Shooting in CHattanooga- 4 marines killed
- Thread starter rutgersdave
- Start date
Thoughts and prayers to the families of those Marines.
Recruiting centers are incredibly soft targets. Guaranteed military presence, virtually no security. In order to recruit well you can't put up a lot of barriers or hurdles that may dissuade people from coming in.
The only good part is the gunman died. They can comb through his computer and cell phone to see if he had any co-conspirators, but he was probably some maladjusted douche who was able to pass a background check.
Recruiting centers are incredibly soft targets. Guaranteed military presence, virtually no security. In order to recruit well you can't put up a lot of barriers or hurdles that may dissuade people from coming in.
The only good part is the gunman died. They can comb through his computer and cell phone to see if he had any co-conspirators, but he was probably some maladjusted douche who was able to pass a background check.
Every day we pay for George Bush's failure to do the right things on 9/12.Draw your own conclusions as to what they should have been,but suffice it to say that Judge Reinhold would have approved to what I have-and did have at the time-in mind.
It takes hard work to be as stupid as this. Congratulations.
Shooter identified as Muhammed Youssef Abdulaziez. I wonder if this one is ISIS inspired.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/chattagooga-shooting-suspect-identified-cbs/ar-AAd3U69
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/chattagooga-shooting-suspect-identified-cbs/ar-AAd3U69
I'll let others turn this into a political topic on a football board.
So I'll just say it's a sad day and my condolences go out to all affected by this senseless tragedy.
So I'll just say it's a sad day and my condolences go out to all affected by this senseless tragedy.
It's rare that I can't even guess at what a post means, but I'm stumped. In particular, what does Judge Reinhold have to do with George Bush and 9/11?
I pray for the families of both the marines and police officers that was wounded or loss their lives.
What is your solution?Islam has been at war with humanity for the past 1400 years.If you want to surrender,it's up to you.
Two good Democrats-Roosevelt and Truman- knew what to do during WWII:Incarcerate and bomb away.Bush should have padlocked every mosque,put them up for auction,then used the proceeds to pay the families of the dead instead of burdening the taxpayers.Then,announce to the people of Mecca and Medina to clear out within 72 hours.
Two good Democrats-Roosevelt and Truman- knew what to do during WWII:Incarcerate and bomb away.Bush should have padlocked every mosque,put them up for auction,then used the proceeds to pay the families of the dead instead of burdening the taxpayers.Then,announce to the people of Mecca and Medina to clear out within 72 hours.
At first we were told they are becoming terrorists becausw theyre uneducated in a 3rd world country.
Then we were told theyre becoming terrorists in europe because they cant get work.
Then we were told theyre becoming terrorists in america because theyre not part of the american dream due to racism.
Now we have american citizens who own homes in america... Studying in our colleges... One of which was even married to an attractive caucasian female... Becoming terrorists.
The common denominator: being muslim.
Whats the next excuse? Im waiting
Then we were told theyre becoming terrorists in europe because they cant get work.
Then we were told theyre becoming terrorists in america because theyre not part of the american dream due to racism.
Now we have american citizens who own homes in america... Studying in our colleges... One of which was even married to an attractive caucasian female... Becoming terrorists.
The common denominator: being muslim.
Whats the next excuse? Im waiting
I think he's suggesting that Bush should have thrown hot coffee in Bin Laden's face... Alright Hamilton!
This. Unfortunately, not much we infidels can do. It's up to the good Muslims to put their foot down and denounce the behavior. They need to stop allowing their mosques to be used as breeding grounds and good Imams should be screaming from the pulpit that the war must stop.
We take in refugees from Sudan after their country is in kaos and then their off springs commit terrorist acts. We take in refugees from Kuwait and their kids become terrorists. Even with the horrible acts in Syria, I hope we don't bring in their refugees because their kids will be the next terrorists on US soil. It's not worth bringing in war refugees from the Middle East, they will bite the hand that feed them.
Is Dylan Roof not a terrorist? Did he not kill more people? Are most mass shootings in America not committed by white males? What's the common denominator here?
This ruhasaarrived gets the award for biggest moron of the year.
Oh, they'll be here. Obama will make sure of it. He treats our country like the Assyrians treated vanquished nations.
Terrorist attacks and related incidents in the United States
http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255a.html
http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255a.html
I wonder why the thwarted attempts do not list the reasons for the attempted attacks. Seems like an important oversight to me since there was clearly an agenda if they were terror attacks that were thwarted.
