We are putting Fred Grunninger in the Rutgers Sports Hall of Fame??????

[Scarlet Shack]

Fred was a loyal son and bled scarlet...without doubt.

And a true gentlemen

However...his blunder and not getting us, in the big east in 1979 ...when we were the at the top of the men’s basketball programs in the north east and then later turned down a second invite..which destroyed the men’s basketball program ...should not have him in the hall of fame for Rutgers

An award for service to his alma mater....sure

Hall of fame recognition ....nope

 

[richthedentist]

Agree not just that blunder but so many other sports were such a joke when he was here but like you say this is basically an award for his service to Rutgers nothing more

 

[RUnTeX]

Fred was a loyal son and bled scarlet...without doubt.

And a true gentlemen

However...his blunder and not getting us, in the big east in 1979 ...when we were the at the top of the men’s basketball programs in the north east and then later turned down a second invite..which destroyed the men’s basketball program ...should not have him in the hall of fame for Rutgers

An award for service to his alma mater....sure

Hall of fame recognition ....nope

Was it all those championships as a golf coach, perhaps? :Surprised:

 

[HeavenUniv.]

You have to be kidding me !!!

 

[Local Shill]

Can Mr. Pernetti be far behind? Bobby Mulcahy is already in.

 

[Mr Magoo]

That's hilarious. We're in the bizarro world. His head should be on the Mt. Rushmore of Rutgers sports ineptitude.

 

[lloyde dobler]

Seton Hall should name a building after him.

 

[RUnTeX]

Seton Hall should name a building after him.

Or put up a statue of him, or better yet, elect him to their hall of fame.

 

[HeavenUniv.]

Who gets in next year? Fred Hill Jr.? Craig Littlepage? Terry Shea? Julie Herman?

 

[TDIrish27]

Les Cason

 

[ColonelRutgers]

Went to 6 NCAA tournaments including 3 during the Big East 80’s-90’s glory years under Gruninger in his 25 years as AD and ZERO under all other ADs combined in the other 55 seasons of NCAA tournaments. Hired a coach who was national coach of the year.

Hired two Women’s basketball hall of fame coaches who have hung countless NCAA banners in the RAC. Had Player of year in women’s basketball.

Men’s Soccer was a national power under his tenure having hired Bob Reasso who led us to three. Final fours including a national championship appearance. Had player of year in men’s soccer.

Oversaw the building of a new Basketball arena and the new Rutgers Stadium. How many other AD’s have built ANYTHING?

Hired Fred Hill as baseball coach who presided over a winning program for 30 years.

The only thing any of the other ADs accomplished so far was hiring Schiano.

 

[LC-88]

Went to 6 NCAA tournaments including 3 during the Big East 80’s-90’s glory years under Gruninger in his 25 years as AD and ZERO under all other ADs combined in the other 55 seasons of NCAA tournaments. Hired a coach who was national coach of the year.

Hired two Women’s basketball hall of fame coaches who have hung countless NCAA banners in the RAC. Had Player of year in women’s basketball.

Men’s Soccer was a national power under his tenure having hired Bob Reasso who led us to three. Final fours including a national championship appearance. Had player of year in men’s soccer.

Oversaw the building of a new Basketball arena and the new Rutgers Stadium. How many other AD’s have built ANYTHING?

Hired Fred Hill as baseball coach who presided over a winning program for 30 years.

The only thing any of the other ADs accomplished so far was hiring Schiano.

Trade all that for Big East in 1979.

 

[Mr Magoo]

Went to 6 NCAA tournaments including 3 during the Big East 80’s-90’s glory years under Gruninger in his 25 years as AD and ZERO under all other ADs combined in the other 55 seasons of NCAA tournaments. Hired a coach who was national coach of the year.

Hired two Women’s basketball hall of fame coaches who have hung countless NCAA banners in the RAC. Had Player of year in women’s basketball.

Men’s Soccer was a national power under his tenure having hired Bob Reasso who led us to three. Final fours including a national championship appearance. Had player of year in men’s soccer.

