Perception of RU from top-tier recruits

[ouchmyknee]

My brother happens to be friendly with a few top 100 recruits and their families and had a nice talk over the weekend with some of the kids about recruiting. While most of the recruits my brother was with aren't considering Rutgers (I believe they all have offers), they did discuss RU and why they weren't in the mix. I think they're honest answers go a long way for showing just how tough it is to land program changers. Here's some bits:

On whether Rutgers has a shot to land them: after a brief chuckle, the general consensus was no. they like that the program seems to be on an upswing and the staff is good, but the program is just so much further down than other options. Would you rather go to Duke or Rutgers?

On whether the new practice facility has any effect: not really. every team has a practice facility.

Why not Rutgers: because they're not Kentucky or Duke.

On what Rutgers can do to start being in the mix: need to make the NCAAs consistently. need to consistently send players to the league.

After hearing that Rutgers has sent Quincy Douby and Hamady to the league: who?

So, yeah. It's tough.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

I think that is reality and I believe/hope the current staff understands they can't change that overnight. They need to build a roster with that assumption and realize the only way to change that is performance on the floor. If you don't realize this you are landing incomplete rejects from the Top 150 pool that most likely also have baggage.

 

[S.W.A.I.N]

THe thing with the practice facility is a brand spanking new one will just get us up to the level of everyone else...it won’t be a differentiator.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

Not anything here that is earth shattering. We are talking about a program that has not been to the NCAAs since 1992 and any post season since what....2005.

This program will be built with solid 3 star players, a few 4 stars and solid coaching.

 

[Johnny Biggs]

Pretty much what Coach Pike said when he took the job ruco.

 

[rubaseball78]

My brother happens to be friendly with a few top 100 recruits and their families and had a nice talk over the weekend with some of the kids about recruiting. While most of the recruits my brother was with aren't considering Rutgers (I believe they all have offers), they did discuss RU and why they weren't in the mix. I think they're honest answers go a long way for showing just how tough it is to land program changers. Here's some bits:

On whether Rutgers has a shot to land them: after a brief chuckle, the general consensus was no. they like that the program seems to be on an upswing and the staff is good, but the program is just so much further down than other options. Would you rather go to Duke or Rutgers?

On whether the new practice facility has any effect: not really. every team has a practice facility.

Why not Rutgers: because they're not Kentucky or Duke.

On what Rutgers can do to start being in the mix: need to make the NCAAs consistently. need to consistently send players to the league.

After hearing that Rutgers has sent Quincy Douby and Hamady to the league: who?

So, yeah. It's tough.

Having a new practice facility may not have an effect, but "not" having one would.

 

[kcg88]

Having a new practice facility may not have an effect, but "not" having one would.

Yup. Turning a disadvantage to something neutral is just like turning something neutral to an advantage IMO.

 

[RutgersMO]

My brother happens to be friendly with a few top 100 recruits and their families and had a nice talk over the weekend with some of the kids about recruiting. While most of the recruits my brother was with aren't considering Rutgers (I believe they all have offers), they did discuss RU and why they weren't in the mix. I think they're honest answers go a long way for showing just how tough it is to land program changers. Here's some bits:

On whether Rutgers has a shot to land them: after a brief chuckle, the general consensus was no. they like that the program seems to be on an upswing and the staff is good, but the program is just so much further down than other options. Would you rather go to Duke or Rutgers?

On whether the new practice facility has any effect: not really. every team has a practice facility.

Why not Rutgers: because they're not Kentucky or Duke.

On what Rutgers can do to start being in the mix: need to make the NCAAs consistently. need to consistently send players to the league.

After hearing that Rutgers has sent Quincy Douby and Hamady to the league: who?

So, yeah. It's tough.

How many players can Duke sign?

We need to get beyond the platitudes ...maybe ruffle a few feathers / get the players who will get us back to the dance before dancing is outlawed.

MO

 

[knights1212]

There is nothing here that we didn't already know. Coach & the staff are working hard. That is all we can ask for. I trust they will make good decisions and continue to move us forward.

