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Joe Mixon Video Released

Sure this is technically "self defense" but it's hardly justified self defense. For starters, it looks like the young lady spit on and pushed mixon. Mixon responded with a heavy right hook, far from equal. Second, this is a ~120 pound human being against a 200+ pound individual. That push did nothing to mixon and he had complete control of the situation. There was nothing equal about this situation.

....people keep talking about size and sex in this case - 'Mixon needed to have restraint because she was a small woman'. I will say we just hired a normal looking woman about her size.....who just happens to be a world sparring champion in her form of Karate. Sorry - you just never know who you're dealing with - tough to see the optics on this as a football player destroys a little girl, but she was dead wrong - to what extent Mixon was wrong is tough to call. Goes back to 1st grade - KEEP YOUR HANDS TO YOURSELF!
 
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She barely touched him. Some of you defending his actions are pathetic. You wouldn't be saying this if that was your daughter.

If this was my daughter you bet I'd be upset and want the book thrown at him....but I'm also having a convo with my daughter saying 'what on earth are you thinking putting your hands on someone else?'
 
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It's actually self-defense. Size and weight don't matter according to the law. He doesn't have to sit there and let her hit him, he has every right to defend himself from a legal standpoint. However, from a "should he do it" standpoint, absolutely not. You shouldn't hit a girl under any circumstances.
 
College athletics especially football has completely lost its moral compass and is far worse than the nfl when it comes to the sleeze factor. Just this week Minnesota players thinking gang banging a student is ok, Bobby Petrino blatantly cheats, and surprise surprise a 5 star athlete is given another chance most wouldn't get.

Oh for all the people saying she attacked first, have you ever heard the term disproportionate response. If an 6 year started hitting you, would you slug them? Get real and stop twisting the intent of the laws to fit your gender equality hating agendas.
 
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College athletics especially football has completely lost its moral compass and is far worse than the nfl when it comes to the sleeze factor. Just this week Minnesota players thinking gang banging a student is ok, Bobby Petrino blatantly cheats, and surprise surprise a 5 star athlete is given another chance most wouldn't get.

Oh for all the people saying she attacked first, have you ever heard the term disproportionate response. If an 6 year started hitting you, would you slug them? Get real and stop twisting the intent of the laws to fit your gender equality hating agendas.

I'm not saying he was right, clearly he wasn't. I don't think anyone thinks that. But self defense is self defense. There's no law that says self defense doesn't apply to women. And she's not a six year old, she's an adult. He doesn't have to sit there and be a punching bag to her. Should he is a different issue. It's similar to when someone tries to fist fight someone and the person takes out a gun and shoots them.
 
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....people keep talking about size and sex in this case - 'Mixon needed to have restraint because she was a small woman'. I will say we just hired a normal looking woman about her size.....who just happens to be a world sparring champion in her form of Karate. Sorry - you just never know who you're dealing with - tough to see the optics on this as a football player destroys a little girl, but she was dead wrong - to what extent Mixon was wrong is tough to call. Goes back to 1st grade - KEEP YOUR HANDS TO YOURSELF!

She didn't wind up for a roundhouse kick.......all she did was spit on him and push him in a way that didn't even move him. If he pushed her back and she fell I would understand but he just about knocked her unconscious. That is not a reasonable response.
 
I'm not saying he was right, clearly he wasn't. I don't think anyone thinks that. But self defense is self defense. There's no law that says self defense doesn't apply to women. And she's not a six year old, she's an adult. He doesn't have to sit there and be a punching bag to her. Should he is a different issue.
The legal definition of self defense is as follows:
"the use of reasonable force to protect oneself or members of the family from bodily harm from the attack of an aggressor, if the defender has reason to believe he/she/they is/are in danger."

Do you think he 1. had reason to believe he was in danger and 2. used "reasonable" force to protect himself?
 
