GA coach Taylor to A&M

[RUcrazee]

Yes, this program has been on a downward trend for years. A bunch of fluff filled seasons with padded record won’t change reality. This program hasn’t been a threat to win a regular season crown. Hasn’t been close to a conf. tourney crown. Hasn’t sniffed a sweet 16 even with the recent talent. There is much more to this than swapping coaches.

Some of the problems we’re seeing now have been growing exponentially the last few season. Specifically, ties to the community, the fan base, local recruiting and relationships with HS coaches. These are absolutely massive problems that everyone person on here should be concerned about. Funny u skipped over all but recruiting. Not many people have good things to say about this program. That all needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. = rebuild

The portal is a two way street. It’s not some benefit a new coach will have. Every program is in the same boat. As for the players, it’s easy come easy go.

Yes, obviously a new coach will have their own coaching style. Some holdovers will buy in. Some won’t. Some will leave. = rebuild

Yes, the area has talent. CVS also allegedly has the touch… why do we not secure much local talent? Just because they have a “touch” doesn’t equal success. Goes back to local relationships and trust. We have minimal. = rebuild.

I recognize the talent on the team and the potential of incoming players. But I’m also not going to count on any of them staying the longer this goes on. The coaching was terrible this season in her absence. If ur on this team what are you actually banking on or optimistic about ?

I’ll agree on the APC. Beautiful facility. Should benefit any new coach.

However, I look at our other sports programs and see the changes Hobbs has made abs the coaches he’s hired. All have revamped their programs and suffered through years of growing pains only to be relevant on the national scene now and highly successful within our conf. I expect the same to be done here.

You're talking about the things you feel are the shortcomings of CVS and staff. If we stick to "rebuild" in the context in which we were talking (what the next coach steps into), ....CVS' shortcomings and all....if she left today, the next coach is walking into a new house(APC) in a great neighborhood(Big Ten) with some decent furniture pieces already there(current roster).

Yes, players may decide to leave if they don't see a fit with the new coach. They may not. That happens everywhere. Those are the things you have to wait and see about. In our case, the new coach has ten players there,... already signed. If he/she can sell his/her vision, and show that they want the player to stay, they are coming in with a leg up. As opposed to the coach who has no good players on the roster and has to go out and get the bulk of their players to commit and fill the roster like Auburn, and Syracuse had to do last off season.

Any coach that we should be interested in is, hopefully, going to be a proven and experienced P5 coach, WNBA or NBA HC or Asst. Coach, an asst. coach of a successful P5, or an up-and-coming mid-major coach......preferably, the first or second mentioned, I would think.

Whatever coach we choose will have their own connections and hopefully their own attractiveness that allows them to recruit successfully. That should be a top factor in choosing the next coach. If you select the right person, who hires a solid staff that can sell recruits on what they have to offer, recruiting is not a problem. That applies to any program that changes coaches.

By what you are saying,....any team that changes coaches is in a rebuild. I guess you can say that is true to a degree, but situations run the gamut from good ones to step into to starting from scratch, with levels in-between. I'm saying that ours is a good one to step into.

Like I mentioned above, Illinois has about five players in the portal now.....considered to be their best, including their most notable talent, Aaliyah Nye. Shauna seems to be stepping into a more bare cupboard due to the fact she has to fill out the bulk of the roster and find good talent. And she doesn't have program History or Tradition to use as a selling point. I don't personally know about their facilities, but I'm not sure she can use those as an additional selling point.

 

[MADHAT1]

as far as :"this program has been on a downward trend for years"
The downward direction was from a great program into just a good one that instead of being considered a top 10 program turned into one that is considered close to a top 25 program .
That change took place years ago so implying RU WBB is in a downward trend now is untrue.
The program can be considered far less than it was before and that trend started years ago and is a disappointment to those that remembered how good the program was years ago and the new fans that feel RU should be better than it is now.
Especially not being considered a lock for the Dance and the way it preforms when invited.
2 of the last 3 years CVS was coaching RU made it to the tourney ( 1st round knock outs left a bitter taste) and the year didn't go the dance was canceled .
Ity was a year RU played good enough for invite.

Looking back at a few seasons before Vivian's last 3, you can say RU was improving their play and went back into NCAA invite mode from being left out of the invite list.
So that can't be considered a downward trend, but showing improvement.
But in all honesty, RU didn't show it was capable of greatness and that is a factor when looking at RU WBB not reaching the expectations of the fanbase because it once was a great program that it's fans demand ( rightfully so) it return to and not just stay at a level that it's isn't considered even a top 25 program and not a lock to be considered on pre-season while usually falling short of being one in the final polls.

