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Game 15 Hartford: Same Old Rutgers

If I am being honest, I think Pikiell got very excited after SHU and has to come down as well.

I am not sure the coach expected to win that game that quickly in his career.

The team needs to get back to what worked for them. Better ball movement, players in their natural spots, and just have fun. That is it. Once they have fun, I think the excitement comes back.

I would not be surprised if some question Sanders commitment to full time basketball either. At times it looks like he is having too much fun, and not getting serious. Sanders is a clutch player no doubt, but during warmups he is a not locked in. The team certainly plays to the level of their opponent as well.
 
If you can't find multiple reasons to question the coaching staff last night you just clearly don't want to.

a few..what the hell has been done to address the terrible foul shooting we saw last year too? (I think ) 20 of 41 last two games we lose by a bucket each! at home!

why can't you finish both end games? why such blunders in both?

why has Freeman regressed? why is Corey still missing planes? (that one is easy..because the coach currently doesn't have other options)

future may be brighter but this team and the lack of maturity by the so called leaders is pissing me off.

oh, let me add one more. what the heck happened to Jake Dadika. a kid that appears to work hard, do whats asked, and was effective in sending the message last year when this crap was going on. He's not the answer to scoring but he should have started in front of Souf if not Williams.
 
If I am being honest, I think Pikiell got very excited after SHU and has to come down as well.

I am not sure the coach expected to win that game that quickly in his career.

The team needs to get back to what worked for them. Better ball movement, players in their natural spots, and just have fun. That is it. Once they have fun, I think the excitement comes back.

I would not be surprised if some question Sanders commitment to full time basketball either. At times it looks like he is having too much fun, and not getting serious. Sanders is a clutch player no doubt, but during warmups he is a not locked in. The team certainly plays to the level of their opponent as well.

One of my biggest concerns coming in to the year was the team continuing playing with the same intensity as last year. I desperately want to think his demeanor can work, but have always had doubts. Unfortunately those doubts are front and center. Can you treat players with 100% respect and not scream and yell and have it work? What coaches succeed in college basketball that way? Again, I really want to see a team win without a (part time) a$$ hole coach that is riding players. I think he is going to have to adjust. This team needed something at half time. When they came out of the lockerroom all smiles and jokes I didn't sense an urgency. Maybe that is on Williams Freeman and sanders.
 
a few..what the hell has been done to address the terrible foul shooting we saw last year too? (I think ) 20 of 41 last two games we lose by a bucket each! at home!

why can't you finish both end games? why such blunders in both?

why has Freeman regressed? why is Corey still missing planes? (that one is easy..because the coach currently doesn't have other options)

future may be brighter but this team and the lack of maturity by the so called leaders is pissing me off.


I am not blaming missed FTs or missed layups on the staff.

Not having a plan against 1-3-1, not getting the team to play full court man, unpreparedness in the end game (I think he froze), allowing Freeman to play no defense are my biggest concerns.

The refs totally gift wrapped an opportunity for us to have a chance to tie in the end game AND gave 2 minutes to talk about it. I am thinking screens away with a long pass to taller players off screens at least has the chance to get off a make able shot.
 
One of my biggest concerns coming in to the year was the team continuing playing with the same intensity as last year. I desperately want to think his demeanor can work, but have always had doubts. Unfortunately those doubts are front and center. Can you treat players with 100% respect and not scream and yell and have it work? What coaches succeed in college basketball that way? Again, I really want to see a team win without a (part time) a$$ hole coach that is riding players. I think he is going to have to adjust. This team needed something at half time. When they came out of the lockerroom all smiles and jokes I didn't sense an urgency. Maybe that is on Williams Freeman and sanders.
you'll never get it from these two and I sense Mike has been pushed aside.
 
I am not blaming missed FTs or missed layups on the staff.

.
until I even hear a mention of drills to shoot better foul shots (like all the focus on bounding) I certainly do have concerns for what they've done there to address. free points. and clearly a difference maker. I hope just having players take more bad shots isn't the coaching method.
 
I was a 60%ish FT shooter in HS. I was 90%+ in practice. You can't replicate game FTs in practice.

I'd much rather see practice time allocated to other things that can prepare us better. I am not convinced there is ANY correlation to practicing FTs in practice and success in a game.
 
until I even hear a mention of drills to shoot better foul shots (like all the focus on bounding) I certainly do have concerns for what they've done there to address. free points. and clearly a difference maker. I hope just having players take more bad shots isn't the coaching method.
Good shooters make good free throw shooters. Good free throw shooters aren't developed, they're recruited.
 