There are plenty of non-Islamist terror attacks. But that doesn't diminish the impact of the number of Islamist terror attacks. We shouldn't become bigoted against Muslims but nor should we let political correctness lead to us sticking our heads in the sand.
As the mother of daughter soon to be engaged to an Air Force Sgt., this is very scary, currently he is an Air Force recruiter and they have been told for 3 months that is an elevated risk of this happening in recruiting offices. I am on edge every time I tirn on news.....
I am also getting tired of hearing the peaceful, I don't know what happened excuse
I am also getting tired of hearing the peaceful, I don't know what happened excuse
I think VK said it best: "It's up to the good Muslims to put their foot down and denounce the behavior. They need to stop allowing their mosques to be used as breeding grounds and good Imams should be screaming from the pulpit that the war must stop."
All local religious leaders also must denounce any form of hatred by the members of their congregation towards other religions.
Hatred towards all Muslim religion because of the terrorists ,using the Koran as an excuse for their vial acts, is wrong .
But the leaders of the local Moslem communities must step up like VK stated to show all that they are standing alongside every
other American and the World in the fight against those using the Koran to justify acts of terrorism
Dylan Roof is a terrorist. He is a terrorist because he is a racist.
These guys are terrorists because they are muslim. Tired of hearing they're becoming terrorists because of educational or financial background.
Not all muslims are terrorists. But the ones who are terrorists are doing it because they are muslim. Rich or poor... educated or illiterate... fortunate or unfortunate.. there are no boundaries for islamic terrorists.
Unfortunately, recruiting offices are viewed as soft targets by the U.S. Jihadists. Those service personnel need to be armed as necessary to prevent these types of attacks. 9/11 happened 14 years ago. When will we learn ?
The definition of "terrorist" requires a political component. Dylan Roof is not a terrorist. He's just a mass murderer.
Actually it's an act of violence intended to create fear for political, religious or economic reasons, but usually acts of violence by Muslims are labeled terrorist attacks and justifiably so in most cases.
Definitions of Terrorism in the U.S. Code
18 U.S.C. § 2331 defines "international terrorism" and "domestic terrorism" for purposes of Chapter 113B of the Code, entitled "Terrorism”:
"International terrorism" means activities with the following three characteristics:
https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/terrorism/terrorism-definition
The FBI looks to the Code of Federal Regulations definition: "The unlawful use of force and violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives."
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92340
Terrorist for religious reasons , trying to change this country to Islam Sharia law from its present form .
Economic terrorism , changing the way banks do business by blowing up wall street.
Plus the political act of terrorism , attacking Military bases in an effort to end America's involvement in the mid east.
Also you can add killing blacks in a church,if done because of racial reasons with the intent to spread fear in the black community, for any reason.
Why do you say terrorism is just political, but you can say political is a catch all for what I pointed out.
18 U.S.C. § 2331 defines "international terrorism" and "domestic terrorism" for purposes of Chapter 113B of the Code, entitled "Terrorism”:
"International terrorism" means activities with the following three characteristics:
- Involve violent acts or acts dangerous to human life that violate federal or state law;
- Appear to be intended (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population; (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and
- Occur primarily outside the territorial jurisdiction of the U.S., or transcend national boundaries in terms of the means by which they are accomplished, the persons they appear intended to intimidate or coerce, or the locale in which their perpetrators operate or seek asylum.*
- Involve acts dangerous to human life that violate federal or state law;
- Appear intended (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population; (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination. or kidnapping; and
- Occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the U.S.
- Is calculated to influence or affect the conduct of government by intimidation or coercion, or to retaliate against government conduct; and
- Is a violation of one of several listed statutes, including § 930(c) (relating to killing or attempted killing during an attack on a federal facility with a dangerous weapon); and § 1114 (relating to killing or attempted killing of officers and employees of the U.S.).
https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/terrorism/terrorism-definition
The FBI looks to the Code of Federal Regulations definition: "The unlawful use of force and violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives."
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92340
Terrorist for religious reasons , trying to change this country to Islam Sharia law from its present form .
Economic terrorism , changing the way banks do business by blowing up wall street.
Plus the political act of terrorism , attacking Military bases in an effort to end America's involvement in the mid east.
Also you can add killing blacks in a church,if done because of racial reasons with the intent to spread fear in the black community, for any reason.
