one, and the more the parents are able and want to be helicopter parents.

I was and am a terrible athlete, and so I really didn't do that as a kid. But I could walk to the public library any time I liked, and check out a book. (I was a big reader). My parents didn't have to approve the book, so they couldn't object if I took out books about baseball players. Nowadays, the library can be reached only by car, and the parents have much more influence over what the kids did.

Another difference is that it was acceptable for adults to step in even if they were not the parents of the children. I think nowadays an adult would be reluctant to do that these days for fear of being charged with God-knows -what. I am afraid to smile at a small kid for fear of being regarded as a potential child-molester.

Just my quick thoughts -- I'm probably way off base. Thanks to RU848789 for raising the topic.

 

[RU4Real]

There's also a difference in the level of danger inherent in the activities. We used to play full-out tackle football, without pads or helmets. I remember taking a line drive to the head during a sandlot baseball game that knocked me out, cold. We'd play "war" by throwing rocks at each other. We rode our bikes in the clay pits, which had been turned into motocross courses by years of such activities; there were jumps of sufficient height and length that broken equipment - and injuries - were not uncommon. All of these were basic, day to day activities.

And, of course, whenever there was a serious dispute among friends (or not-so-friends) it was settled by going out and kicking the shit out of each other.

 

[Knightmoves]

I feel like this is as much geographical as it is generational. Read this story on here all the time, and don't doubt it's happening, but I just don't see it. Kids in my neighborhood and town are out playing unsupervised all the time, riding bikes, hiking trails, making up games at the local park, etc. It's not all that different from when I was a kid.

My favorite recently was seeing kids playing front yard football with a makeshift field all decorated for the local rivalry game taking place that night.

When was the last time you saw a group of kids have a pickup baseball or touch football game at a park in a suburban area ?

 

[ManasquanMike]

There's also a difference in the level of danger inherent in the activities. We used to play full-out tackle football, without pads or helmets. I remember taking a line drive to the head during a sandlot baseball game that knocked me out, cold. We'd play "war" by throwing rocks at each other. We rode our bikes in the clay pits, which had been turned into motocross courses by years of such activities; there were jumps of sufficient height and length that broken equipment - and injuries - were not uncommon. All of these were basic, day to day activities.

And, of course, whenever there was a serious dispute among friends (or not-so-friends) it was settled by going out and kicking the shit out of each other.

Where did you grow up? Sounds like my childhood, minus the clay pits. They were just trails on the "other side" of the river in Bergen county

 

[RutgersUnion]

Im raising my son in Manhattan and unfortunately there is no more unsupervised play anymore. Nothing like what we grew up with in the suburbs.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

There's also a difference in the level of danger inherent in the activities. We used to play full-out tackle football, without pads or helmets. I remember taking a line drive to the head during a sandlot baseball game that knocked me out, cold. We'd play "war" by throwing rocks at each other. We rode our bikes in the clay pits, which had been turned into motocross courses by years of such activities; there were jumps of sufficient height and length that broken equipment - and injuries - were not uncommon. All of these were basic, day to day activities.

And, of course, whenever there was a serious dispute among friends (or not-so-friends) it was settled by going out and kicking the shit out of each other.

Pretty much what he said...we used to kick the crap out of one another whether it was on the court in the backyard, on bike trails in the woods, or pretty much anywhere else...until mom yelled from the front porch!

 

[T2Kplus10]

The sad thing is, based on a 20/20 report that I saw several years ago, crime against children is practically the same as it was in the 50's, 60's, and 70's. I think the only type of crime that is up is via ex/divorced spouses (probably due to custody issues). The fear society has today is essentially baseless.

 

[lakejj]

There's also a difference in the level of danger inherent in the activities. We used to play full-out tackle football, without pads or helmets. I remember taking a line drive to the head during a sandlot baseball game that knocked me out, cold. We'd play "war" by throwing rocks at each other. We rode our bikes in the clay pits, which had been turned into motocross courses by years of such activities; there were jumps of sufficient height and length that broken equipment - and injuries - were not uncommon. All of these were basic, day to day activities.

And, of course, whenever there was a serious dispute among friends (or not-so-friends) it was settled by going out and kicking the shit out of each other.

