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An Illustration of how great the odds are against us

RUSK97

Heisman Winner
Dec 28, 2007
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So Michigan has a 9 million a year head coach. They have tons of self-generated revenue on top of full B1G revenue. Their resources are practically limitless. They've famously raided and obtained NJ's best recruits for the past 2-3 years. A pair of top 5 recruiting class and what looks to be another top 5 recruiting class this February. Those classes were preceded by top 25 class after top 25 class. They have a humongous fan base and tremendous history. They have everything at their disposal to succeed.

And yet, they can't even win their division to get to the conference championship. That is how competitive the B1G East is.
 
Not only did they not win the B1G East, they finished 3rd! Pretty remarkable for what is easily a top 5 team in the country imo
 
And if my thinking is correct, they won't qualify for the Rose Bowl either, correct?
 
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And Texas and Notre Dame are horrible, even with huge budgets and very good recruiting. And Tennessee. And USC. It is hard to win even with money, and without it it is brutal.
 
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And Texas and Notre Dame are horrible, even with huge budgets and very good recruiting. And Tennessee. And USC. It is hard to win even with money, and without it it is brutal.

Texas and Notre Dame are real hard to figure. So many advantages....so many 4-star recruits.
Christ, Notre Dame even has its own network deal with NBC. How could they not have at least
a winning record ? Weak player development...I guess.
 
So Michigan has a 9 million a year head coach. They have tons of self-generated revenue on top of full B1G revenue. Their resources are practically limitless. They've famously raided and obtained NJ's best recruits for the past 2-3 years. A pair of top 5 recruiting class and what looks to be another top 5 recruiting class this February. Those classes were preceded by top 25 class after top 25 class. They have a humongous fan base and tremendous history. They have everything at their disposal to succeed.


Just lost my post so I have to short
 
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Just lost my post so I have to shorten. MONEY IS VERY IMPORTANT TO AN EXTENT BUT IT CAN'T NECESSARILY BUY.

1) Choosing a coach with a good reputation for treating players well. If you don't eventually word gets out. Seed Bannon, Hill Jr., and Rice.

2) Choosing a coach who can put together a good staff-can manage (not micromanage), a coach who works well with others and who can find guys who want to work with him. See Schiano.

3) A school's overall reputation-From the original purpose of Livingston campus to traditionally mismanaging the sports program, Rutgers has had a bad rep. Hurts recruiting.

4) Demographics-New Jersey, for instance, is very wealthy (~#2 in county in per capita income). With 3 above many top students run out of state including top athletes.

5) A school's tradition. Many schools have had some success so a "blip" here and there doesn't matter to recruits as 1)players want to win and gain exposure; and 2)if something has happened it wasn't to them necessarily (see Penn State) and 3) in many states such as North Carolna there is a BIG family legacy in state of attending UNC or NC State.

6) Location. Hurts Rutgers. A top coach can only do so much-other factors determine recruiting. If you have an open minded student who sees a lush beautiful campus, beautiful small college town, oft warmer weather, friendlier people (inc coeds) gonna really help that school. I attended UNC after 5 tough years running around Rutgers (and that's with 3 years of commuting and only having to take a few classes off Cook/Douglass-Livingston also not so bad)-you could walk everywhere and it was a country club compared to RU. New Brunswick is an improved, but not so nice, small city. Livingston (the new "city" is cool but a Chapel Hill is does not make) and Busch are very generic looking.

7)***Team chemistry. A coach has to be a people person to an extent, to choose players who R not just good athletes but good people-and who fit their program and style of play. Pikiell seems to have mastered this. A "diamond" in the rough may be just as important as a 4-5 star player. A case in point is CJ Gettys "Big Country" or as I have dubbed him "B1G RUsty": Though nicely 7 foot he plays with with emotion, is fan friendly and knows his roll (a big factor for the basketball teams success so far). People are really starting to get behind the team.

On the other hand it takes 1 prima donna player to ruin team chemistry or create bad reputation for a team. With basketball a team (especially a top team) has to be careful about how many pro quality athletes they recruit. It may be better to recruit a 4 star athlete who stays 4 years than a 5-star or two who leave after 1-2 years.

8) Natural abilities/stregnths/player development. May fall under recruiting but all the money in the world sometimes can't change a player's lack of ability in certain area. Perhaps with a relatively weak free throw shooting team I was once with Bob Wenzel when asked (at Dook pre RU) "How did your team shoot free throws so well?"
Bob replied "We recruited players who were good at shooting free throws. Championship teams "bring it" every game.

9) S*it luck. Injuries (see Grant) can kill a team Some teams have catastrophic events such
as Eric Legrand's horrific injury-or outside factors that cause distraction and a lack of focus. I was friends/acquaintances of the Punter and Kicker on RU during my undergrad. In their 4 season both had girlfriends or girl problems. Maybe it was me but both seemed to have worse senior vs Junior years. Oft teams play other teams at exactly the right time.