 

[ouchmyknee]

There is nothing here that we didn't already know. Coach & the staff are working hard. That is all we can ask for. I trust they will make good decisions and continue to move us forward.

Agree we all knew this. Just wanted to share what came out of some recruits own mouths and not ours :)

 

[bowlgoal]

Pike is doing everything he can imo. The practice facility is going to help alot but the RAC itself needs a face lift as many have said for years. The outside looks even worse with the construction going on. You may not think it matters but I just try to picture myself visiting for the first time and pulling up the RAC and what my impression would be? I think it hurts

 

[RU84]

It's a chicken and egg thing: Rutgers isn't going to be a destination for top 100 recruits unless we win and make the NCAA's consistently. But it's going to be difficult to get there without these types of players. We're going to have to build with top 150 - 200 recruits, coach them up, hope they stay 3-4 years and maybe reach the point where we're in the NCAA mix. Then, maybe you land one of these players and it elevates your perception. See the Jay Wright playbook.

 

[sct1111]

I think a facelift for the RAC is a must. It's going to look weird next to a brand spanking new practice facility.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

This isn’t a surprise

Having said that...the recruit in the class of 2018 is clear uptick
-4 Star Mathis
-3 Star Harper
-3-4 star carter (depends whose ranking you like)

After last years class of
-3 Star Baker (as we know ...very under recruited)
- 4 star doucoure
-3 Star Johnson

Give me two more classes like this ...and I think we will be plus .500 in year four and on the NCAA bubble in year five. Development of testimony talent adds to the floor every year improvements

Do that ...then the 1 4-Star recruit per year out of 3 may become 2 out of 3....and then, a couple of years later, the goal of making the tourment becomes making the second weekend of the tourney...

 

[HeyHuey]

I think a facelift for the RAC is a must. It's going to look weird next to a brand spanking new practice facility.

I can't find anything about dolling up the RAC. I've seen artist renderings that look like they will build out the front to match the building foundation line of the new practice center. A lower height than the RAC or Practice Center that may house ticket office upgrades and better concession areas. I can't find anything that confirms that is true or just part of the artist's concept for that space.
Re-posting the link for the live cam on top of the Business School building looking back to the construction. Amazing progress since last November.

http://scarletknights.com/sports/2018/2/2/rwjbarnabas-health-athletic-performance-center.aspx

 

[RUJMM78]

It's a chicken and egg thing: Rutgers isn't going to be a destination for top 100 recruits unless we win and make the NCAA's consistently. But it's going to be difficult to get there without these types of players. We're going to have to build with top 150 - 200 recruits, coach them up, hope they stay 3-4 years and maybe reach the point where we're in the NCAA mix. Then, maybe you land one of these players and it elevates your perception. See the Jay Wright playbook.

What Rutgers is doing has to be compared with league opponents who continue to bring in higher level talent.As such it will be very difficult to have winning teams and ultimately NCAA bids.Three star recruits are plentiful but very few of them are difference makers.Squads full of complementary type players won't get the job done in the B1G.

 

[S_Janowski]

My brother happens to be friendly with a few top 100 recruits and their families and had a nice talk over the weekend with some of the kids about recruiting. While most of the recruits my brother was with aren't considering Rutgers (I believe they all have offers), they did discuss RU and why they weren't in the mix. I think they're honest answers go a long way for showing just how tough it is to land program changers. Here's some bits:

On whether Rutgers has a shot to land them: after a brief chuckle, the general consensus was no. they like that the program seems to be on an upswing and the staff is good, but the program is just so much further down than other options. Would you rather go to Duke or Rutgers?

On whether the new practice facility has any effect: not really. every team has a practice facility.

Why not Rutgers: because they're not Kentucky or Duke.

On what Rutgers can do to start being in the mix: need to make the NCAAs consistently. need to consistently send players to the league.

After hearing that Rutgers has sent Quincy Douby and Hamady to the league: who?

So, yeah. It's tough.

