Would be wonderful if the site could do a compare and contrast with their experiences at Rutgers vs their experiences at Duke and Florida, respectively. I suspect Rutgers Basketball may have a culture problem, which has been ongoing for generations, at least since towards the end of the Wenzel era. At least with the football program, i know the kids are working as hard as they can to be the best they can be. With Basketball, i just don't have the same confidence. But I'd like to hear firsthand from the kids who were in the program before- the plain unvarnished truth.
I would love to hear Mike Rosario and Dahntay Jones Perspective
- Thread starter rutgersal
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Rosario left because he thought Rutgers wasn't going to get him to the NBA and his "handlers" whispered in his ear (lot of good that did right Mike). Rosario always thought he was better than he really was.
Jones left because Bannon was a jerk
No analysis needed.
Jones left because Bannon was a jerk
No analysis needed.
Duke and Florida are perceived elite programs that win national championships which naturally attracts the best players.Rosario and Jones gave Rutgers two years to get their house in order but the likelihood of a NCAA bid was very slim..
Rosario was ranked the #16 recruit by ESPN and McDonald's All-American. It was reasonable for him to believe that the NBA was inevitable. He chose to leave Rutgers, which has a poor track record of producing NBA talent, to play for Billy Donovan, arguably one of the best coaches in college basketball and a coach with a terrific track record of producing NBA talent. Rosario likely made the best decision for himself, regardless of whether he eventually made it to the NBA.
I don't say this to be mean. I think Seton Hall is in a very similar position with Whitehead. Both SHU and Rutgers have failed to produce recent NBA talent.
Simple...They were NOT recruited at these programs out of high school. They came to RU to gain plenty of playing time and experience in a high major conference as auditions to their end schools.
Each of these guys immensely contributed to the mess that RU is in now because they were the best players for each of the RU team that they were on. Yes, Bannon and Freddie have a lot to do with their transferring decisions. T. Billet & E. Carter were other transfers who also have impacted the current RU's basketball situation.
With the above being said, Mack , Jack and Lewis have truly bled Scarlet red for RU. It is best to focus on the players who want to be at Rutgers and forget about those who don't want to have anything to do with RU.
This post was edited on 3/6 12:54 PM by RU_WL
Each of these guys immensely contributed to the mess that RU is in now because they were the best players for each of the RU team that they were on. Yes, Bannon and Freddie have a lot to do with their transferring decisions. T. Billet & E. Carter were other transfers who also have impacted the current RU's basketball situation.
With the above being said, Mack , Jack and Lewis have truly bled Scarlet red for RU. It is best to focus on the players who want to be at Rutgers and forget about those who don't want to have anything to do with RU.
This post was edited on 3/6 12:54 PM by RU_WL
Interesting that we lost both Rosario and Carter to Florida. The O dome is very RAC like with the smell of chlorine permeating thru into their practice facility which is located under the stadium. I bet if you talk to either of those guys they would tell you Billy Donovan could win at Rutgers without a practice facility. Florida wasn't the greatest basketball school before he got there and isn't winning the arms race since he has been there. (up till now)
Great thread. We conclude that some of our best left for better coaches but our best thinkers conclude we need better facilities to attract the best players. A little convoluted to me.
Great thread. We conclude that some of our best left for better coaches but our best thinkers conclude we need better facilities to attract the best players. A little convoluted to me.
Agreed that is a tad simplistic, because the kind of coach that could win here isn't coming here without those facilities, so whether it's direct or indirect in terms of getting players, we need them.
Now, the big question is, how much would it take to lure a big-time coach here without those facilities? A lot cheaper than the facilities, but a lot more than would be tolerated by people in New Jersey who already question what the state university spends on athletics.
Both had NBA aspirations. They didn't think Rutgers helped them in those aspirations. Coaching was probably part of it. Facilities was probably another part. How can you develop to the best of your abilities if you don't have a dedicated facility to practice at every day?
The third part was they had no help, being the sole focus of a defense every game gets tiresome, and is not conducive towards developing an off the ball game they would need in the NBA.