Yes, money goes a long away towards success but when you have several teams with many quality players such as within the B1G, lots of factors play into championships.
 
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Texas and Notre Dame are real hard to figure. So many advantages....so many 4-star recruits.
Christ, Notre Dame even has its own network deal with NBC. How could they not have at least
a winning record ? Weak player development...I guess.

I recall that before Winston and the B1G's resurgence it was FL State that was leading recruiting every year and yet still managing to lose 2-3 games every year (often to mediocre teams). I recall an article that showed the best formula for winning NC was to bring in a new and young coach who came to an under-performing team that already had some talent
 
Look at it another way. A school nearly gets the death penalty for hiding the worse sex scandal in sports history, a total embarrassment,has scholarships taken away for several years,and wins the BIG TEN East.Go figure.

Yes..this was not lost on me last night as I watch PSU rout MSU. CFB is really a rigged system. It's rigged in favor of the "rich" teams. There needs to be some way to level the playing field so teams like RU, IN and IL can get their fair share of talented recruits like the pros do it with the worst teams picking ahead of the better teams. Not sure how you would go about that but something needs to change.
 
Never underestimate the odds of a segment of Rutgers fans like the few here who will always overestimate the chances of success. Cripes, take an antidepressant and find something else that makes you less depressed.

Could give you example after example of why your post is not correct.

1. RU beat Michigan in 2014. Harbaugh will melt down, get bored and/or flame out. he was on the verge of 2/3 of those last night.They will have down years.

2. Colorado won the PAC 12 South over USC and UCLA. They pay their coach peanuts. Colorado was horrible, not having a winning season since 2005. They were 1-11 in 2012, 2-10/0-9 in 2014 under their current coach and picked to finish last this year. Good thing they did not listen to RUaMoose and hired Al Golden

3. Oregon has limitless fortunes. They suck now. It was all about the QB for them, and maybe Chip Kelly. They suck now. They lost to lowly Oregon State last night, who were 2-10 last year.

9. Washington State was horrendous in 2012 and they were vying for the PAC12 North.

11. Tennessee currently blows given their resources. They lost to lowly Vanderbilt last night.

12. Texas has been futile for a lot of years.

13. Baylor sucked until Art Briles fourth year in 2011 and look what they did--we should use Baylor as a model for everything we do.

Nobody here, including Chris Ash, promised championships here. I think a large segment of our fanbase would be satisfied with a program that goes 7-5/8-4 in many years, has a down year here and there, and once in a while has a 9-3/10-2 or better year.

There are 35 examples of why you are wrong. I stand by my math and my work.
 
Just lost my post so I have to shorten. MONEY IS VERY IMPORTANT TO AN EXTENT BUT IT CAN'T NECESSARILY BUY.

1) Choosing a coach with a good reputation for treating players well. If you don't eventually word gets out. Seed Bannon, Hill Jr., and Rice.

2) Choosing a coach who can put together a good staff-can manage (not micromanage), a coach who works well with others and who can find guys who want to work with him. See Schiano.

3) A school's overall reputation-From the original purpose of Livingston campus to traditionally mismanaging the sports program, Rutgers has had a bad rep. Hurts recruiting.

4) Demographics-New Jersey, for instance, is very wealthy (~#2 in county in per capita income). With 3 above many top students run out of state including top athletes.

5) A school's tradition. Many schools have had some success so a "blip" here and there doesn't matter to recruits as 1)players want to win and gain exposure; and 2)if something has happened it wasn't to them necessarily (see Penn State) and 3) in many states such as North Carolna there is a BIG family legacy in state of attending UNC or NC State.

6) Location. Hurts Rutgers. A top coach can only do so much-other factors determine recruiting. If you have an open minded student who sees a lush beautiful campus, beautiful small college town, oft warmer weather, friendlier people (inc coeds) gonna really help that school. I attended UNC after 5 tough years running around Rutgers (and that's with 3 years of commuting and only having to take a few classes off Cook/Douglass-Livingston also not so bad)-you could walk everywhere and it was a country club compared to RU. New Brunswick is an improved, but not so nice, small city. Livingston (the new "city" is cool but a Chapel Hill is does not make) and Busch are very generic looking.

7)***Team chemistry. A coach has to be a people person to an extent, to choose players who R not just good athletes but good people-and who fit their program and style of play. Pikiell seems to have mastered this. A "diamond" in the rough may be just as important as a 4-5 star player. A case in point is CJ Gettys "Big Country" or as I have dubbed him "B1G RUsty": Though nicely 7 foot he plays with with emotion, is fan friendly and knows his roll (a big factor for the basketball teams success so far). People are really starting to get behind the team.

On the other hand it takes 1 prima donna player to ruin team chemistry or create bad reputation for a team. With basketball a team (especially a top team) has to be careful about how many pro quality athletes they recruit. It may be better to recruit a 4 star athlete who stays 4 years than a 5-star or two who leave after 1-2 years.

