Watching the game at home yesterday the announcers brought up an interesting tidbit. They said Pike mentioned to them that in practice, Young is a scoring machine and possibly is the best performer offensively in practice, but for whatever reason it hasn’t translated to the games.
Jacob Young Question
- Thread starter RUSCFORMERLYRULOU
- Start date
I wish the Caleb McConnell light bulb would go off for him. Remember what happened with Caleb mid year last year?
I think last December, Harper was 3 of 23 from 3, Mathis 4-25 and Caleb was shaky vs Michigan State at home, but had a couple of key baskets at Wisconsin and at Seton Hall. So patience is warranted here, to a certain degree.
The bad shooting I can accept, but the unforced turnovers are a huge issue, but I honestly think he cannot play any worse than he has so far and that was including UMass and at Michigan State....his points prevented the MSU game from being a 20+ point loss, which would be much more harmful than we want to realize.
I don't think Young's B1G stats will be 13% shooting from 3....but I would also take my chances that Mulcahy has the key to bolting Young to limited minutes or the bench. With every bad shot or forced shot Mulcahy seems to have taken, is a better option than a forced pass...a missed shot is better than a turnover, as long as it's within the flow of the offense. Mulcahy shooting 2 of 5 from the floor on drives or calm pull up shots, is fine....going 1 on 3 in transition by Young, definitely isn't
Mulcahy takes shots within the flow and Young is taking shots, whenever he feels like he needs to make a play. My instincts tell me that everyone on RU can't have a bad game at the same time and RU will figure out Young, or Mathis/Mulcahy/McConnell will figure out a way to make up the difference.
This is not a change of topic, but I would caution fans looking at recruiting rankings as some sort of indictment against the staff, to revisit how they view things. With every turnover and forced shot, it is giving the appearance that "buy-in", by the recruits within the scheme is standing out with almost every player on the roster, except Young. Young is a Top 150 player, but fitting into a system is just as important as how highly ranked the player actually is.
It only takes a couple of highly ranked recruits, believing they have to do too much, within a teams 9 man rotation that can make a roster underachieve across the Power 5 landscape. Some teams around the country, look better on paper, but it doesn't translate on gamedays or distribution of shots.....it was why I was 100% comfortable on Eugene transferring, because I believed others fit what and how RU needed to play....I feel confident that has played itself out, over the first dozen games, while allowing Harper, Myles and others to develop with more touches...... A flawed or limited player within the team concept, that a coach can find ways to use properly, always outshines a more talented/athletic player, believing he can outplay the system or opponent.
The bad shooting I can accept, but the unforced turnovers are a huge issue, but I honestly think he cannot play any worse than he has so far and that was including UMass and at Michigan State....his points prevented the MSU game from being a 20+ point loss, which would be much more harmful than we want to realize.
I don't think Young's B1G stats will be 13% shooting from 3....but I would also take my chances that Mulcahy has the key to bolting Young to limited minutes or the bench. With every bad shot or forced shot Mulcahy seems to have taken, is a better option than a forced pass...a missed shot is better than a turnover, as long as it's within the flow of the offense. Mulcahy shooting 2 of 5 from the floor on drives or calm pull up shots, is fine....going 1 on 3 in transition by Young, definitely isn't
Mulcahy takes shots within the flow and Young is taking shots, whenever he feels like he needs to make a play. My instincts tell me that everyone on RU can't have a bad game at the same time and RU will figure out Young, or Mathis/Mulcahy/McConnell will figure out a way to make up the difference.
This is not a change of topic, but I would caution fans looking at recruiting rankings as some sort of indictment against the staff, to revisit how they view things. With every turnover and forced shot, it is giving the appearance that "buy-in", by the recruits within the scheme is standing out with almost every player on the roster, except Young. Young is a Top 150 player, but fitting into a system is just as important as how highly ranked the player actually is.
It only takes a couple of highly ranked recruits, believing they have to do too much, within a teams 9 man rotation that can make a roster underachieve across the Power 5 landscape. Some teams around the country, look better on paper, but it doesn't translate on gamedays or distribution of shots.....it was why I was 100% comfortable on Eugene transferring, because I believed others fit what and how RU needed to play....I feel confident that has played itself out, over the first dozen games, while allowing Harper, Myles and others to develop with more touches...... A flawed or limited player within the team concept, that a coach can find ways to use properly, always outshines a more talented/athletic player, believing he can outplay the system or opponent.
This. Off topic of Rutgers, but I remember watching LSU games when Ben Simmons was there. They had a guy named Tim Quarterman who thought he had to carry the scoring and it threw off the whole team balance. It neutered a guy who instantly became a top NBA player (and someone who makes teammates better) and derailed everything they tried to do.
Agree. He shot .271 (55-203) through two years at Texas with the closer 3P line. He shouldn't be shooting threes unless he's wide open late in the clock, or has the ball in his hands with under 5 seconds on the clock.... and he should never have the ball in his hands with under 5 seconds on the clock.
Good news is he's definitely shooting fewer threes, at 4.2 3PA per 40 min this year vs. 7.8 at Texas. That number should really be down closer to 3.0, though, imo (Mathis is 3.1/40 min).
The crazy stat is that he's lowest in the rotation in 2P% (.410), yet takes the most 2PA per 40 min than any other player at 10.3.... ahead of Johnson at 9.8 (.746), Harper at 9.5 (.553), and Mathis at 9.2 (.450).
His usage rate is like 27%, 5% higher than Geo and Harper, despite him being the least efficient player on the team. This isn't sustainable
Maybe Pike should have him read this thread!
Any thoughts that he is some kind of fan favorite will most certainly evaporate pretty quickly.
