UCONN transfer Vance Jackson visiting

[NewJerseyHawk]

You have to look at the big picture and not just the 2017-18 season.

And maybe if we had Jackson first we might not have taken Kiss.

The 11 kids on the roster as active, only makes sense if you add a grad transfer, so that player plugs into your top 8 rotation....if you play 9 to 10 players consistently, you should be fine anyway

Sanders, Williams, Baker, Souf would be the 4 primary guards (unless a grad is added to replace Nigel Johnson)

Thiam and Eugene and Bullock are your Small Forward potential players

Sa, Freeman, Doorson and the grad transfer would be the potential PF's and C's on the roster, with Eugene as the one hybrid PF/SF.

One could argue that you are better off with Doucoure coming in for 2017 and adding a 5th year guard, but it depends on what's out there.....I think you have a better chance at a player like Mathis, with 4 starters in place and a SG position waiting for him to compete for with Kiss etc...

 

[AshCatchEm]

5 years of what kind of records and performances?

My friend loves the football program.He said Ash would get at booted in two years if he had the same results as this past year. Two different sports, but I do believe the timelines given are too long.

Nonetheless,15-18 was fun to watch. I would watch 6 more of those seasons. My main point though is that you always mix and match, and you have to make sure you can put a team together that can get you to the 6-8 spots. That is how you keep your job. Jackson would quite possibly further help that cause.

Any coach gets 4 years. That's a given. Anything less is stupidity because no coach in their right mind joins a rebuild not willing to give a sane amount of time to do so. Our basketball team is not a normal rebuild. It is a dumpster fire. Assuming our coach shows no signs of laziness like Jordan previously was (and pikiell has been busting his ass), I think 5 years guaranteed is the minimum. I don't think people understand what it's like to rebuild at Rutgers. We've been rebuilding for 20 years now. We are just getting the facilities and it'd be stupidity to take away pike just when he gets the ability to sell those facilities.

And anyone who thinks a coach will get fired after 3 years during any kind of rebuild has a very weak understanding of college sports. That's basically the recipe for losing the interest of any coach worth anything beyond a pile of donkey shit..because nobody will sign on to a job where they aren't guaranteed 4 years to get their own players.

 

[RutgHoops]

I am all for discussion, but Coach P took a 7-25 team and turned it into a 15-18 team that was immeasurably more interesting to follow.

After a year (one year) on the job and getting an up close look at his squad I don't think it is a stretch to think he has gently nudged out those who he believes don't fit in favor of having the ability to build a roster that does. To me, that shows not only faith in his ability to coach his players but also his belief in his ability to get the players he wants.

So while discussion is what message boards are all about I sort of think watching this play out is the prudent move.

 

[SJScarlet]

You have to look at the big picture and not just the 2017-18 season.

And maybe if we had Jackson first we might not have taken Kiss.

What happens next season can affect future seasons. And your second point is kind of what I'm afraid of, in trying to grab talent where and when you can, you may not end up managing your roster in an ideal way. But we'll see, lots of moving parts.

 

[MADHAT1]

I am all for discussion, but Coach P took a 7-25 team and turned it into a 15-18 team that was immeasurably more interesting to follow.

After a year (one year) on the job and getting an up close look at his squad I don't think it is a stretch to think he has gently nudged out those who he believes don't fit in favor of having the ability to build a roster that does. To me, that shows not only faith in his ability to coach his players but also his belief in his ability to get the players he wants.

So while discussion is what message boards are all about I sort of think watching this play out is the prudent move.

He slowly improved Stony Brook
4-24 his first year 9-20 his second 7-23 his third.
Then the record started looking better and from his 7th season on, 20 or more wins
every year and the NCAA Tourney his last year there ending the season with a 26-7 record.
I don't expect a quick fix, just steady improvement until he fields a team all RU Fans can be proud of.

 

[vascosg]

I love how strong and deep we are with coaches who can teach. Hobbs recruited this kid for UConn. Both the coach and the kid were out of our league not long ago. There is no way this kid steps on our floor thinking he's going to be the man, not play D, or anything else like that. If he comes, it's because he bought into Pike and his vision. I don't want to get my hopes up but this is just crazy how much has changed - top to bottom - for this program.

 

[higgins3]

Any coach gets 4 years. That's a given. Anything less is stupidity because no coach in their right mind joins a rebuild not willing to give a sane amount of time to do so. Our basketball team is not a normal rebuild. It is a dumpster fire. Assuming our coach shows no signs of laziness like Jordan previously was (and pikiell has been busting his ass), I think 5 years guaranteed is the minimum. I don't think people understand what it's like to rebuild at Rutgers. We've been rebuilding for 20 years now. We are just getting the facilities and it'd be stupidity to take away pike just when he gets the ability to sell those facilities.