8) Natural abilities/stregnths/player development. May fall under recruiting but all the money in the world sometimes can't change a player's lack of ability in certain area. Perhaps with a relatively weak free throw shooting team I was once with Bob Wenzel when asked (at Dook pre RU) "How did your team shoot free throws so well?"
Bob replied "We recruited players who were good at shooting free throws. Championship teams "bring it" every game.

9) S*it luck. Injuries (see Grant) can kill a team Some teams have catastrophic events such
as Eric Legrand's horrific injury-or outside factors that cause distraction and a lack of focus. I was friends/acquaintances of the Punter and Kicker on RU during my undergrad. In their 4 season both had girlfriends or girl problems. Maybe it was me but both seemed to have worse senior vs Junior years. Oft teams play other teams at exactly the right time.

Yes, money goes a long away towards success but when you have several teams with many quality players such as within the B1G, lots of factors play into championships.

That was the shortened version? lol
 
Remember in the year 2000 and 2001? We were one of the worst teams in the entire country. 6 years later we were ranked #6 in the country for a week. It can be done but Ash will need some time. Too many woe is me people on this board. Look at WMU, they were horrible a few years ago, now they are undefeated. Patience my friends.
 
Uphill all the way for RU and the FB program in terms of finding success in the B1G....
Lack of state pride.
Lack of flagship state-school pride.
Lack of alumni support.
Lack of booster support.
Lack of B1G $.
All of which translates to $$$$$, which is key to moving the program forward: staff, facilities, etc. The state legislature, RU BOG, President, AD, staff, etc. are on the clock, rallying support of alumni and boosters. An infusion of $. Lots of $. Then smart stewardship of those $ and sound investment decisions in the program.

Only then will success happen. Five years away at a minimum.
 
The NJ area is filled with bandwagon fans. Remember in 2006 when all of these Rutgers fans came out if the woodwork? I was still in high school and Rutgers football became all the talk with Schiano, Ray Rice etc. Suddenly Rutgers became cool. NJ is itching for a successful Rutgers sports program. Rutgers needs to string a few successful season together. They need to become the hot thing in NJ again and the support will come.
 
The gap between us and the others in our division is like the Grand Canyon every conceivable way.

They also signed a $250MM apparel deal.
 
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Yes..this was not lost on me last night as I watch PSU rout MSU. CFB is really a rigged system. It's rigged in favor of the "rich" teams. There needs to be some way to level the playing field so teams like RU, IN and IL can get their fair share of talented recruits like the pros do it with the worst teams picking ahead of the better teams. Not sure how you would go about that but something needs to change.


Fixes could be made to NCAA College Football which would be similar to what the NFL does to make teams more competitive with each other.

The NFL has a Salary Cap which insures ultra rich teams cannot just "buy" the best players.

NCAA College football could install a "Limit" on what a University can devote to the Football Program each year. EX. Max Limit might be $100 million. If a cash rich program takes in $140 million per year (TV,Tickets, Advertising etc. revenue) they would have to give the remaining funds ($40 million) for other University uses (Endowment, student scholarships etc.).

Two: The NFL has a "coaches rule" which does not permit any other NFL Team from contacting that coach while he is still under contract.

The NCAA could impose a college "coaches rule" which would say that no NCAA football program can contact another schools coach while he is under contract. Cannot "buy" another programs successful coach until his contract has expired.

The NCAA already has restrictions in place that limit recruiting and scholarships.

All of these things could be done but teams like Ohio State, Notre Dame, Texas etc. would not like it because it would hurt their competitive advantage.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
Need a successful football coach.

Just buy him.

If he does not work out (2-3 years) just buy another one.

$10 million per year for the HC. No Problem.

LOL!!!!

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
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That is why teams like Rutgers and Pitt will continue to struggle.

The NFL knows how to run a successful business and bring in the money.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

I was thinking of rating each recruit and then limiting how many top rated recruits a team can accept based on where they finished the previous year. Finish 1-5 you can accept X number of four and 5 star recruits. 6-10, X+2. 11-15. X+4 and so on. Teams that don't make the top 25 or whatever would have no limit. Just a thought. Probably not feasible for a variety of reasons
 
Never underestimate the odds of a segment of Rutgers fans like the few here who will always overestimate the chances of success. Cripes, take an antidepressant and find something else that makes you less depressed.

Could give you example after example of why your post is not correct.

1. RU beat Michigan in 2014. Harbaugh will melt down, get bored and/or flame out. he was on the verge of 2/3 of those last night.They will have down years.

2. Colorado won the PAC 12 South over USC and UCLA. They pay their coach peanuts. Colorado was horrible, not having a winning season since 2005. They were 1-11 in 2012, 2-10/0-9 in 2014 under their current coach and picked to finish last this year. Good thing they did not listen to RUaMoose and hired Al Golden

3. Oregon has limitless fortunes. They suck now. It was all about the QB for them, and maybe Chip Kelly. They suck now. They lost to lowly Oregon State last night, who were 2-10 last year.