I literally almost didn't go a single summer without stitches or a cast, causing me to miss weeks of competitive swimming each summer... but I was one of four...

 

[RU4Real]

Where did you grow up? Sounds like my childhood, minus the clay pits. They were just trails on the "other side" of the river in Bergen county

Sayreville - which exists, quite literally, because of its clay pits.

 

[Knight Shift]

There's also a difference in the level of danger inherent in the activities. We used to play full-out tackle football, without pads or helmets. I remember taking a line drive to the head during a sandlot baseball game that knocked me out, cold. We'd play "war" by throwing rocks at each other. We rode our bikes in the clay pits, which had been turned into motocross courses by years of such activities; there were jumps of sufficient height and length that broken equipment - and injuries - were not uncommon. All of these were basic, day to day activities.

And, of course, whenever there was a serious dispute among friends (or not-so-friends) it was settled by going out and kicking the shit out of each other.

Where did you grow up? Sounds like my childhood, minus the clay pits. They were just trails on the "other side" of the river in Bergen county

Mine too. I grew up in the Manasquan Park section of Wall. Lots of undeveloped woods, where we built forts, on the ground, in trees, and in hills. Made motocross trails, jumps, ramps, and blood and bruises were badges of honor. We also spent a lot of time along and on the Manasquan River. In the winter, we would go ice skating unsupervised. When the ice started to melt, we would have iceberg demolition derbies on huge chunks of ice where the water was not over our head. We wound up in the cold water quite a bit. None of our parents scolded us or told us not to do it again. Starting in 7th and 8th grade, we were drinking in the woods, and some kids were smoking cigarettes and other stuff. I had one friend who was in the woods drinking and smoking in 5th grade. I cleared a lot of stuff out of my system, and I don't drink at all now.

We live 1/4 mile from a public boat ramp and dock, and my kids can go down there any time they want. They never do. They can also ride their bikes to the beach or to Hartshorne Woods, and they never do that either,except when I go mountain biking with my son, who is in high school. The problem is their friends live far from our neighborhood, and I never see any local kids down at the boat ramp/dock our out at Hartshorne Woods. But they can all kick my ass in Minecraft and Call of Duty.

Guessing every generation looks at kids and feel they had a better childhood in some way. Things seem to turn out OK anyway.

 

[cubuffsdoug]

There's also a difference in the level of danger inherent in the activities. We used to play full-out tackle football, without pads or helmets. I remember taking a line drive to the head during a sandlot baseball game that knocked me out, cold. We'd play "war" by throwing rocks at each other. We rode our bikes in the clay pits, which had been turned into motocross courses by years of such activities; there were jumps of sufficient height and length that broken equipment - and injuries - were not uncommon. All of these were basic, day to day activities.

And, of course, whenever there was a serious dispute among friends (or not-so-friends) it was settled by going out and kicking the shit out of each other.

I miss those days.[cheers] I started wearing Nike after an accident on my bike. Ran up the side of a tree and the pedal ripped up my leg leaving a scar that looked like the Nike swoosh.

 

[T2Kplus10]

Mine too. I grew up in the Manasquan Park section of Wall. Lots of undeveloped woods, where we built forts, on the ground, in trees, and in hills. Made motocross trails, jumps, ramps, and blood and bruises were badges of honor. We also spent a lot of time along and on the Manasquan River. In the winter, we would go ice skating unsupervised. When the ice started to melt, we would have iceberg demolition derbies on huge chunks of ice where the water was not over our head. We wound up in the cold water quite a bit. None of our parents scolded us or told us not to do it again. Starting in 7th and 8th grade, we were drinking in the woods, and some kids were smoking cigarettes and other stuff. I had one friend who was in the woods drinking and smoking in 5th grade. I cleared a lot of stuff out of my system, and I don't drink at all now.

We live 1/4 mile from a public boat ramp and dock, and my kids can go down there any time they want. They never do. They can also ride their bikes to the beach or to Hartshorne Woods, and they never do that either,except when I go mountain biking with my son, who is in high school. The problem is their friends live far from our neighborhood, and I never see any local kids down at the boat ramp/dock our out at Hartshorne Woods. But they can all kick my ass in Minecraft and Call of Duty.

