I never thought the team quit. What I saw was an ill prepared team to compete with teams who had more talent than they did.
Ash absolutely buries Flood regime
- Thread starter LevaosLectures
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I agree this team not being prepared. I spend time watching the team as they are on the sidelines. There are many times you can see that they were disinterested in being there. The leadership stunk the last couple of years. Very little coach to player and player to player interaction. No real coaching up!! That is also a sign of quitting.
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The players didn't quit. It looked that way because the coaches brought the gameplanning equivalent of a plastic knives to gunfight.
You have never been to boot camp or motivated young men. Coaching is having a PhD in psychology
as for haunting us by NJ.com what else is new. Yes Ash is providing ammo but all that ammo is a dud if we turn the program around. when is a egomaniac become a great leader. When the troops follow openly.
You have never been to boot camp or motivated young men. Coaching is having a PhD in psychology. Everything is to be gained from this. You are telling players to change or move on as you are not the caliber of player need to make a change. Quite simple and blunt. 50% will rise to the call and the other half will transfer or just finish out at Rutgers but off the field. Changing the attitude of the team is a must! Go watch Eddie and how lost these kids are with Eddie applying his "pro attitude of coaching" the man is a COLLEGE coaching disaster
eh - cant agree. I am not one of these guys who said they quit ever time we lost...but there were definitely games where we quit
the one that sticks out in my mind was Wisky (home) 2 years ago. we were tied (or down 3) at the end of the 1Q...then they got tough, and we went fetal
that game still burns me up.
I have to give a LIKE to my friend NUTS here...i can vouche for the fact that he and I argued many a time back in Oct 2013...I liked the trend of the program, he didn't
I could go on and on and on and support why I felt the way I did, the rationale, etc etc etc
but at the end of the day, I was wrong, and he was right. and I know we're both bummed about the levels the program got to...so there's no real winner in that debate!!
BUT, as fans, I think we can all feel very good about where it looks like HCCA is going to take us.
From the upper sidelines you could clearly see instances of a player or players quitting on some plays. Whether it was a receiver not extending to make a catch or a DB not making a full effort to pursue an opponent. Those were the obvious ones, in open field. An experienced coach, armed with the luxury watching of game films, was sure to see many more examples.
I don't go so far to say that the team quit. But some players sure did.
I don't go so far to say that the team quit. But some players sure did.
Maryland collapse did it for me, that was brutal. No coaching leadership especially on defense. Defense has to be better, with the biggest two symptoms.
1) not getting off the field on 3rd down
2) DB's not reacting to the ball when they are in man coverage
We have not rolled the balls out yet but it seems Chris is doing everything to make it different here.
1) not getting off the field on 3rd down
2) DB's not reacting to the ball when they are in man coverage
We have not rolled the balls out yet but it seems Chris is doing everything to make it different here.
But of course this is what we already knew. The previous coach and his staff were bad, really bad. Blowout after blowout after blowout is all the proof you need of that.
If Ash is anything like Meyer, he will be brutally honest even in public. For example Meyer's first year in Columbus, reporters asked about the WRs and he said they were terrible... he wasn't even sure if they were D1 level talents. That is motivation, either they work harder or they give up and quit.
Out of those 9 WRs:
Transfers: 4
Went on to NFL: 4
That honesty let's the players know where they are in the program and to either shape up or ship out. The program doesn't have the time or room for players that don't want to be great.
That's the two worst teams in the league. That's like coming back against ourselves....
well said - I watched the same game. I didn't see "quit" - I saw a team that realized they were out sized, out coached, out manned, out schemed, but kept on playing with heart......
I disagreed with the quitting part but then I remember I didn't have access to the film Ash had..
I'm the farthest thing from a Flood apologist & have been very pro Ash, but question going public with this type of comment,re: quitting.
It's a strong statement to players that things are going to be different. I have no problem with it and I'm sure many players who might have thought some teammates quit have no problem with it.
This is why I WISH I saw some anger from Flood after a blow out loss. There was no anger. It was get ready to go 1-0 the next week. Accountability - at least publicly - was non-existent.
I understand what your saying and this could come back to bite him in the ass. However, usually all the good ones are egomaniacs . They have such a belief that their system is the only right way to do things that they always come off like this. They could give two craps what some pencil neck sports writer thinks about them. The not so good one's more times than not come off as real nice guys.]
When Carroo played we upped our game. When he wasn't it was pitiful.Can one guy make that kind of impact from that position? He may have..
Poor choice of words. Don't recall Coach Schiano ever blatantly ripping Shea.
We did not quit. In fact the Maryland and Indiana comebacks were two of the greatest combacks in RU history. Less we not forget the Arkansas game either for point of reference.
Bad comment and like not coming here right away, growing pains we just have to accept and learn.
We did not quit. In fact the Maryland and Indiana comebacks were two of the greatest combacks in RU history. Less we not forget the Arkansas game either for point of reference.
Bad comment and like not coming here right away, growing pains we just have to accept and learn.
Indiana was a bowl team and actually very good offensively. Maryland was a bowl team the year before.
I don't see him bashing our old staff. He is coming in and changing everything because status quo will not cut it in the BIG. I don't think he is calling out the players for quitting as a motivational tool per se. He said fight or flight from Day 1 so he may be hinting at that but he is too smart to point fingers. Calling out KF does Ash no good but telling the kids they better not quit on his watch can only help Demanding more from them.each and every day cannot hurt and likely will help a great deal over last season.
I think he has handled the off field issues very well by not getting into them. In reality, that is one of the biggest changes we need to see. Those kids quit on the team more than anyone who was on the field last season. That cannot continue to happen in our program. We just are not deep enough to lose that many players for being foolish.