9. Washington State was horrendous in 2012 and they were vying for the PAC12 North.

11. Tennessee currently blows given their resources. They lost to lowly Vanderbilt last night.

12. Texas has been futile for a lot of years.

13. Baylor sucked until Art Briles fourth year in 2011 and look what they did--we should use Baylor as a model for everything we do.

Nobody here, including Chris Ash, promised championships here. I think a large segment of our fanbase would be satisfied with a program that goes 7-5/8-4 in many years, has a down year here and there, and once in a while has a 9-3/10-2 or better year.

There are 35 examples of why you are wrong. I stand by my math and my work.


Great examples. Very important to have an endowment but after a while its not the only factor as many schools have such.
"
I oft think the "foundation" forces the "gap" issue, somewhat, as a "scare tactic."
 
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The NJ area is filled with bandwagon fans. Remember in 2006 when all of these Rutgers fans came out if the woodwork? I was still in high school and Rutgers football became all the talk with Schiano, Ray Rice etc. Suddenly Rutgers became cool. NJ is itching for a successful Rutgers sports program. Rutgers needs to string a few successful season together. They need to become the hot thing in NJ again and the support will come.

Not just bandwagon but this area offers so much that Rutgers et al compete for the consumer dollar (at least for the casual fan).
 
I was thinking of rating each recruit and then limiting how many top rated recruits a team can accept based on where they finished the previous year. Finish 1-5 you can accept X number of four and 5 star recruits. 6-10, X+2. 11-15. X+4 and so on. Teams that don't make the top 25 or whatever would have no limit. Just a thought. Probably not feasible for a variety of reasons

You can't deny a recruit's wish to attend a college. You can maybe limit scholarships based on success of a program but even that seems like it is unfair to the less wealthy college recruit.
 
I was thinking of rating each recruit and then limiting how many top rated recruits a team can accept based on where they finished the previous year. Finish 1-5 you can accept X number of four and 5 star recruits. 6-10, X+2. 11-15. X+4 and so on. Teams that don't make the top 25 or whatever would have no limit. Just a thought. Probably not feasible for a variety of reasons

I don't think that idea would fly.

You have several rating services with varying star results. I think the 85 scholarship limit is the best one can hope for in this regard.

In the old days teams could have 120 recruits or more on their team.
Vacuum cleaner the state of all good players to prevent your competition from getting any.

Limiting money and coaching poaching is the way to go in my opinion.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
As the saying goes, "be careful what you wish for".
How many years were we crying for some P5 conference to save us. So, our prayers were answered BIG time. Our reward is to be in the toughest division of the toughest conference in the country.
Any casual observer would simply say we were doomed to be bottom feeders for many decades to come. Of course, those of us wearing those scarlet glasses think we can fix this pretty easily and challenge those football factories for dominance.
 
Lets keep it real... It is not like we were winning the Big East every season. We only won it once during its final year and it was co-champs with a lot if other teams.

I just want to get back to going to bowl games every year. Beyond that I would be happy with being 7/8 win team most years.

9/10 wins once in a while and who knows the chips could fall in our favor those years and we can end up in the Big Team championship game without being the best team (see Penn state this year).

This will take years to get to that point.

However there are only a few teams that will always be favored to go to the playoffs every season and we just have to understand that we may never ever be that team.

But that is not the end of the world since Most teams in the FBS will never ever be those teams as well.
 
As the saying goes, "be careful what you wish for".
How many years were we crying for some P5 conference to save us. So, our prayers were answered BIG time. Our reward is to be in the toughest division of the toughest conference in the country.
Any casual observer would simply say we were doomed to be bottom feeders for many decades to come. Of course, those of us wearing those scarlet glasses think we can fix this pretty easily and challenge those football factories for dominance.
Are you capital-F kidding me??!? You'd rather be UConn in the AAC getting thumped by every directional school and scraping pennies together for it?

It kinda stinks the B1G stacked the divisions the way they did, but it is what it is.

Interestingly, those who bitch about our soft schedules in the past were still doing it the preseason this year when we had Howard and UNM on the schedule.
 
Fixes could be made to NCAA College Football which would be similar to what the NFL does to make teams more competitive with each other.

The NFL has a Salary Cap which insures ultra rich teams cannot just "buy" the best players.

NCAA College football could install a "Limit" on what a University can devote to the Football Program each year. EX. Max Limit might be $100 million. If a cash rich program takes in $140 million per year (TV,Tickets, Advertising etc. revenue) they would have to give the remaining funds ($40 million) for other University uses (Endowment, student scholarships etc.).

Two: The NFL has a "coaches rule" which does not permit any other NFL Team from contacting that coach while he is still under contract.

The NCAA could impose a college "coaches rule" which would say that no NCAA football program can contact another schools coach while he is under contract. Cannot "buy" another programs successful coach until his contract has expired.

The NCAA already has restrictions in place that limit recruiting and scholarships.