We also aren't getting some of these recruits because we don't offer bags of cash.

Hopefully Pike can get us to the tourney with 100-200 level recruits.

Once we go dancing Rutgers will get an insane amount of PR locally/nationally and Rutgers basketball may actually be a destination where you don't have to offer bags to get a blue chip.

 

[KnightsofChrome]

2018 Sweet Sixteen teams.........How many of these teams had top 100 players out of H.S.? Serious question;
1. Loyola ?
2. Nevada ?
3. Kansas State ?
4. Clemson ?
5. Texas Tech. ?
There are a few others, but none of these teams just roll off of our tongue when thinking of a pathway to the NBA. But, yet we still believe that to build solid programs we must adhere and convince the "one-n-done" crowd that Rutgers is a viable option to Duke, Kentucky, North Carolina, and even Syracuse. Teams like Gonzaga, Villanova, Seton Hall, have all proven this to be the wrong way to build a program.
Stay the course Rutgers, the right players who also see the value of a great education will make this program the envy of North East College Basketball. At least that's my hope.

 

[HeyHuey]

What Rutgers is doing has to be compared with league opponents who continue to bring in higher level talent.As such it will be very difficult to have winning teams and ultimately NCAA bids.Three star recruits are plentiful but very few of them are difference makers.Squads full of complementary type players won't get the job done in the B1G.

Coach P can change the game. Jay Wright did. If you look at the recruiting class rankings for Villanova (with 2 National Championships - 2016, 2018) you appreciate the impact that the coach and the culture have. Villanova rankings: 2013 #36, 2014 #48, 2015 #29, 2016 #45, 2017 #28 and 2018 #13. No top 10s.

per: https://247sports.com/Season/2018-Basketball/CompositeTeamRankings

 

[higgins3]

Interesting.

 

[RU76]

Calipari inherited a UMass team with 10 straight losing seasons and no post-season for a quarter century. Year 2 he was in the NIT. It can be done.

 

[King of S]

Calipari inherited a UMass team with 10 straight losing seasons and no post-season for a quarter century. Year 2 he was in the NIT. It can be done.

Look what Hurley did at URI.

 

[TMCB]

True but not all those kids can get a duke or kent offer

 

[ScarletKid2008]

Calipari inherited a UMass team with 10 straight losing seasons and no post-season for a quarter century. Year 2 he was in the NIT. It can be done.

> See bag man strategy <

 

[richthedentist]

Calipari inherited a UMass team with 10 straight losing seasons and no post-season for a quarter century. Year 2 he was in the NIT. It can be done.

Can’t use Calipari and U Mass talk about paying recruit come on!! Then he left them on probation!

 

[KnightsofChrome]

Calipari inherited a UMass team with 10 straight losing seasons and no post-season for a quarter century. Year 2 he was in the NIT. It can be done.

Yes, it can be done. And, it's done a lot. The real question is what about year 3, 4, 5, 6, 7.....?
BTW, 10 points for the first person to name a HOF Basketball player to graduate from UMass.......

 

[shields]

Dr. J.

 

[KevH]

Agree we all knew this. Just wanted to share what came out of some recruits own mouths and not ours :)

It's a good thing you shared. It's candid and valuable insight... straight from the horses' mouths, so to speak. Not merely message board opinion. As obvious as it might be to some, there are quite a few fans here who expect us to suddenly fill our roster with 4 and 5 star kids. Based on what? A promise?

Like it or not, this thing is gonna be built/earned the hard way. Someone here recently talked about loading the bases and singling in the run versus a home run with nobody on. A single here, stolen base there... We first have to get to a place where we have something to sell kids who have "name brand" options galore... something more than promises. I really believe Pikes will get us there.

 

[Russ Wood]

Pike is doing everything he can imo. The practice facility is going to help alot but the RAC itself needs a face lift as many have said for years. The outside looks even worse with the construction going on. You may not think it matters but I just try to picture myself visiting for the first time and pulling up the RAC and what my impression would be? I think it hurts

I thought it was a bomb/fallout shelter when someone showed me a picture of the building's exterior a few years ago, not an arena.