From the 2009-10 season to the 2020-21 season (12 seasons)
Rutgers made the Tourney 6 times (the 7th time would have been in the 2019-20 season when the dance was called off.
Also in that 12 year time frame, only 1 losing season ( remember the Tim led squad last year isn't being counted)
One of the years RU didn't go dancing they wound up with a 28-9 record winning the WNIT..

So there's no downward trend , now, just a program that isn't doing the job expected and one the fanbase expects to be great based on the fact RU WBB once was considered a great program and should be capable of returning to that status.

 

[Scarlettrooper]

as far as :"this program has been on a downward trend for years"
The downward direction was from a great program into just a good one that instead of being considered a top 10 program turned into one that is considered close to a top 25 program .
That change took place years ago so implying RU WBB is in a downward trend now is untrue.
The program can be considered far less than it was before and that trend started years ago and is a disappointment to those that remembered how good the program was years ago and the new fans that feel RU should be better than it is now.
Especially not being considered a lock for the Dance and the way it preforms when invited.
2 of the last 3 years CVS was coaching RU made it to the tourney ( 1st round knock outs left a bitter taste) and the year didn't go the dance was canceled .
Ity was a year RU played good enough for invite.

Looking back at a few seasons before Vivian's last 3, you can say RU was improving their play and went back into NCAA invite mode from being left out of the invite list.
So that can't be considered a downward trend, but showing improvement.
But in all honesty, RU didn't show it was capable of greatness and that is a factor when looking at RU WBB not reaching the expectations of the fanbase because it once was a great program that it's fans demand ( rightfully so) it return to and not just stay at a level that it's isn't considered even a top 25 program and not a lock to be considered on pre-season while usually falling short of being one in the final polls.

From the 2009-10 season to the 2020-21 season (12 seasons)
Rutgers made the Tourney 6 times (the 7th time would have been in the 2019-20 season when the dance was called off.
Also in that 12 year time frame, only 1 losing season ( remember the Tim led squad last year isn't being counted)
One of the years RU didn't go dancing they wound up with a 28-9 record winning the WNIT..

So there's no downward trend , now, just a program that isn't doing the job expected and one the fanbase expects to be great based on the fact RU WBB once was considered a great program and should be capable of returning to that status.

Come on, respectfully you’re not convincing anyone with the semantics. This program is bad. If you’re satisfied with where we’re at or where we were the last few years then I respect that. I want change. I want some some excitement around the program again and people in the stands. We’re no where near that and haven’t had that in many many years. So yea, you want to play with numbers and talk about some fluff but the proof is right before our eyes.

 

[Scarlettrooper]

You're talking about the things you feel are the shortcomings of CVS and staff. If we stick to "rebuild" in the context in which we were talking (what the next coach steps into), ....CVS' shortcomings and all....if she left today, the next coach is walking into a new house(APC) in a great neighborhood(Big Ten) with some decent furniture pieces already there(current roster).

Yes, players may decide to leave if they don't see a fit with the new coach. They may not. That happens everywhere. Those are the things you have to wait and see about. In our case, the new coach has ten players there,... already signed. If he/she can sell his/her vision, and show that they want the player to stay, they are coming in with a leg up. As opposed to the coach who has no good players on the roster and has to go out and get the bulk of their players to commit and fill the roster like Auburn, and Syracuse had to do last off season.

Any coach that we should be interested in is, hopefully, going to be a proven and experienced P5 coach, WNBA or NBA HC or Asst. Coach, an asst. coach of a successful P5, or an up-and-coming mid-major coach......preferably, the first or second mentioned, I would think.

Whatever coach we choose will have their own connections and hopefully their own attractiveness that allows them to recruit successfully. That should be a top factor in choosing the next coach. If you select the right person, who hires a solid staff that can sell recruits on what they have to offer, recruiting is not a problem. That applies to any program that changes coaches.

By what you are saying,....any team that changes coaches is in a rebuild. I guess you can say that is true to a degree, but situations run the gamut from good ones to step into to starting from scratch, with levels in-between. I'm saying that ours is a good one to step into.

Like I mentioned above, Illinois has about five players in the portal now.....considered to be their best, including their most notable talent, Aaliyah Nye. Shauna seems to be stepping into a more bare cupboard due to the fact she has to fill out the bulk of the roster and find good talent. And she doesn't have program History or Tradition to use as a selling point. I don't personally know about their facilities, but I'm not sure she can use those as an additional selling point.

U continue to just talk about roster and recruiting. What about everything else?

Yes there are degrees. This isn’t as bad as other B1G programs but when the time comes for a new leader, that person will have a lot of work to do around the program and off the court.