All of these things could be done but teams like Ohio State, Notre Dame, Texas etc. would not like it because it would hurt their competitive advantage.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!


Almost all(and I would actually say all) coaches contracts have it in them that other teams cannot contact them during the season. The other schools just contact their agents. Schools aren't allowed to contact coaches while their coach is under contract either, that's why they hire search firms to do it. Both parties have a way around it and it happens in the NFL as well. You will never get a rule passed that there won't be a way around the contact or you won't get the coaches or schools to sign anything but 1 year deals and that isn't going to happen.

I never buy into the "school A" has such an advantage because they have so much money. Every P5 school has the oppurtunity to have just as much as the other. They all have Alumni and all have wealthy Alumni. It is up to the school to be able to take advantage of getting the Alums to donate so their team can be competitive if that is what the school is missing. Having great coaches is a major key but a bigger one is to have the people to get Alumni on board to get the resources needed to compete. You will never get the NCAA to "limit" the finances of schools. College sports has always been about schools with resources and those that scrape together what they can and it always will be that way. It is up to the schools and their Alumni to get what is needed, not the TV contract or the conference share of money. As stated here all the time the rest of the Big 10 schools are getting XXXX dollars more than RU and you won't be able to compete till you get a full share. Getting a full share is not going to make you any more competitive than you are now because you are still going to be a long ways behind the traditional schools because not only do they have a 50 year jump on you money wise, their donation levels continue to be huge. The conference share money is chump change to what resources these schools have and will continue to have. The bigger athletic departments are sitting on huge slush funds as well as what is donated and the conference revenue. NU's football program, for example, has $150mil(that grows annually) sitting in a slush fund for a rainy day if they need it. If RU wants to close the gap, the conference money isn't even a good starting point. The starting point is the 600,000 Alumni in your region to start writing checks. You can have a staff of Saban, Myer, Harbough, and whoever else you want but until you catch up in a lot of other areas then the top kids will continue to leave the state. It is about bells and whistles a lot more than people think. Look at Oregon, they sucked until Knight started writing facility and staff checks and suddenly they are a major player. Had Okie State ever done much before Pickens? No. Texas under Mack Brown rose up because of getting the Alumni to redo their entire football complex. Texas A&M, the same. Alabama has spent close to $1bil on stadium and facilities at Sabans demand so they could maintain. Nebraska has spent $750mil in the last 5 years on all sports facilities and is now gearing up for another $200mil on the stadium perhaps. They spend $25mil annually on stadium improvements just to make little changes. This year they are replacing the ribbon boards(4 years old) and the 4 corner big screen TV's(5 years old). I guess they are discussing having Jumbo screens above both endzones now instead of just the one on the North and having them both be bigger than current one. There are examples all over college sports about what it takes to be competitive and it is $$$$$$ as you folks have stated.

The $100+mil you folks are trying to raise right now is great but it isn't even a full starting point. Everyone has to keep writing more and more checks. Doing a $1mil weight room redo really didn't close the gap with anybody because most of the bigger schools do that stuff annually which I think you folks will get to but just not with the conference pay, especially funding the number of sports you have and the cost of products there.

The odds are not in you favor but it can be done. Just can't have years like this one because any excitement that was left from entering the Big 10 has been used up know and its almost like the process has to start from scratch. NU has had to rebuild some donor trust after the Pederson/Callahan/Pelini stuff but folks all seem to be going in the same direction now despite some 3 yard punts(Ha). The only problem with getting started and doing new facility stuff is that with every upgrade you have to upgrade everything else to match the new upgrade then match it with an upgrade, ect, ect, ect. It turns into feeding the 900lb gorilla that can't be stopped. Then instead of them saying we need $1000 dollars from ou to keep things going, they say to keep improving things and for you to maintain your seats or donor standing type stuff, they need $10,000. Pay it or you get pushed aside because there is always somebody that will write the check to get their foot in the door. It;s an endless circle that as a fan/donor/booster, you can't win.
 
Almost all(and I would actually say all) coaches contracts have it in them that other teams cannot contact them during the season. The other schools just contact their agents. Schools aren't allowed to contact coaches while their coach is under contract either, that's why they hire search firms to do it. Both parties have a way around it and it happens in the NFL as well. You will never get a rule passed that there won't be a way around the contact or you won't get the coaches or schools to sign anything but 1 year deals and that isn't going to happen.