Why do you say terrorism is just political, but you can say political is a catch all for what I pointed out.
I'm saying Roof doesn't fit any definition of terrorism. His motives were none of the things you're describing. He just wanted to kill some black people. He's no different than a serial killer who preys solely on prostitutes - it's part of his profile, but there's no terroristic motive.
No problem with what you think, unless Roof set out to kill blacks with the intent to soread fear in the black community.
So far only speculation about that, without proof and speculation doesn't make what he did a terrorist act
When you said :"Show your work - every authoritative definition I can find disagrees with you."
I thought you were asking because I said this: "Actually it's an act of violence intended to create fear for political, religious or economic reasons, but usually acts of violence by Muslims are labeled terrorist attacks and justifiably so in most cases."
Seems like a misunderstand and now everything has been cleared up.
I don't think it can be proven Roof intended to intimated the black community by his actions, so I don't think he can be prosecuted as a terrorist.
If he really is a domestic terrorist is just a matter of speculation, because he doesn't fit the legal definition of a terrorist with the evidence out there now.
I don't like your definition because it's been specifically expanded by the DoJ. I've never subscribed to the theory that legislation can alter the long-standing definition of a word. If you run through the search results, you'll find that most definitions are specific to political cause.
Regardless, the feds have failed to agree with your assessment, as of yet. The latest filings suggest that the federal prosecutor may charge Roof with hate crimes, but no mention has been made of any add-on charges associated with terrorism.
As I said - the dude hates black people. He has no motives other than his own prejudice, which I suspect is deeply rooted in his relationship with his sister, whose kid is half-black.
Regardless, the feds have failed to agree with your assessment, as of yet. The latest filings suggest that the federal prosecutor may charge Roof with hate crimes, but no mention has been made of any add-on charges associated with terrorism.
As I said - the dude hates black people. He has no motives other than his own prejudice, which I suspect is deeply rooted in his relationship with his sister, whose kid is half-black.
I said:"he doesn't fit the legal definition of a terrorist with the evidence out there now."
So the FBI or any law enforcement agency will not label Roof as a terrorist.
It doesn't matter if we like or dislike the present definition of terrorism, it's the definition the courts go by .
Okay, I missed the first part.
As to the last part - submitting to the whimsy and capriciousness of the State is the first step down the road to tyranny. It's not outside the realm of possibility that the Current Administration's Justice Department seeks to severely dilute the traditional definition of terrorism for reasons not entirely to our collective benefit.
Seems like the current administration isn't playing as fast and loose as you think in describing terrorist acts.
2002 In Review
The FBI recorded seven domestic terrorist incidents, one international terrorist incident, and one terrorism prevention in 2002. The seven domestic terrorism incidents included a string of attacks over a period of several months claimed by special interest movements. These attacks are attributed either solely to the Earth Liberation Front (ELF), an extremist environmental movement active in the United States during the past 20 years, or jointly to the ELF and the Animal Liberation Front, an extremist animal rights movement that has carried out numerous terrorist attacks since 1987. The international terrorist incident involved fatal shootings at the El Al ticket counter at Los Angeles International Airport.
In the one terrorism prevention, law enforcement in Florida exposed a plot to attack Islamic facilities in the United States in response to international events, including the September 11 attacks.
Terrorist Incidents
March 2002 – November 2002
Vandalism and Arson
Erie, Harborcreek, and Warren, Pennsylvania
(Six acts of Domestic Terrorism)
Between March 2002 and November 2002, a series of animal rights and ecoterrorism incidents occurred in Erie, Harborcreek, and Warren, Pennsylvania. On March 18, 2002, Pennsylvania State Police discovered heavy equipment used to clear trees at a construction site in Erie, Pennsylvania, spray painted with the statements “ELF, in the protection of mother earth,” and “Stop Deforestation.” On March 24, 2002, police responded to the same construction site, where a large hydraulic crane had been set on fire, causing approximately $500,000 in damage. A facsimile, purportedly from ELF, claimed responsibility for the arson and vandalism. ELF also claimed responsibility for an August 11, 2002, arson on the U.S. Forestry Scientific Laboratory in Warren, Pennsylvania. In separate incidents in May and September 2002, unknown subjects released approximately 250 mink from a fur farm in Harborcreek, Pennsylvania. On November 26, 2002, the barn on the same Harborcreek fur farm was destroyed by arson. On the ELF Web site, ELF and ALF jointly claimed responsibility for these mink releases and the arson. On August 11, 2002, unknown individuals committed arson on the U.S. Forestry Scientific Laboratory in Warren, Pennsylvania.
