What happened to Cliff?
- Thread starter RUz91
- Start date
I started saying this at the beginning of last year when he couldn’t dominate the cup cakes.
I’m not sure his hands are. He just seems to lack touch.
He is very effective on pick and roll and on putbacks, but not at creating his spot with the ball on the block. We need to STOP trying to run our offense through Cliff in the post.
His rebounding is more from athleticism than from technique.
He got a ton of blocks tonight. That is still a big part of our solid team D.
His rebounding is more from athleticism than from technique.
He got a ton of blocks tonight. That is still a big part of our solid team D.
He’s not a “facing the basket” player either. He’s got zero inside game that’s not a lobe dunk. He hits occasional short jumper
But a certain poster told us all offseason pike wanted those guys off the team and were better now and deeper.
So confusing.
The only time anyone should pass to him is on a drive and dish, where he is in position for a dunk. His role should be rebounding, shot blocking and properly setting picks.
Don’t write stuff like this if you’re not allowed or won’t elaborate. This is how rumors start
I blame the staff for not coaching.
The ball cannot go to cliff if he is outside x feet. X is probably 6-7 feet. Watching the ball being passed to him when he is 12+ feet from the basket is ridiculous. Cliff shot 2 turnarounds off of 1 foot against St. Peters. Are you kidding me?
Cliff must maintain his position instead of giving it up and going to meet the ball. Whenever he does this, he dooms himself. I have noticed an improvement in the past 2 games.
Cliff seems to have carte blanche on offense, which is a detriment to the team. He isn't being held accountable for poor quality shots. We aren't good enough to let that happen.
The ball cannot go to cliff if he is outside x feet. X is probably 6-7 feet. Watching the ball being passed to him when he is 12+ feet from the basket is ridiculous. Cliff shot 2 turnarounds off of 1 foot against St. Peters. Are you kidding me?
Cliff must maintain his position instead of giving it up and going to meet the ball. Whenever he does this, he dooms himself. I have noticed an improvement in the past 2 games.
Cliff seems to have carte blanche on offense, which is a detriment to the team. He isn't being held accountable for poor quality shots. We aren't good enough to let that happen.
I'm with you
His performance yesterday was an absolute disgrace. He should have been benched
Pike allowed Cliff to basically not give full effort in the Hofstra game last year. To me that was coddling and now we get this year
He is all lobs, dunks, layups and putbacks….no offensive moves have been developed. He literally looks the exact same in the post the last 2 seasons. Cliff is freakishly athletic and that may get him to the NBA, but his offensive game is incredibly limited. He is better facing the basket than playing back to the basket. Wolf actually has more offensive game.
Here’s why stats are deceiving. Cliff had 7/9/8. Points are a little low but otherwise looks like a solid performance. Except he shot 3/10, 1/4 FTs, and had 5 TOs. And, if you watched, he was awful.
Bitnez - the issue is he is half assimg it out there...at one point I thought Pike was going to have a coronary
Personally, I feel cliff set a crap/lazy tone for the game from the jump. I would have benched him for the half.
Pike is too damn loyal to the coaching staff.
Our O line was getting it done last year in football. What did Schiano do? Bring in a new o line coach.
Whoever is in charge of big men development needs to go. Sorry, but Cliff has zero low post moves and that’s on the coaches
Our O line was getting it done last year in football. What did Schiano do? Bring in a new o line coach.
Whoever is in charge of big men development needs to go. Sorry, but Cliff has zero low post moves and that’s on the coaches
Exactly!!! Over the last 2 plus years, Cliffs shooting percentage on back to the baskets post ups is bad.
On the other hand, his shooting percentage as the recipient of a screen and roll/ drive and dish/ alley opp are good.
Let’s not post Cliff up.
Careful what you wish for. He was getting thrown around like a rag doll by Dainja.
Coach needs to allow Cliff to do the things he’s good it.
Pike is embarrassing the kid by insisting he gets the ball 10 to 15 feet from the basket.
Pike is embarrassing the kid by insisting he gets the ball 10 to 15 feet from the basket.
Is that done to draw out the opposing center and open the lane for our guards to penetrate? It’s the only explanation I can come up with.