I never buy into the "school A" has such an advantage because they have so much money. Every P5 school has the oppurtunity to have just as much as the other. They all have Alumni and all have wealthy Alumni. It is up to the school to be able to take advantage of getting the Alums to donate so their team can be competitive if that is what the school is missing. Having great coaches is a major key but a bigger one is to have the people to get Alumni on board to get the resources needed to compete. You will never get the NCAA to "limit" the finances of schools. College sports has always been about schools with resources and those that scrape together what they can and it always will be that way. It is up to the schools and their Alumni to get what is needed, not the TV contract or the conference share of money. As stated here all the time the rest of the Big 10 schools are getting XXXX dollars more than RU and you won't be able to compete till you get a full share. Getting a full share is not going to make you any more competitive than you are now because you are still going to be a long ways behind the traditional schools because not only do they have a 50 year jump on you money wise, their donation levels continue to be huge. The conference share money is chump change to what resources these schools have and will continue to have. The bigger athletic departments are sitting on huge slush funds as well as what is donated and the conference revenue. NU's football program, for example, has $150mil(that grows annually) sitting in a slush fund for a rainy day if they need it. If RU wants to close the gap, the conference money isn't even a good starting point. The starting point is the 600,000 Alumni in your region to start writing checks. You can have a staff of Saban, Myer, Harbough, and whoever else you want but until you catch up in a lot of other areas then the top kids will continue to leave the state. It is about bells and whistles a lot more than people think. Look at Oregon, they sucked until Knight started writing facility and staff checks and suddenly they are a major player. Had Okie State ever done much before Pickens? No. Texas under Mack Brown rose up because of getting the Alumni to redo their entire football complex. Texas A&M, the same. Alabama has spent close to $1bil on stadium and facilities at Sabans demand so they could maintain. Nebraska has spent $750mil in the last 5 years on all sports facilities and is now gearing up for another $200mil on the stadium perhaps. They spend $25mil annually on stadium improvements just to make little changes. This year they are replacing the ribbon boards(4 years old) and the 4 corner big screen TV's(5 years old). I guess they are discussing having Jumbo screens above both endzones now instead of just the one on the North and having them both be bigger than current one. There are examples all over college sports about what it takes to be competitive and it is $$$$$$ as you folks have stated.

The $100+mil you folks are trying to raise right now is great but it isn't even a full starting point. Everyone has to keep writing more and more checks. Doing a $1mil weight room redo really didn't close the gap with anybody because most of the bigger schools do that stuff annually which I think you folks will get to but just not with the conference pay, especially funding the number of sports you have and the cost of products there.

The odds are not in you favor but it can be done. Just can't have years like this one because any excitement that was left from entering the Big 10 has been used up know and its almost like the process has to start from scratch. NU has had to rebuild some donor trust after the Pederson/Callahan/Pelini stuff but folks all seem to be going in the same direction now despite some 3 yard punts(Ha). The only problem with getting started and doing new facility stuff is that with every upgrade you have to upgrade everything else to match the new upgrade then match it with an upgrade, ect, ect, ect. It turns into feeding the 900lb gorilla that can't be stopped. Then instead of them saying we need $1000 dollars from ou to keep things going, they say to keep improving things and for you to maintain your seats or donor standing type stuff, they need $10,000. Pay it or you get pushed aside because there is always somebody that will write the check to get their foot in the door. It;s an endless circle that as a fan/donor/booster, you can't win.

Question- so what is the feeling on your head coach? Great season at 9-3 (the kind an RU fan would love to have), close loss to Wisconsin- but do the blowouts by tOSU and Iowa have any fans concerned?
 
Not just bandwagon but this area offers so much that Rutgers et al compete for the consumer dollar (at least for the casual fan).
Rutgers needs to become the flavor of the week again. We really gained a lot of fans after the 2006 season and many are waiting for a repeat.
 
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Question- so what is the feeling on your head coach? Great season at 9-3 (the kind an RU fan would love to have), close loss to Wisconsin- but do the blowouts by tOSU and Iowa have any fans concerned?


I think most are happy to have only been blown out twice this year. Between a lack of depth along either line and the injuries that occurred especially on the Oline people will settle for the results. Still have the OC trying to fit a round peg ina square hole to many time with Armstrong at QB but that is over now except for the bowl game. All the other returning QB's are for Riley's system. They also got to redshirt and keep the redshirt on all the kids they wanted to. That was one of the reasons behind the depth on the lines as well as 2 early NFL entries and a couple transfers. NU fans are laughing a one of the DLine transfers who went as a graduate transfer to Michigan St. so he could play for a playoff spot and a major bowl game. That didn't work out so well for him.

Everybody knows NU has to get stronger and more physical and hopefully the red shirting helps. We are tired of an Oline that is starting 4 walk inside because of injury.

All in all I think things are kind of where people expected them to be. Next year we will see what the Riley/Langsdorf system is for sure going to look like as the offensive skill guys will fit his mold and the line talent will be a little better and definitely deeper with 7 returning that played and 5 coming out of redshirt.

It will be the year things better start looking better or there will be real estate agents involved for some. I think the special teams coach will be let go by the end of next week if not sooner. He did not leave last night like the others did to recruit staring today so hopefully that's a good sign he is packing.