Oversaw the building of a new Basketball arena and the new Rutgers Stadium. How many other AD’s have built ANYTHING?

Hired Fred Hill as baseball coach who presided over a winning program for 30 years.

The only thing any of the other ADs accomplished so far was hiring Schiano.

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. None of them deserve to be in.

 

[LC-88]

His greatest accomplishment was hiring T. Grentz as first full time womens hoop coach in the country.

 

[ScarletKid2008]

Is he making a donation for all the money he cost Rutgers and the decades behind he put the school , which we may never see recovered ?

 

[Plum Street]

Who gets in next year? Fred Hill Jr.? Craig Littlepage? Terry Shea? Julie Herman?

Julie Herman is the best on that list and it’s not even close .

 

[CERU00]

I still can't get over how he was an AD for 25 years!!! Thats insane for an athletic program as bad as Rutgers. Rutgers really really didn't care about sports!

 

[ColonelRutgers]

I still can't get over how he was an AD for 25 years!!! Thats insane for an athletic program as bad as Rutgers. Rutgers really really didn't care about sports!

Also had an undefeated football team under Gruninger and beat teams like Tennessee, Michigan State, and Penn State on the road which we can only dream of now even though we play two of those teams every year. The more I think about it, maybe we should bring back Schiano AND Gruninger!! Knock on wood if you're with me!

 

[shields]

Is Grentz in for her playing career or coach for Hall of Fame?

 

[ColonelRutgers]

Is Grentz in for her playing career or coach for Hall of Fame?

Women's Basketball Hall of Fame as a coach. In National Basketball Hall of Fame as member of Immaculata team.

 

[shields]

Thank you. So he hired two hall of fame women's coaches and Reasso was damn good.

 

[ColonelRutgers]

Well, at least now I know Jerry Carino read my post although not a fan of soccer or baseball, evidently.



but this guy is...

 

[Seton75]

Fred was a loyal son and bled scarlet...without doubt.

And a true gentlemen

However...his blunder and not getting us, in the big east in 1979 ...when we were the at the top of the men’s basketball programs in the north east and then later turned down a second invite..which destroyed the men’s basketball program ...should not have him in the hall of fame for Rutgers

An award for service to his alma mater....sure

Hall of fame recognition ....nope

I think he is in ours too...

 

[Upstream]

Gruninger accomplished a lot as AD and deserves to be in the HoF for what he accomplished pre-1977. Unfortunately he was over his head when Rutgers decided to make the move from what was essentially Div 1AA to Div 1A.

While turning down the Big East was an error, it was an error in 20:20 hindsight. Looking to join a league for all sports was a reasonable decision over joining a league that did not support football. Unfortunately the all-sports league never materialized, and the basketball-only Big East exceeded anyone's expectations. (I believe Gruninger only turned down the Big East that once. The second time, when the Big East started a football division, he accepted the invitation.)

But aside from the Big East decision, he failed to properly support the football program, trying to run a D1A program on D1AA resources. He wrongly fired Frank Burns. He wrongly hired Craig Littlepage.

But he also got the stadium expanded, the RAC built, and the Hale Center built. And pre-1977, he ran a D1AA-equivalent athletic department admirably. That is what he is being placed into the HoF for, not for his later failures when he was over-his-head.

 

[ColonelRutgers]

Gruninger accomplished a lot as AD and deserves to be in the HoF for what he accomplished pre-1977. Unfortunately he was over his head when Rutgers decided to make the move from what was essentially Div 1AA to Div 1A.

While turning down the Big East was an error, it was an error in 20:20 hindsight. Looking to join a league for all sports was a reasonable decision over joining a league that did not support football. Unfortunately the all-sports league never materialized, and the basketball-only Big East exceeded anyone's expectations. (I believe Gruninger only turned down the Big East that once. The second time, when the Big East started a football division, he accepted the invitation.) Shea and Littlepage were bad hires, but all things considered he did a decent job hiring coaches overall. And he cut Littlepage loose after only 3 years (no extensions) and it was Mulcahy that gave Shea an ill-advised extension not Gruninger.

