College Avenue improvements - work to be done

[Scarlet Jerry]

I was on campus for Rutgers Day and observed the following aesthetic problems that the university should try to address. Here they are (in order of projected cost):

1. The Murray Hall Cupola
It's in really bad shape. The cupola on Old Queen's was recently refurbished, so I hope that Murray Hall is next.

2. Replace the blacktop paved paths on the Old Queen's campus with bricks
The entire campus is a historic site, and putting in brick walkways would "complete" the colonial look of the area. I would also eliminate parking on front of Old Queen's - that area should just be a brick walkway. Let everyone park in the lot next to Kirkpatrick Chapel. Actually, I would eliminate that too and build a small deck in the St. Peter's lot (shared by the church and the university). How nice would the campus look if we did something like this (and added brick walkways in Voorhees Mall as well)?

3. Bury the phone/power lines on College Avenue
I know - this one would be really expensive, but it would really improve the aesthetics of the area. I would begin by burying the lines on College Ave and Hamilton Street. Check out the eyesores below:

4. (Bonus) Construct an ivy covered trellis in front of Scott Hall
The Scott Hall architecture does not fit in with the historic buildings on Voorhees Mall. Adding an ivy covered trellis on the front side of the building (facing the mall) would beautify the area and hide the building's 1950's style facade.

-Scarlet Jerry

 

[Korbermeister]

Replacing walkway with brick is good, refurbishing the cupola is also good. Burying wires, I would hold off on that in the hopes that the. College ave initiative comes to fruition and its done in concert with the rebuilding of college ave. If it's a no-go, then bury away..
. As far as Scott hall is concerned, the last thing we want to do is to hide its incompatibility and ugliness, lest our great grandchildren come upon the building and ask themselves, "why is this monument to 20th century mediocrity still standing??" don't give them ANY reason to keep Scott hall as a part of Rutgers!

 

[PeteGiam07]

Its possible the blacktop pavement has something under it...

Several streets in the area are paved over brick.

 

[mentulbloc]

Parking in front of olde Queens should not be allowed. It hides the building and cheapens the look.

 

[BigRnj]

Make Mine street a yellow brick road once again!

 

[sct1111]

Good post! I think the entire college ave campus should have brick walkways especially Queens Campus and Vorhees Mall. I was a little bummed they didn't have brick walkways for the Honors College. Asphalt or concrete just looks cheap.

Also something else I think should really be addressed is to get the damn window units out of Old Queens. The metal rectangles really hurt the facade of such an old beautiful building. Are you telling me there's no way to get central air?

 

[Scarlet Jerry]

I second the air conditioning units in Old Queen's. How was that ever allowed? The building and the campus are National Historic Sites. There has to be a way to air condition the building without window units.

-Scarlet Jerry

 

[retired711]

How would you prefer the University spend its very scarce resources (real dollar funding from the state is at approximately the 1998 level): (a) brick sidewalks that need to be re-done regularly; (b) air-conditioning units in a building that's totally staff; or (c) offering the courses students need to graduate? That is, do you want to spend money on appearance or substance?

 

[Korbermeister]

Make Mine street a yellow brick road once again!

No can do; pIt might clash with the historical structures on the street

 

[sct1111]

How would you prefer the University spend its very scarce resources (real dollar funding from the state is at approximately the 1998 level): (a) brick sidewalks that need to be re-done regularly; (b) air-conditioning units in a building that's totally staff; or (c) offering the courses students need to graduate? That is, do you want to spend money on appearance or substance?

They can build $300 million worth of new academic buildings on college ave but they can't install central air in Old Queens, our flagship building?

It's not a zero sum game. If it's possible to raise $100 million for sports facilities, I'm sure you could raise the money to take out those window units and replace then with central air.

Rutgers isn't rich by any means but its not poor either.

 

[srru86]

They can build $300 million worth of new academic buildings on college ave but they can't install central air in Old Queens, our flagship building?

I think you are mixing up the "They"s. The key element of the new construction on College Avenue is DEVCO involvement. Their mission is to support development in the city of New Brunswick. Rehabbing or upgrading old buildings is not their thing. There is also the difference between capital projects funded by borrowing versus operational funding. Generally harder to borrow to pay for upkeep.

The other big issue is new leadership got away from many decades where the University only wanted to build new in Piscataway and neglected College Ave.

This is sort of like the union saying"How come you can afford new buildings but not increase teacher salaries?" Because the money comes from separate sources and the first is basically a one time expense while the other is an ongoing commitment.