 

[ouchmyknee]

2018 Sweet Sixteen teams.........How many of these teams had top 100 players out of H.S.? Serious question;
1. Loyola ?
2. Nevada ?
3. Kansas State ?
4. Clemson ?
5. Texas Tech. ?
There are a few others, but none of these teams just roll off of our tongue when thinking of a pathway to the NBA. But, yet we still believe that to build solid programs we must adhere and convince the "one-n-done" crowd that Rutgers is a viable option to Duke, Kentucky, North Carolina, and even Syracuse. Teams like Gonzaga, Villanova, Seton Hall, have all proven this to be the wrong way to build a program.
Stay the course Rutgers, the right players who also see the value of a great education will make this program the envy of North East College Basketball. At least that's my hope.

I didn’t look it up, but I’d guess 4 outta 5 of those teams had at least 1 top 100 player.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

Pike is doing everything he can imo. The practice facility is going to help alot but the RAC itself needs a face lift as many have said for years. The outside looks even worse with the construction going on. You may not think it matters but I just try to picture myself visiting for the first time and pulling up the RAC and what my impression would be? I think it hurts

It's amazing that with all the interviews that Hobbs has given that no reporter has asked him a direct question about how ugly the RAC looks from the outside and why he not done some cosmetic improvements. It is embarrassing.

 

[KevH]

It's amazing that with all the interviews that Hobbs has given that no reporter has asked him a direct question about how ugly the RAC looks from the outside and why he not done some cosmetic improvements. It is embarrassing.

I noticed the same thing. I'm not talking anything major, just cosmetic stuff for now. I get that money's tight.

Hey, maybe they'll surprise us and bring in one of those makeover shows! I hear Trading Spaces is coming back to tv.

 

[RUsince52]

The NCAA' s are probably a dream at this point, but make it to the NIT and win a few games and kids that can help us might take notice. Not every top 100 kid will go to every top school so maybe it opens some doors and we receive more consideration. Winning changes everything because these kids aren't use to losing and progress will only take us so far. Let's worry about that once we reach that point.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

I noticed the same thing. I'm not talking anything major, just cosmetic stuff for now. I get that money's tight.

Hey, maybe they'll surprise us and bring in one of those makeover shows! I hear Trading Spaces is coming back to tv.

With the RU Build Fund I'm sure there is some money... Heck, I'll drive from Ohio and volunteer some time to paint....lol

 

[kcg88]

2018 Sweet Sixteen teams.........How many of these teams had top 100 players out of H.S.? Serious question;
1. Loyola ?
2. Nevada ?
3. Kansas State ?
4. Clemson ?
5. Texas Tech. ?
There are a few others, but none of these teams just roll off of our tongue when thinking of a pathway to the NBA. But, yet we still believe that to build solid programs we must adhere and convince the "one-n-done" crowd that Rutgers is a viable option to Duke, Kentucky, North Carolina, and even Syracuse. Teams like Gonzaga, Villanova, Seton Hall, have all proven this to be the wrong way to build a program.
Stay the course Rutgers, the right players who also see the value of a great education will make this program the envy of North East College Basketball. At least that's my hope.

Nevada is the hot transfer school right now the way Iowa State was under Fred Hoiberg. Both Caleb and Cody Martin were top-75 players in their HS draft. They didn't get them out of high school (obviously) but they won the transfer recruiting battle over Pikiell.

Shelton Mitchell and Donte Grantham on Clemson were both top-100 players out of high school, and they won the transfer recruiting battle for Marcquise Reed from Robert Morris.

Texas Tech didn't get any top-100 guys out of HS, but they got the top JUCO point guard in Niem Stevenson and won the transfer battle (again over Pikiell) for top-100 Brandone Francis.