And anyone who thinks a coach will get fired after 3 years during any kind of rebuild has a very weak understanding of college sports. That's basically the recipe for losing the interest of any coach worth anything beyond a pile of donkey shit..because nobody will sign on to a job where they aren't guaranteed 4 years to get their own players.

Gotcha. I am in full support of Pikiell. I think he will take the program to 7-9 in the big ten within three years. Tournament in that same time period, or a year more.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

This would not be the first time I stood alone with my position on a subject. I say pass on this guy.......WOW, he is a "Chucker". All he does is ask for the ball and then shoot when he gets it in his hands. S o many times he did even look for the next pass. I saw one point early in the video where a teammate got on him because he just received a pass and shot an ill advised 3. A lot of shots were taken by him with a lot of time left on the shot and he made no attempt to work the ball around for a better shot.

I really don't like this guy. I prefer team players and this guy does not look like a team player !!!! Maybe it was a lack of coaching and discipline with the Coach Kevin Ollie.

I know it was just 11 games....hopefully, his shot selection improved, but, there were some shots he took that I would sit him if I were the Coach, maybe Kevin Ollie did and that's why the Father was upset.

 

[bostonuconnalum]

As a UConn fan, here is my take on Jackson. Has a decent 3 point shot and it got better as the season went on, which is what you would expect from a freshman. He played more than expected this year due to injuries, but he was not expected to start next year at UConn and his minutes would have probably been cut as well. He has difficulty creating his own shot as he is not an athletic SF, but he seems to have a high basketball IQ. He did not play good D. I think he could be a college hybrid 4 as he is 6' 8" and he has some strength, but he wants to be a 3.

UConn fans did not want him to leave, but he was not going to get a starring role on the team, especially next season, so he decided to look elsewhere for playing time. I don't think you can build your team around him, but he could be a very effective player.

 

[NeverOddOrEven33]

This would not be the first time I stood alone with my position on a subject. I say pass on this guy.......WOW, he is a "Chucker". All he does is ask for the ball and then shoot when he gets it in his hands. S o many times he did even look for the next pass. I saw one point early in the video where a teammate got on him because he just received a pass and shot an ill advised 3. A lot of shots were taken by him with a lot of time left on the shot and he made no attempt to work the ball around for a better shot.

I really don't like this guy. I prefer team players and this guy does not look like a team player !!!! Maybe it was a lack of coaching and discipline with the Coach Kevin Ollie.

I know it was just 11 games....hopefully, his shot selection improved, but, there were some shots he took that I would sit him if I were the Coach, maybe Kevin Ollie did and that's why the Father was upset.

Jackson would be a far far better add than Kiss was. Jackson shot 48% from 3 in AAC play, whereas Kiss was 26% in the MAAC. It's not even close.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

As a UConn fan, here is my take on Jackson. Has a decent 3 point shot and it got better as the season went on, which is what you would expect from a freshman. He played more than expected this year due to injuries, but he was not expected to start next year at UConn and his minutes would have probably been cut as well. He has difficulty creating his own shot as he is not an athletic SF, but he seems to have a high basketball IQ. He did not play good D. I think he could be a college hybrid 4 as he is 6' 8" and he has some strength, but he wants to be a 3.

UConn fans did not want him to leave, but he was not going to get a starring role on the team, especially next season, so he decided to look elsewhere for playing time. I don't think you can build your team around him, but he could be a very effective player.

I just watched his video. What's your opinion on his shot selection? I saw a lot of bad shots and not much passing once he got the ball in his hands. Hopefully, it was just bad coaching. But then, 48% on 3's in conference play is excellent. I just sense he is a ball hog who may alienate his teammates........ just my opinion.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Shack,

He has ample time to recruit for 2018. Was hoping he would use them on 4 year players out of high school

Filling those spots with transfers tells me something about his confidence getting HS sophomores and juniors to come here.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

What happens next season can affect future seasons. And your second point is kind of what I'm afraid of, in trying to grab talent where and when you can, you may not end up managing your roster in an ideal way. But we'll see, lots of moving parts.

That's the ENTIRE point

Coach p is managing the roster brilliantly

He is adding pieces while still leaving those 6-7 spots in the class of 2018 and 2019 open !!!

 

[Scarlet Shack]

Shack,

He has ample time to recruit for 2018. Was hoping he would use them on 4 year players out of high school

Filling those spots with transfers tells me something about his confidence getting HS sophomores and juniors to come here.

Greene ...

Even if we get Jackson...we have 6 to give in the class of 2018 and 2019 (doucour being one of them) and upgrade the roster

This is a good situation and keeps class balance

 

[higgins3]

I just watched his video. What's your opinion on his shot selection? I saw a lot of bad shots and not much passing once he got the ball in his hands. Hopefully, it was just bad coaching. But then, 48% on 3's in conference play is excellent. I just sense he is a ball hog who may alienate his teammates........ just my opinion.