 

[sct1111]

I think you are mixing up the "They"s. The key element of the new construction on College Avenue is DEVCO involvement. Their mission is to support development in the city of New Brunswick. Rehabbing or upgrading old buildings is not their thing. There is also the difference between capital projects funded by borrowing versus operational funding. Generally harder to borrow to pay for upkeep.

The other big issue is new leadership got away from many decades where the University only wanted to build new in Piscataway and neglected College Ave.

This is sort of like the union saying"How come you can afford new buildings but not increase teacher salaries?" Because the money comes from separate sources and the first is basically a one time expense while the other is an ongoing commitment.

Devco is actually restoring the old sky scraper building in Newark that used to house the law school into a dorm. They are in the business of restoring buildings. I just think it should have been included in the college ave redevelopment initiative. I think there are a few buildings they should restore including and especially NJ Hall and Old Queens.

 

[retired711]

Devco is in the business of urban redevelopment. Devco is great for projects in downtown New Brunswick. But their charge does not extend beyond that. And yes, there was a large bond issue, but it can only be used for badly-needed capital construction. The Governor has proposed flat funding for Rutgers and the other state institutions of higher earning, and a recent study says that support for higher education has dropped precipitately since 2008 -- not that it was exactly high then. There just isn't money to do a lot of things that need doing.

 

[sct1111]

Devco is in the business of urban redevelopment. Devco is great for projects in downtown New Brunswick. But their charge does not extend beyond that. And yes, there was a large bond issue, but it can only be used for badly-needed capital construction. The Governor has proposed flat funding for Rutgers and the other state institutions of higher earning, and a recent study says that support for higher education has dropped precipitately since 2008 -- not that it was exactly high then. There just isn't money to do a lot of things that need doing.

http://www.nj.com/education/2015/11/how_rutgers_turned_a_forgotten_skyscraper_into_a_l.html

Devco got $83 million to restore the 15 Washington St skyscraper in Newark. They ARE in the business of restoring buildings. It wouldn't cost anywhere near the same to put central air conditioning on our signature flagship building. The ugly metal rectangles hanging out of a beautiful 200 year old building is a microcosm of the way things are done at Rutgers. We have such a rich history but little things like this have always cheapened our image.

What other university, even those with a much lower endowment then Rutgers has window units in their flagship building? Not many if any.

I actually think in the last stage of the Rutgers 2030 plan, they are including a plan to renovate NJ Hall and a few other older buildings. They restored Winants Hall 25 years ago and it looks great.

 

[PeteGiam07]

Several old prominent buildings dont have central air. I go to Newark city hall often for work and there is nothing but window and wall units and fans there. It happens and its not a priority.

Going through a time on college ave right now where there is the first major construction since the 70s and AC for simply an asthetic look isnt on top of the list.

And besides adding ductwork and units for separate AC zones in the building WILL be costly an require staged planning.

 

[retired711]

http://www.nj.com/education/2015/11/how_rutgers_turned_a_forgotten_skyscraper_into_a_l.html

Devco got $83 million to restore the 15 Washington St skyscraper in Newark. They ARE in the business of restoring buildings. It wouldn't cost anywhere near the same to put central air conditioning on our signature flagship building. The ugly metal rectangles hanging out of a beautiful 200 year old building is a microcosm of the way things are done at Rutgers. We have such a rich history but little things like this have always cheapened our image.

What other university, even those with a much lower endowment then Rutgers has window units in their flagship building? Not many if any.

I actually think in the last stage of the Rutgers 2030 plan, they are including a plan to renovate NJ Hall and a few other older buildings. They restored Winants Hall 25 years ago and it looks great.

You evidently didn't read my post. Yes, Devco is in the business of restoring buildings, but not on campuses. The 15 Washington Street skyscraper is part of downtown Newark.

 

[srru86]

Devco is actually restoring the old sky scraper building in Newark that used to house the law school into a dorm. They are in the business of restoring buildings. I just think it should have been included in the college ave redevelopment initiative. I think there are a few buildings they should restore including and especially NJ Hall and Old Queens.

I know about the Newark building. That is a total renovation and gut job. Not routine maintenance.They are taking advantage of the availability of urban redevelopment funding and opportunity. It is a new effort for them to be in Newark.

But they were founded with the mission of helping New Brunswick grow and be viable. Highly unlikely you will ever see a Devco project in Piscataway. They are not an agency like the New York State Dormitory Authority

 

[retired711]

I know about the Newark building. That is a total renovation and gut job. Not routine maintenance.They are taking advantage of the availability of urban redevelopment funding and opportunity. It is a new effort for them to be in Newark.

