The only reason facilities are built is to attract athletes. They were “buying” them with their resources since there was no legal way to pay. Now the schools who had the best facilities are instead putting their money to NIL… why we are focusing on the one part of my message that i highlighted as unrelated is beyond me. But I’d say it’s a pretty simple concept that facilities were the best payment for recruiting, but now actually putting money and opportunity in your potential fellow rutgers alumnus pocket (which somehow angers people) has become the better tool.
Caleb McConnell signs NIL deal with Knights of The Raritan
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So was Rutgers "buying" its players when it extended Pikiell's contract last month?
DIFFICULTY: If they were, then why was there so much bitching that coaches get paid so much, but players weren't?
We always granted student-athletes an opportunity ... we just called it "a free education" (and room, and food, and books) and "an opportunity to compete" (and travel). Well most of them - I mean, I did it for free as a walk-on. But now that I think about it, I guess I was being paid all along because I got to change my clothes and shower in the Hale Center and freeze while I was standing around in the Bubble. I got breakfast a few times a week, too.
They’re still getting all of those opportunities too. And those are all great! Now they get more opportunities instead of “come here we have the best facilities for you to compete in while you make us millions of dollars during your 4 years” and now the walk ons get more opportunities too. this conversation isn’t going anywhere. It’s 1 am so this is where i exit for my own peace. As i like to say with kyk, agree to disagree! Haha goodnight my friend. Be the change, or shit, even be the pretender. You might like it.
There will be one big difference between the under the table payments we all know were happening in certain situations, and what the future is likely to hold IMO. Many people wouldn't be willing or possibly know how to arrange getting money to players and recruits while it was against the rules. Now that it is allowed, I suspect the floodgates will open at the BIG NAME SCHOOLS over the next few years. The gap will widen and fewer schools will be able to keep up. That's kind of been the case in football for a long time now. Surprise teams making a run at the playoffs is virtually unheard of. We will see how it plays out.
As for the autograph parts of this conversation, it will be a shame if one day a ten year old fan sees his or her favorite Knight and is denied an autograph because it wasn't at a paid KTR-sponsored event. Maybe I am overthinking that part, but I wonder if it could happen in the future.
As for the autograph parts of this conversation, it will be a shame if one day a ten year old fan sees his or her favorite Knight and is denied an autograph because it wasn't at a paid KTR-sponsored event. Maybe I am overthinking that part, but I wonder if it could happen in the future.
Why?
Aren't HC salaries going up?
Assistant coach salary pools going up?
Media rights significantly going up?
Rutgers is potentially going to make $75-$100m a year in media rights soon.
The real problem with NIL is that it's pointed out the entire "amateur" college athletics system is a house of cards reliant upon poor management.
It things are as dire as you state then why are we even still playing the sports?
Your distaste for the new system is misdirected. That’s all. It’s like the guy on the baseball thread who said to blame the autobid system and not OOC scheduling or lack of quality wins as the reason for getting snubbed.
NIL is now a given, just like the autobid system. No kid is going to turn down money they have coming to them, and I would assume you wouldn’t want yours to either. Accepting a NIL deal from the university you’ve attended for several years which requires you to commit to many different engagements with your fan base throughout the year, is completely different from the kids shopping around the transfer portal proactively seeking the highest bidder. I can’t understand how this isn’t obvious to you.
Also - did you even go to the website and look at what the tiers offer? They don’t seem to be designed to target the fans who would’ve otherwise given to Rfund to broadly support Rutgers athletics. This is different. There’s no tax deduction.
Most people paying for this are doing it for the same reason MLB fans pay for premium memberships of their team fan clubs - that’s supplemental to salary so clearly not pay for play even if the proceeds end up supporting the overall financial health of the ball club. The point is there’s a clear market for the things you get at the different membership levels.
If it is misdirected then I am doing a poor job explaining myself…..
1. You are correct if I was a parent of a basketball player I would view things differently. No doubt it is wrong for the coaching staff to make 5,000,000 and the player nothing. I respect Geo immensely with what he has done and how he has handled himself.