Good shooters make good free throw shooters. Good free throw shooters aren't developed, they're recruited.

I'm not talking about making a 50% shooter an 75% shooter. Just going up to 60% is 4.5pts last two games we lost by 5.
I have got to believe a D1 college staff can get a couple of more made shots per game with some solid focus, training, and practice. And a couple of points can make all the difference. (we know that).

and then there is the subject of knowing who to put the ball to and get to the line when it matters.
 
a few..what the hell has been done to address the terrible foul shooting we saw last year too? (I think ) 20 of 41 last two games we lose by a bucket each! at home!

why can't you finish both end games? why such blunders in both?

why has Freeman regressed? why is Corey still missing planes? (that one is easy..because the coach currently doesn't have other options)

future may be brighter but this team and the lack of maturity by the so called leaders is pissing me off.

oh, let me add one more. what the heck happened to Jake Dadika. a kid that appears to work hard, do whats asked, and was effective in sending the message last year when this crap was going on. He's not the answer to scoring but he should have started in front of Souf if not Williams.

There are no “so called” leaders on this team. Sanders is extremely immature and certainly doesn’t lead by example. I like him as a player but quite frankly his act is getting “old”. Freeman doesn’t seem to have any leadership qualities. I had hoped Williams would step up this year as both a leader and a player but his play has regressed, and isn’t even on the court enough to lead.

Let’s hope Baker is that guy next year.
 
One of my biggest concerns coming in to the year was the team continuing playing with the same intensity as last year. I desperately want to think his demeanor can work, but have always had doubts. Unfortunately those doubts are front and center. Can you treat players with 100% respect and not scream and yell and have it work? What coaches succeed in college basketball that way? Again, I really want to see a team win without a (part time) a$$ hole coach that is riding players. I think he is going to have to adjust. This team needed something at half time. When they came out of the lockerroom all smiles and jokes I didn't sense an urgency. Maybe that is on Williams Freeman and sanders.

He is more active than many coaches I have seen on the bench. We have seen a lot of games this year with intensity. I am not jumping the ship on the program, or the direction that it is in. The program has better recruits than they have had in years. It's a players league now. Every sport is going into being a players league. The team has had great games, and still has potential to clean things up.

I am not sure what Pikiell does at halftime, but you are right, the captains are extensions of the coaches. The team played well against top programs this year, and their heads are still swollen. Pikiell needs to demand a win, and more effort. Something has to be said to certain players.
 
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I was a 60%ish FT shooter in HS. I was 90%+ in practice. You can't replicate game FTs in practice.

I'd much rather see practice time allocated to other things that can prepare us better. I am not convinced there is ANY correlation to practicing FTs in practice and success in a game.

lol, there PLENTY of stuff we need to work on in practice. would be interesting to hear what some top coaches have to say on the subject. maybe you're right that by now the muscle memory/bad habits/form are too ingrained to change. I have a hard time believing that myself.
 
Cmon bac....I really expected better of you....I sense a frustration or a sense of entitlement because of raised expectations....

I will disagree across the board because this team plays to the level of its opponent AND that makes for us looking and feeling like every other B1G team.....Penn State wins at Iowa and almost steals a game vs Wisconsin at home and loses by 1.....then PSU blows a game to Rider at the buzzer last week....This on top of the PSU roller coaster last year....hammering RU on New Years Day, then losing to RU at home after a double OT game at Indiana 2 nights before hosting RU.

I'm mentioning PSU because they also upset Michigan State at the Palestra last year and are going through the process RU is going to experience the next 2 seasons.....There is no "straight through path", without turbulence, without signs of live and then significant times where a team looks lost.

The one thing that fans tend to do is live in a vacuum, or no one seems to follow how all the rest of the B1G teams are doing.

I could nitpick and blame Corey Sanders for being late to arrive back from home and if he started, RU likely wins....I could blame lack of intensity (not true) or a rash of turnovers (only 6).....I would say a team that normally shoots 80% from the FT line, shoots under 50%, but RU doesn't shoot 80% from the line.

RU is going through the growth spurt/process and we can discuss whether the schedule makes sense, but for the growth of the fan base being brought back, more wins helps BUT lack of a close game really caught up to this roster the last 3 games.

I would actually like to see this happen now, because this 16 game run is going to have more ups and downs and more signals that we are getting better, followed by 3-4 games where RU looks lost. It is part of the process.....and next year will have these peaks and valleys with a lot of freshman and new parts as well.

