Sales pitch: Who has the most to offer recruits, transfers in the B1G?

[cubuffsdoug]

Basketball-related: I was this on the Michigan site. Kcg88 reps Rutgers over there. Maybe you can explain better than I can what the topic was all about. Based on what I understand are random coaches (anonymously) were asked to rank the teams of the B1G on tiers as to what they can offer recruits or transfers. IMO, Rutgers still suffers from perception and a lack of respect since most in the B1G (coaches, opposing fans, media) take little time to learn about Rutgers. They go with the herd mentality established decades ago. That perception is based on what Syracuse, BC, Penn St., etc created in the formative days of Rutgers as big-time sports, the 1970s. I do think the narrative is changing, but it's slow because some people refuse to change with the times. What do some of you think?

MichiganMan2424
May 19

Interesting ESPN article ($) on which Big Ten teams have the best sales pitches to recruits/transfers based on conversation with anonymous coaches.

ESPN.com 18

Sales pitch: Who has the most to offer recruits, transfers in the Big Ten? 18​

Jeff Borzello talked to anonymous coaches about the Big Ten schools that have the most and fewest recruiting advantages.


I don’t won’t to say too much since it’s paywalled, but the tiers are:
Tier 1: Indiana, Michigan, MSU, OSU
Tier 2: Maryland
Tier 3: Purdue, Illinois, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa
Tier 4: Nebraska
Tier 5: Rutgers, PSU, Northwestern


Like I said, interesting read if you have access. I will say the order in Tier 1 allegedly varied greatly. Every coach but 1 had Indiana in Tier 1, but there was a large divide among people who thought Indiana and MSU were the best two jobs versus people who liked Michigan/OSU. Apparently part of that had to do with the “football school” moniker, and whether people thought that was a good or bad thing.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

We have small crowds (hopefully had)
We don’t have history
We have a small fanbase
We are in a pro sports town

it is what it is. It gets worse with NIL

5 years ago the list had
Poor facilities
RAC is a dump

those have now been addressed. I think small crowds will change too.

 

[kcg88]

What I posted over there:

Ahem.

Rutgers shouldn’t be in the bottom tier. The RAC is a dump but it’s an endearing dump and at 8,000 capacity in a state of 9 million it’s not that hard to fill consistently if the team is half-decent. The new practice facility is really nice. The school is not “really struggling financially” and I don’t know where that comes from. We’re just about at a full share of Big Ten money, and on the football side we shelled out for Schiano and just paid $1 mil for his offensive coordinator.

The tier 3 ones listed have decades of big ten history so we’re definitely not up there. But Nebraska above Rutgers is confusing to me. Is it because they got a 5*? I mean even Fred Hill was able to convince Mike Rosario to come to Rutgers so I don’t see how it’s any tougher for us compared to them.

 

[cubuffsdoug]

We have small crowds (hopefully had)
We don’t have history
We have a small fanbase
We are in a pro sports town

it is what it is. It gets worse with NIL

5 years ago the list had
Poor facilities
RAC is a dump

those have now been addressed. I think small crowds will change too.

I think they are saying small crowds/small fanbase because of the size of the arena. A better judge of the crowd is the atmosphere of the place. The RAC, at times, can be electric. Since Pike's arrival, the RAC has been much better. Better than Nebraska or Minnesota. A pro sports town can be said for several B1G teams. I think it's a lame excuse. I do agree will change, but it will take time to break old habits and perceptions.

 

[RUtrumpet92]

What can Minnesota offer that we cannot? We are in the #1 media market in the world. Highly rated academic profile. Brand new practice facility. One of the top home-court advantages in the nation when our program gives the fanbase something to cheer about.

Nebraska's main selling point is they are the only game in the state. Beyond that... ?

I don't see Indiana as a 1st tier B1G program at this point. Nothing past the Sweet 16 since 2002. No NCAA since 2016. I would say they are tier 2 now with Maryland.

 

[cubuffsdoug]

What can Minnesota offer that we cannot? We are in the #1 media market in the world. Highly rated academic profile. Brand new practice facility. One of the top home-court advantages in the nation when our program gives the fanbase something to cheer about.

Nebraska's main selling point is they are the only game in the state. Beyond that... ?

I don't see Indiana as a 1st tier B1G program at this point. Nothing past the Sweet 16 since 2002. No NCAA since 2016. I would say they are tier 2 now with Maryland.