Edit: Nebraska has fired special teams coach Bruce Read. Much joy in the land of corn. Ha
 
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Almost all(and I would actually say all) coaches contracts have it in them that other teams cannot contact them during the season. The other schools just contact their agents. Schools aren't allowed to contact coaches while their coach is under contract either, that's why they hire search firms to do it. Both parties have a way around it and it happens in the NFL as well. You will never get a rule passed that there won't be a way around the contact or you won't get the coaches or schools to sign anything but 1 year deals and that isn't going to happen.

I never buy into the "school A" has such an advantage because they have so much money. Every P5 school has the oppurtunity to have just as much as the other. They all have Alumni and all have wealthy Alumni. It is up to the school to be able to take advantage of getting the Alums to donate so their team can be competitive if that is what the school is missing. Having great coaches is a major key but a bigger one is to have the people to get Alumni on board to get the resources needed to compete. You will never get the NCAA to "limit" the finances of schools. College sports has always been about schools with resources and those that scrape together what they can and it always will be that way. It is up to the schools and their Alumni to get what is needed, not the TV contract or the conference share of money. As stated here all the time the rest of the Big 10 schools are getting XXXX dollars more than RU and you won't be able to compete till you get a full share. Getting a full share is not going to make you any more competitive than you are now because you are still going to be a long ways behind the traditional schools because not only do they have a 50 year jump on you money wise, their donation levels continue to be huge. The conference share money is chump change to what resources these schools have and will continue to have. The bigger athletic departments are sitting on huge slush funds as well as what is donated and the conference revenue. NU's football program, for example, has $150mil(that grows annually) sitting in a slush fund for a rainy day if they need it. If RU wants to close the gap, the conference money isn't even a good starting point. The starting point is the 600,000 Alumni in your region to start writing checks. You can have a staff of Saban, Myer, Harbough, and whoever else you want but until you catch up in a lot of other areas then the top kids will continue to leave the state. It is about bells and whistles a lot more than people think. Look at Oregon, they sucked until Knight started writing facility and staff checks and suddenly they are a major player. Had Okie State ever done much before Pickens? No. Texas under Mack Brown rose up because of getting the Alumni to redo their entire football complex. Texas A&M, the same. Alabama has spent close to $1bil on stadium and facilities at Sabans demand so they could maintain. Nebraska has spent $750mil in the last 5 years on all sports facilities and is now gearing up for another $200mil on the stadium perhaps. They spend $25mil annually on stadium improvements just to make little changes. This year they are replacing the ribbon boards(4 years old) and the 4 corner big screen TV's(5 years old). I guess they are discussing having Jumbo screens above both endzones now instead of just the one on the North and having them both be bigger than current one. There are examples all over college sports about what it takes to be competitive and it is $$$$$$ as you folks have stated.

The $100+mil you folks are trying to raise right now is great but it isn't even a full starting point. Everyone has to keep writing more and more checks. Doing a $1mil weight room redo really didn't close the gap with anybody because most of the bigger schools do that stuff annually which I think you folks will get to but just not with the conference pay, especially funding the number of sports you have and the cost of products there.

The odds are not in you favor but it can be done. Just can't have years like this one because any excitement that was left from entering the Big 10 has been used up know and its almost like the process has to start from scratch. NU has had to rebuild some donor trust after the Pederson/Callahan/Pelini stuff but folks all seem to be going in the same direction now despite some 3 yard punts(Ha). The only problem with getting started and doing new facility stuff is that with every upgrade you have to upgrade everything else to match the new upgrade then match it with an upgrade, ect, ect, ect. It turns into feeding the 900lb gorilla that can't be stopped. Then instead of them saying we need $1000 dollars from ou to keep things going, they say to keep improving things and for you to maintain your seats or donor standing type stuff, they need $10,000. Pay it or you get pushed aside because there is always somebody that will write the check to get their foot in the door. It;s an endless circle that as a fan/donor/booster, you can't win.

This is spot on. Let some of those numbers sink in for a minute.

The B1G shares are great, and will have us ahead of teams in other conferences like those we used to play. But we are in the baddest division in college football.

It's going to take donations to keep up. Lots and lots of donations.
 
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Almost all(and I would actually say all) coaches contracts have it in them that other teams cannot contact them during the season. The other schools just contact their agents. Schools aren't allowed to contact coaches while their coach is under contract either, that's why they hire search firms to do it. Both parties have a way around it and it happens in the NFL as well. You will never get a rule passed that there won't be a way around the contact or you won't get the coaches or schools to sign anything but 1 year deals and that isn't going to happen.