 

[MADHAT1]

Come on, respectfully you’re not convincing anyone with the semantics. This program is bad. If you’re satisfied with where we’re at or where we were the last few years then I respect that. I want change. I want some some excitement around the program again and people in the stands. We’re no where near that and haven’t had that in many many years. So yea, you want to play with numbers and talk about some fluff but the proof is right before our eyes.

not saying the program is where it should be, but saying it isn't as terrible as you have implied.
No one should be satisfied how the program is today, last year or since 2009-10
But I respectably will disagree with anyone that implies the program has been losing and trying to make it out as one that is a bottom of barrel type
It's a not good enough to be excited about type and that needs to change
It is a program that lost it's way from being a great one and the path back to glory needs to be found, which probably means a change in leadership, especially after last season's fiasco and the way Stringer's LOA made the program into a situation no one can say whose running the show in 2022-23 or if it is CVS , if she'll be able to handle the type of work a coach must do in order to make a program a top 10 one.
What has happened is that questions answer looks like it might be no because Vivian and Hobbs haven't said she's coming back at 100%.
That along with the fatigue issue a few years ago makes for the though Stringer isn't as capable as she should be and it's time for her to retire.

 

[RUcrazee]

U continue to just talk about roster and recruiting. What about everything else?

Yes there are degrees. This isn’t as bad as other B1G programs but when the time comes for a new leader, that person will have a lot of work to do around the program and off the court.

I don't know what I left out. The things I have talked about are the things, that I would think, are desirable in attracting a new coach. A good coach is going to be confident that they have and can build their own relationships with whoever they feel is needed to be successful. I would think all new coaches go through the relationship building process when coming into a new setting.

The things I mentioned are that the foundation is strongly in place for a new coach to come in and do well, sooner rather than later. Recruiting is the key. Also mentioned facilities, prior connections, our program history and tradition.

The next coach absolutely needs good players to compete, some elite players to win at highest level. I don't care where they get them from......Jersey Shore or Alaska.....they just need to win. If they are able to do so, in an attractive style, fan base, local excitement, should come with that.

If it is a coach that is liked by local media, it will greatly assist us in getting back to where we want to be quickly because they will get much-needed marketing(like Pike and Schiano get). Local talent will likely be more attracted and easier to keep home.

All coaches have tons of work to do on and off the court.

That's why the staff they put in place is so important. Nobody knows that better than us after suffering through this past season.

 

[Knight Time Fan]

Come on, respectfully you’re not convincing anyone with the semantics. This program is bad. If you’re satisfied with where we’re at or where we were the last few years then I respect that. I want change. I want some some excitement around the program again and people in the stands. We’re no where near that and haven’t had that in many many years. So yea, you want to play with numbers and talk about some fluff but the proof is right before our eyes.

Absent this past year, I would argue with calling the program "bad". Disappointing I would accept. No better than average for a Power 5 team, I would accept as a description. The middle range of Power 5 teams beat the "fluff" (which RU even did this year), and generally are in contention for an NCAA bid, but unlikely to make it to the Sweet 16, or even, necessarily the 2nd round, but that's more likely. I would say this is where RU appeared to be settling, a far cry from where they were, of course.

I have long argued that the inability to pull an upset - any upset - is one of the most sad signs of decline.

I do, however, lack any illusions that a new coach, even with a difficult path, will necessarily have RU where it was in the 2000s (decade), really the peak of RU success. But I agree we need to try.

 

[Knight Time Fan]

U continue to just talk about roster and recruiting. What about everything else?

Yes there are degrees. This isn’t as bad as other B1G programs but when the time comes for a new leader, that person will have a lot of work to do around the program and off the court.

For a new coach it is all going to be about the roster / recruiting. I think the rest all comes with the territory. The recruiting and roster will, for several years, be key to an success.

 

[MADHAT1]

Absent this past year, I would argue with calling the program "bad". Disappointing I would accept. No better than average for a Power 5 team, I would accept as a description. The middle range of Power 5 teams beat the "fluff" (which RU even did this year), and generally are in contention for an NCAA bid, but unlikely to make it to the Sweet 16, or even, necessarily the 2nd round, but that's more likely. I would say this is where RU appeared to be settling, a far cry from where they were, of course.

I have long argued that the inability to pull an upset - any upset - is one of the most sad signs of decline.

I do, however, lack any illusions that a new coach, even with a difficult path, will necessarily have RU where it was in the 2000s (decade), really the peak of RU success. But I agree we need to try.