She barely touched him. Some of you defending his actions are pathetic. You wouldn't be saying this if that was your daughter.
Just for the record, my daughter would never hit a grown man without any physical provocation. And, she would not be out at 3 AM, hanging out. Plus, I have not read one person on this site "defending his actions" they basically state that this girl has some responsibility with the choking, and slap. Which she does.
But, to make it clear, I don't condone his reaction to the slap, at best he should have pushed her away, and walked away. Then file charges against her.
 
She spit on him???? Awww hell no. Still not saying he should have slugged him but someone should have. Maybe have a female acquaintance handle your light work.
 
I am actually a criminal defense attorney. This is self defense. Legally speaking it doesn't matter if he's bigger, he doesn't have to let her hit him. However, morally, he's 100% wrong. He shouldn't have done it, he should've walked away. Legally, he has a defense. I had a trial on facts similar to this and my client was found Not Guilty. As a man, you walk away and be the bigger person. As a D-1 athlete, walk away and report it to the authorities and maybe she gets charged. You can't slug her. Legally, I think it's self defense, but you still shouldn't do that.
 
If you haven't done so, read David McCullough's bio on the Wright brothers.

Tomorrow is the anniversary of their first Kill Devil Hills flight. McCullough's tale spends considerable time on the events between that flight and their subsequent fame, which came several years later. There were only 5 other people on the North Carolina beach that day and when the initial claims were published (sparsely), nobody believed them. It actually took several years - and a European tour - for the brothers to convince the world that they weren't embarked on some massive fraud.
Speaking of Kill Devil Hills, one of the premier hang-gliding schools is there, and I almost pulled the trigger six years ago to get certified. There are basically two methods of training. One is what they do on the 80-foot dunes at KDH, which are perfectly suited to inaugural lessons and flights since it's easy to launch yourself down the sloping dunes, and should you crash you're only a few feet off the ground and it's sand. The other method, which I considered and was at a school in IIRC Virginia, is to be towed behind a motor scooter that the instructor is driving, and you are only about ten feet off the ground as you become familiar with the apparatus.

I can't say I regret not having gone to either school, though KDH held more appeal. There's still time to learn and I still have enough of a screw loose to do it, but the second-level training gets you certified to (IIRC) 2000+ feet. That would be awesome, and scary at first. I'd of course have to do a special fly-in at the NC game in which Rutgers makes its first appearance, and deal with the subsequent arrest.
 
She didn't wind up for a roundhouse kick.......all she did was spit on him and push him in a way that didn't even move him. If he pushed her back and she fell I would understand but he just about knocked her unconscious. That is not a reasonable response.

I get it - btw I didn't know he spit in her too. So she pushed him, went for his throat and spit on him? What a mentality she had to have to think this was ok - unreal! The optics of the end result look horrible, but her actions are both disgusting and unacceptable.
 
College athletics especially football has completely lost its moral compass and is far worse than the nfl when it comes to the sleeze factor. Just this week Minnesota players thinking gang banging a student is ok, Bobby Petrino blatantly cheats, and surprise surprise a 5 star athlete is given another chance most wouldn't get.

Oh for all the people saying she attacked first, have you ever heard the term disproportionate response. If an 6 year started hitting you, would you slug them? Get real and stop twisting the intent of the laws to fit your gender equality hating agendas.
Newsflash outside of stealing plays all that is a snapchat of college. You don't think frat boys are running trains on coeds? Or hitting girls? Change play book with test and you ha e that as well. You are only hearing about it because they are football players.
 
I get it - btw I didn't know he spit in her too. So she pushed him, went for his throat and spit on him? What a mentality she had to have to think this was ok - unreal! The optics of the end result look horrible, but her actions are both disgusting and unacceptable.
He also claims she said racial slurs. Still doesn't justify it. Thing I done get is how these guys don't have hotter girlfriends/side pieces.
 