I am with you there. One of the most important facets of a rebuilding team is
1) What the person does when they have a shot, but one pass away is a better shot. The person who passes to the better shot is someone you want. Or just the person who passes in general. Shot selection is huge.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Greene ...

Even if we get Jackson...we have 6 to give in the class of 2018 and 2019 (doucour being one of them) and upgrade the roster

This is a good situation and keeps class balance

Ok. I just had visions/hope of a Rice like class.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

Greene

If anything we learned from that is one class
Doesn't not rebuild a program

That class was built on quantity ...it had three top 100s in Mack jack and Seagers...and couple of top 250s in Lewis and Randall

Rather sign regular Sign three man class of


1 top 50-75
1 top 100-125
1 top 150-250

Then a monster class

 

[bac2therac]

I see what you are saying, but no one is getting 6 years to rebuild this program. Pikiell has to look out for his own career,too. Get the right players to get you to the tournament.

You have to mix and match. A lineup like Baker/Mensah, Kiss/player, Jackson/Thiam, Doucoure/Omoyuri, Doorson/player is something that gets you to that point.

You cannot get out of the #14 spot going with "program builders." If so, you will find yourself without a job in five years. You mix and match. They will do their analysis.

Pikiell will most definitely get 6 years unless its a trainwreck....this year will be a step back recordwise....year 3 will be an adjustment year, if Pike is making the NIT in year 6 he will not be fired.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Not many things get me more angry than hearing/talking about timelines with our head coaches.

 

[Scangg]

Pikiell will most definitely get 6 years unless its a trainwreck....this year will be a step back recordwise....year 3 will be an adjustment year, if Pike is making the NIT in year 6 he will not be fired.

I don't know how you can definitively say next year will be a step back record wise when we don't even know what the final roster will look like yet. I wouldnt be surprised at all if we are better not worse after the final roster spots shake out. I also see pikiell having us on a faster timeline than 6 years until NIT

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Roster not determined, but......

OOC probably ultimately is a bit tougher AND
B1G competition will be a bit tougher.

In the B1G we see a ton of top 50 games and I doubt we see so many 300s on the OOC

 

[Scangg]

OOC schedule can be a bit tougher and still be filled with games we should win. The OOC schedule is not going to be tough at all.

B1G getting tougher but so is Rutgers. We were in a ton of games last year and by the end of the season learned how to win some of them. Another year under Pikiell and staff in the system and player development should lead to improvement. No reason to lower expectations and expect a step back... Unless Sanders doesn't come back

 

[MadRU]

I'm looking for continued effort that we showed last year. Player development, stepping forward with recruiting, and continuity in staff.

 

[PaKnight]

I don't know how you can definitively say next year will be a step back record wise when we don't even know what the final roster will look like yet. I wouldnt be surprised at all if we are better not worse after the final roster spots shake out. I also see pikiell having us on a faster timeline than 6 years until NIT

It harder to predict than snow fall totals 10 days out.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

OOC schedule can be a bit tougher and still be filled with games we should win. The OOC schedule is not going to be tough at all.

B1G getting tougher but so is Rutgers. We were in a ton of games last year and by the end of the season learned how to win some of them. Another year under Pikiell and staff in the system and player development should lead to improvement. No reason to lower expectations and expect a step back... Unless Sanders doesn't come back

The takeaway, at least my takeaway, is that progress isn't necessarily going to be seen in the win/loss record. Another factor that isn't being discussed is the relatively healthy season we had. So if we are using '16-'17 as a comparison you have to take in to consideration the easy schedule and lack of injuries.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

OOC schedule can be a bit tougher and still be filled with games we should win. The OOC schedule is not going to be tough at all.

B1G getting tougher but so is Rutgers. We were in a ton of games last year and by the end of the season learned how to win some of them. Another year under Pikiell and staff in the system and player development should lead to improvement. No reason to lower expectations and expect a step back... Unless Sanders doesn't come back

May 18th last year he declared he was coming back. With everyday that passes the odds of him returning tick a little bit lower.

 

[RutgHoops]

Roster not determined, but......

OOC probably ultimately is a bit tougher AND
B1G competition will be a bit tougher.

In the B1G we see a ton of top 50 games and I doubt we see so many 300s on the OOC

Would you consider 9-4/5-13 a step backward? I think that sounds about right.

 

[Scangg]

The takeaway, at least my takeaway, is that progress isn't necessarily going to be seen in the win/loss record. Another factor that isn't being discussed is the relatively healthy season we had. So if we are using '16-'17 as a comparison you have to take in to consideration the easy schedule and lack of injuries.

