Well to @camdenlawprof 's point, business casual or just casual is different for guys and gals. Maybe the wardrobe isn't as extensive as it used to be but it's still more than what we have to deal with.
Rutgers College arts and sciences vs Indiana
- Thread starter RUfubar
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I dunno....it seemed to me that under the business casual (and lesser) dress code/policy, women have it easier and more fleixible than men. It's for full business attire that I feel men have typically had it easier.
Like some schools, it appears that IU has a University Division that most freshmen are admitted into before they move into IU's A&S School/College or certain other undergraduate schools (by sophomore year and/or upon declaration of their major). Alternatively, I believe undergrad business students enter as freshmen directly into IU-Kelley unless they transfer in later.
At Rutgers-NB the arts & sciences freshman are admitted into SAS, business into RBS, agriculture/environmental into SEBS (formerly Cook), engineering into SOE, pharmacy into EMSOP, etc. No such general division exists at RU-NB (or has ever existed? at least in recent memory). Same at Newark and Camden as well. Even when University College existed as a separate academic unit until 2007, it was simply one of four A&S schools in NB along with the other three (RC, LC, DC).
I don't think the above is much of a factor in the undergraduate experience of the two universities or the education received. Both are very good schools with large alumni networks. Because IU has historically had a greater percentage of OOS (esp. from the NY metro) than RU, it has enjoyed a greater reputation among some circles locally. But even in Indiana, many top students also shoot higher than IU for top privates or out-of-state publics.
At Rutgers-NB the arts & sciences freshman are admitted into SAS, business into RBS, agriculture/environmental into SEBS (formerly Cook), engineering into SOE, pharmacy into EMSOP, etc. No such general division exists at RU-NB (or has ever existed? at least in recent memory). Same at Newark and Camden as well. Even when University College existed as a separate academic unit until 2007, it was simply one of four A&S schools in NB along with the other three (RC, LC, DC).
I don't think the above is much of a factor in the undergraduate experience of the two universities or the education received. Both are very good schools with large alumni networks. Because IU has historically had a greater percentage of OOS (esp. from the NY metro) than RU, it has enjoyed a greater reputation among some circles locally. But even in Indiana, many top students also shoot higher than IU for top privates or out-of-state publics.
I'm in legal, outside counsel. I go to meetings where senior managers are in jeans. I wear slacks and bring a sport jacket, but often leave it in the car, and I still feel overdressed.
Women and men seem to dress fairly homogeneously in the engineering and tech. Slacks/pants/khakis and some sort of top.
We have some stuff. They have lots of options for the same style.
Same but different.
When I applied from Central NJ (an area that got both the NYC and Philly TV stations) I got scholarships from Temple and RU-C (and N, SHU) and Temple/SHU would have come out less. SJU and Brooklyn free. And this was in a much stronger legal economy.
I think RU-NB as an undergrad has less local competition. In the tri state area, there's Princeton, Yale, Columbia, NYU...IMO I think RU comes in right after. Stony Brook is not as good; Stevens is good but really only for engineering and TCNJ is a good small school.
Ok, OK, I'm sorry I said what I did about wardrobes. It occurs to me that the experience I'm talking about was 30 years ago, and things were quite different then. Still, even today women tend to need a more varied wardrobe than men, even if both sexes are wearing the same kind of thing.
I’m a boomer, and it was a different era, and of course universities were less expensive then. However, our parents didn’t try to influence us or help us very much.
I don’t recall having even one conversation with my parents about where I went to college, and we were much more rebellious then, so if my parents tried to influence my choice, I wouldn’t have listened. Both of my parents are graduates of Syracuse University (they met on campus), but they never tried to get me to go there and I did not apply there. I accepted admission to a prestigious and expensive university, without considering much the cost. It was tough financially, but between scholarships, loans, part time work and high paying summer jobs, I paid for it. Starting at age 18, I handled all expenses myself.
My daughter however, is a Rutgers graduate and graduated with no debt at all.