2. What KTR is doing I hate, but 100% understand and realize it is essential for survival in this new world that won’t change unless the NCAA comes out of the cave and work on a solution
3. I respect what wkbrdr is doing and he is making himself available here.
4. I believe NIL is the last or close to the last stage that is going to completely overhaul college sports. Many things happened up to this stage and NIL could be just the mail in the coffin.
Basketball is a great game and it saddens me that little by little it is changing. Since NBA isn’t an option for me college is all I have left. I have been a season ticket holder since 1990 (save a few years when kids were born and business was building). I hate where this is headed and I am pretty sure I know the ending.
1. You are correct if I was a parent of a basketball player I would view things differently. No doubt it is wrong for the coaching staff to make 5,000,000 and the player nothing. I respect Geo immensely with what he has done and how he has handled himself.
2. What KTR is doing I hate, but 100% understand and realize it is essential for survival in this new world that won’t change unless the NCAA comes out of the cave and work on a solution
3. I respect what wkbrdr is doing and he is making himself available here.
4. I believe NIL is the last or close to the last stage that is going to completely overhaul college sports. Many things happened up to this stage and NIL could be just the mail in the coffin.
Basketball is a great game and it saddens me that little by little it is changing. Since NBA isn’t an option for me college is all I have left. I have been a season ticket holder since 1990 (save a few years when kids were born and business was building). I hate where this is headed and I am pretty sure I know the ending.
I appreciate the nod and just hope that we can be successful in building RU and the players up so that we continue to be competitive. I agree with the risks you've articulated regarding NIL in general. I hope to god that RU is in a fighting position 5-, 10-, 30-years from now because our fan base rose up and supported facilities, NIL for players, etc. I think we can all agree that we want the same outcome for RU, the athletes, and the sports we cherish. I know NIL isn't for everyone...and parts of it aren't even for me.
I understand you don’t like the idea of KTR, but I also think your failing to see the potential for what it might be able to do for all Rutgers athletics programs.
Over time, if it becomes successful, the free content on its website (Surely there will be some of this throughout the seasons to give prospective subscribers a taste of what they get from membership) alone could generate enough clicks to bring in revenue. Geo’s site too. In the world we live in, successful fan engagement breeds revenue potential even when your fans aren’t willing to fork out big bucks. All I’m saying is it’s not a given the college basketball world is about to crumble to bits. Let’s see what happens over the next 5 years before drawing such conclusions.
Over time, if it becomes successful, the free content on its website (Surely there will be some of this throughout the seasons to give prospective subscribers a taste of what they get from membership) alone could generate enough clicks to bring in revenue. Geo’s site too. In the world we live in, successful fan engagement breeds revenue potential even when your fans aren’t willing to fork out big bucks. All I’m saying is it’s not a given the college basketball world is about to crumble to bits. Let’s see what happens over the next 5 years before drawing such conclusions.
I realize that when I pay $2000 per seat I am essentially paying the coaching staff so taking the stance that I won't be involved in the indirect paying of athletes thru NIL initiatives I am a hypocrite. I also agree and have been a part of donating for facilities which is an indirect pay for play.
Not sure if it was you or Geo...the 2 silos. I am OK with the "good" NIL. The OSU coach saying FB needs $13,000,000 from silo 2 is where I have an issue.
It is too late now, but I wish the NCAA would have taken a different stance here and worked with the athletes to find the right solution. I think in the 21st century players should have access to some of the revenue. In the past I have outlined where it should come from and the approximate amount (in the 50,000/yr ballpark for a B1G player).
Not sure if it was you or Geo...the 2 silos. I am OK with the "good" NIL. The OSU coach saying FB needs $13,000,000 from silo 2 is where I have an issue.
It is too late now, but I wish the NCAA would have taken a different stance here and worked with the athletes to find the right solution. I think in the 21st century players should have access to some of the revenue. In the past I have outlined where it should come from and the approximate amount (in the 50,000/yr ballpark for a B1G player).