Guessing every generation looks at kids and feel they had a better childhood in some way. Things seem to turn out OK anyway.

Did the same exact thing growing up in East Brunswick, mainly in Frost Woods but also a few local sand pits. First pedal bikes and then real dirt bikes (that started in 7th grade). We had several amazing tracks in the Woods, we rode all day with the occasional visit from the cops to chase us out. That's when we broke out the 4-stroke bikes and went back to work! Amazing times. Shocking that there weren't more serious injuries, but a friend of mine did hit a tree once and broke his hip and collarbone. That wasn't fun.

 

[pmvon]

Some people I knew snuck out in the middle of the night and lifted wood from a local development to build a killer half pipe that let to several broken bones once constructed.

 

[T2Kplus10]

Sayreville - which exists, quite literally, because of its clay pits.

Mom from Sayreville, Dad from South River, grew-up in EB. My grandparents lived in Parlin and I had tons of cousins in both towns. I remember riding in one particular sand/clay pit a few times in SV behind the existing Brick House Bar & Grill. Sad to see that area plowed under.

 

[Knightmoves]

Mom from Sayreville, Dad from South River, grew-up in EB. My grandparents lived in Parlin and I had tons of cousins in both towns. I remember riding in one particular sand/clay pit a few times in SV behind the existing Brick House Bar & Grill. Sad to see that area plowed under.

Do they still call folks from South River "River Rats ?"

 

[LC-88]

Another difference is that it was acceptable for adults to step in even if they were not the parents of the children. I think nowadays an adult would be reluctant to do that these days for fear of being charged with God-knows -what. I am afraid to smile at a small kid for fear of being regarded as a potential child-molester.

Good post CLP. Sadly I think you are right. Parents are quicker to blame, post crap on social media, and call "the authorities" than when alot of us were kids. Dad's and Mom's in the neighborhood tended to work things out on the front porch, or at the kitchen table.

 

[FanuSanu52]

When was the last time you saw a group of kids have a pickup baseball or touch football game at a park in a suburban area ?

I feel like I just mentioned football in my post. As for timing, it was last month. Football and soccer I see pretty regularly at the park, baseball, not so much.

Then again, I didn't see baseball all that regularly when I was a kid, either. It's not always easy to get that many kids together, even if you have a park close enough.

 

[newwavedave1]

Sounds a lot like how I grew up. Outside constantly playing football, baseball, wiffleball, swimming, hide and seek, Army (using sticks as guns), and riding bikes everywhere. No such thing as a "play date".

 

[RobertG]

When was the last time you saw a group of kids have a pickup baseball or touch football game at a park in a suburban area ?

last Saturday when I took the dog for a walk.

 

[bac2therac]

back in the 70s and into the early 80s growing up in Hillsborough the recreation department sponsored something called "Summer Rec" at the 4 elementary schools for about 6 weeks in the summer. It ran from 9-2:30 and had 3 counselors although many times just 2. There was no registeration, no sign ins, no checklist, no lunch served, no insurance papers. Basically parents dropped them off outside the school and the kid went in on his own and the parent then picked the kid up outside the school... in my case my mom started working so often was late, the counselors would leave by 3 and leave anyone who was left alone to be picked up. Can you imagine that today, leaving 9 year olds by themselves with no supervision.

They did have organized kickball games and competition between the different schools but other than that each kid basically fended for themselves with no structure. There was pingpong, shuffleoard, knock hockey and arts and crafts inside, if you wanted to play kickball you did, if you wanted to go on the playground you did, if you wanted to take a walk in the woods you did, many of us walked to the Pals Inn at the corner to get soda and chips..leaving the school property without anyone checking or caring. And get this, if you brought your lunch there was no cooler...you had turkey or salami sandwiches sittinig out all day in a cubbyhole and no one got sick...no one was allergic to peanuts either. And there were no participation trophies either...you got first, 2nd or third ribbons..if you were a meek snowflake too bad you did a lot of arts and crafts with the girls.

I think we grew up quicker because we had to and we werent babied and treated like veal, thank god there were no distractions like phones and internet

 

[bac2therac]

I feel like I just mentioned football in my post. As for timing, it was last month. Football and soccer I see pretty regularly at the park, baseball, not so much.