In team sports, secondary players are used when their best skill is in need.
Baseball has pinch hitters, closers and late game defensive replacements. None of these is allowed to play entire games as their skill set is not good enough to do so.
Hopefully, Pike has seen the light with Young and he is used solely as a defensive player when the need arises. He has to be flat out told that he is not to attempt shots! If he can't follow instructions, he deserves to sit and watch the game like the rest of us.
As already noted, it appears that at least one of the regulars is showing his frustration when Young heaves one up. Hard to think that there are not any others. Not good for team chemistry when you have a knucklehead screwing things up.
Any thoughts that he is some kind of fan favorite will most certainly evaporate pretty quickly.
In team sports, secondary players are used when their best skill is in need.
Baseball has pinch hitters, closers and late game defensive replacements. None of these is allowed to play entire games as their skill set is not good enough to do so.
Hopefully, Pike has seen the light with Young and he is used solely as a defensive player when the need arises. He has to be flat out told that he is not to attempt shots! If he can't follow instructions, he deserves to sit and watch the game like the rest of us.
As already noted, it appears that at least one of the regulars is showing his frustration when Young heaves one up. Hard to think that there are not any others. Not good for team chemistry when you have a knucklehead screwing things up.
Agreed. Love his defense, but wish he'd just learn to play smarter on offense.
He had a (-1) against Lafayette
So here are his stats for 3 years...he's shooting much worse here than he did at Texas...has more turnovers here....worse FT....but playing more minutes...he should be more of a depth guy....like 10th man....
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/stats/_/id/4066326/jacob-young
GP MIN FG% 3P% FT% REB AST BLK STL PF TO PTS
12 19.9 32.6 11.5 65.4 2.3 2.0 0.0 0.8 1.8 2.8 6.3
30 16.8 41.3 32.3 68.2 1.7 0.7 0.0 0.7 1.0 0.6 6.2
33 16.4 28.7 22.7 78.6 0.9 0.8 0.0 0.2 1.5 0.9 3.7
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/stats/_/id/4066326/jacob-young
GP MIN FG% 3P% FT% REB AST BLK STL PF TO PTS
12 19.9 32.6 11.5 65.4 2.3 2.0 0.0 0.8 1.8 2.8 6.3
30 16.8 41.3 32.3 68.2 1.7 0.7 0.0 0.7 1.0 0.6 6.2
33 16.4 28.7 22.7 78.6 0.9 0.8 0.0 0.2 1.5 0.9 3.7
Can't really just look at his FT% from TX, because he barely shot any. Missing just one more shot in his freshman year would have dropped his FT% from 78.6% to 71.4%. He's taken more FTs through 12 games this season than he did in either of his two seasons at TX.
He's also being used in a much different role (moving from SG to PG), which you can see in the assist and TO numbers. I'm curious how much the farther 3P line is impacting him, tbh - he's not hitting from outside, and that's where he scored most of his points at TX (165 of 309 pts came from behind the arc)
Basketball Reference site has an advanced stat called BPM:
Box Plus/Minus (BPM) is a box score-based metric for evaluating basketball players' quality and contribution to the team. It is the latest version of a stat previously called Advanced Statistical Plus/Minus; it is NOT a version of Adjusted Plus/Minus, which is a play-by-play regression metric.
Basketball-Reference.com › about
About Box Plus/Minus (BPM) | Basketball-Reference.com
There are only 6 players in the Big Ten with a negative BPM (who have played at least 200 mins), and of that six, only one is worse than Jacob Young. (freshman Yvan Ouedraogo from Nebraska)
Box Plus/Minus (BPM) is a box score-based metric for evaluating basketball players' quality and contribution to the team. It is the latest version of a stat previously called Advanced Statistical Plus/Minus; it is NOT a version of Adjusted Plus/Minus, which is a play-by-play regression metric.
Basketball-Reference.com › about
About Box Plus/Minus (BPM) | Basketball-Reference.com
There are only 6 players in the Big Ten with a negative BPM (who have played at least 200 mins), and of that six, only one is worse than Jacob Young. (freshman Yvan Ouedraogo from Nebraska)
It’s not about a player missing a 3. Most 3s are missed shots.
It’s about a poor shooter taking a bad 3, or a poor shooter taking it way to early in the shot clock with no rebounders in position, or a poor shooter taking the 3 without passing the ball at all.
That is what Young has been doing. It is freakin frustrating.
Yes, Paul is always on the court with Jacob. IMO, it’s because Paul is the exact opposite of Jacob. And correct again, that stinks for Paul’s +|-
Over a decent sample size (which we have now), +|- is a very accurate indication of who is playing well and who isn’t. Better players have better +|- and not so good players have poor +|-
I think it is a great stat.
And I would have guessed that Myles, Geo, Caleb and Harper are our top four +|-. And they are.
Watch his 3 point shooting form. He is quick, pushes the ball, and has no fluidity and no follow through.
It’s the opposite of someone like Caleb, Geo and Harper, who have pretty good form.
Sorry but if Yeboah is not ahead of Caleb and Harper, I guess we've been watching the games differently.
Calculating +/- is simple math. If a player has a good +/-, the team is playing better with him/her in the lineup. But context is everything. If someone comes off the bench and a teammate goes off for a period, that will inflate the sub's +/-. Conversely, if the sub comes in at SG and the other team's Big goes on a tear, that will deflate that subs +/-. But it is usually a good indicator, and one you know coaches track closely. In the Knicks case, it played a large part in why Elfred Peyton was installed as the starting PG over Dennis Smith and Frank Ntliklina as soon as he was healthy.
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