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When will you guys finally believe Ray didn't get a shot because he wasn't good anymore. If he was still running well he would have been given a shot by someone. Risk wasn't worth the reward.
Ray's backup had a similar lack of production that season making the most likely cause of Ray's decline his offensive line. Bernard Pierce averaged 4.9 yards per carry in 2012. The following year (Ray's last) he averaged 2.9 ypc. In 2012, Ray had 4.4 ypc. In 2013, Ray had 3.1 ypc.
 
How about a equal response? aka common sense. Stop trying to defend a wrong with another wrong.
slippery slope. Equal response.. define that legally. Its impossible. Thats why you are seeing all the issues with police and use of force/perceived threat. Its easier and better to just avoid these situations obviously.
 
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Ray's backup had a similar lack of production that season making the most likely cause of Ray's decline his offensive line. Bernard Pierce averaged 4.9 yards per carry in 2012. The following year (Ray's last) he averaged 2.9 ypc. In 2012, Ray had 4.4 ypc. In 2013, Ray had 3.1 ypc.
Ok. I give up. Ray Rice is the first still productive player a league driven by money ever turned it's back against. He should have announced he was bisexual. Then he would have had 20 teams come after him.
 
Just for the record, my daughter would never hit a grown man without any physical provocation. And, she would not be out at 3 AM, hanging out. Plus, I have not read one person on this site "defending his actions" they basically state that this girl has some responsibility with the choking, and slap. Which she does.
But, to make it clear, I don't condone his reaction to the slap, at best he should have pushed her away, and walked away. Then file charges against her.
Exactly... then throw in alcohol to this recipe for disaster.
 
Now I don't agree, but I think what people are saying here is if you put a man in place of the women in this video, how would you then perceive the situation. So I can see their point with the equal rights debate.

You can't demand equal rights in some situations and than not in others which don't benefit you. Look at the facts, she hit him and grabbed his throat 1st. A man does that to you and you hit back. However, I was taught you never hit a women, this kid's parents apparently never taught him that etiquette.
There is one area in which men and women are not equal - size and strength.
 
I am actually a criminal defense attorney. This is self defense. Legally speaking it doesn't matter if he's bigger, he doesn't have to let her hit him. However, morally, he's 100% wrong. He shouldn't have done it, he should've walked away. Legally, he has a defense. I had a trial on facts similar to this and my client was found Not Guilty. As a man, you walk away and be the bigger person. As a D-1 athlete, walk away and report it to the authorities and maybe she gets charged. You can't slug her. Legally, I think it's self defense, but you still shouldn't do that.
After reading the legal definition, it didn't seem like this situation could fit the defense. However, you're the expert here. Thanks for the information.
 
After reading the legal definition, it didn't seem like this situation could fit the defense. However, you're the expert here. Thanks for the information.

Bodily harm is defined as any pain so it could be a push or a slap. She was the aggressor. The only time you have a legal obligation to retreat is if you're going to use deadly force, except in stand your ground states. I think everyone on the board agrees he's an asshole and there was no reason whatsoever to do that. The bigger man would walk away and I think we all would. I'm just saying legally it's a strong self defense case so I can understand why the situation was handled the way it was.
 
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There is one area in which men and women are not equal - size and strength.
Totally agree, but as far as i know the law doesn't fully address this. Obviously the law ended up being somewhere in the middle here since apparently most of the charges were dismissed by the judge and Mixon plead guilty to what was apparently a lesser charge (i'm not a legal expert). So it does seem the law found there was wrong doing on both accounts.
 
Totally agree, but as far as i know the law doesn't fully address this. Obviously the law ended up being somewhere in the middle here since apparently most of the charges were dismissed by the judge and Mixon plead guilty to what was apparently a lesser charge (i'm not a legal expert). So it does seem the law found there was wrong doing on both accounts.

