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OT: Matthew Hurricane

PLEASE DO NOT BELIEVE ANYONE WHO SAYS THEY KNOW WE'RE GOING TO BE HIT BY THIS STORM. Of course, it's possible, but nobody on the planet can predict a hurricane's path and intensity that far out. Stay tuned.

This.

Also, for the truly dedicated "WHAT IF" crowd, any members showing a path toward this area (and to be clear, it's not any individual model consensus showing that, but some of the ensemble members), that activity is projected in the 10 day range, so it's outside the game day window for next week.
 
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This.

Also, for the truly dedicated "WHAT IF" crowd, any members showing a path toward this area (and to be clear, it's not any individual model consensus showing that, but some of the ensemble members), that activity is projected in the 10 day range, so it's outside the game day window for next week.

And really, that's why I read this board.
 
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The 00Z models from last night showing a bit of an eastward (out to sea off the east coast) shift beyond day 5 with the Euro, in particular showing Matthew being very strong, but well out to sea, near Bermuda. It's not over for the east coast, since there are models showing an east coast hit and since forecasts just aren't that accurate beyond 5 days (the NHC official forecast only goes out 5 days for good reason - accuracy beyond 5 days sucks), but the probability of an east coast strike has decreased, which would obviously mean no impact to the RU game (although if it were to come near here, it would be in the Friday-Sat timeframe).

By the way, the storm is still strengthening - up to 105 mph now...
 
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The 00Z models from last night showing a bit of an eastward (out to sea off the east coast) shift beyond day 5 with the Euro, in particular showing Matthew being very strong, but well out to sea, near Bermuda. It's not over for the east coast, since there are models showing an east coast hit and since forecasts just aren't that accurate beyond 5 days (the NHC official forecast only goes out 5 days for good reason - accuracy beyond 5 days sucks), but the probability of an east coast strike has decreased, which would obviously mean no impact to the RU game (although if it were to come near here, it would be in the Friday-Sat timeframe).

By the way, the storm is still strengthening - up to 105 mph now...

You sure about this? The timing of the models suggests otherwise, as does math.

The current NHC track has Matthew in the Bahamas at 9AM Wednesday. The distance from Exuma to Sandy Hook is close enough as makes no difference 1200 miles. To get the storm here on Saturday, given a direct path, would require a forward speed of at least 14 mph. Large storms tend to move more slowly than that.
 
Have family vacationing in Turks & Caicos until Sunday. For the more knowledgeable folks -- will they have any issues getting out of there?
 
Have family vacationing in Turks & Caicos until Sunday. For the more knowledgeable folks -- will they have any issues getting out of there?

Shouldn't, no. T&C not in the current path and the storm is projected to still be south of Cuba on Sunday.
 
Winds up to 120 mph, which is major hurricane (cat 3) status, despite 20 knots of SW shear, which is very surprising. This storm is likely becoming big enough to "make" its own weather to a certain extent, i.e., to be less affected by external factors, like shear. Jamaica/Cuba could really get crushed and Haiti might get pounded too.

Biggest question is whether the trough coming across the US mid-next week will be strong enough and timed properly to "push" Matthew off to the NE, and off the east coast. That's what a lot of the models are picking up on, but that's 5+ days away and nowhere near certain. The other big thing to watch in the near term is when does Matthew make the turn from heading roughly West to heading north - how far west the storm gets will affect what longitude the storm heads up and will impact whether it hits Florida, NC or is off the coast - although off the coast is still looking more likely.

@RU4Real - no, I'm not sure about it being at our latitude on Friday/Sat - was simply looking at some of the model output which shows that (below - many have the storm at the SC/NC latitude next Friday morning, so being at our latitude Fri/Sat is plausible). Even in the next few days the Euro has the storm moving a lot slower than the GFS and that could translate to a day or 2 difference to reach our latitude. Could be anytime between Friday and Sunday, at least - most tropical systems do accelerate a fair amount once they get to north of the Bahamas, but not all, often including larger storms, as you noted.

IMG_0336.thumb.JPG.e1796d9a88be90a7923601732dbdc9cb.JPG
 
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It will go OTS unless there is a HIGH block there's nothing to push it west once it starts churning north
 
Winds up to 120 mph, which is major hurricane (cat 3) status, despite 20 knots of SW shear, which is very surprising. This storm is likely becoming big enough to "make" its own weather to a certain extent, i.e., to be less affected by external factors, like shear. Jamaica/Cuba could really get crushed and Haiti might get pounded too.

Biggest question is whether the trough coming across the US mid-next week will be strong enough and timed properly to "push" Matthew off to the NE, and off the east coast. That's what a lot of the models are picking up on, but that's 5+ days away and nowhere near certain. The other big thing to watch in the near term is when does Matthew make the turn from heading roughly West to heading north - how far west the storm gets will affect what longitude the storm heads up and will impact whether it hits Florida, NC or is off the coast - although off the coast is still looking more likely.