There is no Same Ole Rutgers in the big picture....same ole RU would not have closed Montez Mathis, Shaq Carter, Harper Jr and would not working hard for 2018 and 2019 pieces that are true difference makers. Doucoure and Baker are solid building blocks that are going to be inconsistent as freshman.....The program is 2 years away depth, skill and talent wise from being stable and a normal B1G program.

We have to go through this process, but a true rebuild isn't for the faint of heart or can't be based on strictly results....results happen in recruiting, mixed with progress on the court. I would feel more skeptical if Florida State beat RU by 12 and Michigan State by 18 with a loss to Seton Hall, vs beating Stony Brook and Hartford....There would be many more questions about what RU is going to be, if that was the case.

Stay the course.....30+ games, recruiting, develop and grow, rinse and repeat....the ceiling is 6 B1G wins (best case scenario and requires the RAC to be alive). The Seton Hall win, the Florida State/Michigan State games were the signs that we are on the way....don't waver because of 2 OOC losses....

That Same ole Rutgers line in the OP was funny.

It was a few bad games....highlighted by some bad FT Shooting, bad overall shooting, Geo had two bad games, Freeman had two bad games.....Shit Happens, but, the SKY is Falling scenario is silly.

Pikiell said the team just needs to refocus on defense and Rebounding. This is not doomsday....this is the same team that beat Seton Hall and played MSU, FSU tough.
 
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Pikiell is a very good coach. I'd be very surprised if he did not get this team back to playing to the best of it's capabilities.
 
S janowski said it. Souf turning into not a reliable 7 minute player puts the team in a very tough predicament. Combine that with Mike Williams playing hurt, and it is hard to predict how the big 10 will go.

I am not sure what Mike Williams could give consistently to make us more confident in how the big ten goes, since the guards are thin. I have noticed a trend with the best games the program has played. Baker scored more than 8 points, played his usual game, and Eugene Omoyuri had a game of 6+ points, and a good amount of rebounds.

I forget the poster that mentioned playing Sanders, Baker, Eugene, Freeman, Doucoure. Every game is widely matchup oriented.

Also, maybe try Dadika. Coach sees every practice. It just seems like Souf live is very telling of his potential, and what he adds to the program.

See how big ten goes. If it does not shake out well, Omoyuri, Thiam, and Baker should get the majority of focus.

The keys.
1. Get Omoyuri more touches
2. Freeman never attempt a 3 pt shot.
3. Freeman learn how to guard screens, and staying wide in his stance.
4. Coach be realistic what happens if changes aren't made from a focus and effort standpoint. Send a message to players.
5. Keep Sanders and Baker together. Sanders benefits a lot more with Baker than Williams.
6. Where are all your shots coming from, and where is the programs ball movement to get better shots with less predictability.
 
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Convenient. Very convenient.

The reality that no one wants to believe because it hurts the narrative is the there isn't much behind "the old guard".

We lose to SB and Hartford because our starting 2,3 and 5 are no different than the starting 2,3,5 of our opponent. I hope I am being hard on Baker, but I fear I am not.


you are being way too hard on Baker and giving passes for the poor play and sometimes attitude of Sanders and Freeman and bad shooting by Williams. The new guard has to play more so the teams indentity changes and we grow for next year. I do agree Baker's minutes can be cut a bit from 35. I would rather the team actually get better for the future than get a cheap win, Doucoure and Thiam need to play more in Big 10 play. We have centers and do not use them..whats the point..we redshirted Johnson..why? if our centers arent good enough to get time what does that say for Johnson. We keep playing smaller because we are scared of smaller teams..why?
 
That Same ole Rutgers line in the OP was funny.

It was a few bad games....highlighted by some bad FT Shooting, bad overall shooting, Geo had two bad games, Freeman had two bad games.....Shit Happens, but, the SKY is Falling scenario is silly.

Pikiell said the team just needs to refocus on defense and Rebounding. This is not doomsday....this is the same team that beat Seton Hall and played MSU, FSU tough.
The only thing funny was you referring to anyone else's opinion other than your own as silly. The joke's on us.
 
There is lots of blame to go around for this loss.

But How about 4 extra minutes of Sanders instead of Mensah and we probably win this game and we are not having theses discussions. Its not Pikells fault that he missed a flight and let the team down again.
 
more importantly it was mental, it was fundamentals, it was everything including coaching...complete breakdown the last two games, one game can be excused not two

It happens in sports.....they are called slumps. This is a mini slump. The staff and players will refocus to right the ship.