But aside from the Big East decision, he failed to properly support the football program, trying to run a D1A program on D1AA resources. He wrongly fired Frank Burns. He wrongly hired Craig Littlepage.

But he also got the stadium expanded, the RAC built, and the Hale Center built. And pre-1977, he ran a D1AA-equivalent athletic department admirably. That is what he is being placed into the HoF for, not for his later failures when he was over-his-head.

Not sure he can be blamed for running the athletic department on the cheap. Afterall, it was President Bloustein that came up with the term "Bigger Time" which is the definition of an administration half-assing it. Rutgers was the State University less than 20 years when Gruninger took over. It was a big leap for a university and alumni base that was did not know what it truly took to be big time. Amazing what we were able to accomplish with Burns, Anderson, and Graber considering the type of money and facilities they inherited. All things considered he did a decent job hiring coaches. He at least had the sense to cut Littlepage loose after 3 years (no extension) and it was Mulcahy not Gruninger that gave Shea and staff an extension.

The turning down the Big East twice is really a myth. We had a potential second chance to get in but it was contingent on Penn State being admitted and that never got approved by the existing Big East basketball schools. So about 12 years later we were a Big East basketball school and had every opportunity to turn it around but didn't.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

Colonel

Please stop

We were a basketball school and had it going ...by today’s ncaa standards...we wound have danced 6, and possibly 7 straight years.

We joined the eastern 8 concerned about the automatic bid to the ncaa in 1976-1977...and found schools that we had...nothing in common with. We had nothing in common with Duquesne, UMass, and GWU. Villanova dropped football. So we hitched to west va, Pitt and penn state

We had real basketball rivalries with Syracuse, St. John’s, seton hall who took our place)..and Uconn.and played the others. We were an aspiring football school ..but a real basketvall school ...and Fred chose not to go with the basketball option

Go ask tom young what he though of Fred’s decision not to join the big east right after James Bailey and abdel Anderson graduated

Guess what...if Fred lets Rutgers in the big east ...we go to more final fours...and I bet we would have won a national championship...or more

Everyone one of our 70s basketball peers played for a national championship in the 80s in the big east ...Syracuse, Villanova, seton hall, Georgetown. St. John’s was a one seed and number one in 1985. Providence made the final four

Us...our program rotted in the Atlantic 10

Nope...Fred made a huge blunder that set this athletic department back 10-15 years ...and the men’s basketball program still hasn’t recovered.

 

[Racpack]

This is a big mistake. Not getting us in the Big East is minor compared to his approach to and treatment of student athletes. He never would get away with his actions today. Hobbs, Pernetti, and Mulcahy care about student-athletes. All ADs have faults. But Fred set RU athletics back years by his treatment of student athletes. Regarding Grentz, he never provided any support for her. The other picks for the Hall of Fame are great.

 

[ecojew]

Seton Hall should name a building after him.

Agree. I've often said that Gruninger created SHU basketball. His bad decision cost this university millions of $$$ and set us back decades.

 

[Kbee3]

Went to 6 NCAA tournaments including 3 during the Big East 80’s-90’s glory years under Gruninger in his 25 years as AD and ZERO under all other ADs combined in the other 55 seasons of NCAA tournaments. Hired a coach who was national coach of the year.

Hired two Women’s basketball hall of fame coaches who have hung countless NCAA banners in the RAC. Had Player of year in women’s basketball.

Men’s Soccer was a national power under his tenure having hired Bob Reasso who led us to three. Final fours including a national championship appearance. Had player of year in men’s soccer.

Oversaw the building of a new Basketball arena and the new Rutgers Stadium. How many other AD’s have built ANYTHING?

Hired Fred Hill as baseball coach who presided over a winning program for 30 years.

The only thing any of the other ADs accomplished so far was hiring Schiano.

That last one there IMO dwarfs all the others combined.
In re-watching the Louisville game I was impressed by the crowd. Possibly the high point in all of Rutgers sports.