@RU4Real - no, I'm not sure about it being at our latitude on Friday/Sat - was simply looking at some of the model output which shows that (below - many have the storm at the SC/NC latitude next Friday morning, so being at our latitude Fri/Sat is plausible). Even in the next few days the Euro has the storm moving a lot slower than the GFS and that could translate to a day or 2 difference to reach our latitude. Could be anytime between Friday and Sunday, at least - most tropical systems do accelerate a fair amount once they get to north of the Bahamas, but not all, often including larger storms, as you noted.

IMG_0336.thumb.JPG.e1796d9a88be90a7923601732dbdc9cb.JPG

So, when your model is the one that's tracking far west into Mexico.... what are you thinking right now?

Is this a "our data is showing X, Y, Z so this makes sense to us" type of a reaction, or a "what is our model missing that everyone else seems to be including" sort of reaction?
 
So, when your model is the one that's tracking far west into Mexico.... what are you thinking right now?

Is this a "our data is showing X, Y, Z so this makes sense to us" type of a reaction, or a "what is our model missing that everyone else seems to be including" sort of reaction?

The different models are biased toward different dynamics - that's what makes them different in the first place. So when you have a single outlier, such as shown, the question is really "remind me again what this model's bias is".
 
The different models are biased toward different dynamics - that's what makes them different in the first place. So when you have a single outlier, such as shown, the question is really "remind me again what this model's bias is".

If you're looking at them all, yes - each one has its idiosyncrasies and biases.

I meant if you're the person (or team) responsible for the writing/maintaining/improving the code behind that specific model... what are you thinking right now? Is it a "this is performing as intended" or a "what are we missing?" type of reaction at this point?
 
Wow, Matthew is now a Cat 4 storm with 140 mph winds. Nearly unprecedented strengthening since its formation just a little over 48 hours ago. NHC track forecast slowed down a bit, which is good news if you want this to go out to sea, as it would allow the big trough near the Gulf of Alaska to get to the east coast in time to kick the storm out to sea. Lots needs to happen still for that to play out. In the short term, look out Jamaica/Cuba/Bahamas (and maybe Haiti).

Matthew has continued to rapidly strengthen at a remarkable rate
today. A NOAA Hurricane Hunter aircraft recently reported a peak
SFMR wind of 116 kt and flight-level winds of 121 kt. A recent
dropsonde from the aircraft indicated that surface winds are around
120 kt. Based on all of these data, the initial intensity is set to
120 kt, an increase of 55 kt in the last 24 hours. The latest
pressure estimate from the aircraft is 949 mb, a drop of 44 mb since
this time yesterday.

http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/text/refresh/MIATCDAT4+shtml/302051.shtml?
 
So, when your model is the one that's tracking far west into Mexico.... what are you thinking right now?

Is this a "our data is showing X, Y, Z so this makes sense to us" type of a reaction, or a "what is our model missing that everyone else seems to be including" sort of reaction?

There are dozens of meteorological models, but there are only about 5-10 that are truly used by pros (the 5-6 "globals" and a few hurricane-specific models, like the GFDL and SHIPS) and for good reason - most of the rest aren't very good for global/large scale synoptic forecasting, which is what is required for forecasting tropical systems beyond a few days, as there are global interactions that are key to intensity/track forecasts. Many of the others are either regional models that don't incorporate full global data sets or short term models or even models not necessarily geared towards the weather.

In this case, I looked up the OCD5 model that is the Mexican outlier and it's simply an air dispersion model used for air quality monitoring, especially in relation to pollution sources. It's the "Offshore Coastal Dispersion (OCD5) model" and my guess is it works fine for its intended use, but that it's really not intended for predicting hurricanes. However, there are folks, like the guy who runs Tropical Tidbits (an FSU met), which is where I got that graphic, who include model output from any models they can get their hands on and most of these are publicly available.

All of the above is why, rather than citing any old sources, you'll almost always see me citing either the NHC, TWC (which has gotten much better the last couple of years) or the Weather Underground site, as these guys are the best at what they do. I was only using that graphic to make a very specific point for 4Real.

http://www.boem.gov/BOEM-Newsroom/Technical-Announcements/tech2008-029.aspx
 
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There are dozens of meteorological models, but there are only about 5-10 that are truly used by pros (the 5-6 "globals" and a few hurricane-specific models, like the GFDL and SHIPS) and for good reason - most of the rest aren't very good for global/large scale synoptic forecasting, which is what is required for forecasting tropical systems beyond a few days, as there are global interactions that are key to intensity/track forecasts. Many of the others are either regional models that don't incorporate full global data sets or short term models or even models not necessarily geared towards the weather.

In this case, I looked up the OCD5 model that is the Mexican outlier and it's simply an air dispersion model used for air quality monitoring, especially in relation to pollution sources. It's the "Offshore Coastal Dispersion (OCD5) model" and my guess is it works fine for its intended use, but that it's really not intended for predicting hurricanes. However, there are folks, like the guy who runs Tropical Tidbits (an FSU met), which is where I got that graphic, who include model output from any models they can get their hands on and most of these are publicly available.