Indiana is living on its rep from years ago.

 

[NewJerseyHawk]

90% of writers in the B1G have not traveled to Piscataway for a game in either sport.....we actually have Middlesex County residents in their 40s and 50s, who have never set foot on RUs campus, but consider driving down Easton Avenue as qualifying to say they've seen campus.

The proof is in the evidence when you read other people's boards and have fans comment about attending a RU football game and being in and around campus. Most of the reviews are positive and place our tailgating up with most other campus stadiums.

It's only been 7 years, it's too early to worry about image just yet. Let's revisit this 4 to 5 years from now, with 4 to 5 years of a full share of revenue and 4 to 5 more years of Schiano and Pike and see what the verdict is then.

 

[RUJMM78]

How can Penn State be tier 5 and be a dominate recruiting school in many B1G sports except for basketball. which the school has shown very little interest.for decades.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

I think they are saying small crowds/small fanbase because of the size of the arena. A better judge of the crowd is the atmosphere of the place. The RAC, at times, can be electric. Since Pike's arrival, the RAC has been much better. Better than Nebraska or Minnesota. A pro sports town can be said for several B1G teams. I think it's a lame excuse. I do agree will change, but it will take time to break old habits and perceptions.

I believe you are wrong about Minnesota and Nebraska

 

[cubuffsdoug]

I believe you are wrong about Minnesota and Nebraska

You think Minnesota and Nebraska have a better atmosphere than the RAC since Pike's arrival? I think Minny has a nice mix of noise and excitement for the Barn, but nowhere as exciting as the RAC when all things are equal. Nebraska fans show up and support their teams, but you never hear about stories of how exciting their arena gets during big games. I have a story about Nebraska (football) during my freshman season at Colorado. We were in a tight game 7-0 late 4th quarter, and not once did NU crowd (full house) make noise to the point our offense had difficulties running plays. That's Nebraska in a nutshell for every sport.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

I should have read your post better. I was thinking in terms of size

 

[Degaz-RU]

Basketball-related: I was this on the Michigan site. Kcg88 reps Rutgers over there. Maybe you can explain better than I can what the topic was all about. Based on what I understand are random coaches (anonymously) were asked to rank the teams of the B1G on tiers as to what they can offer recruits or transfers. IMO, Rutgers still suffers from perception and a lack of respect since most in the B1G (coaches, opposing fans, media) take little time to learn about Rutgers. They go with the herd mentality established decades ago. That perception is based on what Syracuse, BC, Penn St., etc created in the formative days of Rutgers as big-time sports, the 1970s. I do think the narrative is changing, but it's slow because some people refuse to change with the times. What do some of you think?

MichiganMan2424
May 19

Interesting ESPN article ($) on which Big Ten teams have the best sales pitches to recruits/transfers based on conversation with anonymous coaches.

ESPN.com 18

Sales pitch: Who has the most to offer recruits, transfers in the Big Ten? 18​

Jeff Borzello talked to anonymous coaches about the Big Ten schools that have the most and fewest recruiting advantages.


I don’t won’t to say too much since it’s paywalled, but the tiers are:
Tier 1: Indiana, Michigan, MSU, OSU
Tier 2: Maryland
Tier 3: Purdue, Illinois, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa
Tier 4: Nebraska
Tier 5: Rutgers, PSU, Northwestern


Like I said, interesting read if you have access. I will say the order in Tier 1 allegedly varied greatly. Every coach but 1 had Indiana in Tier 1, but there was a large divide among people who thought Indiana and MSU were the best two jobs versus people who liked Michigan/OSU. Apparently part of that had to do with the “football school” moniker, and whether people thought that was a good or bad thing.

Everybody's got an opinion, and I guess I understand why Big Ten coaches would still have RU in Tier 5, but, WHY IN GOD'S NAME IS NEBRASKA IN TIER 4?!?

Seriously, what has Nebraska EVER done in college basketball? They have a cavernous, pro-like arena, and they don't have much history. And their recent history has been putrid. How they're not in Tier 5 is beyond me.

 

[RUsojo]

You guys are thinking too hard. You’re in the bottom tier until your program or head coach of your program has a long storied success of putting kids in the league. That’s it.