I think he has handled the off field issues very well by not getting into them. In reality, that is one of the biggest changes we need to see. Those kids quit on the team more than anyone who was on the field last season. That cannot continue to happen in our program. We just are not deep enough to lose that many players for being foolish.
Coaches call out the team for poor performances after every game in every sport. What he said was very tactful, the team quit which includes coaches, not the players are quitters which would be derogatory.
Nick, tactics are just that tactics. Sometimes they work and sometimes they don't. That team was a mess by the end of the season. Bashing them and the coach most of them probably liked may not work. Then again, as you say, it may set the tone he wants to send. I see both sides of this argument. Urban Meyer did it with a winning rep behind him. Ash is a new head coach. Hopefully it will work and all respond well. Also, he may have already addressed the issue with the team in a meeting which makes this a moot point.
Ash's remarks reminds me a lot of Urban's actions/statements when he took over OSU. Some of his statements raised some eyebrows. Heck, he initially called the receivers "a clown show." And man did he stir up the pot in recruiting basically throwing the "gentleman's agreement" that existed among the BIG coaches right out the window going immediately after kids already committed to other BIG teams and saying that the other BIG coaches /teams needed to step up their recruiting efforts for the good of the conference. I guess my point being he came to win games, not make friends. Ash has a lot of Urban in him.
Saying the team quit is a poor choice of words. If someone is a quitter it speaks of their character. We played very good teams all looking to run up points to get in the playoffs. I didn't think the team quit, beaten down maybe, but not quit. He is a rookie head coach so you can't expect him to be as smooth as someone in the position for many years. I thought his 5 AM workouts were a mistake, and credit to him he realized it and made a change, refreshing from the stubbornness we are used to seeing.
I hope he can get us to a bowl in his first year. Our offense should be decent. He needs to find linebackers and tell them not to run to a hole when two are there as all it takes is a cut from the rb and the lb is sealed off. Then teach safeties to take proper angles and we are on our way to 6 wins.
I hope he can get us to a bowl in his first year. Our offense should be decent. He needs to find linebackers and tell them not to run to a hole when two are there as all it takes is a cut from the rb and the lb is sealed off. Then teach safeties to take proper angles and we are on our way to 6 wins.
Does not say that at all. We were out coached but never quit. Carroo never quit.
Um, let me see, who do I believe, a stellar coach who is a year removed from being the DC of the NC team, or PSU_Nut? Northern Illinois with their band of 2 star recruits was good enough to play tOSUf competitive for 4 quarters but RU wasn't? And did Ash say the team gave up on every game?
Sad thing is that PSU_Nuts comments are only a tip of the iceberg of really dumb comments on this thread, most of the variety that if they didn't give up every game than they couldn't have quit at all.
I find Ash's frankness totally refreshing after years of bullsh!t coachspeak.
HCCA is spot on In his comments- whether they are hurtful or not is not the point - he's talking about a 4 win team that should at least had 6 wins, and a coaching staff that failed to motivate solid athletes. If an athlete is questioned whether they quit or not, typically one of 2 things happen- they quit or they improve. He's doing his job and getting them pissed off at him. We saw what a players coach can do, let's see what a football coach can do. I hope he maintains the tone and builds a winner again at Rutgers.
While I think that's a little bit strong, I will say this type of behavior is characteristic of many a successful coach/person/leader. The key is keeping it in check just enough to avoid damaging those under his charge.
I do recall Shea ripping Graber saying the cupboard was bare.
We went through a strange series of coaches where each one did better with the previous guys recruits than he did with his recruits. And that is why I love what Schiano did here.. he changed all that.. now Flood.. he did best with Schiano recruits... even though he got credit for saving a Schiano class when GS split for the NFL.
Finally, a coach who sees what I've seen from this team way too many times for years. They quit when the going gets tough or they simply find a way to lose. This is why we don't get the respect from other teams. Finally a coach who gets it!!
Ash isn't Urban Meyer. All I am saying is that he just might be going to far bashing his players by implying they were quitters. Most likely he will get away with it because this team probably wants to prove to everyone that they are better than what people saw last year. Nonetheless it may not have been necessary to say this in public.
Agreed. GS left the program in waaay better shape than he found it. That should be his lasting legacy. Hopefully Coach Ash does the same.
after the arrests and Flood suspension there were alot of finger pointing on the team and there were some kids that didnt give 100% and the staff was also to blame..it wasnt a good atmosphere on team the last four games..(from what I was told, TIFWIW). The last month since workouts started,Ash and staff have sent the message to a few players who thought they may have 'special "treatment in past ..mainly this is a clean slate..prove it to him now....not what you did in the past...
Indiana had the worst defense in the conference, ranked 116th nationally in scoring defense at 37.6 ppg, and finished 6-7 overall. They only beat two teams that finished with more than 3 wins, and only one that finished with more than 5 (Western Kentucky). The year before, Maryland had the third worst defense in the conference and ranked 87th nationally in scoring defense at 30.2 ppg.
Ash is telling it like it is. How do you expect players to improve if you tell them, "you guys lost last year, but it's ok". He is trying to change the culture, and it needs to be changed. Schiano has been gone for a few years now, the team has been going downhill under Flood, coaching, discipline, you name it. The team had some decent games against equal talent, but winning the games you're supposed to win isn't good enough to improve the program. And Flood's "signature" wins in 2014 where due to having Fridge as OC.
Ash basically has to do something similar to what Schiano did, and his blue print will need to be similar to Schiano's. How do you change the culture is you say the culture is ok?
To quote Damien Lewis as Major Dick Winters in Band of Brothers: "Captain Sobel, we salute the rank, not the man."
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