I dont like watching kickers kick and I don't like watching 40% of FGA be 3 pointers. Plus the game has no flow and the illegal screening is ridiculous. Yes the college game is morphing in to the NBA and that saddens me incredibly.
i am all for being in the games. First and foremost and love that we are in it and our recent retention and commits show the value for sure.
just find it odd that the KTR angle has been “we took our time to do it right” when the for-profit “collective” angle seems to be the most obvious breach of the rule (when you hear from the board themselves they look for no ROI and only connect with current Rutgers players it sounds even worse outloud) and where the ncaa will crack down first.
The booster who pays $1M with his own company to put someone’s name on a billboard seemed more in line with the rule.
Hopefully we never see a thread titled “Rutgers for-profit NIL collective first program to be investigated by NCAA” lol
just find it odd that the KTR angle has been “we took our time to do it right” when the for-profit “collective” angle seems to be the most obvious breach of the rule (when you hear from the board themselves they look for no ROI and only connect with current Rutgers players it sounds even worse outloud) and where the ncaa will crack down first.
The booster who pays $1M with his own company to put someone’s name on a billboard seemed more in line with the rule.
Hopefully we never see a thread titled “Rutgers for-profit NIL collective first program to be investigated by NCAA” lol
It’s going to do more than just good for the athletic program if we can get it right at knight society. Our goal is a lot larger than NIL. We want to build up all of rutgers. That’s why we’re trying to partner with basically every local restaurant and bar as well. The community needs to be stronger and more connected than ever. Our end goal is to be donating to charities and all student clubs and organizations.
on top of that, when rutgers athletics is doing well, people are just more happy. Athletics is the driver to everything else being lifted up at the university. We just need some people to have a little more faith.
I am Wayne Gretzky and I go to where the puck will end up.
Everyone knows we are 1-2 years away, without change, of this being a contest of what fanbase has the most mount of money.
I'll take some
1. fill the lanes on a fast break
2. dunks are fine
3. some ball movement north and south
4. less isolation
5. 18 foot shots being more desirable than a 25 footer
this will be legal and on steroids. OSU football coach said he will need $13,000,000 per year to keep his roster intact. Rutgers hoops may need $3,000,000 per year at some point.
How can we explain to NJ taxpayers that you are indirectly paying for RU basketball and football yet the players are getting paid?
In just 2014 alone Michigan in our own conference had revenues 4x Rutgers, bringing in $118M more than RU. If you’re conservative that’s basically saying you’ve been fine with the $500M advantage Michigan has had in just revenues not even expenses, but only now do you think it’s a financial disadvantage.
Not sure I understand your post/criticism, or if you don't fully get what we're doing/view.
I think the NCAA's intent was always to allow players to sell themselves as a service. I.e., Geo could never go do a basketball clinic and earn money. Geo could never sell an NFT with his face. Geo couldn't sell his autograph. Geo couldn't go to a local financial advisor conference and get paid for a speaking arrangement. Those are services with value that KTR will help athletes monetize. That effort is directly in line with the NCAA's overall goal.
Thank you, Geo...for everything! Caleb's post in Richie's Round Table NIL thread had a link inside the post taking you right to a Player's Trunk site.... where I bought a Caleb hoodie this morning . Very cool....RHJ and Geo have merchandise there, too. I will be back to look around there more later...when I'm not supposed to be at work lol! I will be joining KTR shortly, too, even though I am one of the mind and age that feels that the NIL meant the death of college sports as I knew it. It is a world in which I was sure Rutgers athletics would surely become irrelevant due to its marginal fan and institutional support. I see (I believe) someone like Geo willing to fight for a way that he feels there IS a way that may help Rutgers athletics to survive. He, Geo, has been fighting for things from which he, personally, may least benefit ...because he is fighting for something (NIL) that is actually in its infancy, but his actual college playing days are almost over. He is fighting for something bigger than himself...mostly for the benefit for others. As I said, I am very skeptical about the future of Rutgers athletics, but if Geo (as an insider) feels there is a path here where Rutgers and the players can all benefit, then I am going to give it a go as much as I can. Maybe, these efforts like Geo's, Jon's and many others will allow Rutgers sports to survive by helping to build more alum and fan support (i.e. drag some money out of cheap fans' pockets - including me! ) through these new and untraditional pathways. Rutgers' real problems are 50 years old, from the days where the school decided it would be cool to be in the same pool with Michigan, Alabama and Penn State...as long as we didn't have to spend too much money to do so lol. This school will need alum and fan support because help from Trenton/Administration will always be limited here in Jersey...we are being called out by this new NIL world. Oh, well, this started out as a short thank you to Geo's and Jon's teams...and look what happened...sorry (not). GO RU!