Then again, I didn't see baseball all that regularly when I was a kid, either. It's not always easy to get that many kids together, even if you have a park close enough.

in my job driving around, me and my brother always note how remarkable it is that we rarely see any kids outside in the summer at all, its quite noticable

 

[FanuSanu52]

in my job driving around, me and my brother always note how remarkable it is that we rarely see any kids outside in the summer at all, its quite noticable

I'd imagine just as noticeable as all the kids playing all summer at the park where I walk my lab. And walking through my backyard to get to the trails. And biking/hiking/walking those trails. And taking a break from riding their bikes around the neighborhood so they can pet said lab. And playing basketball or football in the street right outside my office window.

Or, I guess, considerably less noticeable.

 

[Jersey Boys]

Our weekend spring and summer days were spent playing pickup basketball or stickball ALL day... You needed to win on the court because there were literally 3-4 teams waiting to get on. A few years ago I happened to be in the neighborhood so I drove by the old basketball park one beautiful late spring and it was dead! Maybe 2 kids walking around and a kid shooting lay ups.

The first major snowstorm we played tackle football in the street if there was enough snow. Shout out to @S.B. Crumb.

Oh... And bottle rocket fights at night on rooftops in early July. Quite stupid I know, but we lived.

 

[FanuSanu52]

back in the 70s and into the early 80s growing up in Hillsborough the recreation department sponsored something called "Summer Rec" at the 4 elementary schools for about 6 weeks in the summer. It ran from 9-2:30 and had 3 counselors although many times just 2. There was no registeration, no sign ins, no checklist, no lunch served, no insurance papers. Basically parents dropped them off outside the school and the kid went in on his own and the parent then picked the kid up outside the school... in my case my mom started working so often was late, the counselors would leave by 3 and leave anyone who was left alone to be picked up. Can you imagine that today, leaving 9 year olds by themselves with no supervision.

They did have organized kickball games and competition between the different schools but other than that each kid basically fended for themselves with no structure. There was pingpong, shuffleoard, knock hockey and arts and crafts inside, if you wanted to play kickball you did, if you wanted to go on the playground you did, if you wanted to take a walk in the woods you did, many of us walked to the Pals Inn at the corner to get soda and chips..leaving the school property without anyone checking or caring. And get this, if you brought your lunch there was no cooler...you had turkey or salami sandwiches sittinig out all day in a cubbyhole and no one got sick...no one was allergic to peanuts either. And there were no participation trophies either...you got first, 2nd or third ribbons..if you were a meek snowflake too bad you did a lot of arts and crafts with the girls.

I think we grew up quicker because we had to and we werent babied and treated like veal, thank god there were no distractions like phones and internet

1. Summer Rec was awesome. I only went occasionally because I had a stay-at-home mom so no reason to go everyday. Good idea all around and a lot of fun as a kid.

2. Some of those things are really not examples of "better when I was a kid." Not bringing a cooler to keep your food in on a hot day? That just means you didn't have a cooler or weren't smart enough to bring it. No badge of honor for eating a hot, disgusting sandwich. Leaving school property during a supervised camp? That's really just negligence on the part of staff.

3. A third place ribbon in summer rec kickball is the quintessence of a participation trophy. I hope you didn't make your mom hang that on the fridge.

 

[bac2therac]

it wasnt negligence because thats how it was back then...it was a different kind of life, you may find it hard to believe but that was the norm...and in grade school and high school all the brown baggers had sandwiches that were not refrigerated...it was accepted...now I think everything is done with such precautions its unreal

 

[AreYouNUTS]

Who used to go to the quarry in Hopewell? Freakin' fantastic! Ice cold water! Loved that place!

 

[OntheBanks]

I remember when I was in 8th grade I got on my bike and rode from my house on the border of South Amboy & Sayreville down Bordentown Ave. to my aunts house in Spotswood. After visiting for a while I rode back home.