I never buy into the "school A" has such an advantage because they have so much money. Every P5 school has the oppurtunity to have just as much as the other. They all have Alumni and all have wealthy Alumni. It is up to the school to be able to take advantage of getting the Alums to donate so their team can be competitive if that is what the school is missing. Having great coaches is a major key but a bigger one is to have the people to get Alumni on board to get the resources needed to compete. You will never get the NCAA to "limit" the finances of schools. College sports has always been about schools with resources and those that scrape together what they can and it always will be that way. It is up to the schools and their Alumni to get what is needed, not the TV contract or the conference share of money. As stated here all the time the rest of the Big 10 schools are getting XXXX dollars more than RU and you won't be able to compete till you get a full share. Getting a full share is not going to make you any more competitive than you are now because you are still going to be a long ways behind the traditional schools because not only do they have a 50 year jump on you money wise, their donation levels continue to be huge. The conference share money is chump change to what resources these schools have and will continue to have. The bigger athletic departments are sitting on huge slush funds as well as what is donated and the conference revenue. NU's football program, for example, has $150mil(that grows annually) sitting in a slush fund for a rainy day if they need it. If RU wants to close the gap, the conference money isn't even a good starting point. The starting point is the 600,000 Alumni in your region to start writing checks. You can have a staff of Saban, Myer, Harbough, and whoever else you want but until you catch up in a lot of other areas then the top kids will continue to leave the state. It is about bells and whistles a lot more than people think. Look at Oregon, they sucked until Knight started writing facility and staff checks and suddenly they are a major player. Had Okie State ever done much before Pickens? No. Texas under Mack Brown rose up because of getting the Alumni to redo their entire football complex. Texas A&M, the same. Alabama has spent close to $1bil on stadium and facilities at Sabans demand so they could maintain. Nebraska has spent $750mil in the last 5 years on all sports facilities and is now gearing up for another $200mil on the stadium perhaps. They spend $25mil annually on stadium improvements just to make little changes. This year they are replacing the ribbon boards(4 years old) and the 4 corner big screen TV's(5 years old). I guess they are discussing having Jumbo screens above both endzones now instead of just the one on the North and having them both be bigger than current one. There are examples all over college sports about what it takes to be competitive and it is $$$$$$ as you folks have stated.

The $100+mil you folks are trying to raise right now is great but it isn't even a full starting point. Everyone has to keep writing more and more checks. Doing a $1mil weight room redo really didn't close the gap with anybody because most of the bigger schools do that stuff annually which I think you folks will get to but just not with the conference pay, especially funding the number of sports you have and the cost of products there.

The odds are not in you favor but it can be done. Just can't have years like this one because any excitement that was left from entering the Big 10 has been used up know and its almost like the process has to start from scratch. NU has had to rebuild some donor trust after the Pederson/Callahan/Pelini stuff but folks all seem to be going in the same direction now despite some 3 yard punts(Ha). The only problem with getting started and doing new facility stuff is that with every upgrade you have to upgrade everything else to match the new upgrade then match it with an upgrade, ect, ect, ect. It turns into feeding the 900lb gorilla that can't be stopped. Then instead of them saying we need $1000 dollars from ou to keep things going, they say to keep improving things and for you to maintain your seats or donor standing type stuff, they need $10,000. Pay it or you get pushed aside because there is always somebody that will write the check to get their foot in the door. It;s an endless circle that as a fan/donor/booster, you can't win.

Name one NFL coach who left an NFL Team for another while under contract.

If that were the case you would have NFL coaches leaving every year they won the Super Bowl.

No one says if our current coach wins the Super Bowl he may be gone next year.

He will only be gone if his contract is expired.

NFL prohibits such a move.



HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
I think most are happy to have only been blown out twice this year. Between a lack of depth along either line and the injuries that occurred especially on the Oline people will settle for the results. Still have the OC trying to fit a round peg ina square hole to many time with Armstrong at QB but that is over now except for the bowl game. All the other returning QB's are for Riley's system. They also got to redshirt and keep the redshirt on all the kids they wanted to. That was one of the reasons behind the depth on the lines as well as 2 early NFL entries and a couple transfers. NU fans are laughing a one of the DLine transfers who went as a graduate transfer to Michigan St. so he could play for a playoff spot and a major bowl game. That didn't work out so well for him.

Everybody knows NU has to get stronger and more physical and hopefully the red shirting helps. We are tired of an Oline that is starting 4 walk inside because of injury.

All in all I think things are kind of where people expected them to be. Next year we will see what the Riley/Langsdorf system is for sure going to look like as the offensive skill guys will fit his mold and the line talent will be a little better and definitely deeper with 7 returning that played and 5 coming out of redshirt.

It will be the year things better start looking better or there will be real estate agents involved for some. I think the special teams coach will be let go by the end of next week if not sooner. He did not leave last night like the others did to recruit staring today so hopefully that's a good sign he is packing.


Edit: Nebraska has fired special teams coach Bruce Read. Much joy in the land of corn. Ha

Interesting. As an outsider, would have thought you guys would be worried about the loss of Armstrong. Did not realize you guys were changing offensive scheme.
 
ok,Ill play,then how has Maryland,Temple,BC,Pitt,Western Michigan, and even Syracuse been able to have a better Football program then RU the last four years?
people with this "rigged system" ,"player payouts "is such Whiny excuse driven BS..
One thing of note regarding money; maybe IF Ru spent the money on Narduzzi when they had a chance ,we wouldnt be one of the worst programs in college football right now..You get out of a program what you invest into it.
 
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