 

[cubuffsdoug]

You guys are thinking too hard. You’re in the bottom tier until your program or head coach of your program has a long storied success of putting kids in the league. That’s it.

The poll took more than one factor into account when judging. I think you ignored that part of the debate by focusing on the results of kids in the league.

 

[RUsojo]

The poll took more than one factor into account when judging. I think you ignored that part of the debate by focusing on the results of kids in the league.

Yes I did. Didn’t read the criteria my bad. Ultimately thought that’s mostly what matters

 

[Russ Wood]

Everybody's got an opinion, and I guess I understand why Big Ten coaches would still have RU in Tier 5, but, WHY IN GOD'S NAME IS NEBRASKA IN TIER 4?!?

Seriously, what has Nebraska EVER done in college basketball? They have a cavernous, pro-like arena, and they don't have much history. And their recent history has been putrid. How they're not in Tier 5 is beyond me.

Nebraska's basketball facilities are amazing and they have lots of money. That kept them out of the bottom tier because, as you pointed out, Nebraska's basketball history is bad.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Everybody's got an opinion, and I guess I understand why Big Ten coaches would still have RU in Tier 5, but, WHY IN GOD'S NAME IS NEBRASKA IN TIER 4?!?

Seriously, what has Nebraska EVER done in college basketball? They have a cavernous, pro-like arena, and they don't have much history. And their recent history has been putrid. How they're not in Tier 5 is beyond me.

News flash......what have we ever done? Nebraska has 1 NCAA appearance a 22 win season (w/o NCAA) and 4 total over .500 seasons since 2011. We have 2 seasons over .500 and 1 NCAA appearance.

We are trending in the right direction. They are trending in the wrong direction.

 

[kcg88]

News flash......what have we ever done? Nebraska has 1 NCAA appearance a 22 win season (w/o NCAA) and 4 total over .500 seasons since 2011. We have 2 seasons over .500 and 1 NCAA appearance.

We are trending in the right direction. They are trending in the wrong direction.

We had more NCAA wins last season than Nebraska has in their entire history.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

We had more NCAA wins last season than Nebraska has in their entire history.

but we never had this...

tim miles talking about wednesday - Search Videos

www.bing.com

 

[bac2therac]

News flash......what have we ever done? Nebraska has 1 NCAA appearance a 22 win season (w/o NCAA) and 4 total over .500 seasons since 2011. We have 2 seasons over .500 and 1 NCAA appearance.

We are trending in the right direction. They are trending in the wrong direction.

We are agreeing alot lately

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

We are agreeing alot lately

Let's not talk politics.

 

[Degaz-RU]

News flash......what have we ever done? Nebraska has 1 NCAA appearance a 22 win season (w/o NCAA) and 4 total over .500 seasons since 2011. We have 2 seasons over .500 and 1 NCAA appearance.

We are trending in the right direction. They are trending in the wrong direction.

Did I not say I understand why we’re in Tier 5?

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Did I not say I understand why we’re in Tier 5?

Sorry. You are correct Nebraska has been irrelevant in the college basketball scene. Perhaps that changes with NIL.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

let’s be honest about this

we went 16 years without a winning record and we went 29 years without a ncaa bid

we now went NCAA two years in a row ...which is a BIG first step toward Legitimacy, but still is a ways away from defining us on a higher level

let’s get to the NCAA 5 of the next 7 year’s after the last two year’s and the narrative is permanently changed

there is NO ONE other than Steve P who knows this more

this year’s challenge ...make it three in a row when some people (not me) think you stepped back

do that then then next challenge ...show we built a program ...and keep the success gojng after the geo/Jacob/myles and Ron/Montez/Caleb generation is gone and that it wasn’t just a couple of players that overachieved , but we built a program

if the get there this year and then next generation does 3 of 4....and we continue to recruit and backfill with talent to keep it gojng

everything will take care of itself

and the respect will come

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

Just one guys opinion. Wasn’t there another list that put us on a top list nationally for NIL beneficiaries? It’s going to help us that this was Geo’s movement and the university is behind him. It doesn’t matter that NJ also has pro sports - we also have a ton more people in general. Unlike NW, when Rutgers sports are good there is plenty of local support throughout the Tri State area (think 2006) and even now. Think of all those $52 donations from casual fans - that doesn’t happen at NW. no chance. Also, It doesn’t cost anything to follow people or watch videos on social media. Market size is going to be very relevant for NIL.