Multiple players had bad games....but they did not turn into bad players. Some of it was bad shot selection....just about everything I saw is correctable by making some adjustments.

To think that this staff just forgot how to coach and motivate is just Silly.
 
excuse me did we beat Michigan State...we beat SHU thats great but they imploded in the last 5 minutes lets be honest here. RU played a great game for sure not taking away from that, but that is the anomoly here

BAC.....is it possible that the good games, good rebounding, good defense and good effort and good coaching against FSU, MSU, Seton Hall are the Norm? Two of them were losses but Rutgers played very well in those games.

Maybe the anolomies are the last 2 games?
 
It happens in sports.....they are called slumps. This is a mini slump. The staff and players will refocus to right the ship.

Multiple players had bad games....but they did not turn into bad players. Some of it was bad shot selection....just about everything I saw is correctable by making some adjustments.

To think that this staff just forgot how to coach and motivate is just Silly.


I dont think bad shooting is correctable...thats been a constant with this team. In addition the warts that Corey and Desean have are not going to suddenly go away
 
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BAC.....is it possible that the good games, good rebounding, good defense and good effort and good coaching against FSU, MSU, Seton Hall are the Norm? Two of them were losses but Rutgers played very well in those games.

Maybe the anolomies are the last 2 games?


look when you lose to Stony Brook and Hartford on your home court we have a problem. We were not making the NCAA tourney anyone but any NIT hope is just about gone now. This is a short term issue that could effect getting over 500
 
look when you lose to Stony Brook and Hartford on your home court we have a problem. We were not making the NCAA tourney anyone but any NIT hope is just about gone now. This is a short term issue that could effect getting over 500

Two terrible games in a row against crap competition. Players can have bad games and that's forgivable. Bad shooting is forgivable. Lack of effort is not forgivable. This is a team that is only going to be successful if they play good defense and hit the glass hard. I have seen subpar defense and poor rebounding the last two games. That's on the players and the coaches. This is correctable and I expect it to be fixed. Getting over 500 is important this year as it keeps our momentum going. Getting some studs in 2019 is a must as we have some good players but need more difference makers.
 
So the good news is we can play with the strong high major teams and that goes full tilt next week. We're in good shape then.
I'm a cup half-filled kinda guy I guess...[cheers]
 
He is more active than many coaches I have seen on the bench. We have seen a lot of games this year with intensity. I am not jumping the ship on the program, or the direction that it is in. The program has better recruits than they have had in years. It's a players league now. Every sport is going into being a players league. The team has had great games, and still has potential to clean things up.

I am not sure what Pikiell does at halftime, but you are right, the captains are extensions of the coaches. The team played well against top programs this year, and their heads are still swollen. Pikiell needs to demand a win, and more effort. Something has to be said to certain players.

He is definitely active and i love his enthusiasm. Again i hope it works. I just found it very disappointing after the awful 1st half the team didn't appear serious and locked in. You'd think after the crap 1st half following the loss to SB the team wouldn't be smiling and joking around. probably more on players
 
BAC.....is it possible that the good games, good rebounding, good defense and good effort and good coaching against FSU, MSU, Seton Hall are the Norm? Two of them were losses but Rutgers played very well in those games.

Maybe the anolomies are the last 2 games?

Let's hope so.
 
There I said it because until Rutgers show as a program that they are doing something different or headed somewhere different, they are Same Old Rutgers. Now Bac calm down you don't mean that you are just emotional after a horrific loss. Yes in some aspects Pike has moved the program forward beyond the stench of Rice and Jordan but the harsh reality is that in terms of wins/losses and expectations, Rutgers is still the favorite for the Big 10 basement this year. When a team follows up a huge win over a ranked team in Seton Hall with two horrific losses to low majors at home then yes the Same Old Rutgers label still applies.

Two big cliches we hear is "they would have lost this game last year"...well they actually won it last year in a dogfight...and "they will learn from this loss(Stony Brook)"...no they didnt they played exactly the same. Remember LeBonnaBing or losing back to back to Drexel and William and Mary. Well welcome to StonyHart. Two losses that certainly rival those losses and may be worse given the level of opponent. Lets stop with the Stony Brook/Hartford are pretty good talk..they were only good because RU let them be good. When you allow low majors to walk on to your home court and play them evenly and then when given a chance to put them away you allow them back in, you deserve to lose. RU deserved to lose these last two games...outplayed, outhustled, outcoached. Its as if this was just a continuation of the Stony Brook game with just a different opponent. Almost the same exact game where RU continually shot themselves in the foot, bricked shots, bricked foul shots and when you allow a low major team to stay in the game to the last few possessions, you get what you deserve.