The lack of injuries is a fair point. Let's hope for a healthy year... Especially for poor doorson

 

[knights1212]

I think we will be about the same as last year as long as we can add one more player who can help us in the coming season. I believe the OOC schedule will be about the same. Hopefully we can be about 11-2 again in the OOC. The BIG games might be a little tougher but hopefully we can do at least as well. We should have a lot of home games in the OOC as SHU will be at home and hopefully a game in the BIG-ACC Challenge is at home as we were sent to Miami last year.

 

[MoobyCow]

I don't know how you can definitively say next year will be a step back record wise when we don't even know what the final roster will look like yet. I wouldnt be surprised at all if we are better not worse after the final roster spots shake out. I also see pikiell having us on a faster timeline than 6 years until NIT

If we can get a kid or two who can actually shoot... who knows? But, right now, it's hard to project us being better.

 

[higgins3]

Pikiell will most definitely get 6 years unless its a trainwreck....this year will be a step back recordwise....year 3 will be an adjustment year, if Pike is making the NIT in year 6 he will not be fired.

Gotcha. I would sign up for 6 years of last years play and better. I am very confident in the staff.

 

[knights1212]

Coach will definitely get all 5 years and probably more. Many posting here don't have any idea how hard of a rebuild he faced and how good of a job he is doing.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Would you consider 9-4/5-13 a step backward? I think that sounds about right.

I'd need a lot more color. We were 11-2 4-16 15-18. Finished 135 kenpom.

If you really want to be fair you have to kick out 8 games against schools ranked 250 and up. That leaves you 7-18 in games against TOP 250.

I do find value and progress the fact that we were in so many B1G games and that is no where in our record.

against TOP 107 teams (Nebraska was 107) we were 4-18.

Progress usually isn't linear with respect to wins and losses. I'd rather measure with my eyeballs. December 22, 2017 I am sure my opinion will be different.

 

[Scangg]

If we can get a kid or two who can actually shoot... who knows? But, right now, it's hard to project us being better.

We will land another shooter before the season. Also, I would expect the players on the roster to shoot at higher percentages from 3 this year. I mean they can't shoot worse right? Thiam especially should see a significant jump in his 3 point %

 

[RUJMM78]

He slowly improved Stony Brook
4-24 his first year 9-20 his second 7-23 his third.
Then the record started looking better and from his 7th season on, 20 or more wins
every year and the NCAA Tourney his last year there ending the season with a 26-7 record.
I don't expect a quick fix, just steady improvement until he fields a team all RU Fans can be proud of.

A rebuild at Stony Brook isn't comparable to Rutgers as a member of the B1G.The talent required is far different as was seen in the Big East where Rutgers was unsuccessful.Pikiell understands the challenge and knows that recruiting will only improve significantly by winning now as a indicator of even better success in the future.

 

[PaKnight]

A rebuild at Stony Brook isn't comparable to Rutgers as a member of the B1G.The talent required is far different as was seen in the Big East where Rutgers was unsuccessful.Pikiell understands the challenge and knows that recruiting will only improve significantly by winning now as a indicator of even better success in the future.

But as a member of the B1G RU should be more attractive than Stony Brook.

 

[Scangg]

But as a member of the B1G RU should be more attractive than Stony Brook.

Exactly. It works both ways.

 

[Mr_Twister]

A rebuild at Stony Brook isn't comparable to Rutgers as a member of the B1G.The talent required is far different as was seen in the Big East where Rutgers was unsuccessful.Pikiell understands the challenge and knows that recruiting will only improve significantly by winning now as a indicator of even better success in the future.

Reading this thread points out that the ideal hire would have been a coach with a stellar reputation as a national recruiter. The recruit locally paradigm has not worked for multiple decades. Landing that coach is next to impossible. Go Rutgers. Go Coach Pikiell and staff.

 

[FELONIOUSMONK]

Oh the humanity...Take him if he will take us..

 

[bostonuconnalum]

I just watched his video. What's your opinion on his shot selection? I saw a lot of bad shots and not much passing once he got the ball in his hands. Hopefully, it was just bad coaching. But then, 48% on 3's in conference play is excellent. I just sense he is a ball hog who may alienate his teammates........ just my opinion.

Remember, he was a freshman and most freshmen are going to have ups and downs. He really struggled with his shot early season, but he improved as the season went on and ended the year with a good 3 pt FG%. That said, he benefited from Jalen Adams kick outs on drives to get open shots. He seems to be a good shooter, but he struggles to create his own shot.

He isn't a ball hog and he generally took good shots later in the season. Like I said previously, he seems to be a college stretch 4 that wants to be a featured 3 who hasn't developed a defensive mentality. Coach Pikiell has some Jim Calhoun in him and if he comes to Rutgers, he will make him play defense, which is why he may not end up at Rutgers.