 

[cubuffsdoug]

Just one guys opinion. Wasn’t there another list that put us on a top list nationally for NIL beneficiaries? It’s going to help us that this was Geo’s movement and the university is behind him. It doesn’t matter that NJ also has pro sports - we also have a ton more people in general. Unlike NW, when Rutgers sports are good there is plenty of local support throughout the Tri State area (think 2006) and even now. Think of all those $52 donations from casual fans - that doesn’t happen at NW. no chance. Also, It doesn’t cost anything to follow people or watch videos on social media. Market size is going to be very relevant for NIL.

Rutgers posters have a habit of undervaluing Rutgers while overvaluing opposing teams. We look at things from a half-empty view.

 

[RUDiddy777]

Rutgers posters have a habit of undervaluing Rutgers while overvaluing opposing teams. We look at things from a half-empty view.

Think the article is pretty fair… and the acknowledgement of a coach that were the one tier 5 that could move up is a reflection of our potential. 2 good seasons won’t wash away the stink of 2 decades of irrelevance and embarrassment, but it’s starting to work. And the next 2 decades are looking really, really bright.

 

[cubuffsdoug]

For the most part, the article is fair, but you have to remember Rutgers isn't coming from an established position like Maryland (ACC) or protected by being a part of the B1G for decades. That leaves Rutgers open to being mocked consistently. As stated by another poster, few from of the media, fans, etc. have actually been to Rutgers or know much about it. Because of this, the new kid will always catch flack.

 

[HeavenUniv.]

Some of these articles/polls are so lazy I am surprised they even know Rutgers is in the Big Ten.

 

[Russ Wood]

Some of these articles/polls are so lazy I am surprised they even know Rutgers is in the Big Ten.

Since Jeff Borzello interviewed B1G coaches, I'm pretty sure they know that Rutgers is in the B1G 🤷🏾‍♂️

 

[HeavenUniv.]

Russ, not this specific one, but we have been in the Big Ten for a while now and some of the football and basketball writers still think we have the same kids as year one. I can usually pick them out when they talk about Coach Jordan or Coach Flood lol.

 

[bowlgoal]

It’s an interesting conversation. I tend to wonder what the one, over the top reason is for choosing a school. I think you have a select number of 4 and 5 star kids who are at a level where they can think they can compete for the national championship by going with the blue blood and also tell themselves that it gives them the best stage to showcase their talents to either the NFL or NBA, etc. I also think there are some 4 stars who don’t choose the brand name and there are a number of reasons behind that choice. Some want to play close to home and although winning a NC is not likely, they still are convinced that they not only have a great path to pro sports but they may feel they have a chance of seeing the field or court earlier in there college careers. And of course some are also interested in the education and I’m not minimizing that in any way. Schools like Rutgers, Northwestern and Michigan certainly use education for recruiting. Rutgers and NW have to use it more because Michigan’s sports success and academics are both at elite levels. Rutgers also uses the proximity to NYC and Wall Street very well in recruiting.

That brings us to NIL and something that is probably going to forge its way to the top of an athletes list I don’t love it because it’s just another advantage for schools with wealthy donors who have illegally paid athletes for years. The one positive is kids will stay in school longer because many will sign lucrative deals.

 

[letitrip2]

Just another stupid poll. Means nothing.

 

[HeavenUniv.]

 

[RUsojo]

NIL is not going to have a material impact on college basketball programs nor college basketball parity. It will have a material impact on players. That’s the whole point.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

Sorry. You are correct Nebraska has been irrelevant in the college basketball scene. Perhaps that changes with NIL.

That changes with their current coach.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

That changes with their current coach.

If he makes it

 

[huskersalways]

If he makes it

It’s year 3 of a complete transition/overhaul of the program. Nobody at NU is unhappy with what’s been happening. There are no holdover players left now and 11 of the scholarship guys are 4/5 star kids. This year may still be shaky but he is building the roster up more and more all the time. He is using a mix of transfers and high school kids.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

It’s year 3 of a complete transition/overhaul of the program. Nobody at NU is unhappy with what’s been happening. There are no holdover players left now and 11 of the scholarship guys are 4/5 star kids. This year may still be shaky but he is building the roster up more and more all the time. He is using a mix of transfers and high school kids.

Hopefully people have patience if he really is the right guy for the job.