 

[RUnTeX]

Not getting us in the Big East is minor compared to his approach to and treatment of student athletes. He never would get away with his actions today. Hobbs, Pernetti, and Mulcahy care about student-athletes. All ADs have faults. But Fred set RU athletics back years by his treatment of student athletes.

If the bolded is common knowledge, I must be out of the loop. Should I be afraid to ask what the issue was with student athlete treatment during the Gruninger era? Never heard anything during my time on the banks but I wasn't necessarily well plugged in either.

 

[newell138]

I can say this now because he’s no longer living but my uncle who was the AD at Georgetown in the same era as Gruninger had no respect for him. When Fred got elected to the athletic administrators HOF about 15 years ago he just laughed

 

[RUich]

Each school's Hall of Fame represents what actually happened when they were in charge. National champion programs have much more impressive people
than bottom feeders.

 

[ruman]

Went to 6 NCAA tournaments including 3 during the Big East 80’s-90’s glory years under Gruninger in his 25 years as AD and ZERO under all other ADs combined in the other 55 seasons of NCAA tournaments. Hired a coach who was national coach of the year.

Hired two Women’s basketball hall of fame coaches who have hung countless NCAA banners in the RAC. Had Player of year in women’s basketball.

Men’s Soccer was a national power under his tenure having hired Bob Reasso who led us to three. Final fours including a national championship appearance. Had player of year in men’s soccer.

Oversaw the building of a new Basketball arena and the new Rutgers Stadium. How many other AD’s have built ANYTHING?

Hired Fred Hill as baseball coach who presided over a winning program for 30 years.

The only thing any of the other ADs accomplished so far was hiring Schiano.

Rejecting the Big East negates all of that x10

 

[ruman]

Gruninger accomplished a lot as AD and deserves to be in the HoF for what he accomplished pre-1977. Unfortunately he was over his head when Rutgers decided to make the move from what was essentially Div 1AA to Div 1A.

While turning down the Big East was an error, it was an error in 20:20 hindsight. Looking to join a league for all sports was a reasonable decision over joining a league that did not support football. Unfortunately the all-sports league never materialized, and the basketball-only Big East exceeded anyone's expectations. (I believe Gruninger only turned down the Big East that once. The second time, when the Big East started a football division, he accepted the invitation.)

But aside from the Big East decision, he failed to properly support the football program, trying to run a D1A program on D1AA resources. He wrongly fired Frank Burns. He wrongly hired Craig Littlepage.

But he also got the stadium expanded, the RAC built, and the Hale Center built. And pre-1977, he ran a D1AA-equivalent athletic department admirably. That is what he is being placed into the HoF for, not for his later failures when he was over-his-head.

There was going to be no Eastern all sports conference without Syracuse and
BC. Saying no to the Big East while those schools where in it never made sense to me. Even in 1979.

 

[ColonelRutgers]

I realize I'm playing devil's advocate in this discussion especially because basketball has always been my #1 and football a distant second in my Rutgers fan ranking. I missed the "glory years" of the seventies unfortunately. But I also think fans have overstated what a high caliber program we had going and that it was only Gruninger's boner that started the slide. I've read so many things on this board over the years about how Tom Young failed to capitalize on the Final Four year and completely struck out on recruiting after that and seemingly only recruited every other year, always having imbalanced classes on the roster (all sophomores/seniors or all freshmen/juniors) and never attracted any kids from the fertile NYC/NJ area. The last Rutgers team of the pre-Big East era was the 1978-79 team led by Senior James Bailey which was also the last ranked Rutgers team, topping out at #18. In Bailey's All-American Junior year the team was good and did manage to make the Final Four but it was the NIT Final Four. But before the Big East ramped up, the 1979-80 and 1980-81 Rutgers teams were mediocre and failed to reach postseason. Only diamond-in-the-rough recruit Roy Hinson led us out of the post-season darkness (1982 NIT) and landed us in NCAA in 1983, the first year of the Big East Tournament at MSG Yes, if we were in the Big East in the early days it would be hard to fathom that we wouldn't have gone on the same path of success that ALL of the other Big East programs but given the importance of football and the shadow of Penn State to say it was a no brainer to join up with those initial Big East schools in 1979 isn't being fair (and has stated previously it is a myth that Rutgers turned down a second invite). The only reason BC was added to the Big East is because the league's #1 Massachusetts choice, Holy Cross, turned them down and they didn't even have football to consider. So,if a small catholic basketball only school with no "bigger time" football aspirations turned the league down it may demonstrate that it wasn't as obvious what a sensation that conference would become.