The illision of a new HC coming in and making RU back to what it was isn't an illusion , if one realizes Rome wasn't built in a day and RU's return to glory will take some time.
But what that new HC might do is add a little excitement when thinking about the future and that excitement has been missing for awhile now replaced with hope and before every season ended
hope fades and the wait till next year hope starts, but excitement of a new season starting is tempered by the program's failure to reach the goals and expectations of it's fan base for a long time

 

[RUcrazee]

I have long argued that the inability to pull an upset - any upset - is one of the most sad signs of decline.

I do, however, lack any illusions that a new coach, even with a difficult path, will necessarily have RU where it was in the 2000s (decade), really the peak of RU success. But I agree we need to try.

I agree with most of what you're saying. I don't understand the statements above though.

The expectations for RU, in the eyes of their peers and the analysts, have not been very high at all over the past several years. They have had to prove themselves worthy of respect every year since the falloff roughly ten years ago. The last four years(not including this past season) They did just that. The main opportunities that they had for upsets came against the top of the Big Ten. They actually pulled of an upset of Md at Md, beat Iowa, Northwestern, Ohio St, Michigan, and Mich St in moments when they were considered underdogs. Granted, it didn't happen enough in the B1G Tourney, which is why we are not satisfied, .....but it is something worth recognizing.

And regarding us getting back to where we were in the 2000s......doesn't that all depend on who you get as coach?

 

[RUcrazee]

I just look at the examples of Vic Shafer, Dawn Staley, Kim Mulkey going to a place and turning them into instant contenders. Dawn consistenly makes deep runs in the NCAA Tourney. I have no doubt that Kim and Vic will do the same. Those two are at schools with history and tradition, similar to us.

 

[Knight Time Fan]

I agree with most of what you're saying. I don't understand the statements above though.

The expectations for RU, in the eyes of their peers and the analysts, have not been very high at all over the past several years. They have had to prove themselves worthy of respect every year since the falloff roughly ten years ago. The last four years(not including this past season) They did just that. The main opportunities that they had for upsets came against the top of the Big Ten. They actually pulled of an upset of Md at Md, beat Iowa, Northwestern, Ohio St, Michigan, and Mich St in moments when they were considered underdogs. Granted, it didn't happen enough in the B1G Tourney, which is why we are not satisfied, .....but it is something worth recognizing.

And regarding us getting back to where we were in the 2000s......doesn't that all depend on who you get as coach?

The Maryland victory was Rutgers first over a top 10 team in almost 10 years - 2009 through December 2018. That's the type of thing I'm talking about, not winning against your peers. Do you remember the "week to remember"? In 2004-2005, victories over Tennessee, Texas and LSU in the same week. At Texas, we were there, Scarlet R sponsored an event, the others home. All, IIRC, highly ranked. It has been a while. It was so different following the team back then.

As far as getting us back to the 2000's - well, it does depend on the coach, but there are very few sure things. Texas thought it had a sure thing with Gail, and Aston, for that matter, neither worked out. Tennessee I'm sure expected much more out of Holly. Jim Foster at Ohio State. The list goes on and on. Guarantees - very few. I think some fans think that - while it may take time - Rutgers returning to national prominence will happen with a new coach. I'm simply aware that it is not guaranteed. With any coach we are likely to get. Even Kim Barnes Arico, no matter how well thought of, and successful in a general sort of way, has only taken Michigan to new lofty national heights this season.

 

[RUcrazee]

The Maryland victory was Rutgers first over a top 10 team in almost 10 years - 2009 through December 2018. That's the type of thing I'm talking about, not winning against your peers. Do you remember the "week to remember"? In 2004-2005, victories over Tennessee, Texas and LSU in the same week. At Texas, we were there, Scarlet R sponsored an event, the others home. All, IIRC, highly ranked. It has been a while. It was so different following the team back then.

As far as getting us back to the 2000's - well, it does depend on the coach, but there are very few sure things. Texas thought it had a sure thing with Gail, and Aston, for that matter, neither worked out. Tennessee I'm sure expected much more out of Holly. Jim Foster at Ohio State. The list goes on and on. Guarantees - very few. I think some fans think that - while it may take time - Rutgers returning to national prominence will happen with a new coach. I'm simply aware that it is not guaranteed. With any coach we are likely to get. Even Kim Barnes Arico, no matter how well thought of, and successful in a general sort of way, has only taken Michigan to new lofty national heights this season.

Gotcha. Makes a lot of sense. Very true about nothing being guaranteed.

Those were the good ole days at the RAC (2000s). Fell in love with Cappie's game. Truly felt like she was the best female basketball player in the world after watching her in her last year at RU(bias edge over Candace P).