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No need to apologize. What you said is generally correct for the legal profession. But both in corporations and smaller firms, dress codes are very casual. The white shoe firms are still quite formal in their dress code.
My parents didn't try to influence me either. Neither went to college. However, economics dictated that I went to Rutgers, even though I really wanted to go to Lehigh University, where I was accepted. In the end, I am glad I went to Rutgers.
When it came to our oldest son, we exerted no influence. In fact, I had encouraged him to go to UCLA, even though it would have been much more expensive for us. But he was very pragmatic about it, and said it would have been a waste of money for him to go there.
We tease our youngest about the fact that his parents are both Rutgers alums and his brother goes to Rutgers and that there is no pressure for him to go there. He is free to go to whatever school he chooses, except there is one forbidden school in our house, and that school is Penn State.
Do you have pants (nice pants) without pockets? That’s an example I was thinking about when saying the ladies side may dress similar but it’s still very different.
Who the hell has dress pants without pockets? LOL
Women typically carry a purse or a pocketbook. That provides a place for keys and a mobile phone, credit cards and cash.
Men can carry a murse (man-purse), but that may subject them to ridicule. When I go to a client, I usually carry a soft briefcase (not a murse!!!), and I could get by without pockets in my pants. However, can't imaging wearing pants without pockets.
I am the same about a belt too. If it has loops, put a belt on it.
But sometimes on their pants the loops seem just for show.
And what’s with the buttons on the opposite side for shirts and blazers/suit jackets?
Penn State has a neat little trick in their admissions. When you apply, you are given the opportunity to choose an alternate admission, either at a satellite campus, or through their summer program. My twins were both accepted to that hellhole, but my "lesser academic" son was admitted to the summer program. Upon successful completion of 6 credits the summer before Freshman year with a C or better, he can be fully admitted into the university as a matriculating student.
Question is, did he "get in" to Penn State? In his mind, yes. On his Naviance, he self-reported as "admitted". In Penn State's official statistics, no. He was offered the summer program, but not admitted as an incoming Freshman.
It's a genius idea when you think about it, the academic equivalent of "we never offered". If Rutgers made those under the 50 percentile admit spend their summer on campus before coming in as a Freshman, it would inflate both the rejection rate & the enrollment yield to make the school look elite on paper rather quickly.
The ones I’m referencing got into main campus at University Park. Right out of high school. No Altoona, Hershey or Summer Program.
And they were not all stars on the field or the classroom. But not hurting in the wallet.
LOL with the belt. What's a belt? I hate belts. IMO, buy pants that fit. If you need a belt, get a smaller waist size pair of pants! Many years ago, working in an engineering/factory environment, khakis/dockers were the uniform. One of the senior engineers bluntly asked me, "Don't you own a belt?" I forget my response, but I was a little astounded that he was so fixated on my lack of belt. Always wear a belt when I wear dress slack and a suit.
"However, economics dictated that I went to Rutgers, even though I really wanted to go to Lehigh University, where I was accepted. In the end, I am glad I went to Rutgers."
Same could have been said of me.... determined the extra $$ in loans that i would have taken out to go to Lehigh were not worth it. In the end one of the best decisions I made
Heck, for me, the difference was (IIRC) $13,500/year versus $6,000 per year, which at the time, was an astronomical difference. Nowadays, that difference is more on the order of $50,000/year. Even though my son would not have had any loan burden if he chose to not go to Rutgers, he did not see the value in spending the extra money on another school.
My wife and I each graduated from Rutgers, her the smart one with an engineering degree and me the one with two degrees. Seemingly her whole family — dad, two sisters, one brother-in-law —all went to TSFP. I’ve already told my kids, who are 17 months and almost 2.5 years old, that I will not pay for them to go to that school. When I’ve told others of this, they’ve laughed, and I quickly say, I’m not joking.