There is no law for size and strength. There is no law that says self-defense doesn't apply to women. I am a criminal attorney. He entered an alford plea which means that he did not admit any wrong doing, they gave him a deferred sentence and probation. That means that when he completes probation, the charge would be dismissed. It could be argued that he used unreasonable force against her. However, this is a classic self defense case and I think he would've been acquitted had he taken it to trial. I won a case on similar facts.
 
I'm sorry, when did the spitting occur, I saw no evidence of this. The dude broke a woman's jaw people. Did she hit first, yes, but he broke her jaw. The guy should have been told to find a new school. Damn, we need to be better then this. Schools like Oklahoma and Rutgers need to have higher standards. Just the way it needs to be. Set the example, don't be the example. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm. Take care brush ya hair.
 
There is no law for size and strength. There is no law that says self-defense doesn't apply to women. I am a criminal attorney. He entered an alford plea which means that he did not admit any wrong doing, they gave him a deferred sentence and probation. That means that when he completes probation, the charge would be dismissed. It could be argued that he used unreasonable force against her. However, this is a classic self defense case and I think he would've been acquitted had he taken it to trial. I won a case on similar facts.

He entered a plea?

So then he was charged with an actual crime, right?

That would seem to suggest that you're wrong.
 
I'm sorry, when did the spitting occur, I saw no evidence of this. The dude broke a woman's jaw people. Did she hit first, yes, but he broke her jaw. The guy should have been told to find a new school. Damn, we need to be better then this. Schools like Oklahoma and Rutgers need to have higher standards. Just the way it needs to be. Set the example, don't be the example. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm. Take care brush ya hair.

There are situations where someone is getting beat up and they take out a gun and shoot an unarmed person and they are justified in self defense. He shouldn't have done it, I wouldn't do it. But he was legally justified.
 
There are situations where someone is getting beat up and they take out a gun and shoot an unarmed person and they are justified in self defense. He shouldn't have done it, I wouldn't do it. But he was legally justified.

He was charged, pled guilty and sentenced. This does not sound like "legally justified".
 
I don't have a dog in this fight since I just now read the thread. I haven't seen anyone ITT defending Mixon, so those making pious and misdirected responses and accusations (jtung, for instance), I'll help you understand the distinctions going on here to help hone your critical thinking skills. There are essentially two arguments being made ITT, and are as follows:

1. The narrow argument, which limits its scope to the details and events seen on the video. People in here are consistently saying Mixon shouldn't have hit her, even though according to the law he may have had a right to. This is where normatives conflict with that which is legally permissible (e.g., you shouldn't hit a woman even if you have the right to).

2. The broader argument, with societal implications. Those saying that equal rights entail equal responsibilities are also correct, which is why in the phrase "Rights and Responsibilities," the two go hand in hand. Cases like Mixon's bring broader issues into the discussion at some point, which are external to the narrow argument that would take place in a courtroom. As a society we seek consistency, and inconsistencies in law warrant discussion about the nature of the inconsistencies. Translation: If there are truly equal rights and consistency is highly valued, and Mixon would have been within his rights to punch a man who spit on him and wrapped his hands around his throat, then he is within his rights to do the same to a woman. Conclusion: Either change the laws regarding equal rights (which is undesirable because it engenders inconsistency and unfairness), or adjust the description of what took place (i.e, rather than saying he hit a woman, say he hit a 120-pound person with disproportionate force).

Neither 1 nor 2 above is a statement that anyone wants to see Mixon exonerated.

Next lesson: The difference between speaking in the indicative and imperative moods, with a brief explanation of normatives.
 
I don't have a dog in this fight since I just now read the thread. I haven't seen anyone ITT defending Mixon, so those making pious and misdirected responses and accusations (jtung, for instance), I'll help you understand the distinctions going on here to help hone your critical thinking skills. There are essentially two arguments being made ITT, and are as follows:

1. The narrow argument, which limits its scope to the details and events seen on the video. People in here are consistently saying Mixon shouldn't have hit her, even though according to the law he may have had a right to. This is where normatives conflict with that which is legally permissible (e.g., you shouldn't hit a woman even if you have the right to).