Cliff’s deficiencies were covered up by his role in the past. He can’t just wait to be fed easy dunks this year.
Looks like this to me. Cliff has been looking lazier and lazier. Making bad passes, not being aggressive in the paint. Could be hurt, but could also be not playing hard. What a shame.
Not even layups, nor any inside shot attempt. He simply can’t shoot unless it’s a dunk or is uncontested layup.
I think we all suspect that over the last 3 years, in order to keep him, Cliff has been told by Pike that they will work on the skills he needs to get to the NBA and that he could utilize those skills in games. So last year we had the 3 point shooting debacle and for the last 2 years at least he’s been the first option in half court. It’s time for Pike to move on from that commitment.
All of these posts highlight the issues with the coaching staff
Cliff is not a post player and even becoming a post player WILL NOT HELP HIM WITH THE PROS. I am not sure why this is a central focus to our offense as it clearly doesn't work for him or for us. We try this the first 5mins of every game and we are typically in a deficit by the time we make any changes
This team actually has massive potential from what I can see but we need to make changes to suit the players that are out there and it starts with Cliff. His job should be living in the paint on Defense to disrupt the other team. Too often he was pulled away from the basket yesterday and a well coached team like Illinois were using backdoor cuts all over the place as we were overmatched man to man and were getting easy layups. On offense ONLY High PnR for Cliff so he is cutting to the basket and in a position for lobs(yes lobs as throwing a bounce pass will be a lost cause)
Also we should take notes from Illinois for all the movement they have on offense to create open looks. We just stand around too much. Wat I loved about Mag in our offense is the way he always flashed to the top of the key or cut to the low block which created more opportunities. We have lost most of that when he got injured. We saw the repercussions last year when Caleb and PM would just dribble around stall our offense. While we seem "faster" this year it is the exact same issue. We just have quicker ball movement around the outside yet its wasted energy going nowhere. Instead in a high PnR we try and create spacing for high percentage shots. Why I like Gavin doing the PnR with Cliff is if his defender comes off of his to guard CO he gets a wide open shot.
Again, this is all on coaching and I do not like what I see.
Also, Hyatt needs to pass the ball. He’s a spot up shooter and not a guy that can beat defenders 1:1. Overall the team doesn’t pass the ball well. Cliff and Hyatt don’t pass.
One thing that has happened to him (it may not be the only thing) is that he doesn't have someone who knows how to (or can) get him the ball the way that certain previous players did. Now, that fact may underscore limitations in Cliff's game. So be it. But, regardless, to this point, nobody seems to be able to get Cliff the ball in situations that allow him to take advantage of his quickness, leaping ability and long arms the way that certain (unnamed) previous players could.
He's actually very good at beating his guy and using his body. The problem is he couldn't make a layup to save his life. If he could convert layups he'd be one of the best attackers at the rim that we have had in a very long time.
We don’t get dribble penetration coupled with assists…don’t get to the rim to score, don’t swing the ball quickly, don’t cut, basically a stationary offense. Guards aren’t creating opportunities and we are super easy to defend. Only guy that does any of this is Williams. He was brought in to help, not to be a lead guy. I think he needs to be a lead guy on this squad.
The pick and roll was huge for Cliff in the past. The bigger guards were able to pass over the defense and hit him for easy dunks. Out smaller guards are being overwhelmed by the defense and so they are not able to make the pass. I think it was much easier to do with larger guards.
Sorry. This has already been reviewed. Scientists did the analysis and confirmed that passing isn't in his DNA.
I wonder what his shooting percentage is on non-dunk shots? I actually thought they made a decent effort to get him the ball in good position early yesterday but he just is not capable of finishing. On the rare occasions when he gets fouled, it's advantage the opponent given the FT %. I guess Jay Young was a big man savant given how Myles developed compared to Cliff.
At times I feel that Cliff is working off the critique of his game when he went to NBA camps and we're now seeing the unfortunate net results.....
what's frustrating is EVERYBODY knows it yet they continue to do it. When you have such agreement on this forum you know something is fracked up. It almost looks like the deal to get Cliff back was to have him use Rutgers as a development year regardless of the cost to the team. (started last year)