I’ve told this story before but a guy who I grew up with (our dads worked together and we did a lot of stuff with the family) had a brother who went to Rutgers while he didn’t go to college. Caught up with him at a college fair a few years ago as his daughter and my son are the same age. We’re chatting and trying to catch up while his daughter started to drift over to the State Penn table. Out of nowhere I hear in his deep voice...”DON’T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT!” Gave him a knowing nod and a “nice job, dad.”
When I was about to enter college nearly 60 years ago, I applied only to Rutgers and UPenn. I was accepted to both, but decided on Rutgers, and I am glad I did. First, it was more affordable, even though, as a PA resident, I had to pay out-of state tuition. Also, I was interested in UPenn because of its architecture school, but it was a 5-year degree program, which made it even more costly. I thought I could postpone architecture to a shorter post-graduate program, which is what I did with the help of a scholarship from Columbia.
Rutgers was a very different place from what it is today. Still in transition from a relatively small, all-male student body on a campus with vestiges of a quasi-Ivy past, to a large, diverse, public research university.
For any young person wanting to expand horizons, Rutgers clearly enjoys the advantage of physical location, in proximity to so many opportunities. UPenn was a good alternative because of Philly, but I had no interest at all in Penn State, stuck in the middle of Pennsyltucky.
Rutgers was a very different place from what it is today. Still in transition from a relatively small, all-male student body on a campus with vestiges of a quasi-Ivy past, to a large, diverse, public research university.
For any young person wanting to expand horizons, Rutgers clearly enjoys the advantage of physical location, in proximity to so many opportunities. UPenn was a good alternative because of Philly, but I had no interest at all in Penn State, stuck in the middle of Pennsyltucky.
Maine is small and most of the students are from Maine. Orono is very small and Bangor/Brewer are not great. That said, pace is slower and more relaxed. The student should really visit Orono and see if it is a fit. Most kids from New Jersey will experience culture shock.
My gf went to Rutgers NB for pharmacy school and IU for her MBA (online, but had to go to campus on occasion). Bloomington is a great college town and community, but it is really is in the middle of nowhere (an hour drive through cornfields from Indianapolis). The IU campus is gorgeous, and she was really impressed with the quality of the education she received and the people/faculty she encountered at IU, but Kelley is a top program so that’s not really surprising. You should look at the departments she’s interested in at each school to assess their strengths. The lack of diversity may also be a cultural shock in Indiana.
Lastly, one thing she says all the time is she was grateful to go to Rutgers first, as most of her friends she made there were also from NJ and have stayed in the area long-term. It’s really solid for career networking and remaining connected to your classmates after college when you “stay home” at your own state school. It’s even more advantageous if there’s a strong job market in your state for graduates in the major she’s considering.
Just some points 16 and 17 year olds don’t usually think about!
Lastly, one thing she says all the time is she was grateful to go to Rutgers first, as most of her friends she made there were also from NJ and have stayed in the area long-term. It’s really solid for career networking and remaining connected to your classmates after college when you “stay home” at your own state school. It’s even more advantageous if there’s a strong job market in your state for graduates in the major she’s considering.
Just some points 16 and 17 year olds don’t usually think about!
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This is a fantastic point. I'm beyond my 10 year alumni gathering and I'm still in regular contact with my friends from RU- meeting one on vacation tomorrow. And it's not something I thought about as a HS kid either.
I can totally understand comparing Indiana and Rutgers, but I really don’t understand the interest in Maine. Was it the billboard on the turnpike?!?! Maine is ranked significantly lower than IU or RU from an academic perspective. I get that rankings are not everything, but for biological and life sciences you gain a ton of credibility when you get your degree from strong research institutions with great faculty who pull in significant grant money.
Don’t know much about Maine, so maybe I shouldn’t be so critical. I just don’t think it has the same academic reputation as IU or RU.
Don’t know much about Maine, so maybe I shouldn’t be so critical. I just don’t think it has the same academic reputation as IU or RU.
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you're completely correct. Some people, I suppose, like the idea of being in Maine. I can't otherwise see why an NJ student who can get into Rutgers would go there for the same money.