Kansas State is a valid exception, because they had 3* Dean Wade explode after his freshman year. It would be terrific if Geo Baker makes that same kind of jump but that's not exactly the kind of thing you can count on. Loyola is a special case because they're not targeting top-100 guys, so of course they don't have any.

As to your other cases... Villanova and Gonzaga have been so good for so long that Jay Wright and Mark Few are essentially able to pick their recruits that fit their system. By the way, both Gonzaga (Zach Collins) and Villanova (Jahvon Quinerly) either have had or will have a one-and-done guy. Seton Hall pulled in one special class and had it all work out. Again, that's not the kind of thing you can count on.

It's POSSIBLE to outperform your recruiting, but it isn't very likely. If we continue to recruit at a bottom-3 level in the conference then we're going to continue to finish at or near the bottom of the conference.

By the way, Vanderbilt went 12-20 this season and is pulling in two, maybe three 5-star kids if Langford chooses there.

 

[RUJMM78]

It's amazing that with all the interviews that Hobbs has given that no reporter has asked him a direct question about how ugly the RAC looks from the outside and why he not done some cosmetic improvements. It is embarrassing.

Hobbs has a very difficult job where there are so many urgent needs and the lack of resources to catch up with league opponents in coaching salaries and facilities.The RAC like the mens basketball program was ignored for decades largely because the focus within the athletic department was primarily on football.The need for a exterior promenade/entrance for the RAC has been recognized by previous athletic directors but there was no money and the renderings became dust collectors.

 

[Mr Magoo]

Hobbs has a very difficult job where there are so many urgent needs and the lack of resources to catch up with league opponents in coaching salaries and facilities.The RAC like the mens basketball program was ignored for decades largely because the focus within the athletic department was primarily on football.The need for a exterior promenade/entrance for the RAC has been recognized by previous athletic directors but there was no money and the renderings became dust collectors.

This is the truth and if it was a prioroty, it would get done. Unfortunately, it’s still not. I felt there was some momentum with the practice facility but now it’s starting to feel like we are spinning our wheels again.

I brought two people to different games at the RAC this year who hadn’t been there in twenty years and they were dumbfounded. They said it was like a time warp. The RAC is an embarrassment. I’m not talking about a new arena but cosmetic changes/updates would go a long way. We’re in the B1G ten now and we have to start acting like it.

 

[kcg88]

Anyway I'm not so much interested in why guys like Jahvon Quinerly or other 5 stars aren't interested but moreso in why we've been the runner up and not the winner for guys like Jose Alvarado, the Martin twins, Vance Jackson, Tai Strickland, Brandone Francis, and others that the staff has pushed hard for. Basically my worry is that the staff is targeting realistic candidates, pushing hard, and not winning enough of them. Mathis is the big exception of course and hopefully we see more of that and less of us being the only high-major to offer players. Because to win with that recruiting strategy you have to have such a high hit rate and it's been a mixed bag with that from this staff so far (Baker, Omoruyi, and Thiam on one side and Mensah and Bullock on the other... We'll see where Harper lands).

 

[bac2therac]

wait so there are plenty of schools besides Duke/Kentucky, its not either/or, all these kids are not going to Duke so their answers are sort of bs....

I think the main point is about making the NCAA tournament, kids do not want to go to schools that lose and lose alot and have not made the tourney in 27 years..too much of a risk when they can go to a school that has had some succcess.

as for practice facility yes its important, yes every other schools has one, but not having one was basically a non starter for any recruit. It just allows RU to have the basic every other school has but will not be an advantage compared to other schools

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

wait so there are plenty of schools besides Duke/Kentucky, its not either/or, all these kids are not going to Duke so their answers are sort of bs....

I think the main point is about making the NCAA tournament, kids do not want to go to schools that lose and lose alot and have not made the tourney in 27 years..too much of a risk when they can go to a school that has had some succcess.

as for practice facility yes its important, yes every other schools has one, but not having one was basically a non starter for any recruit. It just allows RU to have the basic every other school has but will not be an advantage compared to other schools

Eliminating another thing that schools can use to negative recruit against Rutgers is important.