In September 2002, the individuals vandalized construction vehicles in Henrico County, Virginia, and attempted to burn a backhoe and construction crane. On September 28, 2002, 25 sport utility vehicles (SUVs) were damaged at an Henrico County Ford Dealership, including the etching of the letters “ELF” and “SUV” into some of the vehicles. Also in September, vandalism occurred at two fast food restaurants. A Jeep Liberty was also damaged, and the vandals left a note on the vehicle stating “SUVs are killing the world” and “Earth Liberation Front.”
Terrorist Preventions
August 22, 2002
Planned Attack against Islamic Center of Pinellas County
Pinellas Park, Florida (Prevention of one act of Domestic Terrorism)
On August 22, 2002, police in Pinellas County, Florida, responding to a domestic dispute detained Robert J. Goldstein after finding numerous weapons and explosives and a “mission statement” threatening to attack Islamic facilities in the United States. Goldstein was later arrested and charged with weapons violations and an attempt to destroy property. Michael Wallace Hardee, Samuel V. Shannahan III, and Goldstein’s wife, Kristi Goldstein, were also arrested and charged in connection with the plot. An investigation revealed that the intended target of Goldstein’s planned attack was the Islamic Center of Pinellas County, in Pinellas Park, Florida, and that the attack had been planned to coincide with the first anniversary of the September 11, 2001, terrorist attack. Investigators also determined that Goldstein intended to target the Islamic Center in perceived retaliation for Palestinian suicide bombings in Israel. The four pled guilty in the Middle District of Florida to their roles in the plotting, and in 2003 received federal prison sentences ranging from three years to Robert Goldstein’s 12 years and seven months.
2003 In Review
In 2003, the FBI recorded six terrorist incidents and five terrorism preventions. Domestic terrorists, specifically animal rights and environmental extremists, were responsible for each of the six incidents. Three of the incidents were perpetrated by followers of the Earth Liberation Front extremist movement and involved acts of arson or vandalism and destruction of property. The other three incidents were perpetrated by extremists within the animal rights movement, and included and act of vandalism claimed by the Animal Liberation Front, and two bombings at businesses affiliated with Huntingdon Life Sciences, a frequent target of the extreme animal rights movement.
Each of the five preventions involved domestic terrorist organizations or extremists. These included a white supremacist in Pennsylvania, who planned attacks against abortion clinics and minority targets; a constitutionalist and tax protestor in Idaho, who attempted to arrange for the murders of federal persons involved in a tax evasion case against him; an individual in Texas associated with antigovernment militia members, who was found in possession of heavy weaponry, sodium cyanide, and plans to weaponize sodium cyanide; an anarchist, who planned to bomb a U.S. Coast Guard; and an anti-abortion extremist in Florida, who planned to bomb abortion clinics.
https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/terrorism-2002-2005/terror02_05#terror_0205
That is exactly what has happened in Chattanooga. The mosque cancelled their end-of-Ramadan celebration and instead suggested that their congregants attend local church services to honor the victims.
I don't think it's fair to place the responsibility for halting this violence on "good Muslims".
Reform needs to come from within otherwise it will go nowhere. That's the way it worked for Christianity and the Catholic Church. If it is not the responsibility of good Muslims then who?
One of the problems that the Muslim faith will need to deal with is their belief that the Koran is literally a transcription from God himself through Mohamed in the Arabic language which has largely remained intact. Most of the Bible especially the new testament is attributable to man's interpretation of God's will, i.e. it was divinely inspired but subject to man's imperfection. Jesus heavily used parables and symbolism and rarely dictated. It became a lot easier to re-interpret the Bible once that concept was embraced. However, if your belief is that the Koran is a literal transcription by Mohamed from God, to re-interpret those literal words is sacrilegious.
The same can be said of the Mormon faith being a transcription from God via seer stones. However, eventually they were able to get past that and reform large portions of their faith. It will be a difficult multi-generational effort to reform Islam but it must happen and it must be started and embraced by the MAJORITY of members of the faith, not a few progressive mosques.
There, I've used up my one political political response for the week. :)
Similar threads
Latest posts
-
-
-
-
-
FB Recruiting Recruits React to Rutgers Football's First 2025 Junior Day Event- Latest: Rusty_Screw_88