This post was edited on 3/6 2:45 PM by StyleKnight
I've seen a lot of McD's AAs play in college.. I've also seen a lot of top 20 in the country HS recruits. MR was not good enough for either of those.
He was a good player, don't get me wrong. But he was not stellar either.
RU85 -- UF has their own state of the art practice facility, with the final four floors that they won the championship as the actual floor. It was probably bilt a little over 5 years ago. When I went to school there, the practice facility was at the bottom of the O'Dome (right next to where I took Weightlifting 101). I linked the facility.
PLus the O'Dome is scheduled for a $60 million renovation that was going to start this March but is belayed delayed now until next year. Fundking is mostly private
This post was edited on 3/6 3:54 PM by DoctorCrip
UF Practice Facility
I think you are wrong on this one. Rosario's game would have developed more at a place like RU because he would have been the man. He would have played more minutes than anyone else. Instead, he transferred to a program where he played, but he sat a lot more. He was not in any way a focal point of their team. He was coached to be supporting cast (a sidekick) to other stars. He shot himself in the foot. He transferred for the chance to play in the NCAA Tournament as well as to be a star on a team of stars. The last part didn't work out. He F'ed up.
Jones transferred for much the same reason. Jason Williams was in his ear telling him that you have to practice with stars to be a star. The fact that Dahntey Jones was starting and playing against some of the best talent in the country made the Jason Williams point mute. Jones was just another guy at Duke. His game would have developed so much more at RU with him being the go to guy also.
Jones went from just an athlete his Freshman year at RU to 5th leading scorer in the BE conference. He also went from having no outside shot to developing a decent mid range jumper his Sophomore year. His redshirt year at Duke was a setback for him. He never developed more. He wasn't the go to guy for them. They didn't need him to get 20 plus points per game for them and they didn't need him to play more than half a game. He made it to the NBA a pure athleticism, but he has never been a big star since his days on the banks.
Each of these guys would have developed more had they stayed at RU and continued being the go to guy instead of transferring to a place where they were just supporting cast.
Billet was a different case. He transferred to have a chance to play in the NCAA Tourney. He transferred to an NCAA caliber team, but it wasn't laced with elite talent at his position where he would not get as much playing time. He chose better. He just didn't have the kind of talent that would get him to the NBA.
I do not know what your sources are, but with respect to Rosario, I guarantee you that you are wrong. With respect to Jones, I have no inside information. However, the fact that he publicly stated first that he was choosing only among going to Duke, going to UNC or staying at RU, and later stating that he was choosing only between going to Duke or staying at RU, undermines your contention. If he was leaving to get away from Bannon it is unlikely that he would have gone through that limited progression of options.
Rac, the point is that if Mack left, he would not have as great of stats. He might get wins, but he probably wouldn't have the same personal stats.
Team is everything, but Mack elsewhere is not as great of a player is he is here. He was the guy here.
Team is everything, but Mack elsewhere is not as great of a player is he is here. He was the guy here.
Dahntay has made almost 18 Million bucks in salary in his career. He made the smart choice. And its not like he wasn't a focal point his senior year, he averaged almost 18ppg. Same goes for Rosario and Eli, Florida is just another level. Since Wenzel we have lost a ton of talent to transfers, and it can be attributed to f*ck up coaches and consistent losing.
You don't think he would have made the NBA if he stayed at RU? And this is pretty hard to believe based on where we are now but we weren't too bad back then and would have been better had players stayed (which I contend is because Bannon was a jerk)
If you are good you'll make the NBA no matter where you go. I think this fact has been proven time and time again.
Would he have made the NBAhad he stayed here-- possibly. Would he have been the name brand, and garnered the national recognition. No. Does being exposed nationally while at Duke impact draft status moreso than had he had stayed at Rutgers? I don't know.
Let's put it this way - going to Duke certainly did not negatively impact draft status. He was coached by arguably the best college coach ever. He won a national title his transfer year. There he played and practiced against guys like J-Will, Dunleavy, Boozer, Duhom, etc. These are all first round picks that made him better, i am sure. He then became a household nme and one of the best players in the ACC. He is still on a roster now...the clippers, after 11 or 12 years.