 

[BoogieKnight]

We used to have tackle football in the park every Monday and Wednesday from 4th grade til 7th grade. I was like the organizer of our pick up games. Those were the days of the week we did NOT have organized PeeWee/Junior practice which were Tue/Thur/Friday nights. In 8th grade we were really good and the coach didn't want us getting hurt playing "has been" football so he'd drive past the parks to make sure we weren't playing anymore so that ended.

Rode bicycles, skateboards, played "battleroyale" wrestling matches with all the kids in the neighborhood, lit fireworks, played in the brush down by the train track and river. Remember one time building a makeshift launch and land bike ramp with tires stackedbetween. Someone eventually started a fire inside the tires and we were literally jumping open flames on our BMX bikes. And this was also in a parking lot in view of the street! Also used to ride the trails down the street from Teaneck DQ which are private woods adjacent to Overpeck Park. The older kids must have been doing crazy s#it down there. One New Year's Eve afternoon when I was about 10 years old it was me and a kid2 years older left in the neighborhood battle Royale. I held my own but kid overpowered me eventually. It was in an open lot across the street from my house. I caught my mom watching for a good 10 minutes before she finally called me in for the night. Built toughness.

 

[FanuSanu52]

it wasnt negligence because thats how it was back then...it was a different kind of life, you may find it hard to believe but that was the norm...and in grade school and high school all the brown baggers had sandwiches that were not refrigerated...it was accepted...now I think everything is done with such precautions its unreal

I carried brown bag lunches throughout much of school, too. That doesn't mean I boycott the refrigerator at work now or carry food in a garbage bag to a picnic. You may find that sometimes people do things better than you did them as a kid. You work outside - do you not take a cooler to work in mid-July?

 

[mikebal9]

I played roller hockey outside my friend Pat's house at least 5 days a week. I'd sometimes be there for 10 or 12 hours. My mom knew what neighborhood I was in and that Pat's mom would look after all of us and feed us if need be.
The only time I got into a fist fight, I walked in and my mom said, "Heard you got a bloody nose today." She got a call from another mom because that's how it worked back then.

 

[Jersey Boys]

Someone eventually started a fire inside the tires and we were literally jumping open flames on our BMX bikes. And this was also in a parking lot in view of the street! Also used to ride the trails down the street from Teaneck DQ which are private woods adjacent to Overpeck Park. The older kids must have been doing crazy s#it down there.

To this day I still wish I still had my original Skyway Streetbeat. That thing kicked ass. Would kill to get it back. I also had a GT Performer, but nothing beat the Skyway.

 

[RU_Planning]

What ages are we talking about?

I'd say middle school through high school I don't see much helicoptering at all where I live. Younger kids it's absurd with play dates and such, but it seems like once kids ride the subway on their own they have a lot of free reign.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

We used to have tackle football in the park every Monday and Wednesday from 4th grade til 7th grade..

If the back yards (we played the entire length of our yard and our neighbors...maybe 60 yards total) were too muddy due to rain (development was built on a swamp and we have a creek about 120-feet back) we played on the street. Luckily it was a very wide street, could easily be a 4-lane highway, with very few cars parked on it as all homes had driveways that could fit 2-4 cars. Great times!

We also had 4 families with "home" fields, on the streets, for stick ball. Again, the wide streets a huge plus, as was the dead-end cul de sac 4 houses down!

 

[MozRU]

Grew up in Somerville in the 1980s.

Walnut Street park football games were a foregone conclusion when we had ten of us. Daily during the summer.

During the school year? Van Derveer, Sundays. the boys played a massive game in the circle. Had to cycle kids in and out it got so big. The girls hung out on the strairs. Heard "Wanted Dead or Alive," for the first time there on someone's boom box.

Parents kicked us out of the house at 8am and we had to be back in when the sun came down. You had ride a Diamondback, Mongoose, Redline or a GT or skate on Powell Peralta.

F*** I had a great childhood.

Parents today must have really hated theirs for locking up their kids the way they do today.

 

[BoroKnight]

Do they still call folks from South River "River Rats ?"

They certainly did in North Brunswick, c. 1979. Back then the schools were much closer in size and played in the same conference, and we made a big deal out of the game since A. it was our opening game and B. we beat them like 2-0 a couple of years earlier in the mud to end some crazy winning streak.

Since then, no idea.