2. The broader argument, with societal implications. Those saying that equal rights entail equal responsibilities are also correct, which is why in the phrase "Rights and Responsibilities," the two go hand in hand. Cases like Mixon's bring broader issues into the discussion at some point, which are external to the narrow argument that would take place in a courtroom. As a society we seek consistency, and inconsistencies in law warrant discussion about the nature of the inconsistencies. Translation: If there are truly equal rights and consistency is highly valued, and Mixon would have been within his rights to punch a man who spit on him and wrapped his hands around his throat, then he is within his rights to do the same to a woman. Conclusion: Either change the laws regarding equal rights (which is undesirable because it engenders inconsistency and unfairness), or adjust the description of what took place (i.e, rather than saying he hit a woman, say he hit a 120-pound person with disproportionate force).

Neither 1 nor 2 above is a statement that anyone wants to see Mixon exonerated.

Next lesson: The difference between speaking in the indicative and imperative moods, with a brief explanation of normatives.

Thanks RaRa!
 
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I don't have a dog in this fight since I just now read the thread. I haven't seen anyone ITT defending Mixon, so those making pious and misdirected responses and accusations (jtung, for instance), I'll help you understand the distinctions going on here to help hone your critical thinking skills. There are essentially two arguments being made ITT, and are as follows:

1. The narrow argument, which limits its scope to the details and events seen on the video. People in here are consistently saying Mixon shouldn't have hit her, even though according to the law he may have had a right to. This is where normatives conflict with that which is legally permissible (e.g., you shouldn't hit a woman even if you have the right to).

2. The broader argument, with societal implications. Those saying that equal rights entail equal responsibilities are also correct, which is why in the phrase "Rights and Responsibilities," the two go hand in hand. Cases like Mixon's bring broader issues into the discussion at some point, which are external to the narrow argument that would take place in a courtroom. As a society we seek consistency, and inconsistencies in law warrant discussion about the nature of the inconsistencies. Translation: If there are truly equal rights and consistency is highly valued, and Mixon would have been within his rights to punch a man who spit on him and wrapped his hands around his throat, then he is within his rights to do the same to a woman. Conclusion: Either change the laws regarding equal rights (which is undesirable because it engenders inconsistency and unfairness), or adjust the description of what took place (i.e, rather than saying he hit a woman, say he hit a 120-pound person with disproportionate force).

Neither 1 nor 2 above is a statement that anyone wants to see Mixon exonerated.

Next lesson: The difference between speaking in the indicative and imperative moods, with a brief explanation of normatives.

Well put
 
Newsflash outside of stealing plays all that is a snapchat of college. You don't think frat boys are running trains on coeds? Or hitting girls? Change play book with test and you ha e that as well. You are only hearing about it because they are football players.
Yeah i understand it happens but regular students get expelled or lose their scholarship. Jurich came off as thinking it was no big deal that his already untrustworthy coach cheated a fellow conference team. When you are a scholarship athlete representing your university you are and should be held to a higher standard whether you or I like it or not.
 
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There are situations where someone is getting beat up and they take out a gun and shoot an unarmed person and they are justified in self defense. He shouldn't have done it, I wouldn't do it. But he was legally justified.
His teammates left. He stayed. He chose to become a willing combatant. He was never in any physical danger from that woman. She did not look like she was chasing him all over the place. A couple of steps to the right, left or back would put him out of reach. He chose to respond with even greater force. Any claim of self defense would be flimsy.
 
how do you get there from my comments? Seriously, tell me?
You said: This is where this ideal of equal rights gets tricky. If equal rights exist...then i'm afraid this guy is off the hook.

That's how I got there.
 
Again the backup to Rice went from 4'9 a carry to 2.9. Tells me the line was terrible. Sorry did not see the above info.
 
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