But they were founded with the mission of helping New Brunswick grow and be viable. Highly unlikely you will ever see a Devco project in Piscataway. They are not an agency like the New York State Dormitory Authority

Is Old Queens actually in Piscataway?

 

[Cofifa]

I was on campus for Rutgers Day and observed the following aesthetic problems that the university should try to address. Here they are (in order of projected cost):

1. The Murray Hall Cupola
It's in really bad shape. The cupola on Old Queen's was recently refurbished, so I hope that Murray Hall is next.

2. Replace the blacktop paved paths on the Old Queen's campus with bricks
The entire campus is a historic site, and putting in brick walkways would "complete" the colonial look of the area. I would also eliminate parking on front of Old Queen's - that area should just be a brick walkway. Let everyone park in the lot next to Kirkpatrick Chapel. Actually, I would eliminate that too and build a small deck in the St. Peter's lot (shared by the church and the university). How nice would the campus look if we did something like this (and added brick walkways in Voorhees Mall as well)?

3. Bury the phone/power lines on College Avenue
I know - this one would be really expensive, but it would really improve the aesthetics of the area. I would begin by burying the lines on College Ave and Hamilton Street. Check out the eyesores below:

4. (Bonus) Construct an ivy covered trellis in front of Scott Hall
The Scott Hall architecture does not fit in with the historic buildings on Voorhees Mall. Adding an ivy covered trellis on the front side of the building (facing the mall) would beautify the area and hide the building's 1950's style facade.

-Scarlet Jerry

agreed

 

[HeavenUniv.]

Cofifa,
Are there any plans by Rutgers/Devco for the blocks from Douglas to downtown ?-- Hope everything is back on track after the fire.--- Not sure if I ever mentioned it,but the Honors College looks fantastic !!! Thanks.

 

[Cofifa]

Most of the land between Downtown and Douglass is owned by a Church that has had its own redevelopment plans for about 15 years .
We lost no time due the fire and we had no damage . The first Honors College Class had a great year and the next class is suppose to be as talented and as enthusiastic as the first

 

[Scarlet Jerry]

Cofifa,

Glad to see you agree.

Camdenlawprof - I disagree with you. A certain percentage of the budget should be spent on capital projects/updates and beautification. Restoring the cupola and adding a trellis or two is not going to break the bank. Even adding bricked walkways can be done over the course of several summers, spreading the cost over a few years. Small improvements can magnify the aesthetic beauty of an entire area. I'm also not talking about adding central air everywhere, but we should certainly do something to greatly improve the look of our flagship building.

Scarlet Jerry

 

[srru86]

Is Old Queens actually in Piscataway?

No sorry. Making the point Devco is not a Rutgers focused organization. What they do in conjunction with the University fits in their larger plan to make NB a great place to live, work, go to school. It's a mutually beneficial relationship. It's been decades since any major building happened on College Ave. Without Devco we might still be waiting.

 

[NotInRHouse]

Most of the land between Downtown and Douglass is owned by a Church that has had its own redevelopment plans for about 15 years .
We lost no time due the fire and we had no damage . The first Honors College Class had a great year and the next class is suppose to be as talented and as enthusiastic as the first

When are they going to get to work?

 

[retired711]

Cofifa,

Glad to see you agree.

Camdenlawprof - I disagree with you. A certain percentage of the budget should be spent on capital projects/updates and beautification. Restoring the cupola and adding a trellis or two is not going to break the bank. Even adding bricked walkways can be done over the course of several summers, spreading the cost over a few years. Small improvements can magnify the aesthetic beauty of an entire area. I'm also not talking about adding central air everywhere, but we should certainly do something to greatly improve the look of our flagship building.

Scarlet Jerry

Well, this is what makes life interesting -- people disagree. I don't mind the trellis and the cupola. But putting central air into a building as old as Old Queens would be a tremendous project, I think.

 

[Scarlet Pride]

Ductless and min-duct systems seem to be obvious answers for Old Queens. You can get rid of the window units with these less intrusive systems. Now I don't know about priorities or cost but central air conditioning isn't the only answer. It's possible a complete renovation of Old Queens is on a wishlist timeline and they feel that doing piecemeal work isn't worth it right now.

 

[retired711]

I suspect (without any real evidence) that doing the job would be hard. If it were easy, the University would have done it long ago for the sake of its staff's comfort. But perhaps I'm wrong.