How anyone could argue that he didn't make the "right choice" is preposterous.
Let's put it this way - going to Duke certainly did not negatively impact draft status. He was coached by arguably the best college coach ever. He won a national title his transfer year. There he played and practiced against guys like J-Will, Dunleavy, Boozer, Duhom, etc. These are all first round picks that made him better, i am sure. He then became a household nme and one of the best players in the ACC. He is still on a roster now...the clippers, after 11 or 12 years.
How anyone could argue that he didn't make the "right choice" is preposterous.
I have shared this story before and I will sahre it again. I sat right next to Jone's family in Penn Station right after Rutgers lost in the BE tourney his soph year. There was lots of frustration with Rutgers losing and not getting to the NCAA and IIRC Bannon in that particular game for not going to D Jones at the end. They didn't think Rutgers and Bannon could get him to the tourney and the exposure to get him to the NBA. It was all about him and that was that.
My personal opinion on Eli and Rosario is the same thing. They wanted their shot and didn't think they could get it here. That's what you get when you have a "team" with one self absorbed "star"...
When you commit to RU realistically do you think you're going to win the NC at this point?
No.
But getting to the NCAA or the B1G finals or something like that will be sweeter than going to an establishment and geting knocked out in the 2nd round. No one remembers those players. The guys that get RU over the hump will be legen.......wait for it.................--dary.
I am telling you what I personally heard from his family. So that is not D. Jones himself. So in his case maybe it was folks speaking in his ear and he wanted to stay but others wanted a sure thing..Duke and talked him into it. I 100% stand by what I heard them saying and it was a long wait for the train so I heard plenty.
And with Rosario I said it was my opinion on him. If that was not the case then I think better of him but since I wasn't a big fan anyway I care less. I thought we had something back with bannon and that crew. And that was the last time we had a real BB team on the rise.
IF you mean stayed at Rutgers....Douby...and Hamady (sp) to a lessor extent.. if you mean sticking power from Rutgers..yes, John Battle.
Dahntay Jones didn't leave Rutgers because of Kevin Bannon. Bannon was the reason he came.
I ran into Dahtay at the airport in Memphis a few years back when he was with the Grizzlies. He told me that he still talks to Kevin Bannon pretty regularly. He left Rutgers because he needed to be surrounded by better players in order to effectively showcase his talent. Going to Duke was a no brainer right thing for him to do basketball wise once it was established that we weren't going to be able to surround him with a stable of offensive threats.
As an aside, Dahntay wasn't a favorite of his teammates when he was at Rutgers, which I imagine also played a significant role in his decision to leave
I ran into Dahtay at the airport in Memphis a few years back when he was with the Grizzlies. He told me that he still talks to Kevin Bannon pretty regularly. He left Rutgers because he needed to be surrounded by better players in order to effectively showcase his talent. Going to Duke was a no brainer right thing for him to do basketball wise once it was established that we weren't going to be able to surround him with a stable of offensive threats.
As an aside, Dahntay wasn't a favorite of his teammates when he was at Rutgers, which I imagine also played a significant role in his decision to leave
The big thing Coach K did for Jones was get the playground "attitude" out of him. Saw a number of games when Dahntay would posture and taunt, even getting into it a time or two with opposing assistants who were incensed by his antics. You could see the look of extreme displeasure on Coach K's face when that happened, and Dahntay would soon be sitting on the bench. You saw that a lot his junior year; hardly at all his senior year, when he earned his rep as a strong defender, laying the groundwork for a career in the NBA as a rotation player and sometime starter.
The Rosario I saw in the McDonald's All-American game was a well-schooled kid who played team ball. He was the fair haired boy for the fickle Fred Hill jr for a year, and became selfish. Gets to Fla, and surprise! Lots of fine guards, including Bradley Beal. Both guys made the right move.
TL
No one has said if we have a chance to get a top tier coach we'd pass up that opportunity for a new work out facility.
Unfortunately at the moment finding the money to build something is much closer to reality than finding enough money to hire away Billy Donovan.
But don't let misinformation, twisted logic and bad recollection get in the way of offering an opinion..