Just an observers in that a collective of boosters pooling money to a for-profit company to give NIL deals to seems obviosuly outside the spirit of the rule. If the money for the collective was not publicly crowd-sourced and the company only facilitated activations that would seem more up and up.
Like I said it’s not a criticism I am happy we are in the game doing this because there is no oversight and we should be playing with any advantage we can get.
But that’s not what’s happening here. A collective like this isn’t needed to buy players. What part of that aren’t people grasping? If Warren Buffett was a RU fan and felt like it, he could pay Caleb or any other player $800k to agree to put his face on one of his insurance or manufacturing business advertisements. Caleb’s brand brings no value whatsoever to those companies - it’s pay for play. But it’s now fair game. That’s the problem with NIL.
With the Collective, the NIL deals are awarded in order to be able to deliver on the goods and services promised to subscribing members who are paying for them. The prices seem reasonable to me based on what’s being offered.
@ wkb - you might want to think about family membership pricing options at all levels. For instance, access to meet and greets with players is very cool, but it’s likely to be something people would want to bring their kids to. Just my two sense. Training sessions with players is something a parent would want for their kid (not themselves).
I do want to be clear / or clear something up. KTR is NON profit. If the money isn’t used ultimately, it gets returned. KTR hired SANIL to run operations, and SANIL is a company that makes a profit. But no more than 15% of funds raised will go to funding all operations (website, staff, etc). No profits are retained at KTR, and none of the board make money from this organization. This is entirely us doing this to support the school.
We are not a 501c3 non-profit organization though. So nothing is tax deductible.
Again, just wanted to be very clear about that.
Are you sure you're not Chicken Little wearing a Wayne Gretzky mask?
There is no pre-determined outcome here - the future is cloudy. The OSU Coach said he needs $13M because he is worried about OSU losing its standing at the top of the food chain with the constant flow of 4 & 5 stars at most positions on the 2-3 deep. He's likely covering his a$$ and trying to build NIL revenue momentum from his boosters because the old ways of making this happen behind the scenes is becoming antiquated.
The world is changing every day - and as the saying goes.......you can either adapt or die.
I will need a reminder. I’m on twitter but done go on every day. Go Geo!
I will never understand people who aren’t happy for our players when they succeed in life. NIL gives every athlete the ability to earn fair market value on their NIL. Is it perfect? no way. Is every athlete in a better spot than before? 100%. There are a lot of selfish people who don’t like it because of selfish reasons.
College athletics wasn’t already a contest of what fanbase has the most amount of money?
Guess nobody minds millions given to ADs to pass along to athletes. But cut out the AD middleman and let the athletes benefit directly everyone loses their minds.
Can’t cut out the middle man and not let them get their taste I guess?
https://rutgers.forums.rivals.com/threads/ot-northwestern-receives-almost-500m-donation.224768/
I am chicken little without the mask. I get a lot right, but boy am I wrong sometimes.
The college basketball world is definitely changing. You either adapt or die. As a fan I have to make the decision, stay a season ticket holder and emotionally invested in program OR get Devils season tickets. The Devils make this an easy decision.
I am happy for Caleb.
Olympic sport athlete won’t end up in a better spot. Also, 2030 there will be less scholarship spots for a football player. Caveat……if I am right where this is headed.
The Olympic sport athletes are 100% in a better spot. In fact some Olympic sport athletes are making more in NIL than top football and basketball players.
Sports were getting cut before NIL and NIL has nothing to do with sports being cut. Sports are getting cut because they don’t make money and are a drain on the ones that do.
Yes sports were getting cut before NIL and I am just speculating they will cause more to be and could be wrong.
Football and basketball not being profitable are the reason Olympic sports are/were cut. Before all the money came in to football and basketball there wasn’t issues with non revenue sports. Total athletic budgets were small and all programs were fine.
I am guessing Title IX was a reason too.
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