 

[HeavenUniv.]

What I never understood about people saying Gruninger was waiting for the all sports conference was that if it ever did happen and it appeared to have strong enough members is that we just could have left the Big East. If the Eastern all sports conference was created, that means the Big East would have lost Rutgers, Pittsburgh, Boston College, and Syracuse.

 

[RU MAN]

Fred was a loyal son and bled scarlet...without doubt.

And a true gentlemen

However...his blunder and not getting us, in the big east in 1979 ...when we were the at the top of the men’s basketball programs in the north east and then later turned down a second invite..which destroyed the men’s basketball program ...should not have him in the hall of fame for Rutgers

An award for service to his alma mater....sure

Hall of fame recognition ....nope

Shack, I couldn't agree more. When I saw that, I rolled my eyes and laughed sarcastically. That man single handily destroyed any chance Rutgers had at the time of going big time. His ignorance and frankly stupidity set us back decades and we're still to this day trying to recover.

 

[ruman]

What I never understood about people saying Gruninger was waiting for the all sports conference was that if it ever did happen and it appeared to have strong enough members is that we just could have left the Big East. If the Eastern all sports conference was created, that means the Big East would have lost Rutgers, Pittsburgh, Boston College, and Syracuse.

Been saying that for 40 years. Pitt actually joined the Big East in early 80s to kill the all sports league.

 

[ruman]

I realize I'm playing devil's advocate in this discussion especially because basketball has always been my #1 and football a distant second in my Rutgers fan ranking. I missed the "glory years" of the seventies unfortunately. But I also think fans have overstated what a high caliber program we had going and that it was only Gruninger's boner that started the slide. I've read so many things on this board over the years about how Tom Young failed to capitalize on the Final Four year and completely struck out on recruiting after that and seemingly only recruited every other year, always having imbalanced classes on the roster (all sophomores/seniors or all freshmen/juniors) and never attracted any kids from the fertile NYC/NJ area. The last Rutgers team of the pre-Big East era was the 1978-79 team led by Senior James Bailey which was also the last ranked Rutgers team, topping out at #18. In Bailey's All-American Junior year the team was good and did manage to make the Final Four but it was the NIT Final Four. But before the Big East ramped up, the 1979-80 and 1980-81 Rutgers teams were mediocre and failed to reach postseason. Only diamond-in-the-rough recruit Roy Hinson led us out of the post-season darkness (1982 NIT) and landed us in NCAA in 1983, the first year of the Big East Tournament at MSG Yes, if we were in the Big East in the early days it would be hard to fathom that we wouldn't have gone on the same path of success that ALL of the other Big East programs but given the importance of football and the shadow of Penn State to say it was a no brainer to join up with those initial Big East schools in 1979 isn't being fair (and has stated previously it is a myth that Rutgers turned down a second invite). The only reason BC was added to the Big East is because the league's #1 Massachusetts choice, Holy Cross, turned them down and they didn't even have football to consider. So,if a small catholic basketball only school with no "bigger time" football aspirations turned the league down it may demonstrate that it wasn't as obvious what a sensation that conference would become.

I’m old. I remember reading about the new league and asking what the heck we were doing. We were in the Eastern 8. It was not a long term option. Georgetown Syracuse StJohns all were in the new league. They were our rivals in the late 70s. It was an awful decision that Syracuse happened to get right.

 

[dpwhite]