All of the above is why, rather than citing any old sources, you'll almost always see me citing either the NHC, TWC (which has gotten much better the last couple of years) or the Weather Underground site, as these guys are the best at what they do. I was only using that graphic to make a very specific point for 4Real.

http://www.boem.gov/BOEM-Newsroom/Technical-Announcements/tech2008-029.aspx

I get that there are varying levels of quality in models, and that some are much more trusted/consistent than others. Your second paragraph explains why that one is so variant, though, if that's not actually what it's designed to do. It might just be Michael Jordan trying to hit a curve ball.
 
I get that there are varying levels of quality in models, and that some are much more trusted/consistent than others. Your second paragraph explains why that one is so variant, though, if that's not actually what it's designed to do. It might just be Michael Jordan trying to hit a curve ball.

"Curve ball... don't... swing."
 
There's no real model support for that solution. As of now, all signs point to a sharp right turn into the Atlantic.
What he said. The only caveat is look for when Matthew makes the turn from westward to northward - if it is much later than currently forecast (tomorrow evening), the rest of the forecast will be impacted significantly.
 
11 pm, Cat 5, 160 mph sustained winds. Holy crap. No major change in forecast track near Jamaica and over eastern Cuba, probably as a Cat 3/4 by then, if the intensity falls a bit, as predicted before landfall in Cuba. Then the Bahamas, probably as a Cat 2/3, assuming some weakening due to interactions with the mountains of Cuba, then hopefully out to sea, but not a given yet.

http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/text/refresh/MIATCDAT4+shtml/010259.shtml?
 
Winds up to 120 mph, which is major hurricane (cat 3) status, despite 20 knots of SW shear, which is very surprising. This storm is likely becoming big enough to "make" its own weather to a certain extent, i.e., to be less affected by external factors, like shear. Jamaica/Cuba could really get crushed and Haiti might get pounded too.

Biggest question is whether the trough coming across the US mid-next week will be strong enough and timed properly to "push" Matthew off to the NE, and off the east coast. That's what a lot of the models are picking up on, but that's 5+ days away and nowhere near certain. The other big thing to watch in the near term is when does Matthew make the turn from heading roughly West to heading north - how far west the storm gets will affect what longitude the storm heads up and will impact whether it hits Florida, NC or is off the coast - although off the coast is still looking more likely.

@RU4Real - no, I'm not sure about it being at our latitude on Friday/Sat - was simply looking at some of the model output which shows that (below - many have the storm at the SC/NC latitude next Friday morning, so being at our latitude Fri/Sat is plausible). Even in the next few days the Euro has the storm moving a lot slower than the GFS and that could translate to a day or 2 difference to reach our latitude. Could be anytime between Friday and Sunday, at least - most tropical systems do accelerate a fair amount once they get to north of the Bahamas, but not all, often including larger storms, as you noted.

IMG_0336.thumb.JPG.e1796d9a88be90a7923601732dbdc9cb.JPG
 
Matthew has weakened a bit according to the current hurricane hunter flight and the less impressive satellite presentation. Pressure up to 947 mbar (from 942) and surface winds officially now at 155 mph (cat 4), but so far, Dr. Greg Postell on TWC (who really knows his stuff) has said that they haven't found surface winds over 130 mph (yet - haven't sampled every quadrant of the storm yet) - will see in the 11 am advisory if they drop the winds a fair amount.

Overnight models widely divergent still after Tues/Weds in the Bahamas. GFS has it scraping the east coast with landfall in SE New England, while Euro is well out to sea near Bermuda. Still pretty unlikely it comes very close to us, but it's not a lock yet.
 
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What's all this talk about rain? She's a professional and has the weather covered, and everything looks good to me. She is to be trusted, my friends.

yanet-garcia-sokek-9.gif
 
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11 am update with winds down to 145 mph, as expected, given the less impressive satellite presentation. Question is whether this is temporary weakening associated with an eyewall replacement cycle or real weakening (still some shear from the west and the west side looks more ragged). Still expected to be a cat 3 when it hits eastern Cuba and brushes the east coast of Jamaica. After that, the Bahamas as a Cat 2 then who knows, but likely to stay off shore of the east coast - could be a close call, though, especially for eastern NC and then far SE New England/Maine.

http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/refresh/graphics_at4+shtml/173419.shtml?5day#contents

145144W_sm.gif
 
Sooooooooo any update on the Hurricane?

12Z (7 am EDT starting point) models, today still showing a spread from a a hit in the Carolinas (UK) to a coastal scraper (GFS) to off shore (several) and well off shore (Euro). Next update is 5 pm. Still 5+ days out before it leaves the Bahamas, so uncertainty is still very high.
 
12Z (7 am EDT starting point) models, today still showing a spread from a a hit in the Carolinas (UK) to a coastal scraper (GFS) to off shore (several) and well off shore (Euro). Next update is 5 pm. Still 5+ days out before it leaves the Bahamas, so uncertainty is still very high.

Thanks, beats talking about the game
 
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