I blame the coaches. I blame the players. These two games are inexcusable from both. To actually approach the game with the same mindset that lost you the last game is mind boggling. How..how? Thats on coaches, thats on players. You know why I absolutely hated playing all 13 conference games at home...why? because I felt the team would develop bad habits while not challenging themselves and thats exactly where we got the last two games. Those bad habits, those 5-10 minutes of poor play earlier in the season came back to haunt them. The SHU win may turn out to be a negative. This team developed an inflated ego and felt that all they had to do is step on the court. They lacked hunger, they went through the motions, they lacked purpose. Perhaps more road games or some tougher home games might have set this teams mindset on a different road. What is stunning is how bad fundamentally this team looked the past two games, it doesn't look well coached..that after looking extremely well coached the past few weeks. They cannot run a proper break, they cannot make a layup, they cannot hit foulshots, they cannot rebound, they do not move in their offensive sets. Just a breakdown from coach to players.

That last play with 14 seconds..what was that...for a team that has trouble executing, waaaaaaaay too much dribbling away from the basket...wtf was Pike calling there. It looked doom from the start. Would rather attack the hoop then fumble away and not even take a shot...poor job there but the game was lost way before that.

No I dont have a problem with Pike sitting Corey. Have to show discipline, that wasnt the first time, the team had many opportunities to win the game. Went up 27-20 and Freeman throws up a stupid 3 and from there it was a game...that after a 19-4 RU run which made it look like RU would take this one easy.

So yeah its all about negativity tonight because it should be. Save the excuses and sugarcoating. This team just suffered two back to back home losses that rival what Jordan and Hill did..that is not fake news. What does that mean? Well who knows, right now we are a bad team that cannot shoot and runs horrible offensive sets. I do know this team will lose ugly at Purdue and Michigan State and Wisconsin at home almost becomes a must win or do you really feel confident in this team overcoming a 0-5 league start. Confidence has dropped on whether this team can get to 6-12 and finish over 500. I think there is a shot but considering the program is 6-48 in league games over the past 3 years, that clearly will require the program shedding the Same Old Rutgers label. I get tired of posting that this team needs to play a full 40 minutes to win games and the small margin of error. I unfortunately didnt think it applied to the cupcake games but here we are. If they can whether the storm the next two weeks and go back to basics of hard work then maybe things will uptick again
BAC great post. After last night's debacle I had to stay away from this site. I was afraid I would rail against the players and coaches. Thank you. You did it for me. The biggest take away is after the SH win, both the players AND the coaches got too full of themselves. And they are equally to blame. I love Pikiell but his decision making with the game on the line in both games was piss-poor. What the hell was he thinking? He wasn't.

Both the players and coaches thought they could come out puff out their chests, go through the motions and win each game by double digits for just showing up. They forget, we're Rutgers. NOBODY FEARS US. NOBODY. In order to have a successful rest of the season we have to play like underdogs, which we will be in practically every game. After the SH win I penciled in 18 wins. Now, we may get 15 and that means we finish once again without a winning record.
 
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The sky is falling scenario is SILLY.

To think that Pikiell and Staff just forgot how to coach for two Games is Silly.


It's possible Pikiell was exposed this game. i never expected a simple 1-3-1 zone to not be solved. i was stunned with 2 minutes of actual time he couldn't come up with a play with 1.6 seconds left. This was a real eye opener and almost an epiphany moment for me.
 
There is lots of blame to go around for this loss.

But How about 4 extra minutes of Sanders instead of Mensah and we probably win this game and we are not having theses discussions. Its not Pikells fault that he missed a flight and let the team down again.
Cept that we came out of the half with The lead and lost the game. I give Sanders credit for making some shots but that's all, we lost with him playing.
 
Rutgers problem offensively is twofold

1. They lack a guy who with 5 seconds or so left on the shot clock can go get a good shot.

2. They have 2 guys who think they can


This is where Nigel Johnson came in handy last year. This team could use someone with Myles Mack's shooting ability.
 
Rutgers problem offensively is twofold

1. They lack a guy who with 5 seconds or so left on the shot clock can go get a good shot.

2. They have 2 guys who think they can


I can't believe I am sticking up for Sanders. if you want to knock him he actually didn't have the ball enough last night.
 
Green

Corey Sanders cost Rutgers that game last night

The only time I've ever questioned Coach P was last night when he played him.
 
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